Gun Control thread (merged many)

[Armistead]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

Armistead nailed it.

I was looking at a Winchester .270 that I was considering purchasing. It is owned "in the family", and it was handed to me by someone I know and trust. He handed it over and said "Its unloaded - I checked." First thing I did was double check it. If I have a firearm in my possession - I consider it loaded until I check it. No if's, ands or buts about it. Know what - he didn't take offense to that at all - nor would any other reasonable gun owner. Why? Because safety comes first.

People who do not take the responsibility of a firearm seriously - or are not confident in their ability to carry/use a firearm - often make choices like carrying unloaded - thinking its "safer". That leads them to assume that the firearm they carry is "safe" until they make it otherwise - which leads to the "its ok, its safe" attitude and thus - accidents with firearms.

Exactly...either way you choose, the gun is always loaded in your mind...to stray from this process is deadly. There is or should be no playing mind games on yourself dealing with guns...

[MH]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

People who do not take the responsibility of a firearm seriously - or are not confident in their ability to carry/use a firearm - often make choices like carrying unloaded - thinking its "safer". That leads them to assume that the firearm they carry is "safe" until they make it otherwise - which leads to the "its ok, its safe" attitude and thus - accidents with firearms.

Slogans...

Actually I don't really know what you talking about...
I can say though that there was a time when howling gun was second nature to me so maybe I lack this certain attitude but not the respect toward guns or insecurity.

Only the most natural skilled shooters have such ability, you and I don't have it....and none would use it in a life and death situation...

It is not so difficult. when it comes to shooting center of mass....if you don't have the skill you probably would not do much better with your preferred method.


I own no gun now though and that's fine....

[CaptainHaplo]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

This woman who liked to frequent the type of gun webblogs you are getting your information from thought that too.
She got shot by a two year old.

I kind of doubt it since she didn't treat the firearm with respect or safety. But since you made the claim....

Why don't you post a link to prove your accusation - or are you once again just making crap up as you go along to try and "prove" your point.....

@MH
Mythology, it does seem to be the topic of the faithful.

Gotta love it when someone admits they are no expert, then contradicts the experts. Just like we all get a good laugh when you are challenged and spend more time on semantics trying to untwist the knot in your knickers than you do actually making a point.

[GoldenRivet]

Carrying with and without a round in the chamber demo




for those who took a couple of minutes to actually watch...


the woman in the video cant draw her firearm on the participant until he presents her with a clear threat, and the confrontation must begin at about arms length

first she carries chambered - in the video he draws a knife, she draws her firearm. She shoots the man twice as he reaches her. But he is able to get off to slashes at her that contact her body. while she is injured by the knife, his wounds would be certainly incapacitating or even fatal

second she carries empty - in the video he draws a knife, advances on the woman and stabs her repeatedly, ultimately lowering her to the ground and stabbing her several more times - she is never once able to chamber a round and get off a shot at all.

additional videos are all over the net of people timing their shots with and without chambered rounds.

for the fastest most experienced carriers - at least 1 full second is required to rack the slide and present the loaded firearm and discharge it - 1 full second above their normal draw and shoot time - in a life and death situation this could make the difference

[MH]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

Gotta love it when someone admits they are no expert, then contradicts the experts.

There are all kind of experts....
Happy shooting though.

[CaptainHaplo]

Originally Posted by MH

Slogans...

Actually I don't really know what you talking about...
I can say though that there was a time when howling gun was second nature to me so maybe I lack this certain attitude but not the respect toward guns or insecurity.

If you choose to treat firearms as if they unloaded or in a casual manner - then you do lack a certain attitude - one that would qualify you as responsible with a firearm.

I am not sure what "howling gun" is or how it somehow qualifies you to speak on gun safety - but you admitted you are not expert. I linked you to one (of MANY) that gave examples of why your position was wrong. Argue all you like - the fact remains that your arguing with experts that say your wrong.

It is not so difficult. when it comes to shooting center of mass....if you don't have the skill you probably would not do much better with your preferred method.

