"SH3Gen" Campaign enhancement (version 0.6.0)

[GlobalExplorer]

UPDATE 2009-09-14

I've focussed my activities on other things and there is no more time for Sh3Gen to be actively developed. But because of its design, it can be run with SHIII in the future.
Sorry that I never took the time to fix the issue with dolphins appearing as icebergs :shifty: . But I wrote instructions how you can easily fix it in several threads in the past
Since there were some problems with the web page, I put up the download again. If you miss the old website content it is contained in the installation package in folder Sh3Gen/Documentation/Web.

Latest version is 0.8.2 and everything you need can be downloaded from here: http://www.global-explorer.de/SH3GEN/contentpage_download.htm

Sh3Gen campaign enhancement

Sh3Gen is an external patrol engine for Silent Hunter III. It is reading and analyzing the main application files, adds historic and geospatial data and writes back an updated patrol information into a savegame. The new information shows up on reload of the savegame, in the ingame map and wardiary.

Sh3Gen is designed to be fully compatible with all mods for SHIII, and its data structures are open for community mods. Using Sh3Gen is safe, as the only files affected are the ones from the specified savegame. Sh3Gen is not a mod, but an application, and can safely be run with any mod, as long as the mod is working in the first place. Since its release, the concept has proven to be working, user have reported that the program is stable and clean.

Precisely, you will be given information about:

■ enemy ports - what kind of ships are there?
■ warships, big ships and convoys - where does naval intelligence suspect them to be?
■ the overall situation - whats going on in the world in general?
■ single merchants - in which areas can you expect to find unprotected shipping?
■ position of allied airbases - deduct amount of allied airpower from this

In addition to the data that comes from SHIII, it adds layers of 'virtual' data, namely:

■ real, varying mission objectives
■ standing operational orders in effect during the patrol, specifically researched for the whole war

Sh3Gen is meant to be an athmosphere and gameplay enhancement, not a spysat mod. Therefore, any information will be given randomly and will often not be reliable. There are a multitude of options to adjust reliability and amount of information to your playing style, as well as options to switch off certain modules.

You will also be given real mission objectives, derived from patrol data, for the first time giving missions an interesting purpose, that is tightly integrated within the game world. There is no direct reward for fulfilling the objectives in terms of prestige points, other than what you make of it in your imagination, but I think it will reward you with much more interesting missions than vanilla SHIII.

The first time you use Sh3Gen please read my quickstart guide. The instructions might sound a bit complicated or daunting, but in fact it is very simple and logical, as you will notice if you have used it a few times.

See this thread for information about the Tracking Room Edition, which automatically creates detailed strategic maps for you:

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=106314

http://www.global-explorer.de/thumbs/uk2.jpg (http://www.global-explorer.de/screens/uk2.jpg)You need DotNET Framework to run this software. I offer working versions for both .NET 1.1 and 2.0. Ignore everything you might read about lack of .NET 2.0 compatibility, while I am updating the documentation.



Thanks to all people involved, especially: Brad Golding, Hans Abbadon, Georg Unterberg. My thanks also go to Jaeson Jones, bigboywooly and the GWX crew for their support.
http://www.global-explorer.de/theaters.jpg

[Marhkimov]

WOW! This looks promising. :yep:

[Ducimus]

WOW :o

This does most certainly look to remove the tedium from patrols. An engaging experience is a good one.

[Vonsteel]

BLOODY FANTASTIC.... Downloading now!
It certainly gives you a bit more to do and think about instead of hitting the X button all the time to get to the destination quickly..

Very nice effort

[THE_MASK]

It says there is an unhandled exception


See the end of this message for details on invoking
just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.

************** Exception Text **************
System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.Interpreter.CInterpreter .prime(CGroups Groups)
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.Interpreter.CInterpreter .Run()
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.CCampaign.initializeCamp aignData()
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGenerator.Run(Str ing PatrolGrid)
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGen2.Button_OK_Cl ick(Object sender, EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.OnClick(EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.OnClick(EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.OnMouseUp(MouseEventAr gs mevent)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmMouseUp(Message& m, MouseButtons button, Int32 clicks)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ButtonBase.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage (Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(M essage& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)




************** JIT Debugging **************
To enable just in time (JIT) debugging, the config file for this
application or machine (machine.config) must have the
jitDebugging value set in the system.windows.forms section.
The application must also be compiled with debugging
enabled.

[Vonsteel]

Bah.... Just installed and got this trying to generate :(



See the end of this message for details on invoking
just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.

************** Exception Text **************
System.ArgumentException: Item has already been added. Key in dictionary: "BBKingGeorgeV" Key being added: "BBKingGeorgeV"
at System.Collections.SortedList.Add(Object key, Object value)
at Sh3Gen2.Foundation.Containers.CSortedCollection.ad d(Object Item, String Key)
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.CPeriod.initializeFactio ns()
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.CPeriod..ctor(String Key, String Name, Int32 BeginDate, Int32 EndDate)
at Sh3Gen2.Database.CDatabase.GetPeriod(Int32 Date)
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGenerator.Run(Str ing PatrolGrid)
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGen2.Button_OK_Cl ick(Object sender, EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.OnClick(EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.OnClick(EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.OnMouseUp(MouseEventAr gs mevent)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmMouseUp(Message& m, MouseButtons button, Int32 clicks)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ButtonBase.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage (Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(M essage& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)


************** Loaded Assemblies **************
mscorlib
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/microsoft.net/framework/v1.1.4322/mscorlib.dll
----------------------------------------
Sh3Gen2
Assembly Version: 1.0.2208.7904
Win32 Version: 1.0.2208.7904
CodeBase: file:///C:/Program%20Files/Sh3Gen/Sh3Gen.exe
----------------------------------------
System.Windows.Forms
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/assembly/gac/system.windows.forms/1.0.5000.0__b77a5c561934e089/system.windows.forms.dll
----------------------------------------
System
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/assembly/gac/system/1.0.5000.0__b77a5c561934e089/system.dll
----------------------------------------
System.Drawing
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/assembly/gac/system.drawing/1.0.5000.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/system.drawing.dll
----------------------------------------

************** JIT Debugging **************
To enable just in time (JIT) debugging, the config file for this
application or machine (machine.config) must have the
jitDebugging value set in the system.windows.forms section.
The application must also be compiled with debugging
enabled.

For example:

<configuration>
<system.windows.forms jitDebugging="true" />
</configuration>

When JIT debugging is enabled, any unhandled exception
will be sent to the JIT debugger registered on the machine
rather than being handled by this dialog.

[Noily]

GlobalExplorer - A quick question is this designed to be used with a clean install or can it be used with mods :up:

[Skweetis]

note that dotNET 1.1 and 2.0 are exclusive. Programmes written with 1.1, will not work if you only have 2.0 installed.

[Tazzie]

Has anybody got this mod to work yet? :hmm:

[Mr.Fleck]

Yes, its working fine for me.

I'm using Win XP with latest patches, .NET 1.1, SH 3 with RuB 1.45, SH3 Commander and a variation of graphics and sound mods.

The map markings and information are visible. The information in the war diary is not visible. I suspect SH3 Commander is overwriting it or the wrong file is written when SH3 Commander is used.

I like the tool and encourage GlobalExplorer to continue his work.

Cheers
Mr. Fleck

[GlobalExplorer]

Today I have issued version 0.1.1 that should fix some of the issues posted here.

To all the people who dowloaded Sh3Gen and got Exception messages as posted by some, this is happens while Sh3Gen is building its database (see FAQ). I have put restrictions on the use of exception handling, because I want to see whats going on. If these problems are handled at runtime, the results of the generation process might be unsatisfactory, without us knowing why.

One thing that Sh3Gen is very good at is showing small inconsistencies in the mods you are using. I have found out some interesting things, for small errors in Harbour Traffic like a Swedish naval base in Izmir and the like. There are also German ships in French harbours at the wrong time and naval bases in CAMPAIGN_RND, though this might be a feature of the milchcow mod.

If you encounter problems and are looking for a solution please:

- post the name of the campaign mod you're using (RuB, HT, IuB, U-Boat War, TeddyBar, ..)
- send me the exact error message like some users already did. It helps me assess the problem greatly.

@Cdre Gibs: You might have dotNET 2.0 installed. My new version lets you continue the installation, though my dotNET check is not successful. I haven't tried it with dotNET 2.0 yet, but Microsoft says it should be compatible. Also keep in mind that as of now, dotNET 2.0 is still only beta. Please retry with version 0.1.1 and tell me if it worked.

@Vonsteel: Your Roster\Sea contains .cfg files with incorrect ClassNames (looks like you spawned the .cfg of BBRevenge for another unit). This has been fixed in 0.1.1, by using the filename instead of the ClassName in the .cfg file.

@sober: I have included a change in 0.1.1 that might help with your problem, but I am not sure. Please post which campaign mod you're using, and maybe send me the file Sh3Gen.log by email.

@Noily: You can absolutely use it with mods, but right now there are still some problems.

Some info from the updated FAQ, which might help as well with your problems:

Q: Does this require a "clean" install or can I use it with mods?
A: Of course you can use it with mods. The program might however create an error message with some mods, and be unable to successfully generate data. Because the program is designed to read whats there and see what can be made out of the data, you should always give it a try. The worst thing that can happen is that you will not be able to use the program with your particular mods and that the generation process might not be successful, but you can be 100% sure that your Sh3 installation is not harmed.

Q: I am getting exception messages that say a certain item could not be added or a certain object does not exist. Can you explain to me whats going on?
A: These errors usually occur if some of the data in your Sh3 folder is inconsistent (usually if a unit or classname has been used twice) and it is exactly the kind of error that is to be excepted wile Sh3Gen is building its database. Keep in mind that, while the program itself is pretty small, it is analyzing large amounts of text (right now ~ 20 Mb). Usually, this text has been changed my a multitude of mods, and not every small mistake shows up in Sh3. Right now Sh3Gen is designed to be pretty picky about data consistency, because I don't want to get unpredictable results, and I also want to see what went wrong.

[Mr.Fleck]

@GlobalExplorer: Do you use different randomization ranges for enemy and for friendly minefields and sub nets? Since the position of friendly minefields and sub nets should be well known, I suggest either very small positional variations or no variation at all. What do you think?

So long
Mr. Fleck

[Marhkimov]

So I take it that SH3Gen is really good at discovering errors which might be present in other mods?

Perhaps it could be used in a secondary measure as a "checking" tool for modders??? :hmm:

[GlobalExplorer]

@Mr.Fleck: Thanks for the thumbs up. You are correct, the mine randomization is a special issue. Right now I am not showing the waypoints of all the mines, but just the waypoint of the OrdnanceUnit. The problem with randomization in ports is, that units might show up on land, but a small randomization would be better. I have put this into valid suggestions.

@Mr.Fleck: I am not using Sh3Commander, but if it is writing into the wardiary as well, you can't have both. But in coming versions it should be absolutely no problem to analyze the wardiary better (right now it also overwrites your sinkings, thats why I said generate at the beginning of a mission, somewhat out of port).

@Marhkimov: To some extent. I guess I could implement a spysat mode that shows all units in a certain timeframe with their internal Ids. You can also find some information in Sh3Gen's debug files. But right now I don't have plans to implement too many nice-to-have's, as there is still much work to be done to improve the current features.

[Mr.Fleck]

SH3 Gen seems to work with SH3 Commander. My previous statement that SH3 Commander is conflicting with the war diary is wrong. It was my mistake. I must have messed up the files. :oops:

Everything looks fine right now :up:

Cya
Mr. Fleck

[Gizzmoe]

Also keep in mind that as of now, dotNET 2.0 is still only beta.

It isn´t, 2.0 Final was released a while ago.

[THE_MASK]

Thankyou . Works now after installing 1.1

Regards FRITZ DITTMER OBERLEUTNANT Z. S.

[THE_MASK]

How do i access this colored world map while playing the career ?

[Skweetis]

That's correct, .NET framework 2.0 is now released. If the program is written in .NET 2003, it will NOT be compatable with 2.0. they are two seperate frameworks. However, programmes developed in .NET 2005 are backwards compatible with 1.1.

Case in point, installing 2.0 will NOT overwrite 1.1.

I don't mean to highjack, I am just clarifying the .NET framework issue, as I understand a bit about .NET as my company develops its software using it.

[GlobalExplorer]

@sober: I am glad it's working for you now. Which campaign mod are you using?

@sober: The colored map is just for reference. I hope you can easily locate the theaters in this map. However, I will make an annotated map later.

Gizzmoe: I have checked and yes, you are correct. DotNET 2.0 is final since a few months, as is Visual Studio 2005.

@Skweetis: Does this mean everybody with 2.0 has to / can install 1.1 alongside? I ask because I absolutely have to put this into the technical readme.

[Vonsteel]

Youre NEW version has worked the treat... No errors now..

BUT :damn: i created a new saved game about 100nm outta Kiel, generated a new (mission) via youre program (went good) went back into the game restarted the saved game, looked at the map in Portsmith as ships where sighted there and NO markers..

Am i missing something?

Keep going mate, Im liking this new toy :) :up:

[simsurfer]

bookmark

[Vonsteel]

Bookmark?? :D

[Average Joe]

I've tried a full patrol and started a new one, and Sh3-Gen is pretty neat. It adds a new interest to patrols!

The only minor problem I see is installing. It allows the user to pick (browse) the drive and folder where SH3-Gen is to be placed. I tried installing to D:\Sh3Gen\ , but folder/files ended up in the default install location ( C:\program files\Sh3Gen\ ). No real problem, I just moved the folder to drive D: and made a new/proper shortcut.

I like the way it mentions: Historic Period, 'Hunted' :know: , as my campaign date is now June/1944, and it's pretty rough!

Pretty neat too, to be able to re-generate a save-game for better results of intel, etc.

So it works very well so far, no real problems at all, and it's fun.

Another thing, (GlobalExplorer you basically warn about this) is to use Sh3Gen right after exiting/saving out of home port.

If I use Sh3Gen to re-generate a save-game, I lose ship-course plotting and any other map markings from the save, but it's not a problem. Reloading a save-game (not re-generated) will load sub-course, plots, markings as usual.

Also I think using the 'global' eraser icon in the F5 map-screen will remove all Sh3Gen markings, so that's a no-no.

While I did see convoys and a few single contact-marks far from land, most seem concentrated on harbors, and and standard-route convoys. Much past mid 1943, and usually it's too dangerous to enter such shallow waters and try to enter an enemy harbor. But this will be great during early-war patrols! :up:

I don't know if it's possible, but it would be neat to see a some areas marked, where there's some chance of heavy concentrations of single-type merchants, in several areas. That would really help-out during late-war patrols.

Thanks for making this mod :) I know it takes 'gobs of time' to create them.

p.s. 'Wish-list'; auto-updated (moving) positions of possible contacts throughout a patrol. Probably not possible though.

[Skweetis]

@Skweetis: Does this mean everybody with 2.0 has to / can install 1.1 alongside? I ask because I absolutely have to put this into the technical readme.

Yes, that is correct. If you used develepment studio 2003, it will not work with .NET 2.0.

Therefore they MUST have 1.1 installed.

Hope that helps.

PS: it is my inderstanding that .NET 2.0 isnt used by any programs yet, the 2.0 Framework is there at this point for developers using Studio 2005, which I believe is still in beta. Ill ask the programmers at work tomorrow.

[GlobalExplorer]

Today I have released version 0.1.2. The most important update is the fixed installer and an included map of all the theaters of operations.

@Vonsteel: I am not completely sure what you are mean, but I take that your intelligence update said that there are ships in Portsmouth but you didn't see any markers? Then you are indeed missing something. Marine intelligence has a suspicion about certain units being in this port, but cannot locate them precisely. So it is your job to go there and check for yourself! Does this help?

@Average Joe: Haha, thanks for pointing out the problem with the installer. Has been fixed in 0.1.2. If you knew in what rush the first installer was thrown together, you certainly wouldn't have used it :)

@Skweetis: Can you confirm that 1.1 and 2.0 can be installed on the same machine? It should work, though I would like to hear it from someone who has actually tested it.

[GlobalExplorer]

will try v0.1.2 tomorrw as its nearly 02:00am here

Wouldn't help, as this looks like a bug in the "Generate" button, and I haven't changed anything there. Better wait till the next update.

But please send a screenshot of Sh3Gen, before you push the "Generate" button, to mail@christian-wendt.org, because I have to see what you entered in the dialog boxes.

Also, please send me the file <savegamename>.psc

Whats you patrol Gridsquare?

[kriller2]

wow! nice mod :up: , I have tested this and it works good on Rub 1.45 and HT 1.47, but I can't get the war-diary to show the information? which file do I have to change to get it to work?

/Kriller

[GlobalExplorer]

wow! nice mod :up: , I have tested this and it works good on Rub 1.45 and HT 1.47, but I can't get the war-diary to show the information? which file do I have to change to get it to work?

/Kriller

The war diary is saved in <savegame name>.clg. So please check that. By default, Sh3Gen Beta writes into Entries 1-3, so you will lose this info if another application writes there too. If you want, you can also send the file to me because I will see what went wrong. There is also a certain possibility that Sh3 doesnt like some entries, and I will have to change something in my output routine.

