FIFA World Cup 2014 - Page 54

Feuer Frei! · 07-14-14, 01:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vanjast

'bad sportsmanship'

Seems it's not the first time in this tournament:

http://get-benched.com/general/argen...nference-snubs

Aaannnd.....the blame games begin from Sir Messi:

http://get-benched.com/general/messi...at-on-strikers

Hmmm, just found this too:

http://www.sbnation.com/lookit/2014/...den-ball-video

No eye contact with golden ball presenter, a dismissive handshake and cursory glance at Neuer...
Meh, let him sook. If he's going to be like that. And blame everyone barr himself for the loss.
I think he forgets it's a team game.

Devastated? Yes. Understandable? Yes.
But show some sort of class.

Skybird · 07-14-14, 05:42 AM

That is the problem with pathetically high flying emotions: if you fail, you fall the deeper.

The German title is the result of not just 120 minutes, but the past 10-12 years. When the new millenium dawned, German football was somewhat mediocre, and technically inferior, only fighting alone did not do it for the Germans anymore. They had to reinvent themselves, had to start almost from scratch and relaunched the work in the youth sector, the systematic training of talents on club level, and the superior status of the very healthy structures of club finances in germany, which sets he Bundesliga apart from playgrounds of foreign investors like in Britain and Spain, helped in that. Since then, Germany had four semifinals, one final lost, and so has suffered a lot of opportunities until last night. But after this time, and this way of working for success, the Germans indeed deserved this title more than anyone else this year. And the amount of growth they showed during the tournament, was amazing. As i have said before: before the tournament such a rise of their performance level, compared to the last months before the cup, was not to be automatically expected.

It' been a long, long way! Let's celebrate!

It shows the US football administration what a trainer they got with Klinsmann who gave the starting shot in Germany, and it could show the Brazilians what they have to do now in the coming 6-8 years. To simply assume this all was a mishap and they will get the title in Russia in 4 years, imo is a bit childish, owed once again to this incredibly emotional temperament many people in South America seem to have.

I hope to see the next cup with video backup for the refs. Their performance this cup was terrible and unacceptable. Yesterday, Germany should have gotten a penalty in first half after a foul in penalty zone, and too many extremely brutal fouls against German players had no consequences. The Germans numerically fouled more, yes: but the more brutal fouls came form Argentina, while some of the German fouls were so minor that one could have let some of them even pass. The scene with Neuer against Hindugain was no foul (like they now say in Argentina), but iron determination. The outcome of the action proved Neuer right. A lot of goalies jump like he did, but even with straight leg and foot first, to scare the attacker off. Neuer yesterday at least bend his leg, but the physical contact was not to be avoided if he wanted to get the ball, and he did. Should he freeze and let Hindugain shoot the goal? Its part of the goalie's job to allow getting shot at, or risk physical collisions with other players if only he get the ball. Usually it is the attacker being expected by referees to break off if they see they cannot get the ball without slamming into the goalie.

Skybird · 07-14-14, 06:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

As mentioned earlier, I am an outspoken Robben "fan" (note the sarcasm, please).
But even I have to defend him here.
While he IS a diver (class A diver man!), he is also a very skilled and fast player who can turn a game around by his actions. He has proven that in the German Bundesliga and also in this tournament. He IS a very good player... unfortunately he is just as good as a diver...

Well, I am a Robben fan (and no sarcasm at all), but I became that not before the last season. He is a very ripe player now, willing and capable to direct a match and dangerous and unpredictable in his movement patterns to decide matches all by himself. He is a walking and running landmine. It was also enjoyable how he made his peace with his engagement at Munich and fully settled down in that team again - it has not always been like that for him in Munich. He almost left. Regarding football, he is at home in Munich. And that does good things for him, mentally.

And he looks so funny when running, his arm-leg coordination is weired, almost girly. But it is effective, extremely, and that is what counts. also, I like the way he presents his personality in interviews.

