WW1 Mod

Mr Welles · 02-08-07, 05:52 PM

I'd just like to say hello and that I've been enjoying NYGM for a few months now (thank you to the makers of that mod) and that I'll download GWX soon (thank you in advance).

However I'm interested in the possibility of making a ww1 mod for SH3... I have several questions for the hard working SH3 mod community, any responses would be useful.

I know the textures can be changed, but can the actual 3d models of the U-boats be changed? Or would I have to keep the current models as abstractions for ww1 u-boats? Probably something like a IIA to represent UB I (no deck gun, 2 torp, V.short range).
IID to represent UB II (though IIA/IIB would be better size wise) (88mm, 6 torp, short range).
VIIC to represent U-31's (and similar) (105mm gun, 6 torp, medium range).
IX to represent Mittel U's (both an 88mm & 105mm gun, 16 torp, long range).
IXD to represent the few U-151's (two 105mm & 18 torp, very long range).

I am assuming that stats like crush depths, diving speed, surface & submerged speeds, hull strength & repair times be changed?

Obviously a realistic deck gun would be more important in such a mod... I have heard of a realistic deck gun mod with GWX, does anyone know the details of how this works?
To represent periods of restricted warfare it would be useful to split up the merchant shipping of enemy nations & make them a part of a generic neutral nation. Is this possible?
Would it be possible to mod 'invisible' weapons for some merchant ships? This way Q ships could be somewhat represented as they'd only give themselves away by firing (though even then how would you improve a Q-ship AI to make it cunning... i.e. it only returns fire or fires when a U-boat has gotten close enough to kill?)
Can torpedo speeds & ranges be adjusted... and electric torpedoes removed. Also can torpedo loads & torpedo tube configuration be modded?
I believe ASDIC could be disabled or at least diminished appreciably & depth charge count (& size) reduced ... am I correct? Hopefully the 'informal' hand made depth charges of 1915 could also be implemented?
Can the actual date on the campaign map be changed or will that have to be abstracted?
Seaplanes & airships would be most useful... as would new naval bases, pre-dreadnoughts, sailing ships & old style liners. Enemy submarines would be extremely useful.
I'm assuming that reducing torpedo warhead strength is possible? However does decreasing the torpedo warhead affect anything in a flooding based damages system (like what NYGM & GWX have)?
Totally 'blue sky thinking'... could ASW trawlers drag chunks of SH3 ASW nets behind them to help catch subs? Or could an abstract ASW net be represented by invisible but extended projections from the back of the trawlers?

Mush Martin · 02-08-07, 05:57 PM

I used mission editor a few times to simulate
Jutland.

a very impressive scene it was too.

you could do it as a mod with a mission or two or three

a campaign would be quite a lot of work though and
the depth of it would have us all waiting for
the Imperial flotilla to finish there work instead.

but it is possible to do it however modelling is quite a chore
and Im not able to do that part at all.
MM

Mush Martin · 02-08-07, 05:59 PM

Damage issues need to be balanced

keel strength versus torpedo yield etc balancing it to try and
aproximate the performance of original ships and weapons
etc.
MM
PS I am currently working on a Cruiser sub with two deckguns.

ReallyDedPoet · 02-08-07, 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mush Martin

the Imperial flotilla to finish there work instead.

MM

When's this out

RDP

Mr Welles · 02-08-07, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mush Martin

I used mission editor a few times to simulate
Jutland.

a very impressive scene it was too.

you could do it as a mod with a mission or two or three

a campaign would be quite a lot of work though and
the depth of it would have us all waiting for
the Imperial flotilla to finish there work instead.

but it is possible to do it however modelling is quite a chore
and Im not able to do that part at all.
MM

Hmmm... unless I'm mistaken, you'd have to mod so many of the core values of the game to make a few missions that you may as well make a campaign anyway (even if it was only a limited, say 1918, campaign)

Two deck gun U-boats would be amazing

As for Imperial Flotilla, I don't believe it will be out for many years plus it'll be a different game in its own right... I'm just hoping to create a WW1 mod (indeed I'm surprised no-one has bothered... though from what i can tell SH3 was initially very 'un-moddable') for SH3.