Hasta luego,
GlobalExplorer

[GlobalExplorer]

Will do when I get back, dropping my son off at the airport (sending him on a holiday to Sydney), but I can tell you my patrol grid right off. Its a NULL patrol - I'm between ports and chasing down 3 convoys

Gut Johann, sehr gut. I could reproduce your error, and it's the null value. No more sending of files needed. Just stay tuned for my next small update which will fix your problem.

[Vonsteel]

!!AWESOME NEWS!!

Got it to work properly newest version.
Saved my game OUT of kiel again about 100nm wenr back to the opening screen in game (menu area) alt tabbed did the business(generating) Loaded the previosly saved game and there were all the markers, and especially the WAR DIARY entry :rock: :rock: :rock:

Wonderful

[JScones]

@Cdre Gibs: You might have dotNET 2.0 installed. My new version lets you continue the installation, though my dotNET check is not successful.
Are you using the userAgent string? Try this method... http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-us/dnnetdep/html/useragent.asp

I haven't tried it with dotNET 2.0 yet, but Microsoft says it should be compatible.
:rotfl: Yeah, MS will have you believe that won't they? That's why you still need 1.1 to run apps developed with 1.1 and 2.0 to run apps developed with 2.0. Cdre Gibs has found this out by the sounds of things... ;)

@Skweetis: Can you confirm that 1.1 and 2.0 can be installed on the same machine? It should work, though I would like to hear it from someone who has actually tested it.
The answer is yes. Curiously, have you visited the .NET Framework Developer Center (http://msdn.microsoft.com/netframework/)?

General note especially for XP SP2 users: Don't forget to update your .NET Framework 1.1 via Windows Update!

[Marhkimov]

geez... look at all the computer whizzes...... Too bad I'm not one... ;)

[GlobalExplorer]

Are you using the userAgent string? Try this method...


Thanks for the info. I will check that. Right now I am using the dotNET check sample code that came with NSIS, which has so far worked very well.

As you seem to be a qualified person to ask, can you give me some tips how I can find the Silent Hunter III path in registry? I want to remove the necessity to specify the path manually, but I am not very good at using the registry.

[GlobalExplorer]

20 cm of snow in Berlin, so why not release version 0.1.3 today. It should fix the problem with null patrol areas, as well as some other issues with patrol areas. I have also altered the parameters for neutral and friendly units somewhat, so you should see more spanish, french, scandinavian and italian shipping resulting in more varied ship names.

So far I have mostly been answering your questions, but today I have a number of questions to you.

Questions:

Q: What features would you like to be added?

Q: How do you think Sh3Gen influences the game? Do you want to make it the game easier or harder?

Q: Do you want to see more or less targets, or more specificly smaller ones like patrol boats etc.?

Q: Can you report any conflicts with other mods? which ones should I download and try with Sh3Gen?

Q: What do you think about the way I put the targets into the map. Any questions/suggestions?

Q: Who can report a target sunk with Sh3Gen? The first one to post a screenshot of a sunken warship will be promoted !!

Q: Who wants to work together with me? I need someone with an interest in historic research, because I usually have no time to find all the info myself. For instance I am still looking for Axis / minor factions merchant and convoy names, standing orders, naming system of allied hunter killer groups, etc. etc.

Q: What do you think about more pages in the war diary? So far my ideas are:
-friendly units
-grid squares with high ship concentration
-special missions (needs collaboration with campaign designers)
-standing orders / news (needs somebody else to compile the text)

Q: Do you think this is this ready for a general release? If no one is having any major probs I will make this public in all the major forums once version 0.2 is ready (so far the beta test was exclusive for the subsim.com mods forum).

[Col7777]

Question:

Forgive my ignorance but do I need version 1 of this to be installed first and are the other versions updates or can I just intall the latest version?

I like the sound of this mod. :up:

[GlobalExplorer]

@ Cdre Gibs: Aircraft coverage is a good idea! It's pretty simple to mark airbases with a circle. I already had experimented with it. Problem is, I find it pretty ugly and not really useful. See for yourself:

http://www.global-explorer.de/aircoverage.jpg

Stylised buttons, how cool would that be! Unfortunately we have to stick to the things you could do with the drawing tools, so not possible.

Col7777: Whenever I issue an update, you only need the most recent version. It has an installer and everything, and it's less than 200kb, so maybe you should try it. It will never interfere with mods, so there is no real risk to try it. The worst thing that can happen is that you get an error while reading from Sh3 and have to wait until it's fixed. Or you might lose a savegame, that's why I say to backup them beforehand.

[Vonsteel]

I just looked at youre web page and the 0.1.2 is still on youre site...
Have you uploaded the newest ver?

[Col7777]

I just instaslled the version on your webpage, I got all kinds of errors like one of the posts above, also do you have to be in a campaign or does it work with single missions too?

[kriller2]

The war diary is saved in <savegame name>.clg. So please check that. By default, Sh3Gen Beta writes into Entries 1-3, so you will lose this info if another application writes there too. If you want, you can also send the file to me because I will see what went wrong. There is also a certain possibility that Sh3 doesnt like some entries, and I will have to change something in my output routine.

I cant get the war diary to show when I begin a career, like your picture nr.2... It shows up in SHgenerator but not in SH3 in the mission briefing, when I look in <save game>.clg all the mission text is there.

[GlobalExplorer]

I just instaslled the version on your webpage, I got all kinds of errors like one of the posts above, also do you have to be in a campaign or does it work with single missions too?

I'd like to help but I must see the text of the exception (see above). I have never thought of using it with single missions, do you think this is a worthwile addition?

[GlobalExplorer]

The war diary is saved in <savegame name>.clg. So please check that. By default, Sh3Gen Beta writes into Entries 1-3, so you will lose this info if another application writes there too. If you want, you can also send the file to me because I will see what went wrong. There is also a certain possibility that Sh3 doesnt like some entries, and I will have to change something in my output routine.

I cant get the war diary to show when I begin a career, like your picture nr.2... It shows up in SHgenerator but not in SH3 in the mission briefing, when I look in <save game>.clg all the mission text is there.

I must see it kriller, otherwise I can't help you. I have a suspicion that the text is too long (happens at the beginning of 1939).

[GlobalExplorer]

I have just uploaded version 0.2.0. It's using a much simplified user interface .. it doesn't get more Zen I think :)

http://www.global-explorer.de/interface_main.gif

I have added code to read the Silent Hunter III installation path from registry. As I am not sure if this is working with everybodies machines, it would be nice if somebody could check it and let me know.

I have also added the "Aircoverage" option, which enables the preliminary code to plot airbases. I do however, not like very much how it plots into the map, but I thought that it might be interesting for some people to see for themselves. The option is disbled by default, but you can enable it under Settings->General->Aircoverage.

[THE_MASK]

Version 2 works fine .
XP sp2
.net 1.1
.net 1.1 hotfix
.net 2
commander 2
RUB 1.45

[THE_MASK]

Have you noticed that when looking at the map and you use the (clear map) button it also clears all your info as well .

[JScones]

Are you using the userAgent string? Try this method...


Thanks for the info. I will check that. Right now I am using the dotNET check sample code that came with NSIS, which has so far worked very well.

As you seem to be a qualified person to ask, can you give me some tips how I can find the Silent Hunter III path in registry? I want to remove the necessity to specify the path manually, but I am not very good at using the registry.
Yep, I'll dig out some code and PM it to you, although it sounds like you may have it licked already. I'll also dig out some info that helps allow you to get your app to work with either .NET Framework 1.1 or 2.0 (Side-by-Side execution). This may take me a few days to get around to, though. ;)

Just be mindful that some people have multiple SH3 installations...you may like to add switch support so people can choose the installation that they want to use.

[Ragtag]

Wow, this is a damn nice mod :D
Works excellent and i just love the diary. Keep it up :)

[GlobalExplorer]

Version 0.2.1 is out. Among some minor changes, I have now implemented a config file which allows you to adjust the global parameters that Sh3Gen uses to generate the patrol layer. I had planned to do this at a much later stage, but I am already very happy with the way the output scales with changes in the global parameters. I encourage everyone to play around somewhat with the values and tell me if he found a well balanced setting, because this will save me some limited testing time. If I like your files, they might be included in the next versions or hosted at my site. We'll see.

I am also satisfied that I have also made some progress in my quest for the smallest possible map file that contains the most valuable information (see my reply to Cdre Gibs's post) - filesize is now ~ 10kb, while it used to be >20 at the beginning.

@sober: This is expected, and theres nothing I can do about it. Maybe you could remove the erase all button from your map tools, but it might be easier if you simply don't use it :)

@Cdre Gibs: I'm glad I could finally get you a version that works :) I mean how many times did we try? But not in vain, because through your input I could fix that #null# patrol issue, which I just forgot.

@Cdre Gibs: I have already considered myself to suppress all German ports, because I didn't like the amount of info either. Therefore I have included a change in 0.2.1 which does duppress all shipping in german ports except minefields and subnets. Note that this could be achieved with a single change in Parameter.ini - I set:
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_German=0.0 (used to be 0.7 I think).
So if you want to roll back to the situation before 0.2.1, just change the line to:
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_German=0.7
or something you like more. Got it?

@JScones: Thanks for your help. I am sure this information will be very useful.

@Ragtag: Great that you like it. If you want to make a suggestion, here's the place. As my creativity has already been used up atm, I am now waiting for new ideas.

[GlobalExplorer]

For the record, I want to publish the details of the parameter.ini, because I hope some people will start working with it:

[LocationUpdate]
#These values control the intelligencelevel for locations#
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_German=0.0
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_Axis=0.6
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_NeutralAxis=1.0
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_Neutral=1.0
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_NeutralAllies=0.5
Coeff_LocationUpdateModifier_Allies=0.3
Inc_LocationUpdateBaseValue=0.5
Delta_LocationUpdateVariation=0.5
Thd_LocationUpdateMinGroups=1

[GroupVisible]
#These values control the chance for groups to be visible#
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_German=0.7
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_Axis=0.6
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_NeutralAxis=1.0
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_Neutral=1.0
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_NeutralAllies=1.0
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_Allies=0.075
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_AlliedWarship=6.0
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_AlliedTaskgroup=0.5
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_AlliedValuable=3.0
Coeff_GroupVisibleModifier_AlliedConvoy=1.5

[TheaterAssessment]
#These values control the assessment of the general situation#
Thd_SituationUpdate_Theater=0.4
Thd_SituationUpdate_Single=10
Thd_SituationUpdate_Warships=5
Thd_SituationUpdate_Neutrals=10
Thd_SituationUpdate_Hunters=20
Thd_SituationUpdate_Convoys=3

[PositionalVariation]
#These values control the positional variation of visible units#
Delta_PositionalVariation_Theater=2500
Delta_PositionalVariation_Location=0

[BaseVisible]
#These values control the chance for bases to be visible#
Coeff_BaseVisibleModifier_AlliedAirbase=0.6

[Aircoverage]
#These values control the way aircoverage is used#
Inc_AircraftRangeBaseValue=500
Delta_AircraftRangeVariation=250

[Ragtag]

I don't know how the original campaign creator works but is it possible to have SH3gen to detect when it creates a new mission and then have SH3gen to generate and add the information automatically before i start the mission?
Just so we wont have to alt-tab, generate and then reload.

I have no idea how this works so i'm just asking :P
Again, great work :up:

[Herr Karl]

I don't know how the original campaign creator works but is it possible to have SH3gen to detect when it creates a new mission and then have SH3gen to generate and add the information automatically before i start the mission?
Just so we wont have to alt-tab, generate and then reload.

I have no idea how this works so i'm just asking :P
Again, great work :up:

Sounds like a good idea to me...thxz GE

[GlobalExplorer]

Today I have uploaded version 0.2.2 , which fixes a serious oversight in the war diary. With the previous versions, if the entries created by Sh3Gen exceeded a certain number of lines, Sh3 would hang permanently whenever you wanted to switch to the war diary. It seems this is because Sh3 cannot arrange single entries over multiple pages.

For this alone, I have complete rewritten the part that does the war diary output. It can now spawn long entries over several pages, which should result in a theoretically infinite number of possible informations. You won't see much difference, but this will come handy in case I should implement additional features in the war diary.

@Ragtag & Herr Karl: I have anticipated your question. Of course it sounds idiotic that you have to go out of port, create a save game, run an external app and then reload. But before I started implementing Sh3Gen I had to decide if I was going to implement it this way or not at all.

The problem is, simply put, if you want to add this amount of new features to a game like Sh3 you will need a hole through which you will be able to smuggle it in. I have found one in the form of the .map and .clg files, though it has the aforementioned inconveniences and of course it's not the best one could think of.

But it works very well.

Moreover, I think it is realistic, as real U-Boat commanders where only allowed to open their orders when they were already at sea.

If someone has found a better way that works, I'd be glad to implement it into Sh3Gen.

[GlobalExplorer]

Version 0.3.0 has been uploaded to my site. For this version, I have improved the spatial engine by adding support for quadrants and cartographic aliasnames. Most importantly this means that you are now going to see occasional info on single merchant traffic. Moreover, info about targets includes the quadrant or a geographic location, not just the theater of operation as in previous versions.

I think I can better illustrate the changes with some screenshots:

http://www.global-explorer.de/v030_summary1m.gif

http://www.global-explorer.de/v030_summary2m.gif

http://www.global-explorer.de/v030_summary3m.gif

[ref]

Last mod is very cool. :yep:
The only thing I don't like is that the program overwrites logs entries, I love to generate a report in the middle of the patrol, so the data is more usefull, perhaps a solution is to scan the log for the first entry of a sunk ship :

"EntryText=Ship sunk!...."

and renumber the following entries, something similar with the map file, preload the file, insert the lines you need at the begining, so we don't lose our previous markings and waypoints.

Perhaps you have already tried and is not possible, but asking is free... :P

[GlobalExplorer]

@ref: I hear ya. Probably I am going to work on that. The problem with writing a parser is that I don't know the proper strings in all the different localisations.

In the German version, for instance, if theres a marker in the map, its name is always "MarkierungXy". Now what would that be in English or French?

Having said that, I think I can solve it in some way. I am aware that the clg output must be more intelligent.

[Rubini]

GlobalExplorer:

I just arrive from a month's vacation. What a great mod! :o
I don't install it yet but the idea is brilliant! I have a question: Can you add a special info about the milk cow units?. I think that will be an useful feature for guys using Sansal/HT mod. If you need some help here just ask me!

Greetings,

Rubini.

[GlobalExplorer]

I always like if people post their ideas, but especially if it is you Rubini! Milch cows were only in the back of my mind, but when i think about it, they are a cool addition to the immersion factor. Right now the way Sh3Gen handles them is not convincing .. You will see a marker next to the navalbase's position, but it doesn't have the right name. For instance, I find it odd if 'Corrientes' is annotated as 'Carl Zeiss' or something else from my internal ship database. So I must work on that.

I think possibly the logic could be (pseudocode)

if((german_navalbase_found)&&(navalbase_outside_german_port))
{
navalbase_is_supply_boat=true;
}

I could then give the unit the name that you gave it in the mission editor (otherwise I use one from my database).

Moreover, I could trigger additional logic that will show a new message in the war diary:

"During <timeframe> our U-Boat Supplier 'Corrientes' will be in Vigo"

One question: Have you thougt about providing metadata for you campaign files that other applications might read? This would open up fantastic new possibilities.

[Rubini]

GlobalExplorer,

Yours two possibles solutions are very good! The name can be a generic "Ressuply unit" if would be too hard to find the "real" name.

BTW, what is "metadata" ??? :hmm:

Rubini.

[GlobalExplorer]

GlobalExplorer,

Yours two possibles solutions are very good! The name can be a generic "Ressuply unit" if would be too hard to find the "real" name.

BTW, what is "metadata" ??? :hmm:

Rubini.


metadata=buzzword :)

Many people say it's the future of digital information, or the internet.

It basically means to provide data that describes data. Metadata should be provided
if your data is going to be read and interpreted by other applications.

Example data that I took from your Campaign_SCR:

[Unit 2584]
Name=Pinguin
Class=GeAuxCruiser
..

If an application can only read this data, a lot of ambiguity remains. In this case, for instance, the Name 'Pinguin' is a correct shipname. But in other cases it is a generic string like '39_RussiaTraffic_001'. The designation of the unit is also very vague, in that I know that it is a German AuxCruiser, but not what it is going to do. It could be a docked ship, a supplier or even a Blockade Breaker on a special mission.

Now imagine, you as the campaign designer, would have provided another file, that describes some, maybe just the 10-20 most interesting units. It would then be possible to 'know', what the unit is going to do, and to trigger special logic.

Examples (mind that this would never be in Campaign_SCR, but in another file):

[Unit 2584]
Name=Pinguin
Type=CommerceRaider

I could trigger a special mission that goes like:

Our cruiser 'Pinguin' is on a commerce raiding mission in South Atlantic

or

[Unit xy]
Name=Courageous
Type=UnableToMove

Special mission could be:

The carrier 'Courageous' has been damaged and lies stopped at <position>. Go there at once and sink it

or

[Unit xy]
Name=
Type=SpyBoat

Resulting output could be:

Our agents in Ireland prepare an exchange of documents. They will await you in <location> between <timestart> and <timeend>

[Rubini]

Ok, I understand. :up:

I can help you with a lot of info on this stuff.
I know where and when in the SCR some special units goes on patrol, all the info about milk cows (their positions, dates, names, etc) , Uflaks disposable in the bay of Biscay, some german convoys, Bismarck and Tirpitz operations etc...

