Gold price manipulated since longer than assumed?

[Skybird]

Refering to a German news, professor Rosa Abrantes-Metz from New York University, and Albert Metz, analysts at Moody´s,, published their findings of examining the price fixing for gold in London, and came to the conclusion that the price seems to be manipulated since not just three years, but at least since ten years. The had analysed the price of gold in the years from 2001 to 2013, and found several dates when the price suddenly was dropping sharply, with further examination concluding that it seems that a manipulation in favour of lowering the price artificially has taken place.

Abrantes-Metz delivered major parts of the material that led to the unveiling of the Libor scandal.

London-seated analast comapny Fideres cam to comparable conclusions, claiming that in 50% of the cases the price of gold has been manipulated for a lower score in the years 2010-2013. A relating article they published in the Financial Times, was deleted immediately on the same day.

Currently both German and British authorities exmaine the gold price fixing over suspiucions that the fixing has been manipulated.

The querstion is: do the states and their autorities indeed have any interest to unveil such a manipulation? Hardly. It would mean that in case of such finding being published, the gold price would skyrocket immediately in correcting that manipulation, and the criminal paper currency that was imposed on us would correspondingly drop in relation. When you consider that even with manipulated fixing the price of gold since 2001 has multiplied by a factor of 5 in 2012 and thus the dollar has lost 80% of value towards gold, you can imagine what this would mean for the snowballing system that paper moneys indeed is.

I thus predict that in some time we will read findings and reports claiming that no relevant manipulation of gold price fixings have been found. Some "tweaks" here and there in the past 3 years will be admitted to please the bloodthirsty crowd, but nothing serious and worth to be concerned about.

I dare to claim that a lie from A to Z. The show must run out. The lies must live.

To win some more time before the sky is falling nevertheless.

I have a different view there. The collapse of the paper money system is unavoidable, and so the result in the future already is decided, thus the future influences its past that is currently our present. But if the future is already fixed, why should I resist a collapse that is unavoidable anyway, necessary and even desirable?

Chinese are buying the Swiss and London gold market empty, btw. Does anyone worry for what that indicates, in the West? Nooo... Just do not spoil those precious illusions...

Governments since long try to prevent any objective scale for assessing the state of things in an economy. They prevent price fixings by free market mechanisms. They want to regulate prices. They control the value of money, as if they could do that. They suppress all information that is showing what time the clock in reality is showing, and keep their finger blocking the big hand on the dial.

But that damn thing keeps ticking. How unpleasant.

[STEED]

Nothing new Sky, as you and everyone else knows the whole system is bent or corrupt in some sort of way. These bloated pigs are on a win win win...until the law wakes up and decides to sort them out out big time which will never happen.

BTW: Sky..this book may interest you.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/The-Death-Mo...=currency+wars

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by STEED

Nothing new Sky, as you and everyone else knows the whole system is bent or corrupt in some sort of way. These bloated pigs are on a win win win...until the law wakes up and decides to sort them out out big time which will never happen.

The law is the law made by their own buddies. Go figure.

What just stuns me at times is that people just accept it, instead of storming institutions, hanging politicians and chasing the feudal class through the streets. Everybody tries to stay kind and calm, and ignores that doom is heading for him. I just don't get it. The German hyperinflation was the worst example of hyperinflation ever. But it is a child's play to what is coming to us in a truly globalised financial system and economy.

And it will not just be some bureaucratic nuisance for the ordinary John Smith in our Western countries. It will do plenty of killing. Hope my health takes me out before that day arrives, but things seem to speed up recently, and so I fear me too will get caught by the blow. I'm not eagerly looking forward to that.

The book, don't know that one in special, but have had several titles like that last years. Especially this one got my attention:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Paper-Money-...lev+schlichter

Thanks for the hint.

In general I hint at the masterful work of Ludwig von Mises, and E.F. Hayek. What the above authors describe in latest books, has bee warned of and predicted already decades and over half a century ago by Mises and Hayek. It's a century to go back, if you count their predecessors they based their work on.

