How deep can the ASDIC hear?

V13dweller · 01-31-13, 09:59 AM

I have got myself into a situation where over 30 destroyers are hovering over me, but on my map, their asdics are not appearing, but they are pinging me, and there is none of the yellow or red circle on me at all, I have been in one place for over 3 days in game time, but they have not run out of ammo.

The red semi circle is not even present.
PS. I was 143 meters deep, with Silent running on.
Is there any way I can edit their depth limit myself?
And their "Ash cans" are not able to reach me? so why do they hover around?
Wouldn't they run out of fuel? Ammo?
I have also noticed them picking me up and finding me at ranges of over 30 kilometers without radar (1939)
After scanning the internet for multiple times a day, I am yet to find out how deep the Asdic can hear.
Because If a Submarines max depth is 200, and the Asdic can hear 200, the submarine is useless and needs to be replaced with a more suitable upgrade, such a new model, but since their is only the VII, it is hard to get a work around this.

Targor Avelany · 01-31-13, 12:23 PM

I believe one of the main problems is that we still aren't sure how well the layering works in SH5 models. I've seen a lot of posts saying that no matter what depth you go to, destroyers hear you as well as if you would be at 20m. I believe the only thing that does matter is the rpm/speed (1kn).

gap · 01-31-13, 12:36 PM

Sim.cfg (IRAI settings)

Code:

; Edited by TheDarkWraith for IRAI_0_0_39
; Edited on 1/20/2013 @ 1700

[Visual]
Detection time=2.5					;[s] min detection time.
Sensitivity=1.0						;(0..1)	min detection threshold double detection time.
Fog factor=0.875					;[>=0]
Light factor=1.25  					;[>=0]
Waves factor=1.0					;[>=0]
Enemy surface factor=125.0				;[m2]
Enemy speed factor=8					;[kt]
Min Signal Strength=0.125
Night Sensitivity Factor=0.3
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=0

[Radar]
Detection time=2.0					;[s]
; lower values than 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0						;(0..1)  was 0.01, increased by 75%
Waves factor=0.65					;[>=0]
Enemy surface factor=80.0				;[m2]
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.0
Min Signal Strength=0.125

[Hydrophone]
Detection time=2.0					;[s]
; lower values then 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0						;(0..1)
Height factor=0						;[m]
Waves factor=0.75					;[>=0]
Speed factor=14						;[kt]
;1 is on the deaf side
;0.10 is on the uber end
Noise factor=0.325					;[>=0]    was 1.3, decreased by 74.5%
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.125			;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 3 equals signal reduction to 33%   was 3.0, decreased by 55%
Min Signal Strength=0.125

[Sonar]
;how long you have to be in the AI's active sonar cone before he will start pinging.
Detection time=2.0					;[s]  was 5
; lower values than 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0						;(0..1)
Waves factor=0.3					;[>=0]
Speed factor=15						;[kt]
;how much surface area you present to the AI for him to ping off of, before he gets a ping
;think of this variable as to how much "slop" you can have when pointing your bow or stern at an approaching AI to minimize your profile
Enemy surface factor=325				;[m2]    was 520, decreased by 35%
Lose time=15						;[s]
Min Signal Strength=0.125
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.75			;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 5 equals signal reduction to 20%     was 5.0, decreased by 70%

Trevally. · 01-31-13, 01:12 PM

You can adjust the thermal layer here:-

\data\Cfg\sim.cfg

[Sonar]
;how long you have to be in the AI's active sonar cone before he will start pinging.
Detection time=2.0 ;[s] was 5
; lower values than 1 make it harder for AI to detect you
Sensitivity=1.0 ;(0..1)
Waves factor=0.3 ;[>=0]
Speed factor=15 ;[kt]
;how much surface area you present to the AI for him to ping off of, before he gets a ping
;think of this variable as to how much "slop" you can have when pointing your bow or stern at an approaching AI to minimize your profile
Enemy surface factor=325 ;[m2] was 520, decreased by 35%
Lose time=15 ;[s]
Min Signal Strength=0.125
Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.75 ;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 5 equals signal reduction to 20% was 5.0, decreased by 70%

Trevally. · 01-31-13, 01:12 PM

to slow for the Gap

Targor Avelany · 01-31-13, 01:17 PM

Fifi · 01-31-13, 03:56 PM

So TDW decreased the thermal layer signal attenuation by 70% from stock game...wow!!
Don't you think it's a bit too much?