I will try to put all these info on a text file and point them to you...or even make a special SCR with these infos on it with a special codification...What is better? :hmm:

Rubini.

[GlobalExplorer]

Great!

We should start very simple. If you can provide me with some info about the most important targets in HT1.47, it should be my task to come up with a convincing demo. Once this is accomplished, we can think about the concept another time, and more seriously.

For the beginning, an unformatted text file with 10-20 units would do. I would analyze it and make a list of all the different types of entities I find, as well as make a proposal for the metadata format. In the interest of analysis, it might be better if you try to write down one example of every type of unit you can thnk of, but of course not every single entity of this class. One is already enough.

IMO, the most important types of units would be:

- suppliers (docked or milchcows)
- commerce raiders (Atlantis)
- warships and taskgroups (Weserübung etc)
- concentrations of landing crafts or troop ships (d-day)
-german and italian convoys (north africa)
- concentrations of U-Boats (wolfpacks)

For some reason, atm I can't think of any more, but there are loads.

All should be from static layer (SCR), because I think this information should be reliable.

The info should always contain:

[Group/UnitId from Campaign_SCR, so I can match the info, this is very important!]
Name=<Historic or fictional name>
Class/Type=try to verbalize the type of unit
Why is is there?
What type of action does perform (i.e. warship patrol, commerce raiding, etc), could also be put into Class/Type
Anthing else I didn't think of.

I don't need info about waypoints, EntryDate, ExitDate, etc, because this is already in Campaign_SCR, and we should never duplicate data.

As I said, lets keep it very simple. I have already been approached with some grand ideas, but I prefer to work on something that will work, and without the user having to understand it.

The metadata strategy always works, because the application will check if the metadata file is available, and if it's not, work as usual.

[Rubini]

Ok GlobalExplorer,

Can you send your email adress to me? This way we can share files easily. Contact me by PM. ;)

Rubini.

[NoLine]

- concentrations of landing crafts or troop ships (d-day)


Ok finaly my LCVP is gonna be scripted in the campaign :D

http://img353.imageshack.us/img353/7060/flag5xh.jpg

[NiKuTa]

I have still error :(

Instaled:
XP SP2
.net 1.1
Sh3Gen 0.3.0
commander 2
RUB 1.45
HT 1.47

Mesage :

See the end of this message for details on invoking
just-in-time (JIT) debugging instead of this dialog box.

************** Exception Text **************
System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.Interpreter.CInterpreter .prime(CGroups Groups)
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.Interpreter.CInterpreter .Run()
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.CCampaign.initializeCamp aignData()
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGenerator.Run(Str ing PatrolGrid)
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGen2.Button_OK_Cl ick(Object sender, EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.OnClick(EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.OnClick(EventArgs e)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.OnMouseUp(MouseEventAr gs mevent)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WmMouseUp(Message& m, MouseButtons button, Int32 clicks)
at System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ButtonBase.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.Button.WndProc(Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ControlNativeWindow.OnMessage (Message& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.ControlNativeWindow.WndProc(M essage& m)
at System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.Callback(IntPtr hWnd, Int32 msg, IntPtr wparam, IntPtr lparam)


************** Loaded Assemblies **************
mscorlib
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/microsoft.net/framework/v1.1.4322/mscorlib.dll
----------------------------------------
Sh3Gen2
Assembly Version: 1.0.2216.30497
Win32 Version: 1.0.2216.30497
CodeBase: file:///F:/Gry/SilentHunterIII/Sh3Gen/Sh3Gen.exe
----------------------------------------
System.Windows.Forms
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/assembly/gac/system.windows.forms/1.0.5000.0__b77a5c561934e089/system.windows.forms.dll
----------------------------------------
System
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/assembly/gac/system/1.0.5000.0__b77a5c561934e089/system.dll
----------------------------------------
System.Drawing
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573
CodeBase: file:///c:/windows/assembly/gac/system.drawing/1.0.5000.0__b03f5f7f11d50a3a/system.drawing.dll
----------------------------------------

************** JIT Debugging **************
To enable just in time (JIT) debugging, the config file for this
application or machine (machine.config) must have the
jitDebugging value set in the system.windows.forms section.
The application must also be compiled with debugging
enabled.

For example:

<configuration>
<system.windows.forms jitDebugging="true" />
</configuration>

When JIT debugging is enabled, any unhandled exception
will be sent to the JIT debugger registered on the machine
rather than being handled by this dialog.

[GlobalExplorer]

Version 0.3.1 has been uploaded. I made some changes in reaction to the problem posted above. Because this is related with the way I use quadrants, I have added the missing arctic quadrants AA,AB,AC,AW and AT. Unfortunately UBI left these quadrants from Sh3, but they are easily locateable. Basically they are an extension to the north of the current quadrants, stretching from Greenland to Novaya Semlja.

NOTE: This version exludes every unit outside the current quadrant system, so at the moment there will be no info about traffic in the Black Sea and Eastern Mediterranean. Who can give me information about Kriegsmarine Grid system used in these regions?

@NiKuTa: Check your pm.

[NiKuTa]

Oki, but where is a link to new ver of Sh3Gen?????? :)

[ref]

Oki, but where is a link to new ver of Sh3Gen?????? :)

Page 1 of this thread :

http://www.global-explorer.de/

[ref]

I don´t know if this is related to sh3gen or a bug in my save files, but when I use sh3 commander and try to update my personell file I got an error message "list index out of bounds", anyone else is getting it?.


Suggestion, for those of us with slow machines, a progress bar should be appreciated.

@global explorer, thanks for the file.

[GlobalExplorer]

This must be a problem when Sh3Commander reads the changed .clg file. I had been in contact with JScones, and he said there should be no problem, but since I have changed the output recently this deserves review.

How about that: I could offer an option to remove all Sh3Gen entries after the patrol is finished.

[JScones]

SH3Cmdr does not read any "in mission" save files - when creating a Personnel File, SH3Cmdr reads:

From the selected career folder
Careers.cfg
Careers_0.cfg
Patrols.cfg
Patrols_0.cfg
Log_x.cfg files

From SH3
**_menu.txt
Basic.cfg
UboatAces.cfg
EnglishNames.cfg/GermanNames.cfg

If SH3Gen doesn't modify any of the above files, email me the career files and I'll have a look.

[GlobalExplorer]

@JScones: Thanks for coming :)

I am indirectly modifying the following files:

Log_x.cfg

That is of course, because the <savegame>.clg file gets copied after the patrol.

So it's pretty much obvious that my entries cause this problem when Sh3Commander reads the Log_x.cfg files.

I have uploaded a sample Log_0.cfg. Could you please have a look?

http://www.global-explorer.de/Log_0.cfg

I have two suggestions how this can be solved:

1st: I offer an option two remove Sh3Gen entries after the patrol (why would you look at them anyway). Hoewever that it is somewhat awkward.

2nd: I could use a format that is easily recognizable. For instance I could make use of the entrytitle property and make my titles always begin with "---", not just sometimes. Also, right now I am not using the entrytitle property, but I think I should do that.

Could it be a solution that you simply skip reading all entries without entrytitle? I don't need it because it is useless for formatting. The first entry with the patrol dates doesn't use the title either, so as I assume you are reading only the sinking´s and summary, you could consider these entries as a new class which is non-relevant.

[JScones]

Yeah, I can see where SH3Cmdr is getting upset. Whilst the sample file is fine, if you insert an entry that contains less than three elements (ie "<data>|<data>" or just "<data>"), SH3Cmdr will error with "List index out of bounds (2)". This is because SH3Cmdr is expecting three elements for these entries.

Of course, the flow on is that even where the added entry does have three or more data elements, the resulting HTML file won't be formatted correctly for those "new" entries.

The easiest fix is for you, and anyone else writing to the log file, to write a non-zero number to the "Type" key. I can then add one line to SH3Cmdr to ignore any entry where Type <> 0.

But, whilst this workaround is very simple, I won't be in a position to release an updated version of SH3Cmdr for a few weeks at the earliest, although I could provide just the updated SH3Cmdr.exe file to anyone who's using SH3Gen.

And also, this fix (presumably) won't exclude the extra text from displaying in the relevant Patrol Log summary displayed in SH3 - is this an issue (I assume SH3 will still present the entries OK, but is this what you/users really want)?

[GlobalExplorer]

The easiest fix is for you, and anyone else writing to the log file, to write a non-zero number to the "Type" key. I can then add one line to SH3Cmdr to ignore any entry where Type <> 0.

This won't do, as Sh3 will not display entries with Type <> 0

But, whilst this workaround is very simply, I won't be in a position to release an updated version of SH3Cmdr for a few weeks at the earliest (although I could possibly provide just the updated SH3Cmdr.exe file to anyone who's using SH3Gen).

I' say it would be already very nice if we could have a fix with the next version of Sh3Cmdr, whenever it's released. Sh3Gen is still Beta, and the reason is to identify / solve this kind of problem. In any case I'm glad that you offer your help to make the two apps compatible.

I'm also indebted to Ref for being the first one to report this problem. I have offered him my help for a manual fix, which is in fact pretty simple. Every one else with this problem is invited to contact me for the manual solution.

And also, this fix (presumably) won't exclude the extra text from displaying in the relevant Patrol Log summary displayed in SH3 - is this an issue (I assume SH3 will still present the entries OK, but is this what you/users really want)?

Yes. That's why I will have to offer a 'remove Sh3Gen entries from patrol log' function anyway. It could be run after the patrol, before Sh3Cmdr is used. I just don't want it to be a must. It should be no problem if the user doesn't mind the extra entries.

As far as Cmdr is concerned, I think the check for entries without EntryTitle might be better.

Something like:

try
{
EntryTitle = ClgFile.Read("Log entry " + index, "EntryTitle");
//proceed with reading the entry
//...
}
catch
{
//EntryTitle doesn't exist, so entry will be skipped
}

[KaleunPeter]

Seems quadrant AH is also needed?

1.4b, RUB 1.45, HT 1.47, TeddyBear Campaign RND and LND.
New career 09/39, 2. Fltl, started via SH3Commander.


Item has already been added. Key in dictionary: "AH Key being added: "AH".

************** Exception Text **************
System.NullReferenceException: Object reference not set to an instance of an object.
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.Interpreter.CInterpreter .prime(CGroups Groups)
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.Interpreter.CInterpreter .Run()
at Sh3Gen2.Database.Campaign.CCampaign.initializeCamp aignData()
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGenerator.Run(Str ing PatrolGrid)
at Sh3Gen2.Applications.MapGen2.CMapGen2.Button_OK_Cl ick(Object sender, EventArgs e)

mscorlib
Assembly Version: 1.0.5000.0
Win32 Version: 1.1.4322.573

Sh3Gen2
Assembly Version: 1.0.2218.37244
Win32 Version: 1.0.2218.37244


Output snipped a bit to save space.

Edit: Forgot to mention: SH3Gen 0.3.1

[GlobalExplorer]

@KaleunPeter: You really helped me by pointing to Teddy Bär's NYGM campaign. I could reproduce your error! Problem was that he has hand edited the entries for hospital ships, and mixed up the order of two properties. Seems to be only a problem for Sh3Gen, as I am reading sequentially.

I have uploaded 0.3.2, which fixes this problems. NiKuTa should download the new version, too. I think he had the same problem.

[KaleunPeter]

Now that was a fast fix...

Just installed 0.3.2 and ran it on my savegame from out of Wilhelmshaven. Generation completed without errors. Good work. :)

[GlobalExplorer]

Now that was a fast fix...

Just installed 0.3.2 and ran it on my savegame from out of Wilhelmshaven. Generation completed without errors. Good work. :)

Don't wonna lose you as a customer :)

Btw, 9/1939 is about the strangest month in the whole war. You will get twice as many contacts during this time than during the rest of the war. I will have to talk with campaign designers why this is the case. It could be intentional to simulate easy picking during the first weeks, but I find it overdone.

And yes, this should mean that there is generally more traffic in 9/1939. Maybe nobody has noticed this yet, as Sh3Gen is the first application that can visualize the traffic during a patrol.

[JScones]

This won't do, as Sh3 will not display entries with Type <> 0
How inconsiderate of it. Curiously, where *does* the text added by SH3Gen display within SH3?

As far as Cmdr is concerned, I think the check for entries without EntryTitle might be better.

Something like:

try
{
EntryTitle = ClgFile.Read("Log entry " + index, "EntryTitle");
//proceed with reading the entry
//...
}
catch
{
//EntryTitle doesn't exist, so entry will be skipped
}
Peh. Just gotta add if (not iIdx in [0,slEntries.Count - 1]) and (Length(iniFile.ReadString(slEntries[iIdx], 'EntryTitle', '')) = 0) then continue; as the first line in the loop. ;)

I still need to ensure that the first and last entries are included even though they have no EntryTitle, hence the first test. The second test explicitly looks for an EntryTitle value, as this is more robust than just checking for the existance of the key.

I must admit that I'm not a big fan of this solution as it means that no user added entry can utilise the "EntryTitle" key (plus I suspect that this design decision will come back and haunt me when I get into the expanded patrol log feature) - I'd almost suggest that a new key should be written when manually adding entries which SH3Cmdr can check for and exclude. Something such as "NonSH3Entry=1" or whatever. Either way, though, it's only one extra line of code.

EDIT...Reflectively thinking...Perhaps by writing a unique key you can save yourself some hassle when removing your changes from the Log files? For instance, SH3Cmdr won't care whether the "NonSH3Entry" value is 0, 9, 99, 354.66 or PurpleMonkeyDishwater, so you could specifically write "NonSH3Entry=SH3Gen" and then check for the presence of this value when removing your entries.

[GlobalExplorer]

I'd almost suggest that a new key should be written when manually adding entries which SH3Cmdr can check for and exclude. Something such as "NonSH3Entry=1" or whatever. Either way, though, it's only one extra line of code.

EDIT...Reflectively thinking...Perhaps by writing a unique key you can save yourself some hassle when removing your changes from the Log files? For instance, SH3Cmdr won't care whether the "NonSH3Entry" value is 0, 9, 99, 354.66 or PurpleMonkeyDishwater, so you could specifically write "NonSH3Entry=SH3Gen" and then check for the presence of this value when removing your entries.

Yes. Thats so much better than my proposal. And seems to work too. I have just loaded a file with additional properties NonSh3=true and it showed up fine. I must do some more testing of course.

In fact this idea will help me implement some new features easily :up:

[JScones]

Yes. Thats so much better than my proposal. And seems to work too. I have just loaded a file with additional properties NonSh3=true and it showed up fine. I must do some more testing of course.

In fact this idea will help me implement some new features easily :up:
Be careful though - whilst SH3Cmdr won't care, users of SH3Whatever which also writes to the log may get upset if you strip all entries where NonSH3=true, 'cause you may take out more than just your own! For that reason, I'd set a (string) value which will be unique to SH3Gen, so you can query it with full confidence that you're not gonna strip out someone else's added text.

For that reason, can we perhaps change the keyname to "EntrySource"?

BTW, my one line of code looks much neater now...
if iniFile.ValueExists(slEntries[iIdx], 'EntrySource') then continue;

[GlobalExplorer]

Be careful though - whilst SH3Cmdr won't care, users of SH3Whatever which also writes to the log may get upset if you strip all entries where NonSH3=true, 'cause you may take out more than just your own! For that reason, I'd set a (string) value which will be unique to SH3Gen, so you can query it with full confidence that you're not gonna strip out someone else's added text.

For that reason, can we perhaps change the keyname to "EntrySource"?

Yes, something like EntrySource=Sh3Gen is best, as entries can be directly identified and removed.

BTW, my one line of code looks much neater now...
if iniFile.ValueExists(slEntries[iIdx], 'EntrySource') then continue;

Hehe, that can still be improved. In C#, my aim is usually something like:

ClgFile File=new ClgFile(Path);
foreach(ClgEntry Entry in File.Entries)
{
//process entry
}

[JScones]

Yes, something like EntrySource=Sh3Gen is best, as entries can be directly identified and removed.
Done. If you/anyone wants the updated SH3Cmdr.exe file, let me know.

[Rubini]

Hi JScone and GlobalExplorer,
Great work! Thanks to solve this issue so quickly! :rock:
I should like to test the new SH3Cmdr fix.
My email:
arubinig@ig.com.br
I will install the SH3Cmdr 2.4 (with the fix) today and run some tests with SH3Gen.



GlobalExplorer,
Today at night I will upload the text file from HT to you. :up:


Rubini.

[GlobalExplorer]

@JScone: I have uploaded a sample output file. Could you please have a look if this is in accordance with your fix?

http://www.global-explorer.de/1939.clg

I hope you can all wait a little bit :) My reworked output will be in version 0.4.0, which I hope to finish in a couple of days. It will change much more than the Sh3Cmdr fix. My aim is an intelligent output that will no more overwrite your sinkings or map entries.

@Rubini: I am looking forward to see your HT file!

