Early War - Merchants with Veteran crews?

tat501 · 07-18-16, 10:20 AM

Question says it all.

Just started playing SH4 after a long break - with TMO. Been playing a lot of SH5 so I'm kind of used to blind merchants.

Its my second war patrol - early March 1942. So far I've sunk two merchants for a combined total of 12000 tons. Quite happy with that considering no map contacts on.

However - the problem I've had is that I've been had my persicope spotted by both of them - from 2500+ yards or so - in pretty difficult conditions to spot periscopes - this most recent one it was dawn and I was in the dark with the sun rising behind the merchant. I should have been invisible but it spotted me and started zigzagging. I rather rashly surfaced and went at it with the deckgun - but 4 of my gunners were killed by their machine guns before I sank her.

Is that spotting behaviour normal for TMO? Should I be a lot more disciplined with my scope at those distances? I had it down - was listening on hydro until it crossed where I wanted to shoot from - just raised the scope to confirm it was still on the same course and instantly she saw me.

cdrsubron7 · 07-18-16, 02:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tat501

Question says it all.

Just started playing SH4 after a long break - with TMO. Been playing a lot of SH5 so I'm kind of used to blind merchants.

Its my second war patrol - early March 1942. So far I've sunk two merchants for a combined total of 12000 tons. Quite happy with that considering no map contacts on.

However - the problem I've had is that I've been had my persicope spotted by both of them - from 2500+ yards or so - in pretty difficult conditions to spot periscopes - this most recent one it was dawn and I was in the dark with the sun rising behind the merchant. I should have been invisible but it spotted me and started zigzagging. I rather rashly surfaced and went at it with the deckgun - but 4 of my gunners were killed by their machine guns before I sank her.

Is that spotting behaviour normal for TMO? Should I be a lot more disciplined with my scope at those distances? I had it down - was listening on hydro until it crossed where I wanted to shoot from - just raised the scope to confirm it was still on the same course and instantly she saw me.

You'll find all things in TMO with the bar raised. This was Ducimus's vision. You'll think that the Japanese whether merchant or naval vessel are physic most of the time. That's the way TMO is.

Quote:

Should I be a lot more disciplined with my scope at those distances?

Probably, a good idea.

Rockin Robbins · 07-18-16, 03:18 PM

Tat, never forget that TMO is not a historical accuracy mod. It is a difficulty mod.

tat501 · 07-25-16, 02:01 PM

Yeah thanks for that guys. It certainly made it more difficult - but I just felt it was a bit silly that I got spotted by two merchants from the distance and in the conditions I did. Understanding its to make the game more difficult I accept it.

Tonnage levels are still way too high so bringing them down a bit is ok by me. It means I'll have to learn to play a bit more patiently I suppose.

max-peck · 07-25-16, 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tat501

Yeah thanks for that guys. It certainly made it more difficult - but I just felt it was a bit silly that I got spotted by two merchants from the distance and in the conditions I did. Understanding its to make the game more difficult I accept it.

Tonnage levels are still way too high so bringing them down a bit is ok by me. It means I'll have to learn to play a bit more patiently I suppose.

Just a another thing to mention
As well as periscope exposure another thing that can get you spotted is if your conning tower broaches
In rough weather (7ms winds to 15ms winds) the waves are so high that when you are in a trough your conning tower is very visible for a few seconds

Maybe they saw this?

Armistead · 07-28-16, 07:04 PM

Been awhile since I've played. As far as crew ratings, seems they rank from poor to elite, with TMO using a lot of Vets. However, most merchants are ranked competent, all of them as far as I know, with the Veteran settings used for many escorts. It's possible you were heard on passive sonar or you just left your scope up too long. I can't remember the keys that control the scope manually, not the ones that move it up and down, but the ones you can control the scope movements... I used those so when I had to raise the scope, I just broke water enough and lowered it just under the water line for my next quick look without it going totally up and down.

mikesn9 · 07-29-16, 06:18 AM

'page up', 'page down' move scope up and down slowly.

