Missile System Fired From A Submarine’s Mast to Take Down helos

Onkel Neal · 11-03-12, 04:27 AM

European Defence Firms Propose Missile System Fired From A Submarine’s Mast to Take Down Helos

Now we're talking

Hinrich Schwab · 11-03-12, 07:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

European Defence Firms Propose Missile System Fired From A Submarine’s Mast to Take Down Helos

Now we're talking

That would be a very good tactical innovation for submarines, especially conventional subs during snorkeling.

Recon Pilot: "That's no periscope!"

Sorry...had a cheesy Star Wars moment...

Onkel Neal · 11-03-12, 12:23 PM

Yeah, I agree. But what do I know

All the submariners I spoke with about this, including captains, say the best thing for a sub is to stay deep and silent, they can hear the helos long before the helos can find them.

Still, how sweet would it be to give that ASW helo or plane team a nasty surprise?

Krabb · 11-03-12, 12:38 PM

So, where are now the same British and German systems been developing earlier?

How it will get its targeting info?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

<...>they can hear the helos long before the helos can find them.

Can they? Could you provide more info on this, please.

Nexus7 · 11-03-12, 02:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

(...) they can hear the helos long before the helos can find them. (...)

What if something else detects you and tells it to the helo ?

LoBlo · 11-04-12, 10:23 AM

I think there have been several versions of this in the past. Suposedly the Russian Typhoon and Kilo each had proposed designs for anti-air missiles from there mast. The Aim9x has also been fired in a verticle orientation with success.

The issue however is that in the fog of war one never knows when one is truly detected or not, and if they are not sure will always opt for stealth. Perhaps some missions to purposely hunt and kill helos just for the sake of imposing a pyschology impact on ASW aircraft, forcing them to be less aggressive and use only passive rather than active measures, might... just might... make it worth it.

LB

Hawk66 · 12-15-12, 06:55 AM

unfortunately only in German, but the magazine of the German 'Bundeswehr' claims that the IRIS air defense system for the 212 class would be ready for production.

http://www.y-punkt.de/portal/a/ypunk...ua_MDQ9DJ1w!!/

The IRIS missile can be fired from torpedo tubes, similar like the Harpoon missile, I guess.

Onkel Neal · 12-15-12, 09:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Krabb

So, where are now the same British and German systems been developing earlier?

How it will get its targeting info?

Can they? Could you provide more info on this, please.

Just conversations with Navy people.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nexus7

What if something else detects you and tells it to the helo ?

Good point!

magicstix · 12-15-12, 09:48 PM

This seems like tactical suicide. Sure, you might hit the helo, but you've just set a perfect datum right on yourself for the entire strike group to swarm on.

OneShot · 12-16-12, 03:16 PM

This is more or less a Last ditch measure when you have no room to evade anymore. And as that it might buy you the room to maneuver again. At the cost, as pointed out above, of generating a perfect datum. Considering the alternatives a rather low cost.

As for detecting the helo ... consider this ... the helo flies low over the water and pushes a lot of air downward and "hammers" the water.

Krabb · 12-17-12, 09:51 AM

So, these "hammers" are more audible to the sub, than the sub to helo's sonobuoys or other sensors?

11-03-12, 04:27 AM	#1
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,385 Downloads: 541 Uploads: 224	Missile System Fired From A Submarine’s Mast to Take Down helos European Defence Firms Propose Missile System Fired From A Submarine’s Mast to Take Down Helos Now we're talking __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web

11-03-12, 12:23 PM	#3
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,385 Downloads: 541 Uploads: 224	Yeah, I agree. But what do I know All the submariners I spoke with about this, including captains, say the best thing for a sub is to stay deep and silent, they can hear the helos long before the helos can find them. Still, how sweet would it be to give that ASW helo or plane team a nasty surprise? __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web

11-04-12, 10:23 AM	#6
LoBlo Subsim Diehard Join Date: May 2006 Location: Texas! Posts: 971 Downloads: 78 Uploads: 3	I think there have been several versions of this in the past. Suposedly the Russian Typhoon and Kilo each had proposed designs for anti-air missiles from there mast. The Aim9x has also been fired in a verticle orientation with success. The issue however is that in the fog of war one never knows when one is truly detected or not, and if they are not sure will always opt for stealth. Perhaps some missions to purposely hunt and kill helos just for the sake of imposing a pyschology impact on ASW aircraft, forcing them to be less aggressive and use only passive rather than active measures, might... just might... make it worth it. LB __________________ "Seek not to offend or annoy... only to speak the truth"-a wise man

12-16-12, 03:16 PM	#10
OneShot Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 956 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	This is more or less a Last ditch measure when you have no room to evade anymore. And as that it might buy you the room to maneuver again. At the cost, as pointed out above, of generating a perfect datum. Considering the alternatives a rather low cost. As for detecting the helo ... consider this ... the helo flies low over the water and pushes a lot of air downward and "hammers" the water. __________________ All the things you always wanted to know about Dangerous Waters but never dared to ask!

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12-15-12, 06:55 AM	#7
Hawk66 Commodore Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Germany Posts: 609 Downloads: 36 Uploads: 0	unfortunately only in German, but the magazine of the German 'Bundeswehr' claims that the IRIS air defense system for the 212 class would be ready for production. http://www.y-punkt.de/portal/a/ypunk...ua_MDQ9DJ1w!!/ The IRIS missile can be fired from torpedo tubes, similar like the Harpoon missile, I guess.

12-15-12, 09:48 PM	#9
magicstix Captain Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Nuclear submarine under the North Pole Posts: 481 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	This seems like tactical suicide. Sure, you might hit the helo, but you've just set a perfect datum right on yourself for the entire strike group to swarm on.

12-17-12, 09:51 AM	#11
Krabb Navy Dude Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 172 Downloads: 32 Uploads: 0	So, these "hammers" are more audible to the sub, than the sub to helo's sonobuoys or other sensors?