Feuer Frei! · 07-14-14, 06:10 AM

Some questionable decisions, 2 glaring misses by both sides:

Kroos got out of jail for this:

What a miss!!!
Should have been Argentina 1 Germany 0.

Then:

How the heck could you miss that?
Howedes.

Should have been Argentina 1 Germany 1.

Messi, on his favoured left foot:

Tight angle but hey, he';s the best player in the world right?
Neuer wouldn't have stopped it.

Argentina 2 Germany 1

Here's the Neuer heroics, compared by some fools to that of Tony Schumacher's battering:

Good goalkeeping. Nothing more, nothing less.
Dominant.

Next:

Many possibilities here, but, straight at the keeper.

Argentina 2 Germany 2.

Next:

Neuer beaten, didn't happen often.

Bad miss.

Argentina 3 Germany 2

Stats for Schweini:

What a warrior!!

And here is the goal of Super Mario:

Now that is class

Chest and on volley. No pressure

Superb finish.

Argentina 3 Germany 3.

So, judging by this, we have a 3 all scoreline by the end of extra time.

Penalty shoot-out by my reckoning.

Thank goodness it didn't go there.

A mistifying decision at half time was by the Argentine coach Sabella substituting Lavezzi for Aguero.

With Lavezzi they had the mid field stacked and momentum going forward.
Aguero is a better player than Lavezzi but....not this time.
Once Aguero came on they lost the impetus in midfield, and freed up Schweinsteiger and co to give them a little more space.

Questionable decision really.

And Sir Messi, walking away from Sabella's team talk before extra time:

https://v.cdn.vine.co/r/videos/0710A...PE_SC7OoK7jhrX

Messi doesn't do team talks it seems. Pretty poor.

CCIP · 07-14-14, 06:12 AM

I'd go even further than 10-12 years and say that in many ways, this is at last a capstone to all the work that's been done since reunification. It's been a long road for Germany. And I definitely agree that one of the most important things that this team showed is that it isn't simply enough to have passion, scale of support and individual skill - you need strategy, resources, and a lot of work towards a goal. There's a lot to be said for the fact that these winning players have all come through outstanding and well-managed youth sport programs and leagues that Germany has. And there's a lot to be learned, even beyond sport, about the virtues of patience and knowing how to take a long view and see a process through from start to finish, without taking much for granted.

And that's the story of this World Cup generally, too - one can see, for example, the great resourcefulness of Brazil in hosting this cup and all that they have to offer, but alongside it also a great deal of corruption, mis-management and short-sightedness. I hope the lesson on the pitch is one that Brazilian officials and businessmen also take to heart - yes, you might have a lot to offer, but you really need to work intelligently and with a long view to really get to your goal.

Feuer Frei! · 07-14-14, 06:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

Regarding football, he is at home in Munich.

And he has confirmed this, not moving with Van Gaal to Man Utd.

Feuer Frei! · 07-14-14, 06:23 AM

Interesting.
Just found this:

Quote:

Argentine football icon Diego Maradona feels Lionel Messi should not have been given the Golden Ball award at this year's World Cup in Brazil because he did not deserve it

I thought i'd never agree with him

http://sports.ndtv.com/fifa-world-cu...diego-maradona

And he seems to agree with you Skybird, to an extent.
Commercialism.

Skybird · 07-14-14, 06:31 AM

Maradonna does not like another Argentinian player being lifted to his own national status, and surpassing him - that's what is behind it.

I found a nice nickname for Jogi Löw after reading some press this morning: Löw, the architect.

I started to doubt him over the past 12 months or so. I did him wrong, obviously.

STEED · 07-14-14, 06:35 AM

Well done Germany, and next time be faster about it.

Skybird · 07-14-14, 09:07 AM

Messi MVP already questionable.

But I just read - Columbia gets the fairplay trophy.

I reward FIFA the award for the most stoned junky of the tournament!