[irish1958]

GlobalExplorer,
Thanks for your wonderful work. This mod is great and add greatly to the game. I'm glad you are working with other modlers to intigrate and improve this idea.
irish1958

[Oldgold]

Two thumbs up! Got me intrested in SH3 all over again. Looking foward to hearing future development to this fine mod. Dankeshien Christain!

[GlobalExplorer]

@:irish1958&Oldgold: I am glad you are liking my idea, which grew during half a year of playing Sh3. My plan had originally been to create something similar to Paul Lowengrin's DCG. But later I realized that Sh3 doesn't need a DCG, but rather a means to make the already "dynamic" campaigns more accessible. In fact, most of Sh3Gen should have been implemented in Sh3 in the first place.

[GlobalExplorer]

2006-01-30: Update on Sh3Cmdr compatibility and coming version 0.4

As some people have asked me for the curent status of Sh3Gen I will sum up where we're standing at the moment.

Currently Sh3Cmdr's "Update Personnel File" function will not work on campaigns that have been "enhanced" with Sh3Gen :) JScones and I are working on a solution for that. In fact we already had a solution which unfortunately turned out to be not working :)

I have also encountered some minor problems with re-saving and re-loading. A lot of info would get lost when you were re-saving a savegame generated with Sh3Gen.

I have already fixed these problems for version 0.4, and added improvements as well. The whole output has been re-structured so that it should give better clarity as well as no more cause problems with re-save/re-load.

Moreover, as already announced, version 0.4 will be able to write output intelligently, so that you will no more lose previous waypoints, map entries, sinkings, etc. That means, you should also be able to use Sh3Gen in mid-patrol.

The only problem that remains is the "Update Personnel File" function in Sh3Cmdr. Hopefully JScones and I will have found a solution for this soon. As soon as this is done, I will release version 0.4

Sh3Gen is going to stay beta for a while. For the final release I will be able to provide you with a version that has much better error tolerance. Right now Sh3Gen is set up in a way that it will break off as soon as there is a problem with your data, that's why people are still getting error messages. As with all data-sifting applications, it would be possible to simply ignore the piece of data concerned and continue processing, and the final release will work like that. But at the current stage, it's better to let the application generate an error so that people can report it to me. Therefore, if you encounter abnormal program termination, I encourage you to publish the details as a number of people already did.

GlobalExplorer

[Rubini]

Hi GlobalExplorer,

I'm using the SH3Gen on the last two days without problems. I have a heavy modded SH3 instalation (not RUB) with HT 1.47 and SH3 Cmdr 2.4. The only tiny problems are that what you have pointed on the last post.
Now that i'm using it I can make that text files to send to you soon! ;)

Rubini.

[GlobalExplorer]

Version 0.4.0 has been uploaded to my site.

There are a multitude of changes. The main improvement is the 'intelligent' output. In previous versions, generation would erase most previous map and war diary content. Now, if you use Sh3Gen it will preserve all you waypoints, map entries, sinkings, etc. I think with the new features Sh3Gen is almost ready for general use.

Unfortunately, the new output will not be fully satisfying when used with previous savegames. That's one of the ugly things of beta testing :( You might be able to use the intelligent output with older savegames, but the full features will only be available when you start over with version 0.4.

Other changes:

- added option to selectively disable map and/or war diary output
- added option to check ship destruction and commissioning dates
- removed aircoverage plotting

Version 0.4.0 does not yet contain the promised fix for Sh3Cmdr, because we ran into a little problem and JScones seemed to be unavailable today.

But I have implemented a solution for Sh3Cmdr users that is pretty simple. I have included the promised function to remove Sh3Gen entries after patrol. That means, if you want to use Sh3Gen 0.4 and Sh3Cmdr 2.4, all you have to do is to use my new Sh3Log Editor to remove all Sh3Gen entries from your logfiles (see readme for Sh3Log).

This can also be used if you want to remove my entries for esthetic reasons, i.e. after the patrol, when you only look at the patrol logs for a summary of your sinkings.

In fact, I went overboard and have thrown together a basic editor for patrol log files. For the improved output features in 0.4 I had already implemented the backend for such a program, so I thought I could just write a basic GUI and include it in the package. It should be noted however, that I am not sure if I am going to invest a lot of my time into editor. If people really want to use it, I could implement the missing features (mainly insert and delete entries). But at the moment, Sh3Log should be considered as bonus. I think it will be pretty useful for myself, because there is no alternative atm, and maybe some others will use it too.

http://www.global-explorer.de/sh3log.gif

I have reorganized the whole output. There should be no more problems with re-saving / re-loading. Moreover, text flow as well as clarity have been improved. Targets are now ordered under the suspected location. The text flow will now integrate well with sinkings and patrol summary. Overall, I think it's pretty good now :)

http://www.global-explorer.de/wd1.jpg

http://www.global-explorer.de/wd2.jpg

http://www.global-explorer.de/wd3.jpg

http://www.global-explorer.de/sum1.gif

[Rubini]

Download now, feedback later!:up:

Rubini.

[Vonsteel]

I have had a funny problem that keeps persisting in SH3 Cmdr now that JC is talking on this Post about the intergration of his tool and SH3 Gen...

When i click on Actions/Update youre personnel file i get (List index out of bounds (2) This has happened ever since i started using the SH3 Gen.... Can this be fixed??? Thxs

[GlobalExplorer]

@Rubini: Feedback sounds good :)

@VonSteel: Hehe, maybe you should read the last page of this thread :)

You should download 0.4.0 anyway, as the older versions had some problems long term. If you want to use 0.4.0 and Sh3Cmdr follow my instructions how to cleanup logfiles after patrol. Then you will no more get this error in Cmdr.

As I said before, I hope there will be a "real" fix for Cmdr soon. By real I mean fire-and-forget.

GlobalExplorer

[Vonsteel]

Well instead of me stuffing around with LOG files etc.... Ill wait till a proper fix/Update comes out.......

Goodluck with it

[THE_MASK]

Keep up the good work :sunny:

[GlobalExplorer]

Today a friend came 'round and we played a patrol with Sh3Gen. Here are some screenshots of Leutnant Lütjens, U-558, and his succesful raid on Dover.

Kriegsmarine Intelligence about two suspected warships in Dover:

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/2.jpg

U-558 must not miss this opportunity!

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/1.5.jpg

This is the situation gentlemen:

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/2_overview.jpg

HMS 'Kenya', Southampton Class:

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/3.jpg

Is it a destroyer or is it a cruiser? HMS 'Dido':

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/4.jpg

HMS 'Roxborough', Clemson Destroyer

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/5.jpg

First torpedo hits the 'Kenya':

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/6.jpg

Second torpedo hits the heavily listing cruiser:

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/7.jpg

She won't go down! Let her have another one:

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/8.jpg

She goes down with a big explosion. Note secondary damage on Elco torpedo boat to the right:

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/9.jpg

My first warship after 1 year of playing Sh3. Mission accomplished!

http://www.global-explorer.de/dover/10.jpg

P.S. Currently it's a tad bit too easy for my taste. I will tone it down. But I am very happy :)

Global Explorer

[Letum]

:doh: :doh: :doh:
you're all Crazy going in to ports!
The second a destroyer sees you you're fae is sealed! :dead:


The english could row out in a wooden boat and drop a few hand grenades on your conning tower by sticking their heads in the water to hear you! :dead:

[Nedlam]

Okay, forgive me for asking a stupid question but...

Does this alter the Campaign files or work with what the Campaign files give you and is more like an intelligence report on what is in your Campaign files?

As an example: If your using Campaign files that come with RuB 1.45 only you might get less intel than if you are using the one from HT 1.46 (I think that's the correct version). Because HT has more ummm, harbor traffic, :) in its campaign files.

[GlobalExplorer]

Does this alter the Campaign files or work with what the Campaign files give you and is more like an intelligence report on what is in your Campaign files?

It doesn't alter anything but works with what you have. You described it well.

[Rubini]

Just check your email! :up:

Rubini.

[Nedlam]

It doesn't alter anything but works with what you have. You described it well.

Okay, you convinced me. I'll try it!

[GlobalExplorer]

It doesn't alter anything but works with what you have. You described it well.

Okay, you convinced me. I'll try it!

Great! But before you (or anybody) is going to be disappointed: it might be a good idea to evaluate with a test career until the problem with Sh3Cmdr has been sorted out, and until there are some long-term experiences. However, if your only fear is that it might destroy anything apart from your savegame, this cannot happen.

[GlobalExplorer]

Version 0.5.0 has been uploaded to my site. There are many internal changes that you won't notice. The biggest is the new data driven architecture. Most campaign relevant data is now stored in xml bases data files, which means that the data can be easily expanded and adjusted to taste. In this release, I haven't made use of the new possibilities, so you shouldn't see much difference.

Download:
http://www.global-explorer.de/Sh3Gen%20Beta%200.5.0.zip

I have been able to fix a bug that occured whenever the patrol start month was August or September. This was actually the reason for the many contact updates in '39 I sometimes talked about, so .. sorry it was my fault. Now the amount of info in '39 should be normal.

Apart from the bugfixes, a major improvement is the addition of a slider that adjusts the amount of info revealed by Sh3Gen. My experience so far is, that this should be moved to the left as the war progresses, but it's certainly a matter of taste. Imo the default setting gives a bit too much info, but some people have told me they like it, so now everybody can find their own setting.

http://www.global-explorer.de/general_options.gif

If there are no major problems with this version Sh3Gen is gearing for the next milestone, which is the first release candidates. I am already quite happy with the feature set and general stability so the major things that remain to be done is more balancing and constant improvement. I hope you will understand that I will release less updates once the program is working in a satisfying way, and this is getting closer. It is then to be seen what new features can be added to the program, but generally there is always something I want to add :)

GlobalExplorer

[Church SUBSIM]

Great way to start off a Saturday morning ;)
Thanks for your efforts!

Church

[GlobalExplorer]

Good news for all users of Sh3Gen and SH3 Commander. JScones has provided a fix for the problem with "Update Personnel File":

http://www.global-explorer.de/SH3Cmdr.zip

To install, simply drop SH3Cmdr.exe into your SH3 Commander folder.

:up: Thanks Jaesen! :up:

[Rubini]

Good news for all users of Sh3Gen and SH3 Commander. JScones has provided a fix for the problem with "Update Personnel File":

http://www.global-explorer.de/SH3Cmdr.zip

To install, simply drop SH3Cmdr.exe into your SH3 Commander folder.

Thanks Jaesen!

Great! Great! :rock: :rock:

Rubini.

[GlobalExplorer]

I stopped using SH3Gen only because even after selecting English Text only I still get German for ship class and names. A small detail I know but since I dont speak/read German it sorta killed it for me.

But beyond that every thing else has worked like a charm, Outstsanding effort GE, simply Outstanding! :up:

Ok, after our private discussion I have now understood you problem.

This all comes from the fact that there are dire restrictions as to the structure of names that I can plot into the map:

- must be less than 20 characters
- must not contain unusual characters

So you will have noticed that I use an abbreviation system:

<+|-|?> + <Shiptype> + <Shipname> + <+|-|?>

+ Signature for Axis units
- Signature for Neutral units
? Signature for Allied units

Shiptypes:

BB Battleship
CH Heavy Cruiser
CL Light Cruiser
CX Auxiliary Cruiser
DD Fleet Destroyer
DE Escort Destroyer
FF Frigate
CO Corvette
PT Patrol boat
CV Aircraft Carrier
CVE Escort Carrier
OT Oil Tanker
MS Lineship, Troop Transport, etc
SS Submarine

Now for some reason I couldn't come up with a good abbreviation for merchant ships (MS is already used up by liners and troopships), so there is no abbreviation for them.

After Cdre Gibs feedback I think this might have resulted in a cryptic system, which not everyone will like.

Now here is what I can offer:

1.] option to switch off the abbreviation system (that would mean only abstract designations like "Destroyer" , "Minefield", "Battleship" , .. but no shipnames)

2.] Consistent abbreviations for all types, including Merchants

Has somebody got a good idea for a new abbreviation for merchant ships?

My suggestion: PL or LS for Lineship and MS for Merchant Ship.

[redbrow]

many of you modders are so awesom i demand that if ubi builds another SH game that they include you in the design team!!!!
I DEMAND IT :yep:

[GlobalExplorer]

@Cdre Gibs: Thanks for your input! The next release is gonna have an option to switch off the naming system. With Naming System disabled, the map will only contain no-brainer designations like "Destroyer", "Tanker", "Battleship" etc ..

But even if you want to use the Naming System, I will make some adjustments:

CA for Auxiliary Cruiser
PS for Passenger Ship (Liners and Troop Transports)
MS for Merchant Ship

On top of that, you will be able to make changes to the system through the data files.

GE

[ref]

Is it possible to add intel on the captain log about the convoys in port ?

ie :
Suspected big convoy leaving halifax on date 01-03-41 possible destination bristol. Estimated depart time 6 hs.

German spies at work. :yep:

This way we can try to calculate an interception based on known convoy routes.

Ref

[NiKuTa]

My patrol is in ET25. I have no intel about this region. All intel is only around England. It is good ????

[GlobalExplorer]

Version 0.5.1 has been uploaded to my site.

http://www.global-explorer.de/Sh3Gen%20Beta%200.5.1.zip

In accordance to the input by Cdre Gibs, I have added an option to switch off the naming system.

http://www.global-explorer.de/naming_system_checkbox.gif

If you switch off the naming system, you will see no more cryptic designations in the map. Instead it will always look like this:

http://www.global-explorer.de/naming_system_map.jpg

I have also made the changes to the naming system described above. All strings used for map output are now stored in a data file, which can be altered if you don't like something about my designation system.

[GlobalExplorer]

Think about this GE.

SS Titanic
SS Quean Mary
SS Queen Elizabeth
SS Orian
SS Bharain
SS Hamesly

See a trend here ? ;)

Cdre Gibs: But not all merchants were steamships. There were "Steamers", "Oilers", "Motor ships", etc. Secondly, SS is already the designation for submarines. So, maybe it's just me, but I prefer MS for merchants.

Being a stubborn bastard myself, I have made the changes as initially outlined ;)


BB Battleship
CH Heavy Cruiser
CL Light Cruiser
CA Auxiliary Cruiser
DD Fleet Destroyer
DE Escort Destroyer
FF Frigate
CO Corvette
PT Patrol boat
CV Aircraft Carrier
CVE Escort Carrier
OT Oil Tanker
PS Passenger Ship (Troop Transport, Liner)
MS Merchant Ship
SS Submarine


If you don't like that, the new version allows you to adjust the output to your taste. If you are interested and not afraid to mess around with xml, I'll give you instructions. It's pretty simple.

Also nothing is set in stone so we can discuss and change things.

[GlobalExplorer]

Is it possible to add intel on the captain log about the convoys in port ?

ie :
Suspected big convoy leaving halifax on date 01-03-41 possible destination bristol. Estimated depart time 6 hs.

German spies at work. :yep:

This way we can try to calculate an interception based on known convoy routes.

Ref

@Ref: This is more or less in line with what i would like to add in the future.

[GlobalExplorer]

My patrol is in ET25. I have no intel about this region. All intel is only around England. It is good ????

@NiKuTa: I don't know if you have noticed, but Sh3Gen is using a different set of parameters for the different periods of the war. That means, intelligence on the South Atlantic Theater should be high during Operation Drumbeat, but not before that, and should diminish after August 1942.


The Road To War
19330101-19393008

The Torpedo Crisis:
19390901-19400531
Invasion of Poland until invasion of Norway 05/40

The Happy Times:
19400601-19411131
Until War with USA 12/41

Operation Drumbeat:
19421201-19420731
Fdu sends boats back to North Atlantic ca. 07/42

Radar:
19420801-19430431
until Black May, 40 boats are sunk in 1 month

Hunted:
19430501-19440631
until D-Day 6/44

The End:
19440701-19450531
The Atlantic bases get lost until end of war


If you want instructions on how to change parameters for you current time period, and you are not afraid of xml, ask me. Since version 0.5 it is possible to change these things.

[GlobalExplorer]

Outstanding GE.

Just a lil bit on the GUI. The Intel Slider Bar. I take it that Less intel is to the Left and More is to the Right. But instead of ppl having to guess (although the above is the norm) would it not be possible to put a "-" and a "+" sign at their respective ends of the scale?

I have an XML editor, use it all the time for Freelancer. Dunno if its the same type tho, as that was used to create the ships an weps for the game.

Ok then. The output strings are read from:

..\Sh3Gen\Database\Dictionary\English\Map.names

It should be self explanatory. Look for the node

<Name Key="Merchant">MS </Name>

and change it to:

<Name Key="Merchant">SS </Name>

Using an XML Editor is fine, but even Notepad will do.

[lafeeverted]

The "Intelligence" slider could also be divided by years in the war. Early years you might expect high levels of intell down to the end where very low levels would be available.

[GlobalExplorer]

The "Intelligence" slider could also be divided by years in the war. Early years you might expect high levels of intell down to the end where very low levels would be available.

Good point. But it's already there, in fact has been since the beginning. Read my previous post about how I use different parameters for all time periods. For each period there are different intelligence levels for factions, theaters, as well as general engine parameters.

So what the slider does is give you relatively more or less of what is typical for the period, but it's not like absolute value.

