A German navy for Down Under?

[Skybird]

German newspaper Die Welt reports Merkel has strongly lobbied for Australia buying 12 submarines of the new type 216/218. Her main argument was that Germany, different to Japan - from which Australia also considers to buy - , would be a truly neutral actor on the diplomatic playing field that Australia's neighbourhood is, with the more and more evident confrontation between China and Japan being a point of major consideration.

The boats of this new, yet to build class, are bigger than the 212/214, being 90m long and having 4000 tons (212: 65m, 1950 tons), and have been designed to meet extended endurance demands especially for possible delivery to Australian, India and Canada. By what is known about the type 216/218, they are referred to as the most modern submarines there are. The deal would be worth 14 billion minimum, and would keep the German boatmaker floating, sorry: diving - for years to come. A first customer assessing the new boat class is the navy of Singapore, having ordered two boats for testing. Further possible customers are Poland (with a max of leasing 212s and 218s) and - BIG GULP - Saudi Arabia (they may possibly buy up to 16 !!! boats).

However, these decisions are less militarily founded, but domestic politics have an influence that is decisive. Having a submarine building industry branch, I would be surprised if the Australians in the end indeed would buy foreign submarines instead of building their own Collins II diving thing and keeping the construction jobs inside their country. The German probably have the best boat to offer. But it will not help them.

[Oberon]

They'll need sailors for them first...

[Cybermat47]

Australian U-boats? So much yes.

[d@rk51d3]

Originally Posted by Skybird

However, these decisions are less militarily founded, but domestic politics have an influence that is decisive. Having a submarine building industry branch, I would be surprised if the Australians in the end indeed would buy foreign submarines instead of building their own Collins II diving thing and keeping the construction jobs inside their country. The German probably have the best boat to offer. But it will not help them.

Correct.

It would be political suicide to import any subs, especially after the last debacle over the consideration of importing hull modules from Japan................... not that I'm opposed to any political suicide.

[nikimcbee]

What they want:

What they can afford:

[Jeff-Groves]

What they have on the drawing board.

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Oberon

They'll need sailors for them first...

Sailors are overrated.
It's enough if you have firepower on paper.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

Sailors are overrated.
It's enough if you have firepower on paper.

It's always worked for the Japanese:

[Skybird]

http://img.scoop.it/VnFv6WQKdKb-d4fm...4QGRtDb3Sbc6KY

Bigger than Collins (78m, 3350 tons)

A 218 crewed with Krupps-Bots. That would be a fearsome enemy.

[Oberon]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Krupps-Bots

"AWK-WAAAAARD"

[ikalugin]

Doesn't this imply that a single such sub costs more than 1b each? I mean Kilos may not be the best subs out there, but they cost around 350m each, probably less due to where ruble went.

[em2nought]

I think you guys need to consider drone submarines with subsim captains. Much cheaper, no sailor scum needed.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Oberon

They'll need sailors for them first...

That was my initial thought then secondly the past military/historical links...the world can still be a fickle stage.

[nikimcbee]

I thought they spent all of their lunch money on our F-35s?

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by ikalugin

Doesn't this imply that a single such sub costs more than 1b each? I mean Kilos may not be the best subs out there, but they cost around 350m each, probably less due to where ruble went.

Singapore pays 1.36 billion US-dollar per concept boat (a 216 not yet finalised for version 218), that includes logistics and crew training.

The Improved Kilos, and the 214 and 218, should not be compared, I think. They are separated by a huge margin, by the stats on paper at least, by their endurance and tactical versatility, technology, and the modular design of the 216 class.

The more reasonable comparison would be the Lada class (=Petersburg class), which is said to have an air independant propulsion system like the German and Swedish boats. The bigger export version of the Lada, is the Amur-class. So far all offerings by Russia to foreign customers have been rejected. French, German and Swedish boats were preferred. The Russian boat should cost 450 million dollar.