If you dont like the online DRM...

[badkarma]

Originally Posted by trenken

Did someone say its impossible to remove it? I sure didnt, what I said was thats not a very easy thing to do.

Go on youtube and search for guild wars dev diaries. It also uses DRM, and Jeff Strain talks about how massive a project it is to construct a game around DRM. Every aspect of the game is built with DRM in mind, but it can be removed. Anything can be done, but it would take a long time. A year would not surprise me at all.

You REALLY need to get over the Guild Wars obsession here.
Have you played any single player non-MMO games that require internet
connection? That might actually be relevant to this discussion.
Guild Wars is an MMO, ergo it will ALWAYS need a connection. It's a totally different beast.

And as Mikhayl stated, there is no way they're going to pay devs a year to rewrite most of the game to remove the DRM, so quit with your random guesses.
According to you hackers rewrite these game in 3 days! Man they're good, maybe we should pay them a weeks wages to write us the ultimate sub sim?

[piri_reis]

Originally Posted by Mikhayl

So Ubi would pay a team of programmers for 6months/1year just to publish an offline patch when they decide to remove support for a game from their servers? And that for all their games? Please.

Trenken thinks he knows all the intricacies of the DRM world, from the dev diaries of GW.. And that we're all newbies in this computer business..

That game is an MMO, and needs to check everything you do, everything you buy/sell, use, kill, whatever from the server and interact it with the whole community of connected users...
The DRM we have w/ SH5 will just be a glorified disc-checker at the startup of the game, that will connect and check your digital certificate or whatever system they have implemented, check your version and upload/download savegame. That's all there is to it...
But for some reason they need you to keep being connected, for what reason??

Easy to implement and easy to take out.. The devs are busy developing/tweaking/bug hunting the game engine right now not working on the functions of drm..

[trenken]

Bunch of people here with 0 knowledge of how to build a videogame actually assuming how easy they think it is to remove DRM from any game, and so deathly afraid of a change that the entire PC gaming industry is moving towards. Lol

Only on the internet...

DRM is not starforce, its not hacked in 3 days. Its not something slapped on in post production. Games are built around it. Starforce is entirely different, its a licensing protection system, that is not what DRM is.

Change is good sometimes guys, thats your life lesson of the day. Hard for some to believe apparently, but its actually true, change can be good. I dont understand the miserable pessimistic state of mind where you spend your days ripping a game to pieces that you havent even played yet.

Just calm down, wait for the game to come out. This board is turning into a cesspool of negativity. To be expected I guess.

Originally Posted by trenken

Bunch of people here with 0 knowledge of how to build a videogame actually assuming how easy they think it is to remove DRM from any game, and so deathly afraid of a change that the entire PC gaming industry is moving towards. Lol

Only on the internet...

DRM is not starforce, its not hacked in 3 days. Its not something slapped on in post production. Games are built around it. Starforce is entirely different, its a licensing protection system, that is not what DRM is.

Change is good sometimes guys, thats your life lesson of the day. Hard for some to believe apparently, but its actually true, change can be good. I dont understand the miserable pessimistic state of mind where you spend your days ripping a game to pieces that you havent even played yet.

Just calm down, wait for the game to come out. This board is turning into a cesspool of negativity. To be expected I guess.

So you wanna talk about the wind of changes ? Mind telling at least one good thing about RDM system ?

[Thomen]

Originally Posted by trenken

Bunch of people here with 0 knowledge of how to build a videogame actually assuming how easy they think it is to remove DRM from any game, and so deathly afraid of a change that the entire PC gaming industry is moving towards. Lol

Only on the internet...

DRM is not starforce, its not hacked in 3 days. Its not something slapped on in post production. Games are built around it. Starforce is entirely different, its a licensing protection system, that is not what DRM is.

Change is good sometimes guys, thats your life lesson of the day. Hard for some to believe apparently, but its actually true, change can be good.

Comparing a MMO, that requires a permanent connection with a single player game that does not need such connection, except when used in multiplayer mode does not make you look any more knowledgeable about the details.