And no, I am not yet finished with the balancing of the parameters but that's why I keep asking for your experiences.

GlobalExplorer

[GlobalExplorer]

Version 0.5.2 has been uploaded to my site. It contains nothing revolutionary, but I have wrapped up a number of small fixes and put it into this version.

-added missing spatial data for Black Sea and Mediterranean operations
-fixed a bug with the spatial representation of Hamburg
-added shipnames for a number of smaller nations (thanks to everyone that helped me with that especially to: malcymalc, Myszkin, Paajtor, Saturn5)

GlobalExplorer

Direct download:

http://www.global-explorer.de/Sh3Gen%20Beta%200.5.2.zip

[Tipsi]

Hi, I'm sorry if this has been asked and answered but where is the save game file? It didn't say clearly in the documentation and I can't see any posts related to it.

Thankyou

[Tazzie]

Your save game files are located \My Documents\SH3\data\cfg\Careers in the folder of your captains name.

[Tipsi]

Thanks very much.

The awsome mod seems to be working as i can see contact markers on the map, however I cannot access the in-game journal information, which was presented to me as soon as I clicked generate.

[THE_MASK]

If i forget to update SH3Gen when i quit SH3 sometimes i cannot remember what is the current save . I use the grid number , BE13 etc or BE13a if saving twice in the same area . Would it be possible to put your SH3Gen folder picture on the latest save folder so i know which is the latest save . Otherwise i have to load SH3 and have a look at what my latest save is and then quit then update SH3Gen then reload SH3 . Thanks

[GlobalExplorer]

@Tipsi: The info should show up in your war diary. If it doesn't, make sure you don't have "Generate War Diary" deselected, and don't forget that your diary has several pages.

@sober: If you browse with the filedialog you can always right click and select
Order symbols by->Date
like in any other filedialogbox. That should help you to find the most recent one. Alternatively there is a button on the top right that lets you select the style "Details" which shows the date for each file.

[Captain America]

This was a pretty neat project...hate to see it sink into the abyss.

Is this going to be developed any further?

-CA

[VonHelsching]

This was a pretty neat project...hate to see it sink into the abyss.

Is this going to be developed any further?

-CA

I'm using it all the time. My 6 year son is excited with it, since he *knows* that we're probably going to find something to sink "where the + and ? symbols are". He even picks the harbors which we are going to raid.

Sometimes, when I play alone, I turn the "intelligence" node to ~25% to have a fair level of uncertainty.

Great work! Keep it Up. Along with gouldjg's Advanced Damage, this application changed SH3 for me. :rock:

[GlobalExplorer]

Thanks for bringing some new live into this thread.

What do you think has to be changed? From what I see it, the current version does pretty much all it should do. Of course there are things I want to improve, but I think everyone who wants to use it can do so with very little problems.

Now to the things that make it hard for me / or any other modder. I see that a fair amount of people have downloaded the beta from my site, but very rarely I hear from them again. Some mailed me when they had problems but didn't bother to tell me if my solutions work. I am not angry at anyone, it's just not very motivating this way - and I have other projects that need my attention.

Captain America's question: My plan is definitely that Sh3Gen will be developed further. I have been able to get help from some AOTD veterans, most importantly I could obtain Hans Abbadon's permission to use his standing operational orders. The only problem is that these people seem to be working at a different pace than me .. what took me days will take them months ;)

It certainly helps if someone posts here from time to time. But I think it will annoy people if I am the only person to bump this thread. What I need to do now is some long term assessment of this program. I have been able to use it myself without any problems, and I had a lot of fun with it. However, I don't play Sh3 that much at them moment.

I will be off to Spain for a longer time, so I wouldn't expect a new version before end of April. As soon as I have started to use the new mods, there will be a release that has been tested with them, and hopefully some great new features.

GE

[VonHelsching]

I have also noticed that a lot of people downloading my fixes / modlets and getting minimal feedback, so this sounds familiar. Some words of encuragement wouldn't hurt from time to time, since they are free; as is the time we give to the game in order to make it better.

Just some ideas for further development:

- To add information / intelligence about airbases
- To add information related to a campaign-style game i.e as
an add on to Uboat War Ace Campaign (by HanSolo78 / Travinski)
in order to "lure" or direct the player to certain hot spots.

Keep up the good work :rock:

VonHelsching

[Church SUBSIM]

Here is a "That-a-boy" for you :up:

One thing that I thought was nice (and since had been removed) were the air range circles. I think this data would have been shared with each commander prior to pulling out of port as well as being constantly updated as the patrols progress.

Perhaps adding it as an option rather than a default?

For me, this program is flawless....simple, not demanding of my system, does what it is designed to do each and every time ;)

Nice bit of coding....

Enjoy Spain ;)

Church

[irish1958]

The problem is that the program is too good. I downloaded it and use it all the time. There are no bugs and it worked perfectly from the first install.

You don't take your car back to the dealer every week and say
"Hi, there is nothing wrong with my car." However, if there is a problem you are there every few days until it is fixed.

Perhaps we need a thread with a poll as to use and problems after a mod has been out for a month or so.
irish1958

[Clyde00]

I have also never had any problems with SH3Gen. It has worked perfect every time! :up:

What about using the diary a little more to feel that you are not alone out there? Such as heer movements across Europe, Luftwaffe bombings, uboats lost or missing, etc...

[FullFathomFive]

'Nuther very satisfied user! SH3Gen provides the feel of a good Intelligence briefing that was totally lacking prior. The level of info provided seems totally appropriate and realistic. Thank you for a major mod! (Flawless install and use also :D )

[Rotary Crewman]

Excellent mod, use it all the time!

Just a question, do you guys wait till you get out of port or until you're close to your patrol area?

[Zinmar]

I use it twice. The first is when I head out, and than halfway to my patrol zone. I haven't had one problem with it and I enjoy it greatly. It doesn't promise that the ships will be in the area when you get there, but is fun hunting them. I came across a task force that way, was cool watching it sail by. Sure wasn't going to launch a torp at them, amd in 1943 now, they are gettin accurate with those charges. :o

[zzsteven]

As the others have said, the program runs great.

It would be nice if the airbases were marked on the map.

zz

[GlobalExplorer]

Ok guys. It's really good to hear that you are using the program :yep:

I will watch this thread and put your suggestions on the list for future updates. We are already working on the new standing operational orders, a major addon that will give you historically correct orders for every patrol, which should be a good read during patrol.

As said before, I would not expect a new version before May. If someone should have discovered a major problem with one of the new campaign mods, please inform me and I might have to act. Otherwise I would wait until I have collected enough new data and stuff, and start coding when I have some rest. For now from you feedback I think that the current beta can be considered absolutely useable, which my personal experience tells me, too.

The aircraft info could be re-enabled, it's just not as simple as it sounds. I have removed the demo feature because I was deceiving you about the exact aircraft range, and better than have info that is wrong, is to have no info at all, isn't it? For the future I will probably make a compromise and map out only the location of airbases, but leave the range calculation to you. In plain language, airbases might be crosses, not circles.

Again, whatever your experiences are, especially in terms of realism and game balance, I'd be happy if we could collect it in this thread for future versions.

GE

[castorp345]

We are already working on the new standing operational orders, a major addon that will give you historically correct orders for every patrol, which should be a good read during patrol.
GE

:up:

i too am a very happy user!

but now, about your mentioned operational orders addon... the idea sounds fantastic [!] but will you be doing it in german? :-?

cheers
hc

[baxter]

GlobalExplorer:
I'm also a satisfied customer. I've never had any problem with it. I use it when I've been in my assigned patrol grid for a week or so and haven't had any action. Since the game doesn't include any way to get new orders (which real U-boats did get) I run SH3 Gen and use that to guide me to a different area to hunt. Thanks for your work and for sharing this with everyone.

[Samwolf]

GlobalExplorer,

Where has this little gem been hidden? If it hadn't been bumped I would have missed it. Downloaded and installed, works as "advertised".

Adds a new feel to the game, now I'm not going out totally blind. :up:

[GlobalExplorer]

but now, about your mentioned operational orders addon... the idea sounds fantastic [!] but will you be doing it in german? :-?

English first, German later

As I have already spilled the news about the operational orders, here is a small preview.

[Original Text by Hans Abbadon, "Standing Operational Orders for AOTD". Edited by Brad Golding.]

http://www.global-explorer.de/various/preview_orders.jpg

I am looking for people who want to help with the german translation. I can do it myself, but it would speed things up if I could concentrate on programming. There have already been some answers to this request, but it would be easier if we had several people, because the work could then be splitted up in years. As the data is planned to be finished until May, translation would begin after that.

[trenken]

Is anyone getting an error? I installed Framework 1.1 and I get an error when I try to launch SH3GEN. Here is the error:

Application has generated an exception that could not be handled.

Process id=0xa84 (2692), Thread id=0xa88 (2696).

[jasonb885]

Sounds interesting. Maybe I should add it as a "Recommended" for IC.

:up:

Oh, and the fact that you're processing the SCR and RND files and extracting info is quite cool. Kind of wish I posted my code for doing that, now, as maybe someone would've actually benefited from it. But then, it was in Perl, so I doubt too many people would care.

Maybe I'll get around to it anyway...

[trenken]

I got your PM Global. I just responded.

[GlobalExplorer]

Kind of wish I posted my code for doing that, now, as maybe someone would've actually benefited from it. But then, it was in Perl, so I doubt too many people would care.

Maybe I'll get around to it anyway...

Yeah. I also sometimes think about releasing some parts, but it only makes sense if someone explicitly asks for it.

I think what's needed would be a high level, open-source API for reading and writing to Silent Hunter III files, like menu_1024_768. It could make merging mods a breeze, or allow writing installers for complicated mods, like 6-dials mod.

I once thought about starting an initiative, but I don't think I have the time.

[ref]

I think what's needed would be a high level, open-source API for reading and writing to Silent Hunter III files, like menu_1024_768. It could make merging mods a breeze, or allow writing installers for complicated mods, like 6-dials mod.

I once thought about starting an initiative, but I don't think I have the time.

Sign me in :up: , I think it's not possible for one person to make it, but with the combined efforts of all the modders it would be more than possible, perhaps starting a wiki, where anyone that figures some part of the sim can publish his findings :hmm:
The hard part wil be putting away personal pride and varoius jelousy issues

Ref

[lurker_hlb3]

GE

Is it possible to make this work on "single missions" ????

Leigh

[jasonb885]

Kind of wish I posted my code for doing that, now, as maybe someone would've actually benefited from it. But then, it was in Perl, so I doubt too many people would care.

Maybe I'll get around to it anyway...

Yeah. I also sometimes think about releasing some parts, but it only makes sense if someone explicitly asks for it.

I think what's needed would be a high level, open-source API for reading and writing to Silent Hunter III files, like menu_1024_768. It could make merging mods a breeze, or allow writing installers for complicated mods, like 6-dials mod.

I once thought about starting an initiative, but I don't think I have the time.

The deal for me is I'm not familiar with any Windows-based programming languages or Java and I've not used .NET or Mono under Linux, the latter getting your compatibility for commandline stuff although I don't believe GUI stuff.

I suppose I could publish a spec, though, which details the fields and how they're interpreted. That would be useful in and of itself, actually.

:know:

[Sgian Dubh]

Is this compatible with RUB+Harbortraffic+SHIIcommander?

[JScones]

I think what's needed would be a high level, open-source API for reading and writing to Silent Hunter III files, like menu_1024_768. It could make merging mods a breeze, or allow writing installers for complicated mods, like 6-dials mod.

I once thought about starting an initiative, but I don't think I have the time.
Actually, SH3Cmdr already contains the code to do this, it's just been implemented for a different purpose (you can currently build a whole Basic.cfg file from the ground up with whatever bits and pieces you like). Wouldn't take much to extend it. It's actually been on my mind since SH3Cmdr R2.0...I've just never had the time to pursue it as a specific task because there are so many different ways to do it...from the basic (simply compare two versions of a file and ask the user to confirm a merge of each difference) to the complex (maintain a back end database with the values stored for common mods and let the user simply "pick" the mod components they want).

I prefer the latter approach as the file "build" process would be transparent to the user as the database would manage conflicts and content etc, but maintaining and keeping the database up-to-date would be a dog.

You know, what would be perfect, is to maintain all the individual mod files on one central server. The player would, from time to time, simply run a client/web front end which would present them with a list of all stored mods. They'd simply click whatever they wanted (like online shopping really) and submit. The front end would interact with the back end server database, gather or build the individual files required (based on stored rules/procedures), and download them to the user's machine, in, of course, JSGME ready format.

Of course, by the time this was completed, we'd be playing SH5...

[JScones]

Another, perhaps more realistic alternative, is for modders to "build" the database themselves when they're compiling their mod. The end result NOT being a whole swag of different config files like is the case now, but just ONE file containing ONLY the values that their mod changes (a simple interface could facilitate the building of this file). As a simple example, think of SH3Cmdr's "Medals and renown.cfg" file.

When the user d/ls the mod, they run a builder/merge tool that "expands" these values back into the game's config files. The builder/merge tool would keep track of what the user has installed/uninstalled previously and would report any conflicts, or perhaps handle conflicts gracefully based on rules set by the modder (kinda like JSGME but more specific).

Anyway, I'm just thinking on the fly here...it's 2am...sleepy-bye time. :zzz:

[GlobalExplorer]

Is this compatible with RUB+Harbortraffic+SHIIcommander?

It is compatible with RUB 1.45, HT 1.47, IUB until 1.02, all of the "german" modpacks I know of, and generally everything until last month. The new modpacks I have not tried, but probably work. Please read the first message of this thread if you want more information. I am not running any tests anymore myself, so you are invited to post first results.

GE
Is it possible to make this work on "single missions" ????
Leigh

I don't know, it might be possible, but I am not working on it. So far I don't have interest in single missions, but thanks for this suggestion.

[GlobalExplorer]

Anyway, I'm just thinking on the fly here...it's 2am...sleepy-bye time. :zzz:

My eyes started to bleed after the first paragraph ..

At least I understand that you are talking about a tool that inserts mod data into ShIII file structures, intelligently resolving conflicts and merging stuff as far as possible. That would make a lot of people happy, especially if you released it as a dll that others can link to.

I think this also might be more realistic than the community / opensource approach, from my experience. Reason is there are too many languages around, Sh3Gen is C#, Sh3Cmdr is Delphi, ref does C++ (I think), I also remember having seen Python, Pearl, VB6 and so on. In fact the only major languages I haven't heard of in a ShIII project is Java and VB.NET,

So far I see no one who would organize such a great project. I could contribute with some good classes for a number of filetypes, but I make use of an extensive classlibrary thats in C#, so no way I am going to port it to another language.

Moreover, much more than I dislike releasing tools is releasing code, because you usually end up with answering a lot of beginners questions, while the pros don't need your code anyway.

But as I said, if someone would start an opensource project, I would try to contribute, and help. Also don't forget that ShIV will be there one day, and we might be better prepared next time.

The hard part wil be putting away personal pride and varoius jelousy issues
Ref

It's generally good to see that there are a lot of experienced programmers around here, and I have not experienced any of these issues among them.

[jasonb885]

...

You know, what would be perfect, is to maintain all the individual mod files on one central server. The player would, from time to time, simply run a client/web front end which would present them with a list of all stored mods. They'd simply click whatever they wanted (like online shopping really) and submit. The front end would interact with the back end server database, gather or build the individual files required (based on stored rules/procedures), and download them to the user's machine, in, of course, JSGME ready format.

Of course, by the time this was completed, we'd be playing SH5...

Better yet, a Subversion repository that all SH3 mod developers regularly commit to, complete with changelogs and all kinds of other fun things.

:cool:

[jasonb885]

...

Anyway, I'm just thinking on the fly here...it's 2am...sleepy-bye time. :zzz:

It's actually an excellent idea and something I had thought about at one point.

Kind of like an intelligent `diff` utility for configuration file management.

[jasonb885]

...
Moreover, much more than I dislike releasing tools is releasing code, because you usually end up with answering a lot of beginners questions, while the pros don't need your code anyway.


I prefer to release early, and often. I find I get plenty of useful bug reports and once in a while, even a patch.

But it depends on the tool's target audience, of course.

In either case, I don't think user feedback due to source release should be considered a negative.

I'd also contest that those familiar with programming don't appreciate access to work that's already done. I'd much rather contribute to an existing project than to do it all from scratch. It might even be the difference between doing something cool and not bothering at all. Sometimes you just need someone to lay the foundation.

Of course, as you said, with SH3 everyone's picked a language most favored and each tool is written in a different language.

I used Perl because I'm a Linux/UNIX professional by trade, and Perl is the most effective tool for processing stuff like plain text configuration files of large sizes, like the Campaign_RND.mis file. The only reason I hadn't released my code is it's not documented and thus nearly useless to anyone else, not to mention that few, if any Perl programmers, are actually lurking around here.

Anyway...

[GlobalExplorer]

In either case, I don't think user feedback due to source release should be considered a negative.

You sound like you might have the patience that's needed to organize such an effort, which unfortunately I have not.

It's actually an excellent idea and something I had thought about at one point.

Kind of like an intelligent `diff` utility for configuration file management.

Yes if Jaesons mod-enabler would work like a CVS for mods, that would be cool.