Most people don't have the skill - which is why ownership and especially carrying a firearm comes with the responsibility to train with it - to know it and be able to operate it effectively and safely at any time. This is why most states have both a "book" and range proficiency requirement for concealed carry permits.

I own no gun now though and that's fine....

Yes it is - and actually is a bit of a relief.

To any and all other readers of this thread - take note of something. Do you find it most interesting that the people who are arguing against what the experts say is the safest way to treat firearms are the ones who don't actually own any guns? Quite ironic, isn't it?

Not only do civilian gun experts say carrying loaded is safest, but guess how your local police and sheriff deputies carry..... That's right - one ready to fly in an emergency. All the people YOU rely on to know how to use a gun safely - carry it the same way the civilian experts recommend. So if there is a question in your mind - go out to a range and learn, get trained on a firearm (even if you don't want to own one) and understand how seriously the vast majority of the "gun nuts" take safety and responsibility. You might find that we are nuts - about safety!

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by CaptainHaplo

To any and all other readers of this thread - take note of something. Do you find it most interesting that the people who are arguing against what the experts say is the safest way to treat firearms are the ones who don't actually own any guns? Quite ironic, isn't it?

Yes actually it is.

think i will hop on over to the horse racing forum and give some of the Jocky's expert advice. I mean i have never raced horses... but you just ride em right?


maybe all these guys stayed at a holiday inn last night

EDIT:

part of the problem with the majority of anti-gun folks - they have an irrational fear that they will argue about perpetually in an attempt to rationalize it.

[MH]

To any and all other readers of this thread - take note of something. Do you find it most interesting that the people who are arguing against what the experts say is the safest way to treat firearms are the ones who don't actually own any guns? Quite ironic, isn't it?

lol yeah.

[August]

Well I have been carrying for a long time and I still feel better with an empty chamber. If that makes me a bit slower to a fight then so be it.

[Armistead]

Originally Posted by MH

Slogans...





It is not so difficult. when it comes to shooting center of mass....if you don't have the skill you probably would not do much better with your preferred method.


I own no gun now though and that's fine....

No one shoots this way, except trick shooters and I know several of them. None would use this method except in performing in setup site. Even they, skilled, are honest enough to admit they would face some nervousness and the fact is, in life or death, you don't trick shoot...Seals don't do it, Swat, nor anyone else. The fact you admit you would proves you don't have the skill....really, it's laughable.....

[MH]

Originally Posted by August

Well I have been carrying for a long time and I still feel better with an empty chamber. If that makes me a bit slower to a fight then so be it.

You just might not get stabbed then....

[GoldenRivet]

certainly your right to decide.

carrying empty, carrying chambered, not carrying at all.

2 of the 3 options will send an immediate cease and desists order to a rapist or burglar

you're light years ahead of someone who doesnt carry

[GoldenRivet]

bottom line is... for every one of these stories where someone dies in a concealed carry related accident. i can post ten stories about lives that were saved by concealed carry

[CaptainHaplo]

Originally Posted by August

Well I have been carrying for a long time and I still feel better with an empty chamber. If that makes me a bit slower to a fight then so be it.

The key here is YOU feel comfortable. You understand the risks, you make a calculated decision based on that and what works for you. That I don't think anyone would disrespect. I sure won't. I know lots of people who carry, both OC and CC, and going with or without one chambered is a matter of personal choice.

But anyone making that personal choice needs to do so informed. Your last sentence says you accept that your choice may come with a cost in time should you need to use your firearm. You recognize that and have made your choice. I totally respect that.

The difference is you are making a personal choice about how you will protect yourself. I would still bet that when you are carrying a firearm, you still TREAT it like it's loaded. Correct me if I am wrong.

[MH]

No one shoots this way, except trick shooters and I know several of them. None would use this method except in performing in setup site. Even they, skilled, are honest enough to admit they would face some nervousness and the fact is, in life or death, you don't trick shoot...Seals don't do it, Swat, nor anyone else. The fact you admit you would proves you don't have the skill....really, it's laughable.....

Nonsense.
SEALS don't do it when riding OBL house or similar...agreed.