GWX KC Edition - Depth Charges

Mowgli · 04-22-25, 06:21 AM

I have just spent several hours evading a J Class destroyer in calm weather. It was almost impossible to shake it but I got away in the end with some damage.
Because of the length of the attack I had a chance to make several notes.
It seemed the DD had endless depth charges, I counted at least 40 explosions and so afterwards looked up how many they carried - 45 according to wikipedia. So how does the game allocated DC to destroyers or are they unlimited?

Next I noticed in the numerous attacks that the time from the warning of depth charge in the water varied. At the end at 110 metres it took 38 seconds after being dropped before the explosion.
With this information could I calculate the depth settings of the DC and so adjust my depth in between.

I used SOP to evade.

Hooston · 04-22-25, 08:59 AM

The charges are limited, I believe to 50 per escort. This is in the config files somewhere but I can't find it. When it has run out the destroyer will keep attacking but not drop anything. Each escort will go away when it has had no contact for about 20 minutes, so run silent run deep as soon as they start attacking the wrong place.
The real life number of charges varied tremendously, from about 20 on a 1939 fleet destroyer to 100 or more on a late war ASW ship. Individual captains would often squeeze a few more charges onboard and take a risk with stability. So 50 is not a bad choice. Towards the end of the war some escorts were able to reload from merchantmen in the convoy in calm weather.
IRL guessing the depth of the target was educated guesswork, based on the distance at which the submarine disappeared below the ASDIC beam, until late in the war. The charges would thus be dropped with a large spread of depths. The charges were not very accurate in terms of depth in any case, with settings typically at 50 feet intervals. in game the charges are very accurate in depth terms and you can dodge with a 20m depth change as the escort runs in. Particularly useful if caught in shallow water, but very unrealistic.

...oh and you can go A LOT deeper than 110m!!!!

Mowgli · 04-22-25, 09:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hooston

...oh and you can go A LOT deeper than 110m!!!!

Thanks for the reply, well I counted about 42 but I was really interested in the timing of the explosions after they had been dropped because, if for example in my case it took 38 seconds to explode at 110 metres (I know I could have gone deeper but I start at 80 and gradually go down) then I have options to either raise or lower the depth.

Kpt. Lehmann · 04-22-25, 03:04 PM

Hi guys.... Mowgli & Hooston.

It has been a very long time since I set the DC parameters.
Believe it or not, I actually loosened up the "laser accuracy" of the DC's in GWX 3.0 ----> GWX-KC. The sink rates of the common depth charge are also very very close to real life values. I may have increased the sink rate and blast radius a smidge.... but that was only because ASW vessels when moving slow and dropping DC's would sometimes blow their own sterns off.
That in turn made for unrealistically vulnerable targets.

I'd rather not speak on exact parameter settings though, because I don't want to ruin your immersion.

In any case, I think that the memory of the old stock SH3 SUPER-deadly DC's has been more or less lost over time.

I am really glad you are enjoying yourselves though.

Mowgli · 04-23-25, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kpt. Lehmann

Hi guys.... Mowgli & Hooston.

I am really glad you are enjoying yourselves though.

Most certainly am and it is super stable, you did a great job. Thank you.
Any plans to add to it, although I cannot think of anything of the top off my head.

Tabris · 04-25-25, 11:28 AM

Thanks for bringing this up. A few weeks ago I lost a duel to a lone DD off the West African coast. I counted the bombs, as one does when fighting a single escort. We were sunk after 110 bombs. 110. I did not note the exact type of vessel, but it was one of those interwar DDs. So A&B or C&D, possibly V&W.

I looked at the relevant Library files in S3D immediately after. I am not a pro modder, so I make no strong assertions here, but it seems each DC launcher "weapon" (that which occupies a node in the ship's .eqp file) contains 40 bombs. If I'm correct, that means that DD attacking me still had 130 bombs left, as he had four K-guns and two DC racks, totaling 240 bombs. Totally ludicrous, if true. This would mean the later dedicated convoy escorts like JC Butler and Evarts, which have 8x K-guns and 2x racks, would have 400 bombs! It also means that dedicated fleet DDs like Tribal, which have only modest ASW weapons (two K-guns, one DC rack) are carrying four of five times as many bombs as they could historically.

After much thought and calculation, I changed the number of bombs per weapons station down from 40 to 12. It's my hope that this doesn't nerf the AI too much, but it should make outlasting the enemy's ammunition at least possible. This way, Modified Black Swan would have 120 bombs, which is still 10 more than they carried in real life. I have yet to playtest the change but I'll do so soon and report back.