[STEED]

Some what a 1984 situation where most people are pros and as long as they get there little treats they will gladly go along with the lies. Makes me laugh when I hear friends say did you hear about JP Morgan and Chase along with Goldman Sachs got big stiff fines that will teach them! I just laugh and say teach them what, they only go and do it again.

[Wolferz]

Originally Posted by STEED

Some what a 1984 situation where most people are pros and as long as they get there little treats they will gladly go along with the lies. Makes me laugh when I hear friends say did you hear about JP Morgan and Chase along with Goldman Sachs got big stiff fines that will teach them! I just laugh and say teach them what, they only go and do it again.

Compared to the illicit profits they've raked in with their thieving, the fines are nothing more than a business expense and could be called profit sharing for the gub'mint

Everything is manipulated for max profits these days. Not just gold.
I can only hope that Fort Knox still has the back up plan stored there. But, alas, it may be like the Social Security trust. Constantly raided until depleted.

Oh well. They can't take it with them after their lynching and I really couldn't care less about worldly things like money. You come into the world with nothing and you'll leave it the same way.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Wolferz

Everything is manipulated for max profits these days. Not just gold.

Gold is not manipulated for profit in the main, but for protecting the snowballing scheme itself that is behind paper money - that is the point! It'S not about a simple criminal coup. It is about the very system.

[Betonov]

If you can't beat them, join them.

Any idea how to predict when they'll inflate and deflate prices
There's €200 in my drawer waiting to become €2000

[Skybird]

There are reasonable thoughts voiced by some who predict that gold will go beyond the 10.000 dollar mark the closer to final collapse day we are. I think that is possible. I tcoulöd even become multiple times that price, if you understand the logic behind FIAT money and gold.

But there will be new gold prohibitions announced by states, so you would be needing to act criminally and on the black market if you want to benefit from any - then illegitimate by the law'S letter - savings you stockpiled in gold and did not hand over to the state's gangsters when they demanded you to change your gold for useless rags of paper. You would need to accept the risk of most draconic penalties, because states cannot afford to tolerate black markets in such conditions. Or states catch you by excessive taxation of legal gold sales. In the end, when the going gets tough, there is no safety and no rescue, and those with gold will be in the mess as well as those holding shares (or follies like Bitcoins...) or landproperty (-> taxation, enforced expropriation).

We have had that before, and not just in Germany. America and Britain have been there, too, less than one man's lifespan ago.

Repeatedly.

Originally Posted by Skybird

Gold is not manipulated for profit in the main, but for protecting the snowballing scheme itself that is behind paper money - that is the point! It'S not about a simple criminal coup. It is about the very system.

Gold is manipulated mainly for profit, same as silver diamonds oil or any other tradable material.
If seashells were a major valuable commodity then they would also be manipulated mainly for profit.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Betonov

If you can't beat them, join them.

Any idea how to predict when they'll inflate and deflate prices
There's €200 in my drawer waiting to become €2000

Send it over to me and I'll put it to good use

Back OT...any tradeable commodity is used for profitable gain and always will do as long as there is a buyer and a seller within the marketplace.

[MH]

Gold price manipulated since longer than assumed?

any evidence on the how...because if i had a ton of gold in the basement i would be very happy reading this.

Who is keeping the prices down and letting china buy all this stuff?
Why don't others buy the gold same way china does?

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

Gold is manipulated mainly for profit, same as silver diamonds oil or any other tradable material.
If seashells were a major valuable commodity then they would also be manipulated mainly for profit.

Once upon a time seashells did have value and were actually traded for goods, lands and services. That is until Dutch colonists realized this and began mass-produceding wampum in workshops to the point that the market for wampum was glutted and effectively destroyed.

Now it's nothing more than 'fashion' jewlery.

Kinda like where the dollar is heading.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Send it over to me and I'll put it to good use

Back OT...any tradeable commodity is used for profitable gain and always will do as long as there is a buyer and a seller within the marketplace.

