Gun Control thread (merged many)

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by August

The clip needs to be longer. We don't get to see her chew!

Originally Posted by nikimcbee

I'm sorry, what were you guys saying again?

Something about chewing.

[August]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Something about chewing.

This is why people say the English are gay.

[Onkel Neal]

Originally Posted by Oberon

I need a new joke wrangler, if it was in the UK I'd have said something like Peckham. Perhaps I should have used California as a better example, I've noticed Americans here tend to pick that when they're using a derogative example for a state.



It was a bit waffley wasn't it? I really should be a politician. When I mean a multi-pronged approach, I mean that rather than just looking to enact tougher reponses for crime, one should also look at hitting the causes of crime. For example in guns, tougher sentences for those violating gun safety protocols should also be accompanyed by a campaign to inform and educate people on gun safety as well as an effort by gun manufacturers to ensure that new firearms have as many safety features as possible (although tbh I'm pretty sure that they already do) and perhaps research into whether a non-intrusive device can be made for making older firearms safer. We're living in a world of micro-electronics, I'm sure that such a thing could be possible and be built into the grip of an old pistol by a professional.
That's just an example, and to be honest it probably wouldn't go exactly that way so there's no need to start picking specific holes in it in regards to my lack of knowledge on firearms safety. It's about giving a little bit of a carrot as well as a stick.

The level playing field comes back to trying to create a more equal society, where the money isn't quite so lopsided. Now obviously this isn't going to stop crime and create a utopia, but it might help a little. Again though, it's got to be from both ends of the scale, there's no point extending a ladder down from the top if people aren't going to use it. However, equally you've got to be very careful not to punish those who legitimately are unable to work because of the actions of the fraudsters.

What you've got to try and avoid though, is the criminalisation and demonisation of the poor, which is becoming a sadly too common occurrence and it's something that appeals to that inner part of a person that likes to feel superior to someone else.
I don't know the situation in the US, but in the UK there's been a determined focus by the ConDems to fight benefit fraud, by making it tougher to gain certain benefits. Now in theory this might sound like a good solution, but in practice it's had the unfortunate side effect that many people who are legitimately in need of these benefits have been unable to get them, in particular people who are disabled. This has had a knock on effect.

That's one of the more tougher problems facing a government who wants to encourage people back to work but doesn't want to punish those who cannot. Hopefully as communications get better and medical diagnosis gets better then this might improve, but the current situation of using private medical 'practitioners' to test people for disability benefits instead of actually believing the Doctor who diagnosed them as disabled in the first place...well it doesn't work very well at all. Perhaps better emphasis should be put on the initial diagnosis of disability, and that GPs (General Practitioners...aka your local Doctor) should actually be trusted by the government rather than having to bring in a second opinion.

I know we don't agree about pay rates, and that's fair enough, that's only one part of trying to create an equal society, and to be honest, it's a pretty latter stage thing anyway and not really something likely to ever happen because of human nature. Likewise a fully equal society, sadly, is something I don't think is actually possible because there will always be people who think that they are superior to other people because of factor x or y, but we all come into this world the same way, and we all wind up back in the dirt the same way at the end of it, quite why people need to divide themselves up into groups and judge other people based on what group they're in in the middle of it all is beyond me, and it's rather sad really. Imagine what we as a race could have achieved by now if there was just a bit more co-operation in the world?

Still, a guy can dream, and where we can I believe that we should aim for a more equal world, full equality is never going to happen, but that shouldn't stop us from trying to make what parts we can more equal for everyone. As I'm sure that many people do.

I'm sorry I never replied, I asked and you outlined some ideas. My job sometimes keeps me offline for a day or more. Plus, most of my online time is dealing with people going crazy because they don't like what someone else said in GT....

Ok, I am not going to pick this apart, I like many of your ideas. We probably agree more than we disagree. I guess it's a glass half full, or half empty perception thing.


I guess it's normal human nature for people to behave as you described, dividing themselves into groups and judging, competing. I don't see a problem, as long as none of them force me to contribute my time or energy for their ends.

I know there are needy people, and just like you, I really want to help them. But, where we differ is, I and many like me, feel the onus is on the needy to demonstrate their qualifications for assistance. And no, beggars cannot be choosers, as the old children's saying goes. I know that means a loss of a little dignity, but that comes with the territory. If a guy needs our money, he better be agreeable to our rules.

Anyway, we are talking about keeping crime down, I guess that means we have to pay off a percentage of the population not to rob and kill us. Why does being poor = criminal? I'm pretty close to poor, and I don't mind working 12 hours a day. Why should my tax money go to some drug dealing gangbanger in an inner city? I prefer to take violent criminals and give them free housing for life....apart from society that knows how to behave.

[Mr Quatro]

Consider this for gun control ... even folds down to fit in a back pack



http://rethinksurvival.com/the-ultim...verunder-link/

[August]

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

Consider this for gun control ... even folds down to fit in a back pack



http://rethinksurvival.com/the-ultim...verunder-link/

That is very neat!

[Oberon]

I imagine reloading might be a bit finicky though, getting the shells or individual bullets out of the stock. That's not necessarily a bad thing though, in an active shooter scenario that kind of delay gives the police time to react.

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

in an active shooter scenario that kind of delay gives the police time to react.

Is that your professional opinion?