02-08-07, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Welles

I know the textures can be changed, but can the actual 3d models of the U-boats be changed? Yes. There are new Ships, so new Boats should be possible too.

...speed, surface & submerged speeds, hull strength & repair times be changed?
Yes, can be changed too...

Obviously a realistic deck gun would be more important in such a mod... I have heard of a realistic deck gun mod with GWX, does anyone now the details of how this works? For me the DG in GWX is very close to reality (from what I know about DG´s)
To represent periods of restricted warfare it would be useful to split up the merchant shipping of enemy nations & make them a part of a generic neutral nation. Is this possible? I dont know...
Would it be possible to mod 'invisible' weapons for some merchant ships? This way Q ships could be somewhat represented as they'd only give themselves away by firing (though even then how would you improve a Q-ship AI to make it cunning... i.e. it only returns fire or fires when a U-boat has gotten close enough to kill?) I dont know...
Can torpedo speeds & ranges be adjusted... and electric torpedoes removed. Also can torpedo loads & torpedo tube configuration be modded? Yes
I believe ASDIC could be disabled or at least diminished appreciably & depth charge count (& size) reduced ... am I correct? Hopefully the 'informal' hand made depth charges of 1915 could also be implemented? Yes
Can the actual date on the campaign map be changed or will that have to be abstracted? I guess thats possible...
Seaplanes & airships would be most useful... as would new naval bases, pre-dreadnoughts, sailing ships & old style liners. Enemy submarines would be extremely useful. Possible to do, but with a BIG time eddort...
I'm assuming that reducing torpedo warhead strength is possible? However does decreasing the torpedo warhead affect anything in a flooding based damages system (like what NYGM & GWX have)? Im not sure, but it should be no problem to simulate a WW1 torpedo...
Totally 'blue sky thinking'... could ASW trawlers drag chunks of SH3 ASW nets behind them to help catch subs? Or could an abstract ASW net be represented by invisible but extended projections from the back of the trawlers? I dont think this will be possible due to the AI limits in SH3...

As you can see, im not that sure about all that stuff, but i think that a WW1 mod is absolutely possible. With a huge and GOOD crew, with much time(!!!!!!!) and patience...

Mr Welles · 02-08-07, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nippelspanner

As you can see, im not that sure about all that stuff, but i think that a WW1 mod is absolutely possible. With a huge and GOOD crew, with much time(!!!!!!!) and patience...

If it truly requires a huge AND good crew then it ain't going to happen or it, likely, would have happened already.

However after several years of prior modding I'm hoping there will be a whole bunch of 'tricks of the trade' that others have painstakingly discovered for their various WW2 mods which I perhaps can use for a WW1 mod.

Boris · 02-08-07, 07:43 PM

I doubt it's going to happen. Considering it took the GWX dev team as long as it did, with the biggest mod crew so far assembled... the insurmountable task of a WWI TC would not be worth it. Probably like 2 years work.
I expect the next large modding effort to be first making SH4 more realistic, while the geniuses sort out the technical possiblility of an Atlantic U-boat TC. If SH4 is going to be as moddable as the devs promise, I think there's going to be a frenzy.

Mush Martin · 02-08-07, 10:01 PM

modding the simulated ship and gun strength changes and putting them in is
easy,

ship modelling is very demanding work.

when I model ww1 I just use acceptable substitute ships.

but editing the campaign rnd lnd and scr layers for a whole war is a lot of work.

so is reworking the dates of all units and combatant nations.

for missions you dont have to do the whole thing and they are quick to
build and fun to make.

you can do what your trying to.
but to do an SH3 TC for WW1

doubtful.