07-14-14, 02:08 PM

I don't say this cause I'm German, I am no nationalist or something, but many decisions FIFA made are absurd and some of these trophies should be among the German team as well.
We have solid candidates for best player, and van Buyten sure wasn't best defender...wth?
If... what was Mats Hummels... "present"?
What he has done the whole tournament(!) was outstanding and next to fascinating... but yeah, wouldn't be PC if Germany wins it all I guess.

Fairplay, I guess we could have been a candidate for this as well. The 2 yellow cards in the final sure hurt this statistic... but one of them was pure bs (Schweinsteiger's, he barely touched the argentine player, wth?).

Ah who cares, in a few days already, all of this is forgotten and not important anymore... never was, if you be honest.

mapuc · 07-14-14, 02:45 PM

I thank you for a good discussion during this World Cup it have been some game you will remember and some you'll try to forget.

In all it have been a good World Cup, if we look at the play only. I have stated earlier in this thread what my wishes for future World Cup is.

Thanks for this time see you again in another thread when we discuss....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_FIFA_World_Cup

Markus

Skybird · 07-14-14, 02:57 PM

If you consider to what immense degree this event has the power to remind people of their shared - national - identity, and how much you also are made by these events to realise the national identity, the group identity of the others in their other colours, I would not say that it is all not important.

It teaches a lesson, especially to identity-denying bureaucrats like in the EU or socialist partie, that it is not just foolish but - considering that these emotions obviously are real and intense - almost obscene to just declare all that irrelevant and non-exiostent, as if that identity can be defined at will, by arbitrary adminstrative decision. It brings back some tribal emotions, making something emerging again that is usually covered under a layer of "reasonability" and " pragmatism". But that energy is real, and it motivates people for better or worse, under certain circumstances. Than k good it is a sports event this time. All too often it has been wars.

Even an emotional Vulcan like me yesterday felt that deeply hidden energy touching my inner core. Have I anything to do in real life with those hundreds of thousands and millions of German people? No, I even have attacked them as an anonymous group over political issues many times, and am angry at them. And still - yesterday, for a moment, I felt very clearly that I definitely am not Argentinian, or of any other national or cultural identity - but German.

That may be irrational. Even confusing. Nevertheless such irrational symptoms still can echo in reality, and define it.

The football world cup is the last of the nations' camp fires around which the tribes sit together and do voodoo to scare away other tribes. And if they win, the whole gang howls together, like wolves do.

Schroeder · 07-14-14, 03:21 PM

Did anyone else think that the Golden Glove trophy that Neuer got looked totally cheap?

Platapus · 07-14-14, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schroeder

Did anyone else think that the Golden Glove trophy that Neuer got looked totally cheap?

Well most trophies look pretty cheap and chinzy when you get a real close look at them.