- Tabris

04-22-25, 06:21 AM	#1
Mowgli Sparks Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: South Wales Posts: 248 Downloads: 158 Uploads: 0	GWX KC Edition - Depth Charges I have just spent several hours evading a J Class destroyer in calm weather. It was almost impossible to shake it but I got away in the end with some damage. Because of the length of the attack I had a chance to make several notes. It seemed the DD had endless depth charges, I counted at least 40 explosions and so afterwards looked up how many they carried - 45 according to wikipedia. So how does the game allocated DC to destroyers or are they unlimited? Next I noticed in the numerous attacks that the time from the warning of depth charge in the water varied. At the end at 110 metres it took 38 seconds after being dropped before the explosion. With this information could I calculate the depth settings of the DC and so adjust my depth in between. I used SOP to evade. __________________ Now this is the Law of the Jungle -- as old and as true as the sky; And the Wolf that shall keep it may prosper, but the Wolf that shall break it must die. As the creeper that girdles the tree-trunk the Law runneth forward and back -- For the strength of the Pack is the Wolf, and the strength of the Wolf is the Pack.

04-22-25, 03:04 PM	#4
Kpt. Lehmann GWX Project Director Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: The Republic of Texas Posts: 6,991 Downloads: 124 Uploads: 0	Hi guys.... Mowgli & Hooston. It has been a very long time since I set the DC parameters. Believe it or not, I actually loosened up the "laser accuracy" of the DC's in GWX 3.0 ----> GWX-KC. The sink rates of the common depth charge are also very very close to real life values. I may have increased the sink rate and blast radius a smidge.... but that was only because ASW vessels when moving slow and dropping DC's would sometimes blow their own sterns off. That in turn made for unrealistically vulnerable targets. I'd rather not speak on exact parameter settings though, because I don't want to ruin your immersion. In any case, I think that the memory of the old stock SH3 SUPER-deadly DC's has been more or less lost over time. I am really glad you are enjoying yourselves though. __________________ www.thegreywolves.com All you need is good men. - Heinrich Lehmann-Willenbrock

04-22-25, 08:59 AM	#2
Hooston 中国水兵 Join Date: Jun 2020 Posts: 274 Downloads: 16 Uploads: 0	The charges are limited, I believe to 50 per escort. This is in the config files somewhere but I can't find it. When it has run out the destroyer will keep attacking but not drop anything. Each escort will go away when it has had no contact for about 20 minutes, so run silent run deep as soon as they start attacking the wrong place. The real life number of charges varied tremendously, from about 20 on a 1939 fleet destroyer to 100 or more on a late war ASW ship. Individual captains would often squeeze a few more charges onboard and take a risk with stability. So 50 is not a bad choice. Towards the end of the war some escorts were able to reload from merchantmen in the convoy in calm weather. IRL guessing the depth of the target was educated guesswork, based on the distance at which the submarine disappeared below the ASDIC beam, until late in the war. The charges would thus be dropped with a large spread of depths. The charges were not very accurate in terms of depth in any case, with settings typically at 50 feet intervals. in game the charges are very accurate in depth terms and you can dodge with a 20m depth change as the escort runs in. Particularly useful if caught in shallow water, but very unrealistic. ...oh and you can go A LOT deeper than 110m!!!!

04-25-25, 11:28 AM	#6
Tabris Machinist's Mate Join Date: Jan 2020 Location: Oregon, USA Posts: 130 Downloads: 180 Uploads: 0	Thanks for bringing this up. A few weeks ago I lost a duel to a lone DD off the West African coast. I counted the bombs, as one does when fighting a single escort. We were sunk after 110 bombs. 110. I did not note the exact type of vessel, but it was one of those interwar DDs. So A&B or C&D, possibly V&W. I looked at the relevant Library files in S3D immediately after. I am not a pro modder, so I make no strong assertions here, but it seems each DC launcher "weapon" (that which occupies a node in the ship's .eqp file) contains 40 bombs. If I'm correct, that means that DD attacking me still had 130 bombs left, as he had four K-guns and two DC racks, totaling 240 bombs. Totally ludicrous, if true. This would mean the later dedicated convoy escorts like JC Butler and Evarts, which have 8x K-guns and 2x racks, would have 400 bombs! It also means that dedicated fleet DDs like Tribal, which have only modest ASW weapons (two K-guns, one DC rack) are carrying four of five times as many bombs as they could historically. After much thought and calculation, I changed the number of bombs per weapons station down from 40 to 12. It's my hope that this doesn't nerf the AI too much, but it should make outlasting the enemy's ammunition at least possible. This way, Modified Black Swan would have 120 bombs, which is still 10 more than they carried in real life. I have yet to playtest the change but I'll do so soon and report back. - Tabris