New budget proposal

[gimpy117]

discuss.

[Platapus]

Videos like this are only eye candy.

Show me the actual numbers of his proposed budget and then I can opine.

And, of course, what the President wants is seldom what the President gets. The President is the only politician in DC who has to consistently fight both political parties.

Currently, we probably have the best combination party wise (let's not talk about individuals). I like the GOP to be in charge of the House as most spending bills start there. I like having the Democrats in control of the Senate, primarily because I like different parties in charge of the different chambers. So if I like the GOP in the house, it does not leave much choice for the Senate.

I don't like having the same party in charge of both chambers, and I sure don't like having the same party in charge of both chambers and the Presidency.

But in any case, videos like this are eye candy for the masses.

I am from Missouri, show me the numbers.

[CaptainHaplo]

While I suspect Platapus and I will disagree on the appropriateness of the numbers when they come out (which is all good in a debate), I agree with him totally on this. Show us data and figures, not nebulous politi-speak.

Some goes for the "other side" too.....

[tater]

I didn't watch.

The analogy of the title of course would need to be a family that spends a huge chunk of it's annual income on a crazy credit card shopping spree (the so-called "stimulus"), THEN decides to try and live within a budget. (a family making 50k a year goes out and blows 20 grand on a fancy dinner in NYC, THEN lives within its means).

Lock spending at 2007 levels. Include "entitlements"—if that requires lowering rates of increase, or even cutting benefits to 2007 levels—tough. Debt service should literally come off the top of the entitlements, too. After maybe 10 years, allow the budget to increase at the most conservative inflation rate—and it should decrease if there is deflation to match.

[CaptainHaplo]

#1 Balanced budget ammendment (with the exception being a declared war by congress)

#2 Cut off all entitlement funding (welfare, education, housing assistance, etc) to any non-citizen or non-legal resident.

#3 Move to a consumption tax

#4 Get the federal government back to within its constitutionally defined role.

#5 Return to the gold standard

Do that, and we would have a surplus that would pay down our debt and have us on solid footing. It won't happen, too much special interest to ever let it be.

[TorpX]

I watched the speech.

I felt like it needed a laugh track.

[redsocialist]

HAHAHA How hilarious. OHHHHHHH ohhhhh The Irony!

Here is a more logical effecient budget plan.

1. Cut the $2 Trillion/ a year "defense" spending for the US imperialist agenda and the Arms Industry that use murder for profit and call them "wars" which are Illeagle Occupations
2. Stop the 4 million dollars/ a day funding to Israel
3. Stop the funding to right-wing dictators around the world and giving them military asstince.
4. Stop the funding to US-state department backed "political parties" around the world such as National Endowment for "Democracy".
5. Get rid of the CIA (Central Imperialist Agency), and stiring up/ assassinating democratically elected leaders.
6. Stop making contracts with all the Multi National Corporations that rape the Earth's resources, by merging the state and corporations, eg. United Fruit Company, Goldmen Sachs.
7. Stop medeling in other's countries affairs or bring "democracy" which translates to imperialism and opression.
8. If USA hates Communists so much stop funding/supporting PKK (Kurdistan Workers Party), that it designates as a "terrorist organization", yet supports them to destablize Turkey.
9. Stop ALL THE CORPORATE WELFARE/"Bailouts" and Subsidies to MNCs! If USA really cared about the economy then invent in American jobs,
Stop using slave labor in 3rd world countries using 7 year old girls with 18 hour shifts making 2 cents an hour!!
10. MOST Important! End the 800 bases in 130 countries around the world! Stop USA Imperialism!!

-Feel free to add to this list!

Remember kids, the imperialist state of USA is very expensive, so Americans better get on the streets and stop all that spending from those pesky politicians and that evil commie muslim nazi Obama

[Takeda Shingen]

Originally Posted by redsocialist

HAHAHA How hilarious. OHHHHHHH ohhhhh The Irony!

Here is a more logical effecient budget plan.

1. Cut the $2 Trillion/ a year "defense" spending for the US imperialist agenda and the Arms Industry that use murder for profit and call them "wars" which are Illeagle Occupations
2. Stop the 4 million dollars/ a day funding to Israel
3. Stop the funding to right-wing dictators around the world and giving them military asstince.
4. Stop the funding to US-state department backed "political parties" around the world such as National Endowment for "Democracy".
5. Get rid of the CIA (Central Imperialist Agency), and stiring up/ assassinating democratically elected leaders.
6. Stop making contracts with all the Multi National Corporations that rape the Earth's resources, by merging the state and corporations, eg. United Fruit Company, Goldmen Sachs.
7. Stop medeling in other's countries affairs or bring "democracy" which translates to imperialism and opression.
8. If USA hates Communists so much stop funding/supporting PKK (Kurdistan Workers Party), that it designates as a "terrorist organization", yet supports them to destablize Turkey.
9. Stop ALL THE CORPORATE WELFARE/"Bailouts" and Subsidies to MNCs! If USA really cared about the economy then invent in American jobs,
Stop using slave labor in 3rd world countries using 7 year old girls with 18 hour shifts making 2 cents an hour!!
10. MOST Important! End the 800 bases in 130 countries around the world! Stop USA Imperialism!!