I use that too, especially in calm weather.

Cybermat47 · 07-29-16, 06:20 AM

Damn eastern magic

Gray Lensman · 07-29-16, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikesn9

'page up', 'page down' move scope up and down slowly.

I use that too, especially in calm weather.

This reminds me, I've been meaning to ask, is there a way to move the "night" scope up and down slowly also?

propbeanie · 07-29-16, 09:34 AM

<Insert> and <Delete> keys are used in stock, and a lot of mods. I don't remember about TMO though...

Rockin Robbins · 07-29-16, 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by propbeanie

<Insert> and <Delete> keys are used in stock, and a lot of mods. I don't remember about TMO though...

It's the same.

07-18-16, 10:20 AM	#1
tat501 Helmsman Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: London Posts: 108 Downloads: 275 Uploads: 0	Early War - Merchants with Veteran crews? Question says it all. Just started playing SH4 after a long break - with TMO. Been playing a lot of SH5 so I'm kind of used to blind merchants. Its my second war patrol - early March 1942. So far I've sunk two merchants for a combined total of 12000 tons. Quite happy with that considering no map contacts on. However - the problem I've had is that I've been had my persicope spotted by both of them - from 2500+ yards or so - in pretty difficult conditions to spot periscopes - this most recent one it was dawn and I was in the dark with the sun rising behind the merchant. I should have been invisible but it spotted me and started zigzagging. I rather rashly surfaced and went at it with the deckgun - but 4 of my gunners were killed by their machine guns before I sank her. Is that spotting behaviour normal for TMO? Should I be a lot more disciplined with my scope at those distances? I had it down - was listening on hydro until it crossed where I wanted to shoot from - just raised the scope to confirm it was still on the same course and instantly she saw me.

07-18-16, 03:18 PM	#3
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,900 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	Tat, never forget that TMO is not a historical accuracy mod. It is a difficulty mod. __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

07-28-16, 07:04 PM	#6
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Been awhile since I've played. As far as crew ratings, seems they rank from poor to elite, with TMO using a lot of Vets. However, most merchants are ranked competent, all of them as far as I know, with the Veteran settings used for many escorts. It's possible you were heard on passive sonar or you just left your scope up too long. I can't remember the keys that control the scope manually, not the ones that move it up and down, but the ones you can control the scope movements... I used those so when I had to raise the scope, I just broke water enough and lowered it just under the water line for my next quick look without it going totally up and down. __________________ You see my dog don't like people laughing. He gets the crazy idea you're laughing at him. Now if you apologize like I know you're going to, I might convince him that you really didn't mean it.

07-29-16, 06:20 AM	#8
Cybermat47 Willing Webfooted Beast Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Australia Posts: 5,408 Downloads: 300 Uploads: 23	Damn eastern magic __________________ Historical TWoS Gameplay Guide: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=2572620 Historical FotRSU Gameplay Guide: https://www.subsim.com/radioroom/sho....php?p=2713394

07-29-16, 09:34 AM	#10
propbeanie CTD - it's not just a job Join Date: May 2016 Location: One hour from Music City USA! Posts: 10,109 Downloads: 451 Uploads: 2	<Insert> and <Delete> keys are used in stock, and a lot of mods. I don't remember about TMO though... __________________ "...and bollocks to the naysayers" - Jimbuna

07-25-16, 02:01 PM	#4
tat501 Helmsman Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: London Posts: 108 Downloads: 275 Uploads: 0	Yeah thanks for that guys. It certainly made it more difficult - but I just felt it was a bit silly that I got spotted by two merchants from the distance and in the conditions I did. Understanding its to make the game more difficult I accept it. Tonnage levels are still way too high so bringing them down a bit is ok by me. It means I'll have to learn to play a bit more patiently I suppose.

07-29-16, 06:18 AM	#7
mikesn9 Sonar Guy Join Date: Feb 2013 Location: Sarasota Florida Posts: 391 Downloads: 68 Uploads: 0	'page up', 'page down' move scope up and down slowly. I use that too, especially in calm weather.