[TDK1044]

Originally Posted by trenken

Bunch of people here with 0 knowledge of how to build a videogame actually assuming how easy they think it is to remove DRM from any game, and so deathly afraid of a change that the entire PC gaming industry is moving towards. Lol

Only on the internet...

DRM is not starforce, its not hacked in 3 days. Its not something slapped on in post production. Games are built around it. Starforce is entirely different, its a licensing protection system, that is not what DRM is.

Change is good sometimes guys, thats your life lesson of the day. Hard for some to believe apparently, but its actually true, change can be good. I dont understand the miserable pessimistic state of mind where you spend your days ripping a game to pieces that you havent even played yet.

Just calm down, wait for the game to come out. This board is turning into a cesspool of negativity. To be expected I guess.

I can't speak for anyone else, but the reason for my decision not to buy it is based on a five year history with Ubisoft. Buggy games that need significant patching are one thing, but add online DRM into that equation and for me it's a deal breaker. Simple as that.

That doesn't mean that I disagree with some of the points you make, trenken, especially regarding Starforce. I was trying to figure out what possible relationship Starforce has to online DRM.

I just don't trust this Publisher. So I'm out.

[ETR3(SS)]

Originally Posted by trenken

Bunch of people here with 0 knowledge of how to build a videogame actually assuming how easy they think it is to remove DRM from any game, and so deathly afraid of a change that the entire PC gaming industry is moving towards. Lol

Only on the internet...

DRM is not starforce, its not hacked in 3 days. Its not something slapped on in post production. Games are built around it. Starforce is entirely different, its a licensing protection system, that is not what DRM is.

Change is good sometimes guys, thats your life lesson of the day. Hard for some to believe apparently, but its actually true, change can be good. I dont understand the miserable pessimistic state of mind where you spend your days ripping a game to pieces that you havent even played yet.

Just calm down, wait for the game to come out. This board is turning into a cesspool of negativity. To be expected I guess.

Well please, educate the dumb masses here as to what DRM is exactly.

This DRM nonsence will be cut out or completely disabled like an evil cancer by cracker groups anyway. If UBI wants to cancel work on submarine simulations by including DRM and then later bitch about low sale rates to completly shut it down let them have it. Maybe they already have a plan as a excuse how to seize future developments on submarine simulations which maybe showned to be unprofitable enough in the past or by future sell probability prognosis ? Just a wild guess from my camp..

[Nickolas]

Originally Posted by trenken

...how easy they think it is to remove DRM from any game...

it IS rather easy, that's why games get cracked... its just a few lines of code that activate or block the game's code. That why you can't compare an MMO with a normal game, an MMO needs to be told by the server where other players are and stuff, that's why the whole code "depends" on the "DRM".

Originally Posted by trenken

DRM is not starforce, its not hacked in 3 days. Its not something slapped on in post production. Games are built around it. Starforce is entirely different, its a licensing protection system, that is not what DRM is.

DRM stands for Digital Rights Management, copy protection, by definition is DRM. Starforce is DRM and whatever DRM they are using is not called DRM.

If i remember correctly, mass effect required to connect to internet every 3 or 4 days to remain active (somewhat similar to SHV's DRM) and it was cracked

Originally Posted by trenken

Change is good sometimes guys, thats your life lesson of the day. Hard for some to believe apparently, but its actually true, change can be good.

change can be good, that's true but it also can be bad. And with the info we are getting looks like change will be BAD this time.

Originally Posted by trenken

I dont understand the miserable pessimistic state of mind where you spend your days ripping a game to pieces that you havent even played yet.

that speech about "not having played it yet" is getting really old. If we feel we are not happy with the information we are given we can (and will) make it public. That way UBI could (and i'm not saying they will) come and tell us how and why we are wrong instead of thinking "hehe, these guys will love the game", and turns out nobody buys it because we feel alienated by the campaign map screenshot they posted earlier.

[badkarma]

Originally Posted by trenken

Bunch of people here with 0 knowledge

No, just you.

Originally Posted by trenken

DRM is not starforce, its not hacked in 3 days.