That is why it is of paramount importance to have a currency that is indeed a freely traded commodity just like any other and that has its value not regulated and fixed by governments, but market participants. Only then the "value" of the money actually has a meaning. And only then prices have a meaning. And only then businessmen and traders can make reliable calculations on their cost-gains-balances. In other words, the general status of an economy is reflected ion the price fixing on a free market, and the value of its currencies. And when you want to hide the real status of a desolate economy, you have to prevent all that and command which price the currency should have - by that, you distort all, precent all, disguise all.

But such a commodity currency that is decided about by market and private people, would mean that politicians have limited means available only to finance their spending frenzies by which they bribe the masses to vote for them. So they always will move all heaven and earth and tell just any lie to prevent such a currency and make people believe in paper money instead.

Also, paper money is a precondition for the giant redistribution scheme of real values from bottom to top that is happening today. The word to watch out for is "Cantillon effect". It makes sure that the rich get richer and the poor get poorer just by printing more FIAT money and pumping it into the system.

That gold has been used as such a widely accepted commodity money, is only because of past markets decided so and people made good experiences with the physical availability and ability to manage it. It is practical to handle, can be turned into smaller or bigger coins, and if a symbol on a thaler is declared invalid and the currency changes to another name, you melt your thaler and still have gold that has not lost one bit of its bartering power than if it were not a necklace but the same amount of gold pressed into the form of a coin, also, it cannot rot and does not corrode. It could as well be plant seeds, or seashells or bones, or tobacco, pieces of dried bacon and whatever else man has used as token for a currency system. But people found out that all these things were not as practical and valuable to them as precious metals turned out to be, and that they did not offer the practical advantages of using metal instead of furs or dried bacon. And so, gold it was.

The Chinese were the first to try a paper money system, I think in the 12th century. It collapsed. And since then, ALL paper money system tried in any part of the world have collapsed. The inflation of paper money is nothing else than what ancient kins did when they reduced the amount of precious metals in their gold and silver thalers, and replaced them with inferior iron, to increase the amount of thalers and give the illusion of having more wealth that they then spend. It is betrayal, theft, and always it is snowballing.

[MH]

The Chinese were the first to try a paper money system, I think in the 12th century. It collapsed. And since then, ALL paper money system tried in any part of the world have collapsed. The inflation of paper money is nothing else than what ancient kins did when they reduced the amount of precious metals in their gold and silver thalers, and replaced them with inferior iron, to increase the amount of thalers and give the illusion of having more wealth that they then spend. It is betrayal, theft, and always it is snowballing.

So how economy with relatively fixed amount of gold can deal with growing wealth.?
...after all people create wealth as well.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by MH

So how economy with relatively fixed amount of gold can deal with growing wealth.?
...after all people create wealth as well.

It is totally unimportant how much quantity of a currency is in circulation. The Central banks' self-legitimation in parts is that "somebody must control the amount of money in circulation".

Nonsense.

If you increase the number of currency units in the system by - for the easiness of calculation in this example - by a factor of ten, then you see that prices adapt by moving the decimal one digit to the right. What costed you 1 thaler before, now will cost you ten thalers. If you reduce the number of currency units in circulation by let's say one half, you will sooner or later see that prices half as well.

If there are many gold coins in circulation, their price will drop on the market. When there are fewer gold coins in circulation, their value rises. But if you have some criminal mind called "politician" giving it a fixed value that the market is not to negotiate freely, then you are in a nightmare of deep troubles. Such a currency no longer represents and reflects true market events. And that is what politicians want with their control of the currency - to hide how they are abusing and ruining the system.

Wealth cannot be produced on the basis of fictional value (=credit). Already von Mises showed in all stunning logic, that wealth can only be founded (if you want it to last) on the basis of real value that you have saved before - and then investing this saved value. There are no shortcuts. You need to go the longer and more difficult way. You must save a little bit, and then invest that. Using credits for your investments only founds or increases the snowball system and its longterm devastating effects.

There is no way to generate value out of nothing. It's an illusion, and it destroys us like the happy dreams of constant heavy drug abuse destroys the consumer. But he grins until the bitter end.