-Feel free to add to this list!

Remember kids, the imperialist state of USA is very expensive, so Americans better get on the streets and stop all that spending from those pesky politicians and that evil commie muslim nazi Obama

1. The occupations are not illegal. Also, the United States of America is not, nor has ever been, an imperialist nation.
2. I'd like my nation to cut back on Israeli funding as well, but why all the Israel hate? You've done this in a few threads already.
3. But the dictators that oppose Israel are okay, right?
4. But I thought that we were supposed to counter the dictators.
5. Central Imperialist Agency. Did you think that up by yourself?
6. Why should only the US stop exploiting natural materials? That would be kind of pointless, no?
7. That is neither imperialism nor oppression.
8. There are no communists.
9. I'd like to stop all welfare. Period.
10. Again, that's not imperialism.

Obama is not a muslim, but did you really just call him a commie nazi?

[redsocialist]

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

1. The occupations are not illegal. Also, the United States of America is not, nor has ever been, an imperialist nation.
-------------------------------------------
Yes it has, since 1776. Ever heard of the genocide of 300 million native Americans? Those are the "real americans" not people who come from countries the US has destroyed oppressed/ then call them "illeagle" What about the "interventionism" during the Cold War, murdering democratically elected leaders, then install dictators that in turn slaughter they're own people MUCH more than any "evil communists" have. Augusto Pinochet ring a bell? oh How about funding Saddam Hussein, and selling chemical weapons.. to fight against Iran. The list would go on and on, but I don't have all the time in the world, so I'll let you find that upon yourself.
------------------------------------------
2. I'd like my nation to cut back on Israeli funding as well, but why all the Israel hate? You've done this in a few threads already.
-------------------------------------------------
I don't hate Israel, and what few thread, I just have one other post saying Israel and USA are the real terrorists, and by that I mean the governments. I have friends that are jewish, from Israel, and are against the illeagle occupations.
-----------------------------
3. But the dictators that oppose Israel are okay, right?
-------------------------------------
Doesn't matter US will support anyone infavor who supports Israel, the majority are right-wing dictators. Though as usual USA labels those against Israel as dictators like the "evil tyrant of doom" Hugo Chavez who was democratically elected and continues to be.
4. But I thought that we were supposed to counter the dictators.
----------------------------------------------------
Of course not. Don't you understand economics? Corporations like countries that are "stable" so they can obtain more profit and make deals with them
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5. Central Imperialist Agency. Did you think that up by yourself?
----------------------------------------------------
Yes I did, also I have one for NATO (North Atlantic Terrorist Organization), though I didn't come up with it
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6. Why should only the US stop exploiting natural materials? That would be kind of pointless, no?
-------------------------------------------
All of the first-world countries should stop oppressing the world not just the USA. However, USA comes #1 to imperialism.
---------------------------------------------------------
7. That is neither imperialism nor oppression.
--------------------------------------------------
To you and most Americans its "freedom and democracy", to the rest of the world its imperialism and opression.
--------------------------------------------------
8. There are no communists.
-------------------------------------
Really? Ha you sure are asleep then, WE're everywhere, though e don't all have the same idealogy. more in more around the world are becoming reds, anarchists, socialists, communists. We are building a United left front.
--------------------------------------------
9. I'd like to stop all welfare. Period.
-----------------------------------------
Then you should move to Somolia. That would be a great libertarian uptopia for ya
---------------------------------
10. Again, that's not imperialism.
-----------------------------
Yes it is
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Obama is not a muslim, but did you really just call him a commie nazi?
-----------------------------------------------------
Obama is a puppet for the Imperialist state of USA and its biggest salesmen to sell the agenda, IMO. I used commie muslim nazi to poke fun at the absurdity of the right-wing loonies who go around saying USA #1! etc..

[Takeda Shingen]

Redsocialist, I'll just leave it at this: You're using a lot of terms that you either have a very shallow understanding of, or fail to understand completely.

[gimpy117]

I find it ironic that the right says "control the spending" and when Obama suggests just that...everyone freaks and laughs

[redsocialist]

Yes, your right some of these concepts Ihave very little understanding of, I'm just giving my take on it, and I'm sorry if it came out a bit harsh, I just wanted to wake people up a little bit so they can see where the spending is really going. Thats all!

[Rockstar]

Oh yes, Israel again, the sole source of all the worlds woes. I don't get it, there are nearly 6 BILLION people on this planet, of which is less than 18 million Jews. That's less than one third of one percent of the world population! Statistically speaking they should hardly be heard of! Tucked away like the Ainu in a corner of Asia or Inuit in Alaska, bystanders of history. Yet they're in every headline? If they had a neighbor to trade with that didn't want to see them dead. We just might be able to stop aid and let them grow and prosper.