I'd also contest that those familiar with programming don't appreciate access to work that's already done. I'd much rather contribute to an existing project than to do it all from scratch. It might even be the difference between doing something cool and not bothering at all. Sometimes you just need someone to lay the foundation.


I am absolutely in favour of open source, and I see the advantages. But I also know the problems .. But as said before, if someone would lay a foundation, a lot of people would contribute, and generally these projects get better over time.

Moreover we could have these connections and infrastructures in place when SHIV arrives, which would be another plus. SHIII modding has become a bit chaotic recently and many people are confused. We don't want to let this become another Morrowind, do we?

[jasonb885]

...
I am absolutely in favour of open source, and I see the advantages. But I also know the problems .. But as said before, if someone would lay a foundation, a lot of people would contribute, and generally these projects get better over time.

Moreover we could have these connections and infrastructures in place when SHIV arrives, which would be another plus. SHIII modding has become a bit chaotic recently and many people are confused. We don't want to let this become another Morrowind, do we?

What happened with Morrowind? (Seriously, never played.)

[JScones]

The hard part wil be putting away personal pride and varoius jelousy issues
Ref

It's generally good to see that there are a lot of experienced programmers around here, and I have not experienced any of these issues among them.
Yeah. I agree. I don't know where ref is coming from with that one. I can't think of any programmer that I've interacted with here that's demonstrated any of those traits. Indeed, from my experience we've all tried to work together however we can with our individual projects.

[JScones]

Kind of like an intelligent `diff` utility for configuration file management.
In essence, yes, that's all it is.

[KptnLt Eric Karle]

Well, I just wanted to say that I missed this thread when it started and then stopped playing for a while and have only started again in the last 2 weeks. When I noticed this, it sounded perfect but I was a little apprehensive about trying it as I was afraid it might mess up my campaign (currently 11 patrols - March 1941). Anyway tonight as I was starting my 11th, I decided to bite the bullet and try it and all I can say is WOW. Thanks GlobalExplorer for all the work you put into this. It has made a huge differance to my game and added a whole new level of immersion to this ever-improving sim. The mods that have been released by this community have so fundamently improved this game, and this has taken that improvement to a new level. Thanks again

[DeepSix]

I'm back after a hiatus, too, and this just looks terrific! Thanks, GlobalExplorer, can't wait to try it out!

:rock:

[Kitzbuell]

"Now to the things that make it hard for me / or any other modder. I see that a fair amount of people have downloaded the beta from my site, but very rarely I hear from them again. Some mailed me when they had problems but didn't bother to tell me if my solutions work. I am not angry at anyone, it's just not very motivating this way - and I have other projects that need my attention."

This quote directly caused me to register on SubSim if only to respond with an expression of my gratitude for all of your efforts. I'm speaking directly to Global Explorer at this moment as he has driven the efforts with SH3Gen. However, since I now use many of the mods all of you have contributed to this particular game. You, and those of your ilk, are the ones that keep these games from growing tiresome and thereby being abandoned.

I am not by any sense of anyone's imagination a programmer. Far from it! My last experience with programming was over 20 years ago in college with an Into to BASIC course (the garnerred information of which I've not used since. I am actually very new to modding but have become an avid follower. What I am is a long term computer gamer with a seat of the pants background in building and upgrading computers I've owned. I began reading entries in this forum only a few months ago and found the experience more than a bit addictive. The enjoyment I've gained from reading and, eventually, adding your various mods to my program has been about the only thing that has stopped me from constantly playing SH3 is my free time.

I purchased and installed SH3 early last fall and played incessantly until late November. I enjoyed the game play immensely, however some of the weaknesses in the original software began to get to me and I found myself growing tired of the game play. The game was good enough that, after a month's absence from it, I began visiting the forums related to SH3 and discovered this particular diamond amongst the gems. I began installing many of your mods one by one and, low and behold, SH3 game play became exciting, more enjoyable and a more enveloping experience than it had ever been previously for me.

I am one of those who have downloaded yet not installed SH3Gen as yet but am extremely anxious to do so. I am currently on my 13th patrol with a low level settings for realism. I'm still trying to learn some of the techniques needed for more realistic play. Also, though I attempt to follow and understand the specifics of the conversations here you folks are speaking completely over my head. No matter. I still find what you're able to create and how the process unfolds to be fascinating. I've received nothing but enjoyment from the fruits of all of your labors.

The only thing holding me back from decompressing the SH3Gen software and installing it is I'm a bit timid of not installing it properly and wiping out my current records and/or corrupting the original SH3 software, SH3Commander, etc. I'm only waiting to be sure I understand the methodology completely for the proper installation of the SH3Gen software with the other add-ons I'm currently using. However, I'm too anxious to wait much longer.

In my game experience, I've been lucky thus far. Without using SH3Gen and employing only the historical dates for certain naval vessels recorded as being in specific ports, I've managed to sink the King George V in Scapa Flow and a light cruiser in Lock Ewe. I've used the same data to visit Scapa Flow and other ports in search of these prized targets during the aforementioned dates and found the particular harbors vacant but for the myriad of destroyers and other defensive vessels patroling the wars for interlopers of my kind.

I just wanted to thank each and every one of you that develope these mods and greatly improve the game play for schmucks like myself. Once I install and use SH3Gen I'd be more than happy to add my SH3 game play experiences and critique to this worthy discussion.

[GlobalExplorer]

Havent been able to post here, since I am in Spain right now, and internet access is limited. Work on the standing orders features is progressing slowly, I hope Brad will make more progress in the next weeks, as he didnt have much time recently. Its going to be included in 0.6, which I hope to release somewhen in May (might get later however). But its going to come 100%, and will be a neat, streamlined feature that comes at absolutely no price. I still need the edited data, I have to download and test the new campaign mods, and then there is still more work for me with the german translation and program logic of course.

Has anybody tested the current version with GW and NYGM campaign mods, as well as the integrated version by Rubini? I see no complaints, so I assume its working already.

For the future I have also been thinking about more advanced features, particularly "virtual" Uboats and a radio message generator, but this would come at the price af not being totally compatible with other radio log mods, which I am not completely happy with.

@Kitzbuell: God idea to register and a very good read. You should post more ;) I also am more of the lurker type as long as I am not directly participating in mods, but the community here is, as most people will agree, one of the best. I also think you should try installing Sh3Gen, as the worst thing that can happen to you is loss of a single save game (not that this ever happens to my knowledge), apart from that it doesnt change anything in your mods. Maybe wait for the new Sh3Cmdr, so you dont have to install the fix from my site.

GE

[VonHelsching]

Quoting a PM I sent to GE after he asked me to elaborate further on my initial suggestions:

First of all I would like to congratulate you for the concept of the application. It is excellent and I cannot imagine using SH3 without it.

Sorry it took me so long to answer, but I wanted my thought to mature, in order to give to you something useful. My initial post about "luring" the player into hot spots was just a wild shot in the dark; just an idea for you to elaborate. But I made some second thoughts that go beyond this point. And the thing that made me think further was the Grey Wolves mod.

What I finally think is a good idea (don't know if it is doable though) is for SH3Gen expanding not only in single missions (see a/), but a series of missions that represent a chapter in U-boat history (see /b).

a/ SH3Gen may incorporate into the map small / short chapters of history like the sinking of the Bismarc. SH3Cdr would make sure that the player would be at the right place at the right time (with days in base) and SH3Gen would provide a very nice "intelligence report" of the situation, prety much like it can do now. But; Sh3Gen could additionally provide a1/ the course of the Bismarc, TFs etc. in order to give a dynamic view and a2/ provide additional maps which would update the action (don't know if this would be possible without restarting, though)

b/SH3Gen could incorporate / facilitate a capmpaign that lasts more than a mission; ie a series of missions. This could be done for Pauckenschlag. Here, SH3Gen could really blow the minds of the hardcore realism simmers by providing not only the course of action, but addidional historic data like u-boat sinkings (on the map with the number of u-boat, and the date). This could be expanded for allied sinkings. I'm not into realism much, but I think this historic aspect would be much appreciated. I understand that this is a lot of work, but I'm sure that a lot of people would volunteer to pinpoint X and Ys for every u-boat on the map.

These are my first thoughts. I hope they helped.

[zzsteven]

Havent been able to post here, since I am in Spain right now, and internet access is limited. Work on the standing orders features is progressing slowly, I hope Brad will make more progress in the next weeks, as he didnt have much time recently. Its going to be included in 0.6, which I hope to release somewhen in May (might get later however). But its going to come 100%, and will be a neat, streamlined feature that comes at absolutely no price. I still need the edited data, I have to download and test the new campaign mods, and then there is still more work for me with the german translation and program logic of course.

Has anybody tested the current version with GW and NYGM campaign mods, as well as the integrated version by Rubini? I see no complaints, so I assume its working already.

For the future I have also been thinking about more advanced features, particularly "virtual" Uboats and a radio message generator, but this would come at the price af not being totally compatible with other radio log mods, which I am not completely happy with.

@Kitzbuell: God idea to register and a very good read. You should post more ;) I also am more of the lurker type as long as I am not directly participating in mods, but the community here is, as most people will agree, one of the best. I also think you should try installing Sh3Gen, as the worst thing that can happen to you is loss of a single save game (not that this ever happens to my knowledge), apart from that it doesnt change anything in your mods. Maybe wait for the new Sh3Cmdr, so you dont have to install the fix from my site.

GE

SH3Gen is working well with GW v1.0 on my computer, no glitch's.

zz

[GlobalExplorer]

@zz: Thanks! And good to hear.

@Von Helsching: Thank you for your suggestions, here are my thoughts.

Dynamic updates are not planned .. because this would require constant Alt-Tabbing. Not the grandest concept, as people are already complaining that Sh3Gen requires to Alt-Tab.

Campaign spanning several patrols, sorry, I dont know either. I dont want to give up the abstract way I handle data, which makes Sh3Gen suited for any campaign mods around. Another problem is that the campaign data which I access doesnt contain enough info, so I would have to make to much guesswork.

What I am thinking of is an option to generate a completely new set of radio messages for each patrol, which would contain pieces of the usual target info (similar to the intelligence update), possibly as well as virtual uboats that give updates about sinkings and more. I hope to make a draft for this and update the thread about what I think is possible. Mind however that at this stage it is just an idea I have not decided yet if I will do it, and god forbit when.

What do you think, would it be in the interest of this mod to incorporate radio messages? I ask because for this I would have to give up the totally "clean" architecture that doesnt add stuff to ShIII. Rewriting the radio message file would, of course, never be 100% compatible with other radio log mods, though I would of course offer the usual backup/rollback functions. Its just that this is a step I am not too eager to make, because now Sh3Gen integrates so nicely with other mods. But, on the other hand, it would not alter much and possibly be very much more athmospheric if, for the first time, you would get radio messages about things that are actually there.

Let me know what you think, I can still keep this open for the future, but it could be done one day. Any ideas/feedback welcome.

GE

P.S. About the UBoats sinkings and/or virtual Uboat traffic, I would have to build a UBoat database first, anybody interested to help me with this? No coding required, only some interest to collect enough data from the various sources.

[HEMISENT]

GE
I really do enjoy using SH3 Gen. I don't use it all the time but it"s nice to know it's there. It is a pain in the butt to save/exit to generate a fresh map but that's not your fault. Mostly I Alt/Tab to generate an intel report.
Great work and thanks for all the effort.

PS I think the idea of radio reports is a good one, anything to increase the immersion is a step in the right direction.

[Boris]

Radio messages that are actually relevant... You've got my vote!

[JBClark]

GlobalExplorer,

I just discovered this mod and following your instructions, successfully installed it to run with GW and SH3Commander. I did update Commander and MS net1.1 before I tried it.

This post is to let you know that:

1) It worked. 1st time! No problems. :up:

2) I like it. :up: :up:

Keep up the good work Sir. :sunny:

Regards,

JBC

2.4GHz P4
1 GB RAM
XP Pro
Nvidia GeForce 5700LE 128MB

[VonHelsching]

P.S. About the UBoats sinkings and/or virtual Uboat traffic, I would have to build a UBoat database first, anybody interested to help me with this? No coding required, only some interest to collect enough data from the various sources.

Well, some people around might have this already. Anyone from the uboat.net forums around?

What you actually require would be a database of sinkings, right?. Such as an excel file with the following:

(fictional)
U-569, IXD/2
Sunk 03.05.44 by depthcharges from aircraft or [030544, A/C DC]
All hands lost

Or is it too much info? In 1944 the map would be filled with RIP markings...

[GlobalExplorer]

P.S. About the UBoats sinkings and/or virtual Uboat traffic, I would have to build a UBoat database first, anybody interested to help me with this? No coding required, only some interest to collect enough data from the various sources.

Well, some people around might have this already. Anyone from the uboat.net forums around?

What you actually require would be a database of sinkings, right?. Such as an excel file with the following:

(fictional)
U-569, IXD/2
Sunk 03.05.44 by depthcharges from aircraft or [030544, A/C DC]
All hands lost

Or is it too much info? In 1944 the map would be filled with RIP markings...

In the long term, I am thinking about much more than RIP markings ;)

Name=U-569
Commander=Mustermann
Waypoints=

Other than the UBoat name, commander and TOO it would be more in the spirit of Sh3Gen to have no historically correct data, instead it would be better to generate contacts/encounters from the data in the campaign files. Instead I would add waypoints for all Uboats, for every historical period. Of course its not realistic to have correct data for all boats, but usually it is possible to achieve a believable setup with less, well diversified data. For instance, the same waypoints could be reused for many boats.

Note: I could add your info about sinking of the boats itself, hadnt thought about it previously:

SunkDate=030544
SunkLat=12345.000
SunkLong=-154546.00
SunkBy=Aircraft
etc ..

Mind we are just exchanging thoughts, I have not decided yet about this feature. There are problems with the spatial operations for finding correct contacts. Particularly it is a problem that SpawnProbability is set to very low levels in all campaigns (albeit with good reason). This makes the chance to find any targets at the given coordinates lower, which is bad for Sh3Gen in general.

[zzsteven]

Not real sure what you're trying to do. My understanding: You are trying to generate a listing of other Uboats locations in the game based on game data? If I understand correctly, the only Uboats in the game are the ones Rubini scripted in his HT mods and Sansals milkcows (modified by Rubini). There are no other Uboats in the game, or submarines for that matter. Someone would have to script them in the campaign files first.

If I'm misunderstanding then please feel free to ignore this old guy in the corner. :)

zz

PS In the Parameters.ini file I noticed an entry for Aircoverage. SH3 Gen doesn't seem to show aircoverage, did this not get implemented?

[Rhodes]

I have a question about the sh3 gen, I'm trying for the 1º time and the quickstart text says that the ingame map will have the updates and etc if everything whent right.
But my map and war diary has notting.
When a create a sav game and run the sh3 gen, I need to leave the game and then reload to have the updates of the sh3gen?

[VonHelsching]

Not real sure what you're trying to do. My understanding: You are trying to generate a listing of other Uboats locations in the game based on game data? If I understand correctly, the only Uboats in the game are the ones Rubini scripted in his HT mods and Sansals milkcows (modified by Rubini). There are no other Uboats in the game, or submarines for that matter. Someone would have to script them in the campaign files first.

If I'm misunderstanding then please feel free to ignore this old guy in the corner. :)

zz

PS In the Parameters.ini file I noticed an entry for Aircoverage. SH3 Gen doesn't seem to show aircoverage, did this not get implemented?


No, we were discussing with GE the possibility of displaying actual historic data (actual uboat sinkings) poitend out on the map according to the date. Nothing to do with the .scr layer.

Unless GE has something else in his mind...

[VonHelsching]

I have a question about the sh3 gen, I'm trying for the 1º time and the quickstart text says that the ingame map will have the updates and etc if everything whent right.
But my map and war diary has notting.
When a create a sav game and run the sh3 gen, I need to leave the game and then reload to have the updates of the sh3gen?

What I do to use SH3Gen:

- Load a game (at the office)
- Get out of the port. More than 35 kms away. You will notice an FPS raise, then you ll know.
- Save your game
- Exit
-Load SH3Gen and select your savegeme.
- Generate map (after you fiddle your your preferre intelligence options first)
- Exit Sh3Gen
- Load SH3, your savegame.
- Press F5, et viola!

[Rhodes]

VonHelsching, very thanks. :D :up:

[zzsteven]

Not real sure what you're trying to do. My understanding: You are trying to generate a listing of other Uboats locations in the game based on game data? If I understand correctly, the only Uboats in the game are the ones Rubini scripted in his HT mods and Sansals milkcows (modified by Rubini). There are no other Uboats in the game, or submarines for that matter. Someone would have to script them in the campaign files first.

If I'm misunderstanding then please feel free to ignore this old guy in the corner. :)

zz

PS In the Parameters.ini file I noticed an entry for Aircoverage. SH3 Gen doesn't seem to show aircoverage, did this not get implemented?


No, we were discussing with GE the possibility of displaying actual historic data (actual uboat sinkings) poitend out on the map according to the date. Nothing to do with the .scr layer.

Unless GE has something else in his mind...

