Surface visibility

Flaxpants · 08-05-10, 11:44 PM

Do any of you fine people here use any rules of thumb to calculate at what ranges you are likely to be seen on the surface? I seem to be getting spotted a little too much for my liking lately when I'm assuming I am not easily visible.

I know there are many factors that can affect this, obviously the weather, the sea conditions, speed of the sub etc etc, but are there any general distances for certain conditions that can be used as a sort of guideline?

This is obviously something that I will pick up with more experience, but in the meantime I'll pick your brains....

ediko · 08-06-10, 07:14 AM

I'm very new myself but did you disable the visibility meter? It's in the difficulty settings. It displays a small sub image, it's green when your visibility is small and red when you are easily spoted. I heard something about going deck's awash btw. It's when everything but your coning tower is underwater. You can then use diesel engines and have a smaller silhouette from afar.

Herr-Berbunch · 08-06-10, 07:53 AM

The Submarine Commander's Handbook states:

"In clear weather, do not allow yourself to be seen on the dip of the horizon. Submerge, at the latest, when the top of the funnel of the sighted ship is visible in the dip of the horizon. Some warships, besides having lookout posts with binoculars on the mast, have range finders of great optical efficiency in the foretop. In clear weather, therefore, one should never be able to see more of the enemy than the tops of his masts. Anyone who can see more - i.e., who approaches nearer - automatically runs the danger of being sighted, himself, by the enemy. "

In other words, as soon as you see another ship, dive to PD

papa_smurf · 08-06-10, 08:21 AM

Quote:

n other words, as soon as you see another ship, dive to PD

Or just stay submerged during daylight hours, which is what I do.

Herr-Berbunch · 08-06-10, 08:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by papa_smurf

Or just stay submerged during daylight hours, which is what I do.

Show off

Brag · 08-06-10, 11:05 AM

I got seriously kaboomed by destroyer's artillery, thinking I was well out of sight (see current Balz posting).

Herr-Berbunch · 08-06-10, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brag

I got seriously kaboomed by destroyer's artillery, thinking I was well out of sight (see current Balz posting).

Bad omens to have green bananas on a boat!

flag4 · 08-06-10, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flaxpants

Do any of you fine people here use any rules of thumb to calculate at what ranges you are likely to be seen on the surface? I seem to be getting spotted a little too much for my liking lately when I'm assuming I am not easily visible.

I know there are many factors that can affect this, obviously the weather, the sea conditions, speed of the sub etc etc, but are there any general distances for certain conditions that can be used as a sort of guideline?

This is obviously something that I will pick up with more experience, but in the meantime I'll pick your brains....

Flaxpants, i have this written on the back of my flag chart:

Visual Range: Him spotting Me

Clear Day: 10-15 km
Rough Seas, Good Visability: 8-10 km
Rough Seas, Bad Visabilty : 2-3 km

AND, MAKE SURE IM BARELY ABLE TO SEE HIM WHILST FLANKING

night time - i have no idea - only the lights of the ship, if they are on!

papa_smurf · 08-06-10, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by papa_smurf

Or just stay submerged during daylight hours, which is what I do.

Show off

Tessa · 08-08-10, 05:14 PM

Was raiding Scapa Flow and the weather was absolutely perfect for it - Bad Gale with heavy winds, pretty much the worst weather you can get. Visibility through the UZO was about 300-400m at most; a ship 500m+ away (even one as large as the Hood) was completely obscured by the awful weather. With vizibility being non-existant was able to ride in without submerging, and even got into firing position and launched my spread against her using the UZO.

Being inside a harbor mades the hydrophone useless, on the open sea during a bad storm like that going to periscope depth occasionally to use the hydrophone to search for contacts is your best method of detection. My watch crew was only able to spot 1 merchant in the open sea at around 800m away during that patrol.

Exceptionally bad weather is great to use to slip by the more heavily patrolled areas (like the English chanel) but does increase you fuel usage massively and slow you down about 2 or 3 knots.

08-08-10, 05:37 PM

Most of the 'being spotted' problems are limitations of the Game engine itself.

Many fine people spent many hours fine tuning things as best as they could for thier needs/mods/tastes.

It's just a too general of an area when adjusting that is the problem.

K-61 · 08-08-10, 07:52 PM

I recall reading in one of my U-boat books an account where they were slipping past the escort screen while surfaced at night; they got so close to one escort they could see a deck hand cupping a cigarette in his hand. That's close, but they stil slipped past it and got into the convoy.

Flaxpants · 08-08-10, 10:33 PM

Thanks for the replies folks. In general I can conclude that they can see me from much farther than I had first imagined. I do travel at PD during the day and generally surface at night. The issue has arisen usually when I need the extra speed of surface travel to position myself for an attack on ships that I have already seen/ detected, when it is obvious that underwater speed is not going to be fast enough to get me where I want to be.
In future on these occassions I will have to settle for a less optimum firing position. It's all falling into place- slowly!

dfscott · 08-09-10, 01:48 PM

I find it to be a bit erratic at night, regardless of the vis -- sometimes I can slip within 3K under mod vis, other times they spot me as far off as 5K.

sergei · 08-09-10, 02:04 PM

That's because it will change dependent upon your speed, the aspect you are showing them, amount of cloud cover, the state of the moon, how much chop is on the water, and even what level of experience the ships crew has.