Go find out how long it took to circumvent the DRM that's in Empire:Total War. Then get back here with some knowledge, not just the details contained in 2 blog posts you once read about an MMO.
People WILL be playing SH5, on the day of release, and won't have paid a penny for it or need to report to the mother ship that they just fired a torp at an AI ship.
And currently, there are probably going to be a lot more people typing "SHV" and "Torrent" into google than there were previously.

This is why piracy is so difficult to stop, because once 1 person cracks (and be sure they will) it it is impossible to stop the distribution.. so much so, whereas once cracked games were the preserve of little groups of hackers they are now open to anyone with a little knowledge and access to google.
Making legitimate users lives so awkward that they consider looking for the cracked version is hardly the solution.

But you continue to preach your amazing future, irrelevant of everyone elses' opinions.
You are, of course, far better than the rest us.

[ETR3(SS)]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

1. Do i have to have the game disk to play?

From an Ubi Q&A:

A CD/DVD is not required to play the game.

2. Will save games be saved on my PC?

Again from the same Ubi Q&A

Will all my saved games be stored online?
Yes! They will be stored both online and on your PC.

3. If i lose connection, will i have to start all the way over back in port?

Same Q&A:

What will happen if I lose my Internet connection when I play the game?
If you lose your Internet connection the game will pause while it tries to reconnect. If the Internet Connection is unable to resume you can continue the game from where you left off or from the last saved game.

4. Does the service, by itself, cost anything (per month, etc)?

No data on this at the moment, could go either way. Fact though it does cost money to maintain those servers.

5. Does UBI install any spyware, malware or fishy software to monitor my online experience?

[/QUOTE]

From same Q&A as before:

Do any services run when I am not playing?
No. The only service that might be running after you exit the game is the online synchronization of saved games which runs until it is completed. It is not a hidden window, so you can cancel it at any time, and it will finish the synchronization the next time you start the game.

Do you add any monitoring tools to my computer?
No! We respect your privacy and will only access information needed for the new services and game to function. There are no hidden programs or monitoring tools installed.

Opinion: World of Warcraft is a well know game even if you don't play it. It started out the very same way. Later on in an attempt to uncover people that were using packet sniffers to try and develop trainers for the game, this changed. What Ubi says now and what they do later may or may not be the same thing.

Fact:

Can I resell my game?
Not at this time.

Can I resell my game along with my Ubisoft account?
Your Ubisoft account features your personal data and cannot be given or sold to anyone.

This is the same as with WoW. For those of you that thought you would buy this later on down the road second hand for a cheap price, game over.

[Gatt]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

... perhaps you could explain the FACTS to us all here.

no opinions.

just FACTS by answering these questions:




1. Do i have to have the game disk to play?

2. Will save games be saved on my PC?

3. If i lose connection, will i have to start all the way over back in port?

4. Does the service, by itself, cost anything (per month, etc)?

5. Does UBI install any spyware, malware or fishy software to monitor my online experience?

If I have to tell you why I canceled my pre-order of a game that I will play only offline and that will require a permanent internet connection, then you need some serious help.

I am a beta tester of Rise of Flight (same DRM, so far) and I do know what I'm talking about.

4. Does the service, by itself, cost anything (per month, etc)? No data on this at the moment, could go either way. Fact though it does cost money to maintain those servers.This is it! The half mouth spoken truth IMO! It's aaaaaalll about the money. Weren't they be gipsies afterall to include DRM for later money draining operations "as to support servers" lol omg... Sorry if I insulted somebody bur seriously it is theft with braking in.

[KL-alfman]

my last words to this DRM-issue are quoting:

"defending freedom means thwarting DRM"
(Richard Stallman)

[tater]

A flakey net connection is not "very rare" for some of us, sadly.

If a game requires me to be online, I expect to be playing with and vs other human beings. Period. I can accept that when my connect goes to crap I cannot play.

When an OFFLINE game gets screwed up because of a flakey connection, that's where I draw the line. It's a 100% show stopper. Never would I pay money for that. Not ever.