[REL] Open Horizons II

[gap]

Originally Posted by Josef von Posorschitz

Good work gap, very good

Thank you Josef, let's wait for feed-back by Trevally now

[Trevally.]

Thanks again Gap for your detailed post.

With the work we have been doing on resupplying, we now have 4 options.

1. Is resupply at axis port as normal. Marked on map as port.

2. Is to request a resupply from supply ships while on patrol.
We can now control the ship type to make it any unit in the roster and somewhat the name.
This ship will appear within 10km from the coords you are given when resupply is approved.
This ship can be attacked (prescripted as in campaign MG) and supply will fail. New supply areas can then be triggered into the campaign.

3. Is the new option when a German/axis ship can be in a neutral port. Marked on map as ship within port.
This can be a docked ship/unit of any type and name gived.
Full control over dates.

4. This is using the same method as 3 and can be placed anywhere on the map.
It can be a unit of anytype and name given.
It can be docked or patrol an area. (only as large as the control from the hidden spawn gen that can be made into a hidden navel base)
It will be named on the map as the ships name.
If attacked - the name will remain and the refuel - even if the ship is sunk.

[gap]

Originally Posted by Trevally.

Thanks again Gap for your detailed post.

With the work we have been doing on resupplying, we now have 4 options.

1. Is resupply at axis port as normal. Marked on map as port.

2. Is to request a resupply from supply ships while on patrol.
We can now control the ship type to make it any unit in the roster and somewhat the name.
This ship will appear within 10km from the coords you are given when resupply is approved.
This ship can be attacked (prescripted as in campaign MG) and supply will fail. New supply areas can then be triggered into the campaign.

3. Is the new option when a German/axis ship can be in a neutral port. Marked on map as ship within port.
This can be a docked ship/unit of any type and name gived.
Full control over dates.

4. This is using the same method as 3 and can be placed anywhere on the map.
It can be a unit of anytype and name given.
It can be docked or patrol an area. (only as large as the control from the hidden spawn gen that can be made into a hidden navel base)
It will be named on the map as the ships name.
If attacked - the name will remain and the refuel - even if the ship is sunk.

Thank you for your fast feed-back Trev,

so don't we have any control on dates using the 2nd method?
Can't you make a 'normal' ship, with its spawn dates and waypoints, to perform as a supply unit susceptible to enemy attacks (involving that if she is destroyed, refuelling from her won't be possible anymore)?

P.S: have you seen this discussion:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=199104

What about some escort, or spare parts delivery missions in OHII?

[Trevally.]

Originally Posted by gap

Thank you for your fast feed-back Trev,

so don't we have any control on dates using the 2nd method?

No - when set within a campaign - it is there for the whole campaign

Can't you make a 'normal' ship, with its spawn dates and waypoints, to perform as a supply unit susceptible to enemy attacks (involving that if she is destroyed, refuelling from her won't be possible anymore)?

No - the resupply ships must be called into the game (ready to spawn) at campaign creation stage (so locked into the layer mis)

The tricks I can use require making invisible naval bases locked into the paths (nodes) that all units follow. Then place a ship ontop of it. This gives the ilusion that you get resupplied from the ship (option 3 & 4)

P.S: have you seen this discussion:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=199104

What about some escort, or spare parts delivery missions in OHII?

we have an escort objective in The Battle of the Med and a parts delivery in Monsun Gruppe

There are many new things been added to OHII that im sure users have not yet seen. Everyone keeps playing Coastal Waters or Happy Times

[gap]

Originally Posted by Trevally.

No - when set within a campaign - it is there for the whole campaign

Okay, the point was making refitting units and locations to change during the same campaign, so if we played the same objective at different time-frames, different refuelling options would have been available.

Originally Posted by Trevally.

