Rift between Germany and France widening

Skybird · 09-17-07, 05:26 PM

http://www.spiegel.de/international/...506124,00.html

I already had mentioned myself that I find this hectic narcissist increasingly nerve-killing. I think its Anything Goes! if only it leads to Sarkozy's face being printed in the news paper next day again, 7 days a week. Some of his stunts, like nuclear technology and modern ATGMs for Lybia, offering nuclear technology to other Arab states as well, are totally unacceptable. that he now offered Germany the nuclear bomb, so to speak, just illustrated how little he does know about Germany - or cares for this german ally that he more and more tends to treat like a vasall that is expected to applaud his ambitions, and nothing else.

Think of the constant affronts he causes in whatever way you want, but what he produces is not cosmetic damage on diplomatic level. He simply causes massive, substantial damages that affect many more countries than just Germany or the EU.

I said it before in a threat, and say it again: I'm deeply dissapointed by this man, and have totally misjudged him. Doesn't happen too often that I misjudge somebody so massively. His policies have no other vision than to increase what he considers to be the glory of his personal presidency.

And like all narcissists he hates to be criticised or rejected. It seems he then even become simply mean. Such characters are dangerous, plain and simple.

Monsieur, if you want to be taken serious and be respect - then treat others in a way that they respect you, and do something that we could take you serious for. the world is not your private TV studio with you in front of the cameras, and being director, scriptwriter, actor and studio owner all rolled into one, you know. Right now you just piss most if not all of us off.

The WosMan · 09-17-07, 05:45 PM

When I read your subject line I thought to myself "What else is new?". Hasn't this been the state of Europe for the last 500 years? It is why we fought two world wars.

I don't know much about Sarkozy but I know this, he is much better than Chirac who was personally involved in Oil-for-food scandal, had a questionable personal relationship with Saddam Hussein and helped them acquire the Osiris nuclear reactors that Israel took out in 1981.

Chirac even called Saddam a "close personal friend"

From my perspective, I like Sarkozy's attitude a lot better, he seems to be much more of an ally to the US than the last couple have been. I also like his tough talk against Iran.

Skybird · 09-17-07, 06:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The WosMan

When I read your subject line I thought to myself "What else is new?". Hasn't this been the state of Europe for the last 500 years? It is why we fought two world wars.

Then you are not up to date. until the early or mid-nineties, the ties had developed formidable. helmut Schmidt and Valery giscard d'estaing, and later helmut Kohl and francois Mitterand focussed heavily on this alliance, and pushed it forward. And with all fairness, it worked very well. Without France and germany's reconciliation, there wouldn't have been an EEC, a EU of the early vision, and friendship between both nations of private levels.
Not before the early "EEC" was increasing in size, and the many members could not be discussing solutions so easily anymore, and the eurocrats started to grab for power, in short: not before Schmidt and d'Estaing started to attack and complain about the principles of the fundament for a united europe, as they had envisioned it, becoming increaingly betrayed and destroyed, the state of Franco-German relations started to shift, hidden from the public, but shifting for the worse. Sarkozy has pressed the pedal on this developement, it seems. That he is caring so less to also raise personaL sentiments against himself, does not really help. such acting didn't help bush to find allies. It will not help Sarkozy either. Bad manners most of the time do not pay off.

On a private level, private relations between Germans and French are doing extremely well, and private economic cooperations work good..

Quote:

Originally Posted by The WosMan

Chirac even called Saddam a "close personal friend"

Who - Chircac, or the US? Or both?

Quote:

From my perspective, I like Sarkozy's attitude a lot better, he seems to be much more of an ally to the US than the last couple have been.

Just wait until he spoils it for you, like he has spoiled it for us, and the rest of europe. This guy is willing to sell nuclear tech to your and our worst enemies. That should make you think about this "closed ally" and "friend of US policies". He is not friend to US polices. He wants you to believe so only, it is a stunt, a coup, a way of winning more headlines again.

If you trust him you'll get the same what we got - you have been warned.

