mk 23's

c13Garrison · 09-02-13, 01:02 PM

Shouldn't mk23 torps be just as defective as mk14's? They sound like the exact same animal just with no longer range setting. Once you've had one awful experience with 14s its too easy to avoid them, both 10s & later 23s cost no renown.

chris455 · 09-02-13, 01:53 PM

Mark XXIII had the same Mk VI exploder as the Mk XIV. Same depth engine, same gyro gear. Difference was purely in the propulsion area, no low speed/long range setting in the XXIII.
They suffer from all other defects endemic to the XIV.

The reason that XXIIIs cost no renown later is probably because the high speed/ short range setting becomes increasingly less attractive as Japanese anti-submarine capabilities get better as the war progresses, necessitating attacks from greater range.

c13Garrison · 09-02-13, 02:09 PM

Well the mk 23s modelled in the game have near zero defects, so that certainly isn't accurate then. A true need is to build on Bubb's 14 work and Joe's 28 work to come up with a single comprehensive torpedo update, that both tweaks them to realism & makes it difficult to avoid the mk 14, by making the 14 the only torp that costs zero renown.

Bubblehead1980 · 09-02-13, 03:44 PM

Actually my understanding was that Mark 23 did not enter service until late 43(game allows you to get them too early) after the torpedo bugs were worked out so none went to sea with the magnetic detonator they had the improved firing pin so duds were not a factor.In my mod they do have same chance of running deep throughout the war as do Mark 14's although the constant, major depth problems are solved as they were in real life in late 42.

Rockin Robbins · 09-03-13, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bubblehead1980

Actually my understanding was that Mark 23 did not enter service until late 43(game allows you to get them too early) after the torpedo bugs were worked out so none went to sea with the magnetic detonator they had the improved firing pin so duds were not a factor.In my mod they do have same chance of running deep throughout the war as do Mark 14's although the constant, major depth problems are solved as they were in real life in late 42.

Yes, that's entirely correct. To make it even weirder, most of the mark 23's were back-converted to Mark 14s because skippers wanted that slow speed for long shots. No wonder the couldn't hit anything! The slower your torpedo the longer your target has to do something purposeful or accidentally to ruin your shot. Not only that but inaccuracies in your setup are much more meaningful at slow speed.

Heck, if you can't get within range of a high speed Mark 14, it's not even worth it to take the shot unless it's a very high priority target and you just figure a 10% chance of success is as good as you'll ever see.

Admiral Halsey · 09-03-13, 11:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

Yes, that's entirely correct. To make it even weirder, most of the mark 23's were back-converted to Mark 14s because skippers wanted that slow speed for long shots. No wonder the couldn't hit anything! The slower your torpedo the longer your target has to do something purposeful or accidentally to ruin your shot. Not only that but inaccuracies in your setup are much more meaningful at slow speed.

Heck, if you can't get within range of a high speed Mark 14, it's not even worth it to take the shot unless it's a very high priority target and you just figure a 10% chance of success is as good as you'll ever see.

Funny thing is that in RL those long shots could and did hit.

TorpX · 09-03-13, 11:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

To make it even weirder, most of the mark 23's were back-converted to Mark 14s because skippers wanted that slow speed for long shots.

I've wondered about this. As you say, the odds of getting a hit beyond 4,500 yds. would seem to be much reduced. Were IJN ASW efforts that much better? Or maybe sub skippers just wanted to keep their options open, and have the longer range, just in case.

c13Garrison · 09-02-13, 06:22 PM

Ah, well as long as the 23's only work on the contact pin, I guess they're ok as is then.

joefremont · 09-03-13, 10:15 AM

On doing research for my mod I checked the games configured files and discovered the only difference between the mk14 and mk23 was the lack of the slow speed on the 23 and that the mk14 had a less powerfull warhead than other standard US and German torpedoes. I think that was to reflect the early war TNT warhead.

09-02-13, 01:02 PM	#1
c13Garrison Ensign Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Chicago-ish, USA Posts: 223 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	mk 23's Shouldn't mk23 torps be just as defective as mk14's? They sound like the exact same animal just with no longer range setting. Once you've had one awful experience with 14s its too easy to avoid them, both 10s & later 23s cost no renown.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Switch to Linear Mode Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode

09-02-13, 01:53 PM	#2
chris455 A-ganger Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 71 Downloads: 97 Uploads: 0	Mark XXIII had the same Mk VI exploder as the Mk XIV. Same depth engine, same gyro gear. Difference was purely in the propulsion area, no low speed/long range setting in the XXIII. They suffer from all other defects endemic to the XIV. The reason that XXIIIs cost no renown later is probably because the high speed/ short range setting becomes increasingly less attractive as Japanese anti-submarine capabilities get better as the war progresses, necessitating attacks from greater range.

09-02-13, 02:09 PM	#3
c13Garrison Ensign Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Chicago-ish, USA Posts: 223 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	Well the mk 23s modelled in the game have near zero defects, so that certainly isn't accurate then. A true need is to build on Bubb's 14 work and Joe's 28 work to come up with a single comprehensive torpedo update, that both tweaks them to realism & makes it difficult to avoid the mk 14, by making the 14 the only torp that costs zero renown.

09-02-13, 03:44 PM	#4
Bubblehead1980 Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Florida USA Posts: 7,109 Downloads: 605 Uploads: 44	Actually my understanding was that Mark 23 did not enter service until late 43(game allows you to get them too early) after the torpedo bugs were worked out so none went to sea with the magnetic detonator they had the improved firing pin so duds were not a factor.In my mod they do have same chance of running deep throughout the war as do Mark 14's although the constant, major depth problems are solved as they were in real life in late 42.

09-02-13, 06:22 PM	#8
c13Garrison Ensign Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Chicago-ish, USA Posts: 223 Downloads: 14 Uploads: 0	Ah, well as long as the 23's only work on the contact pin, I guess they're ok as is then.

09-03-13, 10:15 AM	#9
joefremont Loader Join Date: Apr 2013 Location: Near San Francisco Posts: 82 Downloads: 47 Uploads: 0	On doing research for my mod I checked the games configured files and discovered the only difference between the mk14 and mk23 was the lack of the slow speed on the 23 and that the mk14 had a less powerfull warhead than other standard US and German torpedoes. I think that was to reflect the early war TNT warhead.