Don't Waste That Second Torpedo

Brag · 03-10-07, 10:40 AM

You shoot a torpedo and your target keeps sailing merilly along. Blam, you let it have another one and feel a warm glow as the target sinks. But, was that second torp really needed?

(See also I Resign, Thread)
When I set off on my last patrol on 27 Feb 1941, it was with the objective of perfecting one torpedo technique per GWX ship ( Ihad it down pat on stock SH3). Though the seas were mostly rough through most of the patrol, visibility was good.

I fired 18 torpedoes, sunk 15 ships (2 with deck gun). Used 2 torpedoes to sink the first target (large freighter) because I thought one torp didn't do the job. That was an error, the ship would have sank with one. A couple of torpedoes missed during 2 convoy attacks. With exception of that first ship ALL ships hit went down with ONE torpedo.

I aimed at only one point in all shots--under the forwardmost mast of all ships. Small freighters, medium and large. Did not hit any pyro of whale factory ships.

In all cases the ships sank within half an hour, most between 8 - 15 minutes.

None of the ships appeared to have received catastrophic damage at first--thus tempting to send another fish to make sure.

The first indication that the hit is lethal is a small reduction in speed by the stricken vessel. After 3-4 minutes, you will notice a slight lowering of the bow.

I don't know how far away from you the ship must sink for you to lose credit for the kill. With the exception of convoy attacks , I followed the target until they sank. They sink faster in rough weather.

I think that if you try this method, your kill ratio per torpedo will increase. Good hunting.

03-10-07, 10:56 AM

Well I almost never fire another torpido because i never fire a single shot, almost all my shots are salvo (just in case some torpido dude)

.

Pevs86 · 03-10-07, 11:23 AM

Interesting, I've been aiming for the front of ships for awhile now, but still firing 2 torpedos.

Good tip, I'll try it with 1 and if it doesn't work, I expect a full refund!

Morts · 03-10-07, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pevs86

Interesting, I've been aiming for the front of ships for awhile now, but still firing 2 torpedos.

Good tip, I'll try it with 1 and if it doesn't work, I expect a full refund!

im sorry but we cannot give you a new torpedo since we're out
would you be intrested in a 4 shot salvo from a 5" (inch) cannon insted ?

Brag · 03-10-07, 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pevs86

Interesting, I've been aiming for the front of ships for awhile now, but still firing 2 torpedos.

Good tip, I'll try it with 1 and if it doesn't work, I expect a full refund!

See Bernard for refunds :rotfl:

Morts · 03-10-07, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brag

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pevs86

Interesting, I've been aiming for the front of ships for awhile now, but still firing 2 torpedos.

Good tip, I'll try it with 1 and if it doesn't work, I expect a full refund!

See Bernard for refunds :rotfl:

when i "bought" bernard from the barracks i was dissapointed
i didn even get refund

I DEMAND REFUND!!!!:rotfl:

romelus · 03-11-07, 04:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morts

when i "bought" bernard from the barracks i was dissapointed
i didn even get refund

I DEMAND REFUND!!!!:rotfl:

bernard is purchasable? is he only in GWX? i've been playing vanilla and haven't seen bernard

Zatoichi · 03-10-07, 11:37 AM

Thanks, I've been slightly annoyed by the change to explosion physics and damage in GWX. I had spent a lot of time researching tactics from real captains and the best success I’ve had, pre-GWX, was to send an eel about 1 or 2 meters below the keel with magnetic pistol <9 degrees off bow angle. The result was normally the torp would detonate right under the ship sending the entire explosive force up into the mass of the vessel. This would cause such damage as to make it nearly impossible for the crew to repair the damage and the ship would flounder and sink. This has drastically changed in the GWX mod and now the most damage is done at surface levels, which is less likely as the majority of the force of explosion would be sent away from the ship's mass and into the air. In my studies the deeper the explosion next to the hull, the more the damage as the explosion will choose the path of least resistance; as you know you cannot squeeze water, therefore the more water that is behind the explosion the more the energy from that explosion is passed to the object in the opposite direction (i.e. the ship's hull). So it would stand to reason that if you sent a torpedo just beneath the keel on a slight angle cross bow, all the energy from the explosion would pass upward into the ship resulting in catastrophic damage. I have yet to experience this with GWX.
My thoughts,
Ichi

Brag · 03-10-07, 11:45 AM

Hi Ichi,
Welcome to our nest of ruffians!

I've had reasonable succes with magnetics. I often use them in convoy attacks when I can't hang about waiting for a good AOB. Might reserach that angle on my next patrol

Steeltrap · 03-10-07, 12:48 PM

Not sure how the damage model in GWX compares with NYGM, but I tend to fire at the after third of a target, as taking out the engine spaces SHOULD always result in the ship sinking, or at least being slowed dramatically.

Most WWII sub captains would aim at the engine spaces of tankers in particular, as that gave the best chance of sinking them.

So a bow hit might work well in the sim, but I think the real-world case was the aft sections were the best targets from the point of view of doing vital damage.

It's all interesting to try, however!

Cheers

Brag · 03-10-07, 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steeltrap

Not sure how the damage model in GWX compares with NYGM, but I tend to fire at the after third of a target, as taking out the engine spaces SHOULD always result in the ship sinking, or at least being slowed dramatically.

Most WWII sub captains would aim at the engine spaces of tankers in particular, as that gave the best chance of sinking them.

So a bow hit might work well in the sim, but I think the real-world case was the aft sections were the best targets from the point of view of doing vital damage.

It's all interesting to try, however!