The other day, i had the bad idea to attack a task force in medium fog...
Soon i had 7 destroyers upon me, and i was depth charged for almost 4 hours!!
That's very long, and once i thought to reload a save, but i had my afternoon free so i resisted to the envy just to see if i could survive

I tried everything i could, but those AI have a tactic...they were completely around me, surounding me, so noway to escape their ASDIC

Even the decoys had no effect (but maybe i don't know how to use them correctly)
As my batteries were lowering and lowering, and took some damage, i finally decided to give up and reached the sea bottom to lay down and wait for death...
170m depth, i saw i was very close to ground, so i all stopped.

After half an hour of depth charges, they all missed me (not by far) and finally broke the fight!
I'll never know why they gave up. Do they have limited depth charges?
They were protecting an heavy cruiser, so maybe they reached him to head their destination in time?...

So i surfaced and finished my job (had hitted a DD at first, but he never sunk even after 4 hours!)
Was so happy to survive this fight

But 4 hours in real time is very long can tell you...and i'm only at early 1940 career...

Since then, i added TDW depth charges water disturbances to my list

...as i think in RL destroyers were kind of blind for few seconds after explosions.
Will see how it works.

Trevally. · 01-31-13, 04:23 PM

from the same file:-

[AI detection]
;This is a few things:
;- how long the escort will look for you if alerted to your presence.
;- how long you must remain undetected for him to give up and go away.
;- How far away units will come to look for you if alerted by another AI unit. (example: if a AI unit detects you, it broadcasts your location. Any unit that is within 20 minutes treaveling distance will be vectored into your location. Unless contact is made within those 20 mins, at 21 minutes the unit will turn around and go "home".
Lost contact time=30 ;[min]

Fifi · 01-31-13, 05:16 PM

Ok, i see everything can be adjusted to our liking...but don't want to cheat as well!

GT182 · 01-31-13, 06:18 PM

Lastnight I came across a Taskforce escorting and Nelson Class Battleship. I guess I was in the right spot to shoot.... north if the Taskforce and within 800 meters of the closest escort, but sitting there not moving. Sent off 4 torpedos at 90° and nailed her. Now there had to be 12 escorts around her. 5 broke off to hunt me down. As soon at it got a confirmation she was toast I dove to 45 meters at full speed, and turned 90° from my attack heading directly towards the the battleship. All 5 bore down on where I fired from and pounded that area. Just shy of where she was going down I turned again, dropped to 2kts and headed south away from the escorts. Took 3 hours real time to sneek off but they never found me. Now for some unknown reason I couldn't get Silent Running activated... and that didn't seem to matter.

Sometimes if you can get between those attacking you and the ship you torpedoed, the noise it makes will mask your Uboat. You can then slip quietly away. I've slipped up to a ship that's sinking very slowly and waited out the escorts which finally gave up in a short time, and then slipped away. I've found out they won't come close to a sinking ship. I guess it all adds up to the tactics you use...... and a lot of luck. Just don't get too close or that ship will take you down with it.

Harald_Lange · 02-01-13, 08:33 AM

Three days game time ? Are your crew holding thier breath or did you manage to surface at any point?

V13dweller · 02-01-13, 12:53 PM

I would occasionally blow ballast to surface, and drop back into the depths, there was thick fog, that obscured their guns, but their hydrophones were still working, so once I got my air, i would drop back down.

THE_MASK · 02-01-13, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fifi

So TDW decreased the thermal layer signal attenuation by 70% from stock game...wow!!
Don't you think it's a bit too much?

The other day, i had the bad idea to attack a task force in medium fog...
Soon i had 7 destroyers upon me, and i was depth charged for almost 4 hours!!
That's very long, and once i thought to reload a save, but i had my afternoon free so i resisted to the envy just to see if i could survive

I tried everything i could, but those AI have a tactic...they were completely around me, surounding me, so noway to escape their ASDIC

Even the decoys had no effect (but maybe i don't know how to use them correctly)
As my batteries were lowering and lowering, and took some damage, i finally decided to give up and reached the sea bottom to lay down and wait for death...
170m depth, i saw i was very close to ground, so i all stopped.

After half an hour of depth charges, they all missed me (not by far) and finally broke the fight!
I'll never know why they gave up. Do they have limited depth charges?
They were protecting an heavy cruiser, so maybe they reached him to head their destination in time?...

So i surfaced and finished my job (had hitted a DD at first, but he never sunk even after 4 hours!)
Was so happy to survive this fight

But 4 hours in real time is very long can tell you...and i'm only at early 1940 career...

Since then, i added TDW depth charges water disturbances to my list

...as i think in RL destroyers were kind of blind for few seconds after explosions.
Will see how it works.