07-14-14, 05:42 AM	#797
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,826 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	That is the problem with pathetically high flying emotions: if you fail, you fall the deeper. The German title is the result of not just 120 minutes, but the past 10-12 years. When the new millenium dawned, German football was somewhat mediocre, and technically inferior, only fighting alone did not do it for the Germans anymore. They had to reinvent themselves, had to start almost from scratch and relaunched the work in the youth sector, the systematic training of talents on club level, and the superior status of the very healthy structures of club finances in germany, which sets he Bundesliga apart from playgrounds of foreign investors like in Britain and Spain, helped in that. Since then, Germany had four semifinals, one final lost, and so has suffered a lot of opportunities until last night. But after this time, and this way of working for success, the Germans indeed deserved this title more than anyone else this year. And the amount of growth they showed during the tournament, was amazing. As i have said before: before the tournament such a rise of their performance level, compared to the last months before the cup, was not to be automatically expected. It' been a long, long way! Let's celebrate! It shows the US football administration what a trainer they got with Klinsmann who gave the starting shot in Germany, and it could show the Brazilians what they have to do now in the coming 6-8 years. To simply assume this all was a mishap and they will get the title in Russia in 4 years, imo is a bit childish, owed once again to this incredibly emotional temperament many people in South America seem to have. I hope to see the next cup with video backup for the refs. Their performance this cup was terrible and unacceptable. Yesterday, Germany should have gotten a penalty in first half after a foul in penalty zone, and too many extremely brutal fouls against German players had no consequences. The Germans numerically fouled more, yes: but the more brutal fouls came form Argentina, while some of the German fouls were so minor that one could have let some of them even pass. The scene with Neuer against Hindugain was no foul (like they now say in Argentina), but iron determination. The outcome of the action proved Neuer right. A lot of goalies jump like he did, but even with straight leg and foot first, to scare the attacker off. Neuer yesterday at least bend his leg, but the physical contact was not to be avoided if he wanted to get the ball, and he did. Should he freeze and let Hindugain shoot the goal? Its part of the goalie's job to allow getting shot at, or risk physical collisions with other players if only he get the ball. Usually it is the attacker being expected by referees to break off if they see they cannot get the ball without slamming into the goalie. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert. Last edited by Skybird; 07-14-14 at 05:55 AM.

07-14-14, 06:10 AM	#799
Feuer Frei! Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Valhalla Posts: 5,295 Downloads: 141 Uploads: 17	Some questionable decisions, 2 glaring misses by both sides: Kroos got out of jail for this: What a miss!!! Should have been Argentina 1 Germany 0. Then: How the heck could you miss that? Howedes. Should have been Argentina 1 Germany 1. Messi, on his favoured left foot: Tight angle but hey, he';s the best player in the world right? Neuer wouldn't have stopped it. Argentina 2 Germany 1 Here's the Neuer heroics, compared by some fools to that of Tony Schumacher's battering: Good goalkeeping. Nothing more, nothing less. Dominant. Next: Many possibilities here, but, straight at the keeper. Argentina 2 Germany 2. Next: Neuer beaten, didn't happen often. Bad miss. Argentina 3 Germany 2 Stats for Schweini: What a warrior!! And here is the goal of Super Mario: Now that is class Chest and on volley. No pressure Superb finish. Argentina 3 Germany 3. So, judging by this, we have a 3 all scoreline by the end of extra time. Penalty shoot-out by my reckoning. Thank goodness it didn't go there. A mistifying decision at half time was by the Argentine coach Sabella substituting Lavezzi for Aguero. With Lavezzi they had the mid field stacked and momentum going forward. Aguero is a better player than Lavezzi but....not this time. Once Aguero came on they lost the impetus in midfield, and freed up Schweinsteiger and co to give them a little more space. Questionable decision really. And Sir Messi, walking away from Sabella's team talk before extra time: https://v.cdn.vine.co/r/videos/0710A...PE_SC7OoK7jhrX Messi doesn't do team talks it seems. Pretty poor. __________________ "History is the lies that the victors agree on"- Napoleon LINK TO MY SH 3 MODS

07-14-14, 06:12 AM	#800
CCIP Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Waterloo, Canada Posts: 8,700 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 2	I'd go even further than 10-12 years and say that in many ways, this is at last a capstone to all the work that's been done since reunification. It's been a long road for Germany. And I definitely agree that one of the most important things that this team showed is that it isn't simply enough to have passion, scale of support and individual skill - you need strategy, resources, and a lot of work towards a goal. There's a lot to be said for the fact that these winning players have all come through outstanding and well-managed youth sport programs and leagues that Germany has. And there's a lot to be learned, even beyond sport, about the virtues of patience and knowing how to take a long view and see a process through from start to finish, without taking much for granted. And that's the story of this World Cup generally, too - one can see, for example, the great resourcefulness of Brazil in hosting this cup and all that they have to offer, but alongside it also a great deal of corruption, mis-management and short-sightedness. I hope the lesson on the pitch is one that Brazilian officials and businessmen also take to heart - yes, you might have a lot to offer, but you really need to work intelligently and with a long view to really get to your goal. __________________ There are only forty people in the world and five of them are hamburgers. -Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart)