Guess my question was based on this paragraph:
"Other than the UBoat name, commander and TOO it would be more in the spirit of Sh3Gen to have no historically correct data, instead it would be better to generate contacts/encounters from the data in the campaign files. Instead I would add waypoints for all Uboats, for every historical period. Of course its not realistic to have correct data for all boats, but usually it is possible to achieve a believable setup with less, well diversified data. For instance, the same waypoints could be reused for many boats."

So maybe somewhere in the .scr or .rnd files create entries for Uboats?

zz

[GlobalExplorer]

Not real sure what you're trying to do. My understanding: You are trying to generate a listing of other Uboats locations in the game based on game data? If I understand correctly, the only Uboats in the game are the ones Rubini scripted in his HT mods and Sansals milkcows (modified by Rubini). There are no other Uboats in the game, or submarines for that matter. Someone would have to script them in the campaign files first.

If I'm misunderstanding then please feel free to ignore this old guy in the corner. :)

zz

PS In the Parameters.ini file I noticed an entry for Aircoverage. SH3 Gen doesn't seem to show aircoverage, did this not get implemented?

Correct, Aircoverage trigger is still in, as well as most of the original logic. I hope to include a better implementation in the coming update.

Concerning your 1st question. I know that I cannot rely on UBoats in the campaign layer, hence all the fuss. VonHelsching and me have been chatting away about possibilities to build a UBoat database inside Sh3Gen. Its all at a very early stage, and I cant say often enough that its not decided yet. I see with regret regret that I seem to have problems to explain the point. Thats what happens when you try to learn Spanish, seems to be impending my eloquence in english :)

[GlobalExplorer]

I have a question about the sh3 gen, I'm trying for the 1º time and the quickstart text says that the ingame map will have the updates and etc if everything whent right.
But my map and war diary has notting.
When a create a sav game and run the sh3 gen, I need to leave the game and then reload to have the updates of the sh3gen?

Sh3Gen writes all changes into the specified savegame, thats why the save must be reloaded before anything shows up. Workflow is always:

- save
- alt-tab
- run sh3gen with the savegame specified
- reload

[zzsteven]

Not real sure what you're trying to do. My understanding: You are trying to generate a listing of other Uboats locations in the game based on game data? If I understand correctly, the only Uboats in the game are the ones Rubini scripted in his HT mods and Sansals milkcows (modified by Rubini). There are no other Uboats in the game, or submarines for that matter. Someone would have to script them in the campaign files first.

If I'm misunderstanding then please feel free to ignore this old guy in the corner. :)

zz

PS In the Parameters.ini file I noticed an entry for Aircoverage. SH3 Gen doesn't seem to show aircoverage, did this not get implemented?

Correct, Aircoverage trigger is still in, as well as most of the original logic. I hope to include a better implementation in the coming update.

Concerning your 1st question. I know that I cannot rely on UBoats in the campaign layer, hence all the fuss. VonHelsching and me have been chatting away about possibilities to build a UBoat database inside Sh3Gen. Its all at a very early stage, and I cant say often enough that its not decided yet. I see with regret regret that I seem to have problems to explain the point. Thats what happens when you try to learn Spanish, seems to be impending my eloquence in english :)

Thanks for clearing the fog in my mind. If there is any way I can help, please do not hesitate to PM. I really like this program and would like to see it evolve.

Over the last ten years many of my co-workers only speak Spanish. It's been a great opportunity to learn a new language but the frustration of trying to explain something is aggrevating sometimes. :D

zz

[GlobalExplorer]

Hi. I am back in Germany and Sh3Gen is very much alive.

Brad has made great progress recently. The english orders are almost complete. German translation will take place during May, and I hope to get Sh3Gen 0.6 ready in one month from now. Who wants to help me? We can split up the work by years, every year has 1-3 pages of text which need to be translated. Probably I will take over parts of the translation myself, but getting help would speed up release of the next version very much.

Contact by mail preferred. I will send out samples of the english version.

Thanks.

mail@christian-wendt.org

GE

[GlobalExplorer]

January 1940 sample of standing operational orders data:


6 Jan, ships in the British eastern coastal area A, except American and friendly neutral vessels are allowed to be attacked on sight, without warning. Attacks are to be made unobtrusively and submerged in order to preserve the illusion of mine hits.

12 Jan, ships in British east coast areas & west of Bristol Channel, except US, friendlies & neutrals, to be attacked on sight, without warning. Attacks to be unobtrusive & submerged to preserve the illusion of mines. Prize Regulations in force elsewhere.

21 Jan, The inefficiency of the torpedoes has seriously affected morale of U-boat Crews. At least 25% of torpedoes fired were failures. Statistics to
6 Jan indicate 41% of misses due to this cause. These failures have lost us at least 300,000 tons.

24 Jan, British eastern coastal area off SE coast from Flamborough Head to Dover, is now unrestricted. All ships except US, friendlies & neutrals may be attacked on sight, without warning. Attacks to be unobtrusive & submerged to preserve illusion of mines.

Irish territorial waters extend for 10 miles. Outside these areas, Prize Regulations remain in force.

[mikaelanderlund]

Hi GlobalExplorer,

I am using wolfpack mod integreted in my GW 1.1 campagn scr. but the sometimes not showing up on the map. Do you know why? What shall I do to see my wolfpacks/subs on the map?

Mikael

[GlobalExplorer]

What exactly does the Wolfpack mod add?

Do you never get to see U-Boats or do you think they should show up more often? This information is valuable for me, because I can tune these quite easily.

U-Boats are a bit of a stepchild, because up to now most campaign files contain no active patrolling boats, only the ones close to port.

[mikaelanderlund]

Wolfpack is a great mod made by sergbuto which include AI subs attacking allied shippings with virtual torpedoes. The strange thing is that I have seen these subs on the map before when I did not gave the subs specific nams, but this time i gave the subs name like U46 and so on but now I cant see the subs with names on the map.

Mikael

[Georg_Unterberg]

Global explorer,

I can help you with the translation, check your mail.

[GlobalExplorer]

@Georg_Unterberg: Great! I have supplied you with a preview, and I am looking forward to working with you.

@mikaelanderlund: You mean by changing the "Name" tag in the Campaign_RND? Sh3Gen has an own system to generate names for UBoats, and never uses the "Name" tag. Reason is, that most texts are just generic crap like "Coastal_Traffic121", and it's almost impossible for the app to find out when it's not.

[mikaelanderlund]

@Georg_Unterberg: Great! I have supplied you with a preview, and I am looking forward to working with you.

@mikaelanderlund: You mean by changing the "Name" tag in the Campaign_RND? Sh3Gen has an own system to generate names for UBoats, and never uses the "Name" tag. Reason is, that most texts are just generic crap like "Coastal_Traffic121", and it's almost impossible for the app to find out when it's not. Yes, when I am changing the "Name" tag when I am using SH3mission editer (editing Campaign_scr). So you mean I can not "see" the subs on the map when I change the "name" tag to generate names like U46? Sorry for my bad english.

Mikael

[GlobalExplorer]

Sorry for my bad english.

I have the same problem ;)

Sh3Gen doesnt care for what you put in the Name field, whenever it finds a sub (class 200) it generates a new designation for it.

This is especially apparent with suppliers and milchcows, ever noticed that the blue navalbase designation / Sh3Gen marker never match??

[mikaelanderlund]

Ok, I am going to create a new wolfpack in my campaign and this time I will not change the "name" tag. I hopp I can see my pack this time on the map:88) . If not visible on the map it is almost hoppless to find the pack. Thanks for your great mod :P

Mikael

[GlobalExplorer]

I still don't know if I get it.

If you have subs in the campaign layer they should appear, no matter what the name tag is. The name tag will be ignored and a new name will be created by Sh3Gen.

However, it is entirely possible that Sh3Gen doesn't work with the changes made by sergbutos mod, and that the subs are ignored. Maybe I have to look into that. The only snag is, I cannot download GW for a while, it's simply too big ;)

If the structure of the sub/wolfpack entry in Campaign_RND / Campaign_SCR deviates from the standard, there might be all kinds of strange situations.

Sh3Gen is definitely designed to run with AI UBoats, so we should try to find whats going wrong here.

Can you send me some code from the Campaign layer where sergbuto adds the Uboats?

[Keelbuster]

This mod is REALLY COOL. :rock: :rock: :rock:

SH3 is much crazier now! So much for my summer. :ping:

Kb

[mikaelanderlund]

I still don't know if I get it.

If you have subs in the campaign layer they should appear, no matter what the name tag is. The name tag will be ignored and a new name will be created by Sh3Gen.

However, it is entirely possible that Sh3Gen doesn't work with the changes made by sergbutos mod, and that the subs are ignored. Maybe I have to look into that. The only snag is, I cannot download GW for a while, it's simply too big ;)

If the structure of the sub/wolfpack entry in Campaign_RND / Campaign_SCR deviates from the standard, there might be all kinds of strange situations.

Sh3Gen is definitely designed to run with AI UBoats, so we should try to find whats going wrong here.

Can you send me some code from the Campaign layer where sergbuto adds the Uboats?Sorry, I have already deleted it :88) but I will send you my next GW 1.1 edited scr. fil including AI VIIa and AI VII-C/41 packs as soon as possible.

Mikael

[Boris]

GlobalExplorer, if you need more english-german translators I can help... check you email.

[GlobalExplorer]

Question: Does anybody ever use the logfile editor that comes with Sh3Gen? Because if not, it will be removed from the next package, especially because ít is no more needed since JScones has released version 2.5 of Sh3Cmdr.

GlobalExplorer, if you need more english-german translators I can help... check you email.

I might need an german-english translator as well!

[mikaelanderlund]

I still don't know if I get it.

If you have subs in the campaign layer they should appear, no matter what the name tag is. The name tag will be ignored and a new name will be created by Sh3Gen.

However, it is entirely possible that Sh3Gen doesn't work with the changes made by sergbutos mod, and that the subs are ignored. Maybe I have to look into that. The only snag is, I cannot download GW for a while, it's simply too big ;)

If the structure of the sub/wolfpack entry in Campaign_RND / Campaign_SCR deviates from the standard, there might be all kinds of strange situations.

Sh3Gen is definitely designed to run with AI UBoats, so we should try to find whats going wrong here.

Can you send me some code from the Campaign layer where sergbuto adds the Uboats?Sorry, I have already deleted it :88) but I will send you my next GW 1.1 edited scr. fil including AI VIIa and AI VII-C/41 packs as soon as possible.

Mikael

Ok, I have now put four subs into my scr. layer, three VII41/C and one VIIa. Two of the four subs are visible on the map this time. Do you know why I am not able to see all of them? I would like to see all of my subs. Do you think that will be possible?

Mikael

[GlobalExplorer]

Every info that Sh3Gen plots is randomized and is influenced by a number of factors:

- the Theater of Operations (North Sea much better intel than South Atlantic)

- the intel level for the Location, if its in a port

- the historic period ("The Happy Times" much better intel than "The End")

- the target type

- the target allegiance

- you setting for the intel level slider

This is all because I never wanted the info to be god-like and to simulate the phases of the war. It is hard to explain how I handle the changes in the overall situation but it's a very good system.

Seeing only 2 out of 4 subs is not unexpected, though of course you'd rather see all four. There are several layers of parameters at work on top of the spatial model. The system now is optimized for the right amount of targets, not necessarily for friendly units. Also don't forget I have balanced the parameters with IUB 1.02.

I think this will get better with the next versions which will be balanced for the newer mods.

[mikaelanderlund]

Every info that Sh3Gen plots is randomized and is influenced by a number of factors:

- the Theater of Operations (North Sea much better intel than South Atlantic)

- the intel level for the Location, if its in a port

- the historic period ("The Happy Times" much better intel than "The End")

- the target type

- the target allegiance

- you setting for the intel level slider

This is all because I never wanted the info to be god-like and to simulate the phases of the war. It is hard to explain how I handle the changes in the overall situation but it's a very good system.

Seeing only 2 out of 4 subs is not unexpected, though of course you'd rather see all four. There are several layers of parameters at work on top of the spatial model. The system now is optimized for the right amount of targets, not necessarily for friendly units. Also don't forget I have balanced the parameters with IUB 1.02.

I think this will get better with the next versions which will be balanced for the newer mods.

Thanks for you info :) Do you think I can change just the "target type" parameter so all friendly subs will be visible on the map. Can you explain for me how to do that in your mod? Thanks!

Mikael

[GlobalExplorer]

This is to complicated to explain now, but I can help you solve your problem later.

But I can tell you where you find the parameters which influence the composition of intelligence:

Parameters for target types and other:

Sh3Gen/parameters.ini
Sh3Gen/parameters.ini.txt //contains some explanations

Intelligence levels for theaters and factions:

Sh3Gen/Database/Campaign/WWII_Atlantic/<Period>/*.theaters
Sh3Gen/Database/Campaign/WWII_Atlantic/<Period>/*.factions

[mikaelanderlund]

This is to complicated to explain now, but I can help you solve your problem later.

But I can tell you where you find the parameters which influence the composition of intelligence:

Parameters for target types and other:

Sh3Gen/parameters.ini
Sh3Gen/parameters.ini.txt //contains some explanations

Intelligence levels for theaters and factions:

Sh3Gen/Database/Campaign/WWII_Atlantic/<Period>/*.theaters
Sh3Gen/Database/Campaign/WWII_Atlantic/<Period>/*.factions

Possible changes? German faction 1 and centralatlantic/northatlantic 1. What do you think?

Mikael

[Tonnage_Ace]

Great mod, enjoy it a lot. I think you should take the logfile out for your next update, I never use it. Have one question: if I move the slider all the way to the right, will the information provided be 100% accurate, or will there simply be more info? Does the slider affect the accuracy of the information or the amount? Or both?

[GlobalExplorer]

@mikaelanderlund: Theoretically, yes, setting these or other parameters to 1.0 should do the trick. But there might be unwanted results. If you fiddle with the parameters and find out new things, let me know! I am not even convinced that there aren't better setups than my defaults ;)

@Tonnage_Ace: The slider only controls the amount of info, not the accuracy. Do you think there should be two sliders then?

[Tonnage_Ace]

@mikaelanderlund: Theoretically, yes, setting these or other parameters to 1.0 should do the trick. But there might be unwanted results. If you fiddle with the parameters and find out new things, let me know! I am not even convinced that there aren't better setups than my defaults ;)

@Tonnage_Ace: The slider only controls the amount of info, not the accuracy. Do you think there should be two sliders then?
If it's possible to make two sliders(amount of info, accuracy) you would offer what no other spy sat mod offers: a choice. I'm sure some people would like to have some, unrealistic fun and sink all the warships that come within 10km of them. I would play a couple patrols as described, but then of course, delete them from my career as they're just for fun. I say go for it if you can.

[VonHelsching]

I agree 100% with Tonnage Ace.

[GlobalExplorer]

Update 2006-05-06:

During the last two weeks, Sh3Gen 0.6 has been coming along nicely. I hope to have it out any time in the next weeks. It's going to be a pretty substantial update.

All that I am waiting for now is the completed standing orders data, which are also progressing well. Georg Unterberg is completing the german translation, and I am getting help from Boris, who is ace at translating german to english.

The new reliability slider will be in, as well as other options to customize the intelligence level. I have also made changes to generally improve the reliability of targets, as this was a major complaint.

Airbases will be in again.

The first release will require some people to beta test. I can't test with all up-to-date mods / addons right now.

GE

[HEMISENT]

Update 2006-05-06:

During the last two weeks, Sh3Gen 0.6 has been coming along nicely. I hope to have it out any time in the next weeks. It's going to be a pretty substantial update.

Airbases will be in again.
GE

Great news GE
Looking forward to it.

[Sailor Steve]

Stupid Steve comes late to the party!

I downloaded SH3Gen some time ago, and even installed it, but kept finding reasons to never use it.

Never again. Early this morning I ran it for the first time, and was happy enough when I went to my Captain's Log, but positively delighted when I looked at the map. I don't know what I was expecting, but it wasn't a whole lot of information written down by my 1WO based on a radio message or three.

Wonderful stuff! Anxiously anticipating 0.6.

[GlobalExplorer]

Stupid Steve comes late to the party!

I downloaded SH3Gen some time ago, and even installed it, but kept finding reasons to never use it.

Never again. Early this morning I ran it for the first time, and was happy enough when I went to my Captain's Log, but positively delighted when I looked at the map. I don't know what I was expecting, but it wasn't a whole lot of information written down by my 1WO based on a radio message or three.

Wonderful stuff! Anxiously anticipating 0.6.

I know one of the misunderstandings that lead some people to not use Sh3Gen is that they think its another Spysat mod, or in any way unrealistic. But my goal has always been to deliver a RPG-like feeling thats as realistic as possible.

My main inspiration for this concept were two key scenes of Das Boot, namely the sneaking into Vigo and the failed breakthrough at Gibraltar. I knew what was missing in SHIII was this certain "we have to go there but we must expect this" - feeling, the player sitting at the map and drawing a pencil line like Prochnow "..Da müssen wir durch!"

Balancing the amount and reliability of info has and always will be a big issue with Sh3Gen. I have just found that while Sh3Gen works fine with GW, I am not entirely happy with the balancing of information. Version 0.6 will already be more optimized for GW, but probably there will have to be another version entirely devoted to fine tuning of the parameters.

It looks like I am going to be able to offer an early release of 0.6 real soon!