IIRC there are 4 levels of experience - poor, competent, veteran and elite, with each increase bringing a better spotting range for them.

08-05-10, 11:44 PM	#1
Flaxpants Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Koh Samui, Thailand Posts: 1,196 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	Surface visibility Do any of you fine people here use any rules of thumb to calculate at what ranges you are likely to be seen on the surface? I seem to be getting spotted a little too much for my liking lately when I'm assuming I am not easily visible. I know there are many factors that can affect this, obviously the weather, the sea conditions, speed of the sub etc etc, but are there any general distances for certain conditions that can be used as a sort of guideline? This is obviously something that I will pick up with more experience, but in the meantime I'll pick your brains....

08-06-10, 07:53 AM	#3
Herr-Berbunch Kaiser Bill's batman Join Date: May 2010 Location: AN72 Posts: 13,203 Downloads: 76 Uploads: 0	The Submarine Commander's Handbook states: "In clear weather, do not allow yourself to be seen on the dip of the horizon. Submerge, at the latest, when the top of the funnel of the sighted ship is visible in the dip of the horizon. Some warships, besides having lookout posts with binoculars on the mast, have range finders of great optical efficiency in the foretop. In clear weather, therefore, one should never be able to see more of the enemy than the tops of his masts. Anyone who can see more - i.e., who approaches nearer - automatically runs the danger of being sighted, himself, by the enemy. " In other words, as soon as you see another ship, dive to PD __________________

08-06-10, 11:05 AM	#6
Brag Navy Seal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Docked on a Russian pond Posts: 7,072 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	I got seriously kaboomed by destroyer's artillery, thinking I was well out of sight (see current Balz posting). __________________ Espionage, adventure, suspense, are just a click away Click here to look inside Brag's book: Amazon.com: Kingmaker: Alexey Braguine: Books Order Kingmaker here: http://www.subsim.com/store.html For Tactics visit:http://www.freewebs.com/kielman/

08-08-10, 07:52 PM	#12
K-61 Grey Wolf Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Ontario Posts: 795 Downloads: 39 Uploads: 0	I recall reading in one of my U-boat books an account where they were slipping past the escort screen while surfaced at night; they got so close to one escort they could see a deck hand cupping a cigarette in his hand. That's close, but they stil slipped past it and got into the convoy. __________________

08-09-10, 01:48 PM	#14
dfscott Bosun Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Atlanta GA USA Posts: 68 Downloads: 49 Uploads: 0	I find it to be a bit erratic at night, regardless of the vis -- sometimes I can slip within 3K under mod vis, other times they spot me as far off as 5K. __________________

08-06-10, 07:14 AM	#2
ediko Electrician's Mate Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Latvia Posts: 137 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	I'm very new myself but did you disable the visibility meter? It's in the difficulty settings. It displays a small sub image, it's green when your visibility is small and red when you are easily spoted. I heard something about going deck's awash btw. It's when everything but your coning tower is underwater. You can then use diesel engines and have a smaller silhouette from afar.

08-08-10, 05:14 PM	#10
Tessa Grey Wolf Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: CG 96 Posts: 861 Downloads: 22 Uploads: 0	Was raiding Scapa Flow and the weather was absolutely perfect for it - Bad Gale with heavy winds, pretty much the worst weather you can get. Visibility through the UZO was about 300-400m at most; a ship 500m+ away (even one as large as the Hood) was completely obscured by the awful weather. With vizibility being non-existant was able to ride in without submerging, and even got into firing position and launched my spread against her using the UZO. Being inside a harbor mades the hydrophone useless, on the open sea during a bad storm like that going to periscope depth occasionally to use the hydrophone to search for contacts is your best method of detection. My watch crew was only able to spot 1 merchant in the open sea at around 800m away during that patrol. Exceptionally bad weather is great to use to slip by the more heavily patrolled areas (like the English chanel) but does increase you fuel usage massively and slow you down about 2 or 3 knots.

08-08-10, 05:37 PM	#11
Madox58 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Most of the 'being spotted' problems are limitations of the Game engine itself. Many fine people spent many hours fine tuning things as best as they could for thier needs/mods/tastes. It's just a too general of an area when adjusting that is the problem.

08-08-10, 10:33 PM	#13
Flaxpants Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: Koh Samui, Thailand Posts: 1,196 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	Thanks for the replies folks. In general I can conclude that they can see me from much farther than I had first imagined. I do travel at PD during the day and generally surface at night. The issue has arisen usually when I need the extra speed of surface travel to position myself for an attack on ships that I have already seen/ detected, when it is obvious that underwater speed is not going to be fast enough to get me where I want to be. In future on these occassions I will have to settle for a less optimum firing position. It's all falling into place- slowly!

08-09-10, 02:04 PM	#15
sergei Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: London UK Posts: 1,788 Downloads: 405 Uploads: 29	That's because it will change dependent upon your speed, the aspect you are showing them, amount of cloud cover, the state of the moon, how much chop is on the water, and even what level of experience the ships crew has. IIRC there are 4 levels of experience - poor, competent, veteran and elite, with each increase bringing a better spotting range for them.