You might think so at first but when you consider there are things like early middle and late way equipment and sensors and crew ratings . Plus if using IRAI , ships crew have a fatigue roster . Plus a thousand other things that affect the game its not unreasonable that thermal layer is decreased . You have to think like a uboat captain now . The dynamic campaign to consider , have i sunk something in this area before , will the area be more protected . What depth under keel do i have and can i dive deep to escape destroyers . What equipment do i have to evaid destroyers . Do i need to charge in on the protected convoy by myself or call for a wolfpack and shadow until they arrive . Wolfpack depends on nearby AI subs being available or not but i always ask for help if the convoy is escorted . Sometimes no other subs are available in the area so i have to review my tactics . Maybe a fan shot from long way off . What is the weather like and time of day . Am i better to attack at night . How are my crew trained , special training (abilities) etc .

Fifi · 02-01-13, 08:32 PM

You're absolutely right Sober

I never had the chance to get a wolf pack avalaible near by, BTW.

When i'm chased by destroyers, only way so far they lost me, is to go as deep as i can, stop engines and wait...
They eventually drop some charges, but after 15-30 mn leave the area.

THE_MASK · 02-01-13, 10:16 PM

There is a nasty thing in the game called Triangulation .
http://forums.ubi.com/archive/index.php/t-215221.html

01-31-13, 09:59 AM	#1
V13dweller Grey Wolf Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 768 Downloads: 101 Uploads: 2	How deep can the ASDIC hear? I have got myself into a situation where over 30 destroyers are hovering over me, but on my map, their asdics are not appearing, but they are pinging me, and there is none of the yellow or red circle on me at all, I have been in one place for over 3 days in game time, but they have not run out of ammo. The red semi circle is not even present. PS. I was 143 meters deep, with Silent running on. Is there any way I can edit their depth limit myself? And their "Ash cans" are not able to reach me? so why do they hover around? Wouldn't they run out of fuel? Ammo? I have also noticed them picking me up and finding me at ranges of over 30 kilometers without radar (1939) After scanning the internet for multiple times a day, I am yet to find out how deep the Asdic can hear. Because If a Submarines max depth is 200, and the Asdic can hear 200, the submarine is useless and needs to be replaced with a more suitable upgrade, such a new model, but since their is only the VII, it is hard to get a work around this. Last edited by V13dweller; 01-31-13 at 11:58 AM.

01-31-13, 01:12 PM	#4
Trevally. Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: AN1536 (Orkney) Posts: 5,451 Downloads: 166 Uploads: 28	You can adjust the thermal layer here:- \data\Cfg\sim.cfg [Sonar] ;how long you have to be in the AI's active sonar cone before he will start pinging. Detection time=2.0 ;[s] was 5 ; lower values than 1 make it harder for AI to detect you Sensitivity=1.0 ;(0..1) Waves factor=0.3 ;[>=0] Speed factor=15 ;[kt] ;how much surface area you present to the AI for him to ping off of, before he gets a ping ;think of this variable as to how much "slop" you can have when pointing your bow or stern at an approaching AI to minimize your profile Enemy surface factor=325 ;[m2] was 520, decreased by 35% Lose time=15 ;[s] Min Signal Strength=0.125 Thermal Layer Signal Attenuation=1.75 ;[>0], 1 means no signal reduction, 5 equals signal reduction to 20% was 5.0, decreased by 70% __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Trevally Mods for SH5

01-31-13, 01:12 PM	#5
Trevally. Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: AN1536 (Orkney) Posts: 5,451 Downloads: 166 Uploads: 28	to slow for the Gap __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Trevally Mods for SH5

01-31-13, 04:23 PM	#8
Trevally. Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: AN1536 (Orkney) Posts: 5,451 Downloads: 166 Uploads: 28	from the same file:- [AI detection] ;This is a few things: ;- how long the escort will look for you if alerted to your presence. ;- how long you must remain undetected for him to give up and go away. ;- How far away units will come to look for you if alerted by another AI unit. (example: if a AI unit detects you, it broadcasts your location. Any unit that is within 20 minutes treaveling distance will be vectored into your location. Unless contact is made within those 20 mins, at 21 minutes the unit will turn around and go "home". Lost contact time=30 ;[min] __________________ [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC] Trevally Mods for SH5