Just remember that this is a lever action that, judging by the tube length, holds maybe 15-20 rounds of 22LR and it can be adapted for a bunch of different calibers too. Then there's the .12ga shotgun as backup. It's a more capable weapon than it's looks may imply.

[antikristuseke]

According to the Chiappa website it is a double barrel over/under where both barrels are singel shot and there is no magazine.
http://www.chiappafirearms.com/product/2677

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Oberon

I imagine reloading might be a bit finicky though, getting the shells or individual bullets out of the stock. That's not necessarily a bad thing though, in an active shooter scenario that kind of delay gives the police time to react.

Thats why I prefer to keep a semi-auto handy in case the police cannot respond fast enough to an active shooter situation.

[Aktungbby]

Correct! and the proper technique as with my single shot Sharps or trapdoor Springfield is to hold two extra rounds between the last two fingers of the trigger hand...in anticipation of a quick reload. Robert Redford amply demonstrates the technique in Out of Africa in the lion hunt scene with his double barreled rifle. Saves fumbling around in a clutch. I wish I owned that double barreled rifle! $100K and up these days if it's a Purdy!

[Mr Quatro]

I hope I put this in the right thread ... gun control is about guns too.

But this gun is very unique, even a blind man (pun) could use this gun.

X -Caliber® is designed for use in any condition and with any ammunition available.

Originally designed with two calibers, a rifled .22 LR and a smooth bore .12 GA -, this rifle can fire up to 12 different calibers thanks to the 8 steel adapters supplied.

In addition to the two original gauges, adapters allow you to shoot 8 pistol calibers ( .380 , 9 mm , .357Mag/.38SP , .40 S & W, .44 Mag, .45 ACP , .410/.45colt ) and two shotgun calibers (410 ga, 20ga), combining the flexibility of a shotgun and the power of a rifled gun.

all you need is a shooting vest with a pocket full bullets along with the optional adapter. Would this be legal to carry folded up in the trunk of the car?

There was a gun shop on TV out of Carlsbad, California (near Oceanside, California which is the US Marine base) that offers to sell you machine guns that are disassembled and it is legal.

Then they show you how to assemble the same gun they just sold you.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by August

Is that your professional opinion?

Just remember that this is a lever action that, judging by the tube length, holds maybe 15-20 rounds of 22LR and it can be adapted for a bunch of different calibers too. Then there's the .12ga shotgun as backup. It's a more capable weapon than it's looks may imply.

Well, I don't know about professional, but it's an opinion, I'll give it that.
It's a very adaptable weapon, the range of rounds it can fire is very impressive, but it looks like a single shot/reload function, although I might be wrong and you might be able to load multiple rounds.

Originally Posted by Aktungbby

Correct! and the proper technique as with my single shot Sharps or trapdoor Springfield is to hold two extra rounds between the last two fingers of the trigger hand...in anticipation of a quick reload. Robert Redford amply demonstrates the technique in Out of Africa in the lion hunt scene with his double barreled rifle. Saves fumbling around in a clutch. I wish I owned that double barreled rifle! $100K and up these days if it's a Purdy!

Sounds like a throw-back to the old bow and arrow technique, but in the post-Winchester era the speed difference between a single-shot and a repeating rifle is fairly big. I mean, even between lever action and automatic, if you look at the difference in the amount of rounds that a Garand and a Lee Enfield can put down field in the space of a few minutes.
Interesting form of weapon though, I honestly had never heard of a double-barreled rifle until now, must sacrifice a bit of long range accuracy but in the situation that Redford is in then it works well, much like the double barrel shotgun which is more lethal the closer to it you are.

Originally Posted by Mr Quatro

I hope I put this in the right thread ... gun control is about guns too.

But this gun is very unique, even a blind man (pun) could use this gun.



all you need is a shooting vest with a pocket full bullets along with the optional adapter. Would this be legal to carry folded up in the trunk of the car?

There was a gun shop on TV out of Carlsbad, California (near Oceanside, California which is the US Marine base) that offers to sell you machine guns that are disassembled and it is legal.

Then they show you how to assemble the same gun they just sold you.

I think this thread was more about the contentious issue of gun control in the United States rather than an appreciation of firearms themselves. We have two other threads for that:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=205808

And

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=204019

Although the former is a bit more serious than the latter which was started as an expression of exasperation at the number of seperate gun threads which were started around that time.

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Thats why I prefer to keep a semi-auto handy in case the police cannot respond fast enough to an active shooter situation.

That's fair enough, and is your right as an American citizen. Although one does have to wonder that if you're pointing a gun and shooting when the police show up, which person do they shoot?

[Aktungbby]

if you look at the difference in the amount of rounds that a Garand and a Lee Enfield can put down field in the space of a few minutes.

AHHH you English and your 'Mad Minute"; 300 yards is about it actually.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_minute

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

It's a very adaptable weapon, the range of rounds it can fire is very impressive, but it looks like a single shot/reload function, although I might be wrong and you might be able to load multiple rounds.

I was thinking it was a tube fed given that it has a lever action. I guess it could be just for looks?

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by August

I was thinking it was a tube fed given that it has a lever action. I guess it could be just for looks?

I think so, according to the link antikristuseke posted it's a single shot system and the butt just acts as storage rather than a feeding device.