02-08-07, 05:52 PM	#1
Mr Welles Nub Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 3 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 0	WW1 Mod I'd just like to say hello and that I've been enjoying NYGM for a few months now (thank you to the makers of that mod) and that I'll download GWX soon (thank you in advance). However I'm interested in the possibility of making a ww1 mod for SH3... I have several questions for the hard working SH3 mod community, any responses would be useful. I know the textures can be changed, but can the actual 3d models of the U-boats be changed? Or would I have to keep the current models as abstractions for ww1 u-boats? Probably something like a IIA to represent UB I (no deck gun, 2 torp, V.short range). IID to represent UB II (though IIA/IIB would be better size wise) (88mm, 6 torp, short range). VIIC to represent U-31's (and similar) (105mm gun, 6 torp, medium range). IX to represent Mittel U's (both an 88mm & 105mm gun, 16 torp, long range). IXD to represent the few U-151's (two 105mm & 18 torp, very long range). I am assuming that stats like crush depths, diving speed, surface & submerged speeds, hull strength & repair times be changed? Obviously a realistic deck gun would be more important in such a mod... I have heard of a realistic deck gun mod with GWX, does anyone know the details of how this works? To represent periods of restricted warfare it would be useful to split up the merchant shipping of enemy nations & make them a part of a generic neutral nation. Is this possible? Would it be possible to mod 'invisible' weapons for some merchant ships? This way Q ships could be somewhat represented as they'd only give themselves away by firing (though even then how would you improve a Q-ship AI to make it cunning... i.e. it only returns fire or fires when a U-boat has gotten close enough to kill?) Can torpedo speeds & ranges be adjusted... and electric torpedoes removed. Also can torpedo loads & torpedo tube configuration be modded? I believe ASDIC could be disabled or at least diminished appreciably & depth charge count (& size) reduced ... am I correct? Hopefully the 'informal' hand made depth charges of 1915 could also be implemented? Can the actual date on the campaign map be changed or will that have to be abstracted? Seaplanes & airships would be most useful... as would new naval bases, pre-dreadnoughts, sailing ships & old style liners. Enemy submarines would be extremely useful. I'm assuming that reducing torpedo warhead strength is possible? However does decreasing the torpedo warhead affect anything in a flooding based damages system (like what NYGM & GWX have)? Totally 'blue sky thinking'... could ASW trawlers drag chunks of SH3 ASW nets behind them to help catch subs? Or could an abstract ASW net be represented by invisible but extended projections from the back of the trawlers? Last edited by Mr Welles; 02-08-07 at 07:18 PM.

02-08-07, 05:57 PM	#2
Mush Martin Eternal Patrol Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,398 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	in my case I used mission editor a few times to simulate Jutland. a very impressive scene it was too. you could do it as a mod with a mission or two or three a campaign would be quite a lot of work though and the depth of it would have us all waiting for the Imperial flotilla to finish there work instead. but it is possible to do it however modelling is quite a chore and Im not able to do that part at all. MM __________________ RIP Mush Tutorial

02-08-07, 05:59 PM	#3
Mush Martin Eternal Patrol Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,398 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	further Damage issues need to be balanced keel strength versus torpedo yield etc balancing it to try and aproximate the performance of original ships and weapons etc. MM PS I am currently working on a Cruiser sub with two deckguns. __________________ RIP Mush Tutorial

02-08-07, 10:01 PM	#9
Mush Martin Eternal Patrol Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,398 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	yeah modding the simulated ship and gun strength changes and putting them in is easy, ship modelling is very demanding work. when I model ww1 I just use acceptable substitute ships. but editing the campaign rnd lnd and scr layers for a whole war is a lot of work. so is reworking the dates of all units and combatant nations. for missions you dont have to do the whole thing and they are quick to build and fun to make. you can do what your trying to. but to do an SH3 TC for WW1 doubtful. __________________ RIP Mush Tutorial

02-08-07, 07:43 PM	#8
Boris Sea Lord Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Hamburg, Germany Posts: 1,691 Downloads: 41 Uploads: 0	I doubt it's going to happen. Considering it took the GWX dev team as long as it did, with the biggest mod crew so far assembled... the insurmountable task of a WWI TC would not be worth it. Probably like 2 years work. I expect the next large modding effort to be first making SH4 more realistic, while the geniuses sort out the technical possiblility of an Atlantic U-boat TC. If SH4 is going to be as moddable as the devs promise, I think there's going to be a frenzy.