No - the resupply ships must be called into the game (ready to spawn) at campaign creation stage (so locked into the layer mis)

The tricks I can use require making invisible naval bases locked into the paths (nodes) that all units follow. Then place a ship ontop of it. This gives the ilusion that you get resupplied from the ship (option 3 & 4)

yes, I think I see your point: by linking any ship to an hidden base (wich gives us full control on dates through the start/end settings in its cfg file), we can get the illusion to be refitting from the ship, while we are actually resupplied at base. Is this correct?

As noted by you, there are two problems though:

1 - bases cannot move: we can only set different hidden bases to spawn at different dates/locations but, unlike ships spawned with your 2nd method, those locations wouldn't be "random" within a given range, but linked to nodes' positions.

2 - what is worst, the refitting would be available even if the linked ship is sunk, as long as the hidden base is still there

Peraphs I got a better idea, though I am not sure that it would work:

you stated that using the 2nd method we can restrict the type of supply units to be used for it... well, then we could clone an existing ship, give it the appropriate start/end dates in its roster cfg file, and assign it to any set refitting. The question is: how would react the game, if it tried to spawn a supply unit outside its start/end range? Would it spawn her anyway, would it crush to desktop ...or as desired, it would not spawn her at all, and generate instead a refitting failed event?

Those clone units would be used solely for any refitting location/date range group, as seen on the map I've posted yesterday. So we need a minimum of 5, maybe 10 if we wanted to add further variety, ad hoc ships.
But cloning ship definitions got no secret anyway, and can be done using just notepad.

What do you think?

Originally Posted by Trevally.

we have an escort objective in The Battle of the Med and a parts delivery in Monsun Gruppe

I was aware of it

...but we are missing this kind of objective/side mission in the Atlantic. I think it would be nice having to look for/sail together with our merchant raiders or blockade runners and having to defend them from enemy attacks. If you like the idea I can look for historical information on it

Originally Posted by Trevally.

There are many new things been added to OHII that im sure users have not yet seen. Everyone keeps playing Coastal Waters or Happy Times

That's true!

[Trevally.]

Originally Posted by gap

Okay, the point was making refitting units and locations to change during the same campaign, so if we played the same objective at different time-frames, different refuelling options would have been available.

the only way I can see this being done is to make the refuel units within a layer that gets loaded on patrol.
This is how the missions work - when you click "request mission" in the brief room - a new layer is loaded into the campagn that can do anything - missions/refuel/triggers etc. This is how I made the refuel attack work in MG.

The downside of this is it is a lot of work for one off happenings. So a workaround would be to make a template mission with dated named refuel and paste this info into every mission script for the campaign in question.

yes, I think I see your point: by linking any ship to an hidden base (wich gives us full control on dates through the start/end settings in its cfg file), we can get the illusion to be refitting from the ship, while we are actually resupplied at base. Is this correct?

As noted by you, there are two problems though:

1 - bases cannot move: we can only set different hidden bases to spawn at different dates/locations but, unlike ships spawned with your 2nd method, those locations wouldn't be "random" within a given range, but linked to nodes' positions.

2 - what is worst, the refitting would be available even if the linked ship is sunk, as long as the hidden base is still there

but there can be a threat zone used to prevent an attack

Peraphs I got a better idea, though I am not sure that it would work:

you stated that using the 2nd method we can restrict the type of supply units to be used for it... well, then we could clone an existing ship, give it the appropriate start/end dates in its roster cfg file, and assign it to any set refitting. The question is: how would react the game, if it tried to spawn a supply unit outside its start/end range? Would it spawn her anyway, would it crush to desktop ...or as desired, it would not spawn her at all, and generate instead a refitting failed event?