Cheers

I agree with you. However, with GWX I had mixed results with engine room hits. So I'm being systematic in the "research" trying one type of shot and get consistent results over a number of targets to see what works every time.

Pevs86 · 03-10-07, 01:07 PM

I just did Torpedo Academy training...

...

...

1 torp kills are, clearly, impossible. It's not my complete lack of skill, it's everything else working against me

I got pissy with the Tramp Steamer when it didn't sink after 2 hits, then decided to start moving to avoid the 3rd, so fired a 4 shot salvo into it.

03-10-07, 10:40 AM	#1
Brag Navy Seal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Docked on a Russian pond Posts: 7,072 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Don't Waste That Second Torpedo You shoot a torpedo and your target keeps sailing merilly along. Blam, you let it have another one and feel a warm glow as the target sinks. But, was that second torp really needed? (See also I Resign, Thread) When I set off on my last patrol on 27 Feb 1941, it was with the objective of perfecting one torpedo technique per GWX ship ( Ihad it down pat on stock SH3). Though the seas were mostly rough through most of the patrol, visibility was good. I fired 18 torpedoes, sunk 15 ships (2 with deck gun). Used 2 torpedoes to sink the first target (large freighter) because I thought one torp didn't do the job. That was an error, the ship would have sank with one. A couple of torpedoes missed during 2 convoy attacks. With exception of that first ship ALL ships hit went down with ONE torpedo. I aimed at only one point in all shots--under the forwardmost mast of all ships. Small freighters, medium and large. Did not hit any pyro of whale factory ships. In all cases the ships sank within half an hour, most between 8 - 15 minutes. None of the ships appeared to have received catastrophic damage at first--thus tempting to send another fish to make sure. The first indication that the hit is lethal is a small reduction in speed by the stricken vessel. After 3-4 minutes, you will notice a slight lowering of the bow. I don't know how far away from you the ship must sink for you to lose credit for the kill. With the exception of convoy attacks , I followed the target until they sank. They sink faster in rough weather. I think that if you try this method, your kill ratio per torpedo will increase. Good hunting. __________________ Espionage, adventure, suspense, are just a click away Click here to look inside Brag's book: Amazon.com: Kingmaker: Alexey Braguine: Books Order Kingmaker here: http://www.subsim.com/store.html For Tactics visit:http://www.freewebs.com/kielman/

03-10-07, 11:37 AM	#8
Zatoichi Watch Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: New England Posts: 22 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Thanks, I've been slightly annoyed by the change to explosion physics and damage in GWX. I had spent a lot of time researching tactics from real captains and the best success I’ve had, pre-GWX, was to send an eel about 1 or 2 meters below the keel with magnetic pistol <9 degrees off bow angle. The result was normally the torp would detonate right under the ship sending the entire explosive force up into the mass of the vessel. This would cause such damage as to make it nearly impossible for the crew to repair the damage and the ship would flounder and sink. This has drastically changed in the GWX mod and now the most damage is done at surface levels, which is less likely as the majority of the force of explosion would be sent away from the ship's mass and into the air. In my studies the deeper the explosion next to the hull, the more the damage as the explosion will choose the path of least resistance; as you know you cannot squeeze water, therefore the more water that is behind the explosion the more the energy from that explosion is passed to the object in the opposite direction (i.e. the ship's hull). So it would stand to reason that if you sent a torpedo just beneath the keel on a slight angle cross bow, all the energy from the explosion would pass upward into the ship resulting in catastrophic damage. I have yet to experience this with GWX. My thoughts, Ichi __________________ Last edited by Zatoichi; 03-11-07 at 11:47 AM.

03-10-07, 11:45 AM	#9
Brag Navy Seal Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Docked on a Russian pond Posts: 7,072 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Hi Ichi, Welcome to our nest of ruffians! I've had reasonable succes with magnetics. I often use them in convoy attacks when I can't hang about waiting for a good AOB. Might reserach that angle on my next patrol __________________ Espionage, adventure, suspense, are just a click away Click here to look inside Brag's book: Amazon.com: Kingmaker: Alexey Braguine: Books Order Kingmaker here: http://www.subsim.com/store.html For Tactics visit:http://www.freewebs.com/kielman/

03-10-07, 10:56 AM	#2
Dimitrius07 Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Well I almost never fire another torpido because i never fire a single shot, almost all my shots are salvo (just in case some torpido dude) .

03-10-07, 11:23 AM	#3
Pevs86 Machinist's Mate Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Uxbridge, England Posts: 123 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	Interesting, I've been aiming for the front of ships for awhile now, but still firing 2 torpedos. Good tip, I'll try it with 1 and if it doesn't work, I expect a full refund!

03-10-07, 12:48 PM	#10
Steeltrap Grey Wolf Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Sydney, Australia Posts: 818 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Not sure how the damage model in GWX compares with NYGM, but I tend to fire at the after third of a target, as taking out the engine spaces SHOULD always result in the ship sinking, or at least being slowed dramatically. Most WWII sub captains would aim at the engine spaces of tankers in particular, as that gave the best chance of sinking them. So a bow hit might work well in the sim, but I think the real-world case was the aft sections were the best targets from the point of view of doing vital damage. It's all interesting to try, however! Cheers

03-10-07, 01:07 PM	#12
Pevs86 Machinist's Mate Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Uxbridge, England Posts: 123 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	I just did Torpedo Academy training... ... ... 1 torp kills are, clearly, impossible. It's not my complete lack of skill, it's everything else working against me I got pissy with the Tramp Steamer when it didn't sink after 2 hits, then decided to start moving to avoid the 3rd, so fired a 4 shot salvo into it.