[Sailor Steve]

@ redsocialist: Please do not use the quote function and then add your responses inside the quote. It makes impossible to quote you without retyping everything you said.

Also your replies tend to meander from one subject to the next, sometimes in mid-sentence. This makes them difficult to respond to. But I'll try.

Yes it has, since 1776. Ever heard of the genocide of 300 million native Americans? Those are the "real americans" not people who come from countries the US has destroyed oppressed/ then call them "illeagle"

No, and neither have you. First, the vast majority of those were killed by disease, which is a tragedy but would have happened even if every European who came here had the best intentions. Yes, the Spanish colonists enslaved the native populations. For the most part the English and French left them alone. Are you aware that the first English colony was wiped out by the natives? No one is sure exactly why, but there isn't much evidence that the colonists did anything to warrant that attack.

In 1776 the largest nation on the North American continent was the Iroquis Federation, also known as the Five Civilized Tribes. Other tribes were considered "uncivilized" and at the worst enslaved and at the best treated as second-class citizens. The United States at that time tried to deal with the native population, not hurt them. Yes, we are guilty of lying, cheating and stealing, and of the occasional barbarism, and so were "they". I say "we" rather than the government, because most of it was done by people who wanted something, not an evil government. This was even true of the Spanish. Also, since we do believe in "Government of, by and for the People", anything the government does I consider my responsibility, even when I disagree; and I do disagree a lot.

I also say "we" and "they" in quotes, because I'm descended from English and Germans on my father's side, and some Native Americans on my mother's side, including Arapaho and Apache.

What about the "interventionism" during the Cold War, murdering democratically elected leaders, then install dictators that in turn slaughter they're own people MUCH more than any "evil communists" have. Augusto Pinochet ring a bell? oh How about funding Saddam Hussein, and selling chemical weapons.. to fight against Iran. The list would go on and on, but I don't have all the time in the world, so I'll let you find that upon yourself.

If you don't have the time to link references, then you shouldn't make accusations. As to this one, it's true. The US government has installed many people in power because someone thought it would be advantageous to fighting what was considered a greater enemy. I disagree - I don't believe we should do that sort of thing. That said, in America I'm free to say that. In Soviet Russia you couldn't disagree with the government without risking disappearing forever. How many of his own people did Stalin "purge"?

I don't hate Israel, and what few thread, I just have one other post saying Israel and USA are the real terrorists, and by that I mean the governments. I have friends that are jewish, from Israel, and are against the illeagle occupations.

But you sure sound like you do. You also sound like you're convinced you're right, and have no room for discussion. Let me ask you this: Have you ever said anything similar about the Arabic governments surrounding Israel?

Doesn't matter US will support anyone infavor who supports Israel, the majority are right-wing dictators. Though as usual USA labels those against Israel as dictators like the "evil tyrant of doom" Hugo Chavez who was democratically elected and continues to be.

That was not an answer to the question, but a diversion.

Of course not. Don't you understand economics? Corporations like countries that are "stable" so they can obtain more profit and make deals with them

Here you change the subject to seemingly further an agenda, without actually discussing anything. You keep throwing out claims, but not talking about them. You sound more like a propaganda broadcast than someone who really wants to discuss things.

All of the first-world countries should stop oppressing the world not just the USA. However, USA comes #1 to imperialism.

That's a fine accusation, but can you show that the US is more imperialistic than, say, China?

To you and most Americans its "freedom and democracy", to the rest of the world its imperialism and opression.

Really? Ha you sure are asleep then, WE're everywhere, though e don't all have the same idealogy. more in more around the world are becoming reds, anarchists, socialists, communists. We are building a United left front.

Then you should move to Somolia. That would be a great libertarian uptopia for ya

Yes it is

Obama is a puppet for the Imperialist state of USA and its biggest salesmen to sell the agenda, IMO. I used commie muslim nazi to poke fun at the absurdity of the right-wing loonies who go around saying USA #1! etc..

You really do sound like a walking propoganda machine. Is there any actual discussion in your soul, or is it all automatic hate? I'd like to know what you think your beliefs can do to better the world, and not just how evil certain people are. All the things you've said about America and Israel can also be said about any Communist state and any Arab state.

I'd like to hear what you really think, rather than one-sided attacks.

[Rockstar]

Ah, 'red' who believes the United States of Americun's just appeared out from nowhere in North America made a flag and took the land away from the tribes. Here's a news flash, it was Europeans that came to this continent called North America and started taking lands. It was Europeans that moved west and it was Europeans who rebelled against other Europeans. Made their own flag and just continued the tradition of taking lands with their flag.

And to this day you still can find their descendants arguing back and forth over the internet. Accusingly pointing a finger at each other and complaining to each as to who committed the worst atrocities.

Native Americuns means you were born here, it doesn't mean the only ones are tribal because their ancestors arrived first. I'm native of North Americun too because I was born here. My father's side of the family came from Norway and Finnland (european) . My mom's side is for the most part Prussian and Metis (half breed).