01-31-13, 06:18 PM	#10
GT182 Ocean Warrior Join Date: May 2005 Location: New Castle of Delaware Posts: 3,231 Downloads: 658 Uploads: 0	Lastnight I came across a Taskforce escorting and Nelson Class Battleship. I guess I was in the right spot to shoot.... north if the Taskforce and within 800 meters of the closest escort, but sitting there not moving. Sent off 4 torpedos at 90° and nailed her. Now there had to be 12 escorts around her. 5 broke off to hunt me down. As soon at it got a confirmation she was toast I dove to 45 meters at full speed, and turned 90° from my attack heading directly towards the the battleship. All 5 bore down on where I fired from and pounded that area. Just shy of where she was going down I turned again, dropped to 2kts and headed south away from the escorts. Took 3 hours real time to sneek off but they never found me. Now for some unknown reason I couldn't get Silent Running activated... and that didn't seem to matter. Sometimes if you can get between those attacking you and the ship you torpedoed, the noise it makes will mask your Uboat. You can then slip quietly away. I've slipped up to a ship that's sinking very slowly and waited out the escorts which finally gave up in a short time, and then slipped away. I've found out they won't come close to a sinking ship. I guess it all adds up to the tactics you use...... and a lot of luck. Just don't get too close or that ship will take you down with it. __________________ Gary No Borders, No Language, No Culture =s No Country I'm a Deplorable, and proud of it.

01-31-13, 12:23 PM	#2
Targor Avelany Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada Posts: 1,183 Downloads: 225 Uploads: 0	I believe one of the main problems is that we still aren't sure how well the layering works in SH5 models. I've seen a lot of posts saying that no matter what depth you go to, destroyers hear you as well as if you would be at 20m. I believe the only thing that does matter is the rpm/speed (1kn).

01-31-13, 01:17 PM	#6
Targor Avelany Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada Posts: 1,183 Downloads: 225 Uploads: 0

01-31-13, 03:56 PM	#7
Fifi Navy Seal Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: France Posts: 6,087 Downloads: 465 Uploads: 0	So TDW decreased the thermal layer signal attenuation by 70% from stock game...wow!! Don't you think it's a bit too much? The other day, i had the bad idea to attack a task force in medium fog... Soon i had 7 destroyers upon me, and i was depth charged for almost 4 hours!! That's very long, and once i thought to reload a save, but i had my afternoon free so i resisted to the envy just to see if i could survive I tried everything i could, but those AI have a tactic...they were completely around me, surounding me, so noway to escape their ASDIC Even the decoys had no effect (but maybe i don't know how to use them correctly) As my batteries were lowering and lowering, and took some damage, i finally decided to give up and reached the sea bottom to lay down and wait for death... 170m depth, i saw i was very close to ground, so i all stopped. After half an hour of depth charges, they all missed me (not by far) and finally broke the fight! I'll never know why they gave up. Do they have limited depth charges? They were protecting an heavy cruiser, so maybe they reached him to head their destination in time?... So i surfaced and finished my job (had hitted a DD at first, but he never sunk even after 4 hours!) Was so happy to survive this fight But 4 hours in real time is very long can tell you...and i'm only at early 1940 career... Since then, i added TDW depth charges water disturbances to my list ...as i think in RL destroyers were kind of blind for few seconds after explosions. Will see how it works.

01-31-13, 05:16 PM	#9
Fifi Navy Seal Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: France Posts: 6,087 Downloads: 465 Uploads: 0	Ok, i see everything can be adjusted to our liking...but don't want to cheat as well!

02-01-13, 08:33 AM	#11
Harald_Lange Ensign Join Date: Jan 2012 Location: NY Harbour, Periscope depth. Posts: 235 Downloads: 160 Uploads: 0	Three days game time ? Are your crew holding thier breath or did you manage to surface at any point?

02-01-13, 12:53 PM	#12
V13dweller Grey Wolf Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Perth, Western Australia Posts: 768 Downloads: 101 Uploads: 2	I would occasionally blow ballast to surface, and drop back into the depths, there was thick fog, that obscured their guns, but their hydrophones were still working, so once I got my air, i would drop back down.

02-01-13, 08:32 PM	#14
Fifi Navy Seal Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: France Posts: 6,087 Downloads: 465 Uploads: 0	You're absolutely right Sober I never had the chance to get a wolf pack avalaible near by, BTW. When i'm chased by destroyers, only way so far they lost me, is to go as deep as i can, stop engines and wait... They eventually drop some charges, but after 15-30 mn leave the area.

02-01-13, 10:16 PM	#15
THE_MASK Ace of the deep . Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 9,226 Downloads: 901 Uploads: 73	There is a nasty thing in the game called Triangulation . http://forums.ubi.com/archive/index.php/t-215221.html