Firearms yes or no

[Hitman]

My opinion is that firearms are no less legitimate as a means of self defense than any other. Am I wrong?

I can give you a very clear answer from the legal point of view -as far as spanish laws concern, of course, as those are the ones I know- and that is: If you are on a one vs. one situation, as a general rule if you use a gun where the other has no weapons you are screwed legally. The exemption of criminal responsability would never be appreciated as complete, and as such you would more than probably jailed, even if acting in self defence.

a skilled Martial Artist cannot accidentally kill someone

I agree with all you said except with the above quote. My experience tells me that as long as any risky action is involved, a probaility -even if minor- of hurting or even killing someone, exists. I can well remember when sparring at the boxing club how some guys got "accidentally" K.O. even using helmet and big gloves. It sure was their fault by doing an incorrect movement the adversary could not expect -a novice move many times- but the result didn't change that

Accidents happen, and martial arts are an activity prone to them, trust me.

[1mPHUNit0]

No dear
A gun in hand change the situation.
Change:
Stability
Dynamics
Calm
knowledge

[ASWnut101]

Yes, it changes it from someone robbing your house to that someone leaving the house, either to the hospital or in a body bag.

Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey

Well I'll have to remember that in case I murder someone, I can say I was defending myself so it was ok.

What is your definition of murder Penelope? I was talking about self defense.

[1mPHUNit0]

Accidents happen, and martial arts are an activity prone to them, trust me.

No, its not so
There are position of blocking
and others positions that kill noting even if you want

[1mPHUNit0]

What is your definition of murder Penelope? I was talking about self defense.

Bullets of Columbine say noting to you?

[TteFAboB]

Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey

a skilled Martial Artist cannot accidentally kill someone

Ask Skybird.

Waste-gate what do you mean by worthy? "Legitimate"? In a position of self-defense, I don't recognize the authority of anybody but me to judge the legitimacy of my actions.

Considering the other forms to be worthy, then it's worthy aswell. A dedicated gunslinger can defeat a pack of dedicated swordsmen or dedicated hand-to-hand fighters:

Learn to shoot from the hip and you can engage in CQB. The cowboy wins: . And the fat cowboy is slowly getting there:

[ASWnut101]

Bullets of Columbine say noting to you?

This <LINK> says nothing to you?

[Penelope_Grey]

The legal definition is my definition of murder Waste Gate, that is my definition of murder, the unlawful killing of one human by another, and my reply was to ASWnut101.

He was saying in self defence he has the right to kill someone, to actually point a gun at them and kill them deliberately, which is outrageous. Nobody has the right to kill someone, you may have a right to carry a gun but not to kill.

Originally Posted by 1mPHUNit0

Bullets of Columbine say noting to you?

Pal, I live within two miles of Columbine HS and go by it at least three times per week. The people involved in the killings were criminals and if there is a better case for allowing responsible people to have and use firearms I cannot think of one.

The deputy placed in the school before hand was the first to run away.

[1mPHUNit0]

This <LINK> says nothing to you?

I ignore you ...if you understand what it means

[ASWnut101]

So you understand what I'm saying?

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Originally Posted by ASWnut101

I agree. You can't punch or kick someone across a room...

You can if you're Chuck Norris :p


Anyway, this is a debate which has been raging for years. Its my opinion that a firearm is a legitamate defense, yet one which should be used as a real last resort. Why make that burglar's death quick?

But seriously, in response to Penelope's post, firearms shouldnt be used for outright homicide. At most, a limb shot would be enough, I'd imagine.

[ASWnut101]

What's easier to hit? A arm/leg or the torso?

Originally Posted by Penelope_Grey

The legal definition is my definition of murder Waste Gate, that is my definition of murder, the unlawful killing of one human by another, and my reply was to ASWnut101.

He was saying in self defence he has the right to kill someone, to actually point a gun at them and kill them deliberately, which is outrageous. Nobody has the right to kill someone, you may have a right to carry a gun but not to kill.

Ok. What is the unlawfull taking of life? Is self defense unlawfull? Is taking of another life unlawfull when it is self defense?