07-14-14, 06:31 AM	#803
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,826 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Maradonna does not like another Argentinian player being lifted to his own national status, and surpassing him - that's what is behind it. I found a nice nickname for Jogi Löw after reading some press this morning: Löw, the architect. I started to doubt him over the past 12 months or so. I did him wrong, obviously. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

07-14-14, 06:35 AM	#804
STEED Lucky Jack Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Down Town UK Posts: 27,695 Downloads: 89 Uploads: 48	Well done Germany, and next time be faster about it. __________________ Dr Who rest in peace 1963-2017. To borrow Davros saying...I NAME YOU CHIBNALL THE DESTROYER OF DR WHO YOU KILLED IT!

07-14-14, 09:07 AM	#805
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,826 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Messi MVP already questionable. But I just read - Columbia gets the fairplay trophy. I reward FIFA the award for the most stoned junky of the tournament! __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

07-14-14, 02:08 PM	#806
Nippelspanner Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I don't say this cause I'm German, I am no nationalist or something, but many decisions FIFA made are absurd and some of these trophies should be among the German team as well. We have solid candidates for best player, and van Buyten sure wasn't best defender...wth? If... what was Mats Hummels... "present"? What he has done the whole tournament(!) was outstanding and next to fascinating... but yeah, wouldn't be PC if Germany wins it all I guess. Fairplay, I guess we could have been a candidate for this as well. The 2 yellow cards in the final sure hurt this statistic... but one of them was pure bs (Schweinsteiger's, he barely touched the argentine player, wth?). Ah who cares, in a few days already, all of this is forgotten and not important anymore... never was, if you be honest.

07-14-14, 02:45 PM	#807
mapuc CINC Pacific Fleet Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Denmark Posts: 20,659 Downloads: 37 Uploads: 0	I thank you for a good discussion during this World Cup it have been some game you will remember and some you'll try to forget. In all it have been a good World Cup, if we look at the play only. I have stated earlier in this thread what my wishes for future World Cup is. Thanks for this time see you again in another thread when we discuss.... http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_FIFA_World_Cup Markus

07-14-14, 02:57 PM	#808
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,826 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	If you consider to what immense degree this event has the power to remind people of their shared - national - identity, and how much you also are made by these events to realise the national identity, the group identity of the others in their other colours, I would not say that it is all not important. It teaches a lesson, especially to identity-denying bureaucrats like in the EU or socialist partie, that it is not just foolish but - considering that these emotions obviously are real and intense - almost obscene to just declare all that irrelevant and non-exiostent, as if that identity can be defined at will, by arbitrary adminstrative decision. It brings back some tribal emotions, making something emerging again that is usually covered under a layer of "reasonability" and " pragmatism". But that energy is real, and it motivates people for better or worse, under certain circumstances. Than k good it is a sports event this time. All too often it has been wars. Even an emotional Vulcan like me yesterday felt that deeply hidden energy touching my inner core. Have I anything to do in real life with those hundreds of thousands and millions of German people? No, I even have attacked them as an anonymous group over political issues many times, and am angry at them. And still - yesterday, for a moment, I felt very clearly that I definitely am not Argentinian, or of any other national or cultural identity - but German. That may be irrational. Even confusing. Nevertheless such irrational symptoms still can echo in reality, and define it. The football world cup is the last of the nations' camp fires around which the tribes sit together and do voodoo to scare away other tribes. And if they win, the whole gang howls together, like wolves do. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

07-14-14, 03:21 PM	#809
Schroeder Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Banana Republic of Germany Posts: 6,170 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	Did anyone else think that the Golden Glove trophy that Neuer got looked totally cheap? __________________ Putting Germ back into Germany.