Yes - you can clone any ship type and use that to be a named ship from a date you would want.
The supply commands are calling the ships by UnitClass, so you cold clone any or as many ships as you want and give then a new class name. Only these ships would then be called as a supply ship

When you clone the ship - you must also give it a group type. Here is where it could get pulled into traffic with the normal traffic systems.
Im not sure if we can make new ones - it would be good to have a new section for sully ships etc

 
;Warships
Type0=Patrol Craft
Type1=Corvette
Type2=Frigate
Type3=Destroyer Escort
Type4=Destroyer
Type5=Minesweeper
Type6=Light Cruiser
Type7=Heavy Cruiser
Type8=Escort Carrier
Type9=Fleet Carrier
Type10=Battlecruiser
Type11=Battleship
Type12=Minelayer
Type13=Auxiliary Cruiser
Type14=Special OPS Boat
Type15=Landing Craft
Type16=Elite Patrol Craft
Type17=Elite Destroyer escort
Type18=Elite Escort Carrier
Type19=Super Fleet carrier
Type20=Super Battleship
;Merchant ships
Type100=Replenishment
Type101=Tanker
Type102=Cargo
Type103=Troop Transport
Type104=Coastal Vessel
Type105=Life Raft
Type106=Survivor
Type107=Z ships
Type108=Rare Cargo ship
Type109=Rare Troop Transport
Type110=Environmental
;Submarine
Type200=Submarine
Type201=Replenishment Submarine
Type202=Missile Submarine
Type203=Environmental
;Air
Type300=Fighter
Type301=Bomber
Type302=Dive Bomber
Type303=Torpedo Bomber
Type304=Patrol
Type305=Helicopter
Type306=Environmental
Type307=Elite Patrol Aircraft
Type308=Elite Naval Aircraft
;Land
Type400=Vehicle
Type401=Tank
Type402=Armored Personnel Carrier
Type403=Artillery
Type404=Anti-aircraft
Type405=Missile
Type406=Airbase
Type407=Naval Base
Type408=Environmental
;Ordnance
Type500=Minefield
Type501=AntiSub Net

Those clone units would be used solely for any refitting location/date range group, as seen on the map I've posted yesterday. So we need a minimum of 5, maybe 10 if we wanted to add further variety, ad hoc ships.
But cloning ship definitions got no secret anyway, and can be done using just notepad.

What do you think?

I was aware of it

...but we are missing this kind of objective/side mission in the Atlantic. I think it would be nice having to look for/sail together with our merchant raiders or blockade runners and having to defend them from enemy attacks. If you like the idea I can look for historical information on it

I could add these as missions I like working in the missions sytle of the campaign - it adds a challenge

[gap]

Originally Posted by Trevally.

the only way I can see this being done is to make the refuel units within a layer that gets loaded on patrol.
This is how the missions work - when you click "request mission" in the brief room - a new layer is loaded into the campagn that can do anything - missions/refuel/triggers etc. This is how I made the refuel attack work in MG.

The downside of this is it is a lot of work for one off happenings. So a workaround would be to make a template mission with dated named refuel and paste this info into every mission script for the campaign in question.

You are a clever guy

Originally Posted by Trevally.

Yes - you can clone any ship type and use that to be a named ship from a date you would want.
The supply commands are calling the ships by UnitClass, so you cold clone any or as many ships as you want and give then a new class name. Only these ships would then be called as a supply ship

We have only to choice wich ones of the units featured in SH5 + OHII are more suitable for standing in for the various WWII German supply ships I've listed a few posts back.
Some of them, like the auxiliary cruiser Pinguin and the Dithmarschen class tanker are already there. Some other (Belchen, Charlotte Schliemann, etc.) have been created for SHIII, and Uekel might have convertet them for SH5 yet...

Originally Posted by Trevally.

When you clone the ship - you must also give it a group type. Here is where it could get pulled into traffic with the normal traffic systems.
Im not sure if we can make new ones - it would be good to have a new section for sully ships etc

There should already be a specific unit type for supply ships:

Type100=Replenishment

We can try to add new types, but I suspect that they are somehow hardcoded in game: I remember that there were some issues changing unit types for ships inported from SHIV. IIRC, if they were assigned to the wrong type, they couldn't be heard on hydrophone

Anyway, what would be the problem if the cloned supply units are spawned as well in the regular German traffic, other than not being able to refit from them?