What -are you really considering France to be your ally on the ground of US policies...? Usually having defended the French a bit against American ressentiments, I now must laugh.

Quote:

I also like his tough talk against Iran.

He also talked tough against Turkey, and now has started to court them, and indicated to the EU that maybe Turkey's membership will no longer be opposed by him.

I say you simply cant trust what he says.

The WosMan · 09-17-07, 10:27 PM

Very interesting. The whole situation just reminds me of when Donald Rumsfeld mentioned "old Europe".

The Avon Lady · 09-17-07, 11:50 PM

I, too, believe that Sarkozy is nothing but a talking Maginot Line.

joegrundman · 09-18-07, 02:25 AM

You mean this Donald "old europe" Rumsfeld?

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/3...husseinmj1.jpg

09-17-07, 05:26 PM	#1
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,602 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Rift between Germany and France widening http://www.spiegel.de/international/...506124,00.html I already had mentioned myself that I find this hectic narcissist increasingly nerve-killing. I think its Anything Goes! if only it leads to Sarkozy's face being printed in the news paper next day again, 7 days a week. Some of his stunts, like nuclear technology and modern ATGMs for Lybia, offering nuclear technology to other Arab states as well, are totally unacceptable. that he now offered Germany the nuclear bomb, so to speak, just illustrated how little he does know about Germany - or cares for this german ally that he more and more tends to treat like a vasall that is expected to applaud his ambitions, and nothing else. Think of the constant affronts he causes in whatever way you want, but what he produces is not cosmetic damage on diplomatic level. He simply causes massive, substantial damages that affect many more countries than just Germany or the EU. I said it before in a threat, and say it again: I'm deeply dissapointed by this man, and have totally misjudged him. Doesn't happen too often that I misjudge somebody so massively. His policies have no other vision than to increase what he considers to be the glory of his personal presidency. And like all narcissists he hates to be criticised or rejected. It seems he then even become simply mean. Such characters are dangerous, plain and simple. Monsieur, if you want to be taken serious and be respect - then treat others in a way that they respect you, and do something that we could take you serious for. the world is not your private TV studio with you in front of the cameras, and being director, scriptwriter, actor and studio owner all rolled into one, you know. Right now you just piss most if not all of us off. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

09-17-07, 11:50 PM	#5
The Avon Lady Über Mom Join Date: May 2005 Location: Jerusalem, Israel Posts: 6,147 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	I, too, believe that Sarkozy is nothing but a talking Maginot Line. __________________ "Victory will come to us from the wombs of our women." - Houari Boumedienne, President of Algeria, Speech before the UN, 1974

09-18-07, 02:25 AM	#6
joegrundman Ocean Warrior Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 2,689 Downloads: 34 Uploads: 0	You mean this Donald "old europe" Rumsfeld? http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/3...husseinmj1.jpg __________________ "Enemy submarines are to be called U-Boats. The term submarine is to be reserved for Allied under water vessels. U-Boats are those dastardly villains who sink our ships, while submarines are those gallant and noble craft which sink theirs." Winston Churchill

09-17-07, 05:45 PM	#2
The WosMan Watch Officer Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: OH Posts: 332 Downloads: 88 Uploads: 0	When I read your subject line I thought to myself "What else is new?". Hasn't this been the state of Europe for the last 500 years? It is why we fought two world wars. I don't know much about Sarkozy but I know this, he is much better than Chirac who was personally involved in Oil-for-food scandal, had a questionable personal relationship with Saddam Hussein and helped them acquire the Osiris nuclear reactors that Israel took out in 1981. Chirac even called Saddam a "close personal friend" From my perspective, I like Sarkozy's attitude a lot better, he seems to be much more of an ally to the US than the last couple have been. I also like his tough talk against Iran.

09-17-07, 10:27 PM	#4
The WosMan Watch Officer Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: OH Posts: 332 Downloads: 88 Uploads: 0	Very interesting. The whole situation just reminds me of when Donald Rumsfeld mentioned "old Europe".