Ubisoft ain't so Bad

[IanC]

Hang in there FIREWALL! Just don't drop the soap and you'll be fine.

[Rockin Robbins]

Originally Posted by The Enigma

So, pure hypothetically, if there would appear a mod that changes several
.cfg files (not the exe file!) in such way, that an online connection is no
longer needed, would that be wrong to discuss about?

Again, I'm only talking about a (so far non-existing) mod not a cr*ck.

Actually that mod does exist. It does not stop Ubi's DRM or online play at all, just gives you a way to play offline if you choose. It is a straightforward editing of .cfg unprotected text files in the /data directory where files intended to be modded are. Just like all files intended to be modded this file is internally commented for ease of modding as well.

However, upon publication of the mod on the Ubi forum, the Ubi folks pulled it as a crack, which it is not. They then waffled, changing their reasoning that the mod could be useful to pirates. Well, so could RFB for SH4, so that's a specious argument.

That being said, i personally oppose the use of this mod or any mod that would make SH5 more popular in its present state, as enhancing the value of the product removes Ubi's need to fix it. I believe we need to stick to our guns and not purchase, play or mod it until Ubi sees the light of day.

My take is as above. It doesn't deactivate Ubi DRM in any way. It doesn't keep the game from going online at all. It merely allows the user to mimic the changes the online portion does to your .cfg file to allow you to progress in the game. Since the file is a file traditionally modded with approval, since it lives in a directory approved for all previous mods, including mods to that particular file in SH3 and SH4, since it is a normal text file, unprotected and internally commented like all the other files intended to be modded we must conclude that modding it is proper.

However, without specific scrutiny by Subsim high mucky-mucks to verify the above, I won't post the link to the new location as much as I'd love to. The mod is by a German guy named ZygmuntTorpedo.

[Nisgeis]

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

My take is as above. It doesn't deactivate Ubi DRM in any way. It doesn't keep the game from going online at all. It merely allows the user to mimic the changes the online portion does to your .cfg file to allow you to progress in the game.

I don't think that's right, as it's the exe that checks you are connected before launching the game. The only way (I believe) this is useful is if you have a version of the exe that does not try to connect to the internet, which... wouldn't be official.

firewall openly and freely admitted to commiting fraud AND piracy by his purchasing the game then registering/activating it then boxing it up and returning it for a full refund while still playing it on his computer.

what about the poor guy who buys the game he returned and finds the activation has already been used and now this innocent person must go through major BS to get his game to work because firewall did this. i just hope there is some loophole in the activation so there wont be any issues for this guy who buys the returned game as it could easily be you or me who buys it.

many laws were broken in this process but thats between him and his morals to sort out.

the only concern we at subsim have is that whatever you do in your own home is your own buisness but dont talk about it here. once you start talking about how you did it then you are actively promoting piracy or ways to crack game protections and you WILL get banned for it.

[Rockin Robbins]

Originally Posted by Nisgeis

I don't think that's right, as it's the exe that checks you are connected before launching the game. The only way (I believe) this is useful is if you have a version of the exe that does not try to connect to the internet, which... wouldn't be official.

ZygmuntTorpedo says that is not true. I of course have not been able and do not want to verify it for myself. It should be up to Ubi to remedy the DRM issue.

Any player imitated moves to make this less nasty, especially if successful would just result in more sales. Ubi would say "It's working!" and never make the needed changes to the game. When confronted with a draconian or unreasonable policy, the best move is always to observe it to the letter.

People make that mistake at work all the time, cheating to make it look like a stupid policy works. Then the bosses say "It works!" and proudly go about making even stupider policies. Let's not let that happen here. Either we play the game as is and tolerate the abuse or we jingle our money in their general direction and let them know it's theirs when they decide to treat us like human beings.

Jingle! Jingle!

[The Enigma]

Webster, it's completely clear for me, that Subsim doesn't want any discusions about changing library or exe files intending to bypass the copy protection.

I'm trying to find out whether a mod that allows you to playoff line is off limits to discuss here too?

Modding is OK, but is it for all mods?
And if no, why treat mods differently?

To me, a mod is a mod, but is that also for Subsim?

Originally Posted by The Enigma

Webster, it's completely clear for me, that Subsim doesn't want any discusions about changing library or exe files intending to bypass the copy protection.

I'm trying to find out whether a mod that allows you to playoff line is off limits to discuss here too?

Modding is OK, but is it for all mods?
And if no, why treat mods differently?

To me, a mod is a mod, but is that also for Subsim?

offhand anything that bypasses the DRM would be a "crack" even if its called a mod so i would say a "mod" that lets you play the game offline would be a crack or pirate tool since being offline removes the validation of the game as well.

i think it falls into that catagory of you know it when you see it and the very description of what this thing would do says it all.

now IMO if you wanted to discuss it i see no harm in that but providing links or describing how to do it (like a do it yourself demo) is not allowed here.

we already had long discussions about DRM and only a few times did we mods have to step in so as long as we have the discussion within the rules then the topic is not off limits only the specifics of how its done or links to it.

we are all adults here and we can discuss just about anything as long as we maintain the discussion within certain boundry limits.

keep in mind this may change because its only my view of things at this time, the more that is known about it things may change.

[tater]

Altering a savegame is a crack?

[Nisgeis]

Originally Posted by tater

Altering a savegame is a crack?

In conjuction with a cracked exe, yes.

[tater]

Clearly a cracked exe is a crack, and wrong. I didn't say a cracked exe though, just a legal owner prevented from playing by sysadmin incompetence, for example.

[Nisgeis]

Altering the save game wouldn't work on its own, as you can't play any part of the campaign or start the game without an internet connection, so if you can't load the altered save game, because the game won't start, it can't be used to bypass the DRM, without also being used in conjunction with a cracked exe.

[Rockin Robbins]

Well all that remains to be seen, as I have only the word of the modder that it does nothing to defeat the DRM. I'd be glad to supply links to Webster or any moderator by PM so you can check it out for yourself to see where you think the judgment call on this one lies.

One thing for sure. Ubi Forums missed the call by a mile. If it is something impermissible, they have not come up with a reason that stands scrutiny. Maybe you guys can kick the tires and see if it drives.

[The Enigma]

Its a thin line we are talking about, but to qoute a forum admin from another mod site:

However, I have been modding SH3 and SH4 since the beginning,
so I would think I know just a little about it, and in that post of yours it looks
more like a tutorial of how to play a legal copy offline, as 95 % of the
community wishes it, than a description as to how to crack it.

A crack is defined in modifying the executive files with the file extension exe.
So far, I see nowhere a description as how to crack it. Nor do I see links to
the so called crack.
I see a description as to how to modify text files plus adding units from
previous versions, just like modders have done between SH3 and SH4.
As long as it follows that pattern, and that alone, I will allow it for now.
But it may change. Only time will tell. I cannot guarantee it.
Please understand.

[tater]

I admit I had a lot of trouble understanding the thread, but no where does it say anything about touching any file that is not a simple text file. If the "fix" proposed only works after the game has started via a proper connection, and simply allows you to progress after you for some reason lose connection, it doesn't even defeat the DRM, just allows online play after a disconnect.

[The Enigma]

@tater
I would gladly talk about the if and how (from a mod on the web) in here at subsim, but I'm not sure if that is allowed.
(I don't want to end in the brick)

So I won't react on your post Tater.