Originally Posted by Trevally.

I could add these as missions I like working in the missions sytle of the campaign - it adds a challenge

I am starting my research!

[Silent Steel]

Staggering work going on, even if my limited intelligence doesn't allow me to follow in detail.

Impressive and fabulous.

[gap]

Originally Posted by Silent Steel

Staggering work going on, even if my limited intelligence doesn't allow me to follow in detail.

Impressive and fabulous.

Normally I would say "let's cross our fingers and stay tuned", but the involvement of Trevally in any project is itself a guaranty of success. All he needs are the right inputs!

[Trevally.]

Originally Posted by gap

You are a clever guy

We have only to choice wich ones of the units featured in SH5 + OHII are more suitable for standing in for the various WWII German supply ships I've listed a few posts back.
Some of them, like the auxiliary cruiser Pinguin and the Dithmarschen class tanker are already there. Some other (Belchen, Charlotte Schliemann, etc.) have been created for SHIII, and Uekel might have convertet them for SH5 yet...

Yes - we do have most and Uekel will have many more.
HE HAS ADDED HUNDREDS OF SHIPS TO SH5

There should already be a specific unit type for supply ships:

Type100=Replenishment

We can try to add new types, but I suspect that they are somehow hardcoded in game: I remember that there were some issues changing unit types for ships inported from SHIV. IIRC, if they were assigned to the wrong type, they couldn't be heard on hydrophone

Anyway, what would be the problem if the cloned supply units are spawned as well in the regular German traffic, other than not being able to refit from them?

Just done a quick check and type100 is the german tanker and only shows in a few german convoys and some single ship runs - so type 100 looks good for this

I am starting my research!

Originally Posted by Silent Steel

Staggering work going on, even if my limited intelligence doesn't allow me to follow in detail.

Impressive and fabulous.

Originally Posted by gap

Normally I would say "let's cross our fingers and stay tuned", but the involvement of Trevally in any project is itself a guaranty of success. All he needs are the right inputs!

Thanks for your kind words guys - but Earth is still in danger.
I have just built my new ship - Firestorm:-


I am still taking notes and will continue work on OHII - after I have saved earth

[gap]

Originally Posted by Trevally.

Yes - we do have most and Uekel will have many more.
HE HAS ADDED HUNDREDS OF SHIPS TO SH5

are you meaning that SH5 got more than seven different merchant types, by any chance?

Originally Posted by Trevally.

Just done a quick check and type100 is the german tanker and only shows in a few german convoys and some single ship runs - so type 100 looks good for this

Originally Posted by Trevally.

Thanks for your kind words guys - but Earth is still in danger.
I have just built my new ship - Firestorm:-

COOL!

Originally Posted by Trevally.

I am still taking notes and will continue work on OHII - after I have saved earth

Take your time with OHII mate, and focus on your main mission: our lives are in your hands!

[Trevally.]

[Robin40]

Originally Posted by Trevally.

Yes - we do have most and Uekel will have many more.
HE HAS ADDED HUNDREDS OF SHIPS TO SH5





Just done a quick check and type100 is the german tanker and only shows in a few german convoys and some single ship runs - so type 100 looks good for this









Thanks for your kind words guys - but Earth is still in danger.
I have just built my new ship - Firestorm:-


I am still taking notes and will continue work on OHII - after I have saved earth

do you mean that there are hundreds of ships in OHII?

or that is there a specific mod for that?

[Silent Steel]

Originally Posted by Trevally.

...I have just built my new ship...

Please, don't add this one to OHII.
Doesn't seem to fit in a WWII storyline

[Cybermat47]

Originally Posted by Silent Steel

Staggering work going on, even if my limited intelligence doesn't allow me to follow in detail.

welcome to the club.