GE

[Uber Gruber]

I'm going to try this, it sounds really cool.

Just one quick question though, if the map or marine inteligence says enemy warships are in XY quadrant.....will they actually be there in the game ?

Cheers...

[bigboywooly]

i installed sh3gen before my last patrol and after leaving harbour ran the program which gave me a nice big list of intel

it said there was possibly the ark royal and 2 merchant cruisers at scapa which was nowhere near my patrol grid so decided to have a look anyway

after creeping into scapa found only a light cruiser which i sank and as i made my way out my comp froze

so restarted comp then sh3gen and started game only to find the intel at scapa was exactly the same except that this time the light cruiser was there too

needless to say i didnt bother to go to scapa this time - lol

[Uber Gruber]

I see....so the info it shows is ficticious ? Whats the point in the mod then ? Sorry but i'm confused... :88)

[Carolus Rex]

I see....so the info it shows is ficticious ? Whats the point in the mod then ? Sorry but i'm confused... :88)

As I understand it some info is false and some are not. This is to represent the fact that no intellegence is 100% accurate. In future version you will have a slider for accuracy to I think.

[GlobalExplorer]

SH3GEN 0.6.0 BETA

It turns out today I am in a position to release an early beta of v0.6.0. So I would be glad if someone could test it.

It is a fully functional version with only some little things missing. The standing orders data is only complete until mid 43, the rest is coming soon.

This way there will be progress through user input / while I will be able to concentrate more on RL in the next weeks.

More to come ..

GE

DOWNLOAD: www.global-explorer.de/beta/Sh3Gen_v060b.zip

- To install just unzip and run Sh3Gen.exe
- The deinstall simple delete the folder.

This version has mainly been tested and balanced with GW. If you use RUB/IUB/HT, use the alternative parameters.ini file that I supply.

EDIT: My boss has finally gone, so I can update you on some details :yep:

FEATURESET:

+ standing operational orders, german and english language
+ improved customizing options
+ new reliability slider
+ option to toggle parsing of RND_Layer to greatly improve reliablity of intelligence
+ reduced default assessment period and other values to improve target reliablity of intelligence
+ improved balance with GW1.1
+ re-enabled airbase plotting

CREDITS:

This version wouldn't have been possible without the help of several people:
- Hans Abbadon, who gave me the permission to use his excellent U-Boaters Guide for the Standing Orders Addon. Thanks!
- Brad Golding, who invested lots of time into the completely revised Standing Orders for Sh3Gen
- Georg Unterberg, who translated the Standing Orders to German.

- Thanks go to Boris Gerasimon for his translation services.

[GlobalExplorer]

@bigboywooly, Uber Gruber: The information comes from the game, but is not always reliable. The reliability will be increased in 0.6 and coming versions, but there are restrictions which I cannot change, particularly when it comes to the RND Layer. However, with version 0.6, RND parsing disabled and reliability at max, you will get very reliable info.

GE

[VonHelsching]

2006-05-10: It turns out today I am in a position to release an early beta of v0.6.0. So I would be glad if someone could test it.


Excellent! :up:

[bigboywooly]

Hi have downloaded and run - it didnt need to instal ? anyway have left harbour and made a save and generated an intel report so will see how it goes

one thing i did notice was this airfield just off Brest

http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/999/screenhunter363cb.th.jpg (http://img235.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter363cb.jpg)

I presume this is down to the info in the .rnd layer

[GlobalExplorer]

one thing i did notice was this airfield just off Brest

http://img235.imageshack.us/img235/999/screenhunter363cb.th.jpg (http://img235.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter363cb.jpg)

I presume this is down to the info in the .rnd layer

I have noticed that too (with GW1.1), and I think it's from the LND_Layer. I am not randomizing the position, not that I know of ..

[bigboywooly]

lol ok didnt think it was your mod

will let you no how i get on but seems ok up to now

[GlobalExplorer]

lol ok didnt think it was your mod

will let you no how i get on but seems ok up to now

Please don't appologize. I need people to tell me what exactly happens, because I never find enough time to actually play :rotfl:

Maybe someone has an idea about the airbases not on land problem. I have noticed it too, but I think its an issue of campaign design. And it doesn't bother me much, because they are generally very close to land.

There are generally a lot of problems with campaigns that Sh3Gen only brings to light. For instance I remember a lot of Swedish bases around the world ..

Do you like the new airbase signatures? I know its nothing special, but concerning the limitations of the engine, I think it ain't bad.

I would also like to know what people think about the new option to switch off RND parsing. This should help everyone looking for accurate targets to get a much higher reliability. I' be glad to hear to what extent this turns out to be true.

[bigboywooly]

so by unticking the rnd box the info will be more accurate ?

interesting

[GlobalExplorer]

so by unticking the rnd box the info will be more accurate ?

interesting

Yes, and very much so!!

Even if I give you the most accurate fixes on the targets from the RND_Layer, there might be as little as 5% chance for the target to get spawned. The amount depends entirely on the value for Spawnprobability that the campaign designer chose.

With the SCR layer things look very much different, and everything depends mainly on the entry and exitdate. You have additional control over this through the "reliability" slider, which makes the assessed time period shorter. So the chance for static targets is much higher, sometimes up to 100%.

Btw, isn't that even what the names says, "Random" layer, as opposed to "Static layer" :hmm:

So much for theory, now let me know if it all really works like that.

[bigboywooly]

yes will do have just saved game to run a report so will try that out

[GlobalExplorer]

Thanks, and please let me know if it works!

[bigboywooly]

ok so its nov 39 and am just off Scapa in my 7b

Save game and exit and run Sh3gen

Log tells me the Nelson and Revenge in Loch Ewe so off I go ( purely for research lol )

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/7555/screenhunter387mi.th.jpg (http://img139.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter387mi.jpg)

Creep into Loch Ewe - heavy asw and depth beneath keel only 16 mtr

My my whats this

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/3631/screenhunter421ks.th.jpg (http://img99.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter421ks.jpg) http://img116.imageshack.us/img116/6291/screenhunter443vo.th.jpg (http://img116.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter443vo.jpg) http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/3589/screenhunter462jq.th.jpg (http://img517.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter462jq.jpg)

Revenge in dock so settle for Nelson - Fire a spread of 3

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/8135/screenhunter504uz.th.jpg (http://img99.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter504uz.jpg)

Hmm not sunk - another 2 into her

http://img358.imageshack.us/img358/4715/screenhunter525mb.th.jpg (http://img358.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenhunter525mb.jpg)

Being bombed by swordfish now so time to go

Still didnt sink her :nope: but SH3gen was spot on in accuracy

.RND unticked and accuracy full over to the right

Off to hunt the Illustrious which is close to me now - so my intelligence leaves me to believe :rock:

[GlobalExplorer]

@bigboywooly: Excellent report. I'd be very happy if you could provide more testing results like this. And I also hope with the new options to switch off unreliable data sources there is finally a solution for players who want to get the most reliable info.

Please also let me know which campaign mod you used for your test.

With which intelligence/reliability settings do you get results that you feel most comfortable with?

[Uber Gruber]

Thanks for the feedback, i'm going to try this over the weekend and get back to you. Quick question though, is it compatible with NYGM Tonnage War ?

Cheers....

[bigboywooly]

hi I am using GW1 + 1.1 but am using the .scr layer from the wolfpack campaign - not that i think that matters as i understand it collects the data from the scr whatever it is

i was very impressed with the accuracy on slider full over to the right and am sure there are times when I will use it thus but realistically I am not going to creep into every harbour because I know a certain ship will be in there

Its usefull to know - with a certain degree of accuracy - that say a carrier is close to your intended grid not just for the chance to have a go at it but also that there is a greater chance of aircraft where you would least expect them or the fact you may run into a ASW task force

I will carry on using at different stages of intel and let you know the results but have to say am already impressed with first usage

did exactly what it said on the tin

lol :rock: will keep you informed anyways

update

after a 14 hr shift in hot sun thought would have a play

Ran sh3gen from last save then started game

Told me nelson and ramillies in Loch Ewe and stopped in on way back to base ( heavy fog couldnt miss that ) sure enough the old Nelson was afloat again :hmm: and ramillies in dock

had to turn away as no eels left :damn:

Off for a new patrol now will lessen accuracy and see how that goes

[GlobalExplorer]

Thanks for the feedback, i'm going to try this over the weekend and get back to you. Quick question though, is it compatible with NYGM Tonnage War ?

Cheers....

I haven't tested with NYGM, but Sh3Gen should be compatible with all mods. Could you try it for us? That's why I release beta versions in the first place ..

@bigboywooly: I am going to carefully improve the balance between uncertainty and reliability. I think most players usually want to start by playing a few patrols on very high reliability where they will sink a Battleship/Carrier. Later on most people will want to reduce the intelligence to have a more realistic, suspenseful experience.

After 0.6 is about offering options to have very high accuracy, for future versions I have plans to implement other options that make the whole output completely unpredictable, where the player wouldn't know if the info is reliable or not, because even that is random. This is especially important for myself, because I know too much about how Sh3Gen works :rotfl:

Still looking forward to hear about your experiences. 0.6 isn't final so there are still possibilities to make small improvements / fixes.

GE

Off for a new patrol now will lessen accuracy and see how that goes

HINT: It might not be such a good idea to play with reliability at minimum. The reliability slider controls, among other things, the time frame for the intelligence assessment. At the right it's shortest, and therefore very accurate for a very short period of time (I think min is 7 days). To the left you will get targets from a much longer period, (max is ~10 months). So probably not such a good idea to use reliability at minimum :)

[Sailor Steve]

I have plans to implement other options that make the whole output completely unpredictable, where the player wouldn't know if the info is reliable or not, because even that is random.

Now THAT I like!

[GreyOctober]

:damn: SMASHING!! :damn:

[GlobalExplorer]

--

[GlobalExplorer]

UPDATE 2006-05-17:

Today I have released version 0.6.0 and it is available from here:

http://www.global-explorer.de/Sh3Gen%20Beta%200.6.0.zip

As usual, it comes with the nifty installer, and it now includes the complete standing orders 1.0 for the whole war. The output has also been more optimized for GW.

The inprogram documentation is improved and there is also much more information about Sh3Gen features and usage on my site.

www.global-explorer.de

GE

FEATURESET:

+ standing operational orders 1939-1945, german and english language
+ improved customizing options
+ new reliability slider
+ option to toggle parsing of RND_Layer to greatly improve reliablity of intelligence
+ reduced default assessment period and other values to improve target reliablity of intelligence
+ improved balance with GW1.1
+ re-enabled airbase plotting

CREDITS:

This version wouldn't have been possible without the help of several people:
- Hans Abbadon, who gave me the permission to use his excellent U-Boaters Guide for the Standing Orders Addon. Thanks!
- Brad Golding, who invested lots of time into the completely revised Standing Orders for Sh3Gen
- Georg Unterberg, who translated the Standing Orders to German.

- Thanks go to Boris Gerasimon for his translation services.

[gouldjg]

I really look forward to giving this a try :rock: :rock:

[VonHelsching]

Thumbs up for Sh3Gen :up:

Thanks also for the better integration with GW! :sunny:

[GlobalExplorer]

Thumbs up for Sh3Gen :up:

Thanks also for the better integration with GW! :sunny:

Information is lessened by default, especially for some factions which were off (US), reliability has generally increased, but you can go back to pre 0.6 levels by moving the reliability slider. Dont go to zero though, or the info will be almost useless :rotfl:

Please check if you're already happy with GW output. Could only do two patrols and got stuck having issues with sinking behaviour. In the second patrol I could sink a troop transporter and a landing craft in Tobruk, that was pretty cool!

There is also an alternative config file for people with older mods (RuB/IuB etc), completely forgot to mention that. It's in Sh3Gen's root folder.

[Uber Gruber]

So is it less compatible with NYGM ? I have to ask this as NYGM is the base from which I work from.

Thanks....

[Scorpius]

This is one of the best programs for immersion out there! Good job with this mate! :up:

Also what does the ? - and + mean on either side of the ships name?

[Uber Gruber]

The issue has been raised that commanders had no where near the level of intel that SH3 Gen provides.....is this the case ?

[GlobalExplorer]

So is it less compatible with NYGM ? I have to ask this as NYGM is the base from which I work from.

No thats no problem, I must have confused you. I have fine tuned the program setup to generate the most balanced output with GW - it is compatible with the other mods too.

You probably won't even notice a difference. It might only be that there is more or less info for some areas / periods than would be historically correct. The balance can be achieved through improved config files for all mods, but I don't have the time to play them all.

NYGM is a very fine mod, so of course Sh3Gen must run with it.

This is one of the best programs for immersion out there! Good job with this mate! :up:

Also what does the ? - and + mean on either side of the ships name?

The ? is a very important information.

? means it is an allied (enemy) target.
+ means axis
- means neutral

You find this and other important information in my glossary for Sh3Gen:

http://www.global-explorer.de/contentpage_glossary.htm

The issue has been raised that commanders had no where near the level of intel that SH3 Gen provides.....is this the case ?

You're definitely right. But don't forget I am offering many customizing options so you can reduce the intelligence to practically zero. Also, the default setting, the one I recommend, is fairly low. It shouldn't show more than one to three fat targets, and some of them might be unreachable.

But also don't forget this is a game. I strive for what i think is realism, but at the same time it has to be fun.

It is not entirely realistic becuase you could theoretically sink a fat ship every mission, thats for sure.

Where was this question raised?

GE

[Uber Gruber]

Thats fair enough....I mentioned SH3 Gen in the WaW forums and a concern about realism was expressed so I thought it best to ask you what you think.

WaW strives for historical accuracy and realism, well as much as one can with the game engine. Thats why compatibility with NYGM is important as they are, in my crumble oppinion, the realism mod standard.

Cheers....

[bigboywooly]

realism is one thing the ability to WANT to play the game continually is another

If i set out on a patrol and didnt see, let alone sink a ship for 30+ days i wouldnt be in such a hurry to play again - would drive me to despair as it did most uboat commanders at the time

I can understand historical accuracy and am all for it but after all this is a game - and a damn good one ( well now anyway ) and a lot of people want to sink stuff and lots of it which was not the case in WW2 or no doubt I would be speaking German by now lol

But this mod does give you the option to tone down the intel you recieve and its reliability so something for everyone i would say :up:

[Uber Gruber]

I agree with all your points, but i've been playing this game since Jan 2005 so am no longer interested in sinking loads of ships. Now i'm only interested in taking on and facing the challange presented by as much realism as possible.

I've nothing against "gameplay" mods, but I just don't want to play that way anymore. Now, all I want is realism......including the long fruitless periods of patrol.....sinking a ship after 15 days of wallowing alone in the Atlantic is a lot more fun than sinking one ten minutes after the last one.

For me anyway....

[vodkajello]

congrats on this great little program.

I think it adds some fun to the game, and it's very cool that the intel can be tweaked to be as accurate as you want it to be.

GOOD JOB!

[GlobalExplorer]

I agree with all your points, but i've been playing this game since Jan 2005 so am no longer interested in sinking loads of ships. Now i'm only interested in taking on and facing the challange presented by as much realism as possible.

I've nothing against "gameplay" mods, but I just don't want to play that way anymore. Now, all I want is realism......including the long fruitless periods of patrol.....sinking a ship after 15 days of wallowing alone in the Atlantic is a lot more fun than sinking one ten minutes after the last one.

For me anyway....

I agree and understand your point of view, and I don't think it is that much different than mine. If Sh3Gen is for you, you can only find out yourself, though.

Myself I like every sinking to be a difficult and rewarding achievement. That is very much in the spirit of Sh3Gen, and can be experienced with the default settings.

What I found demotivating about stock SHIII was that between leaving the home port, and the "ship sighted" message, you felt like moving through a vacuum. The difference that I try to make with Sh3Gen is giving direction and ambience to the missions. You can prepare strategies, wage the choices that Sh3Gen offers you, and you can use your imagination to see much more in the game than is actually there.

I feel very close to the spirit of WaW, one could even say that I try to offer an engine that can do automatically what they do manually.

I have deliberately added a lot of uncertainty and surprise to the program, so it will take you a long time until you being to look through how Sh3Gen can be "gamed". With new version, you might never be able to exactly predict what you will find, that is my aim.

Hope you give it a try and let me know what can be improved from the viewpoint of the hard-core realism crowd!

GE

[Umfuld]

Downloaded it yesterday.

Right now I'm using GW, Gen and Cmdr. They are all fine and I'm grateful to everyone who does this kind of stuff.

But I must say that so far (early days yet, to be sure), Gen is what I was sort of hoping for.


There are a lot of other subs out there sailing around. And the once per patrol heads up about a convoy seemed like too little intel. Also didn't like that I pretty much always found the convoy whenever I was alerted to one.


Great idea with the intel being hit or miss. First patrol it happened to be right about a BB in port. But next time, who knows?


Thanks again. Oh, and I was SOOOOO lucky to have caught the post about not using the Erase All button. God, that's my favorite button. I would have wept had I not read that. Heehee.

[GlobalExplorer]

Small update: If someone wants to use the alternative config file I supply for older campaigns, don't. I made a small mistake and this file will not work. Better stick with the default config, until I release the next version. There is not that much difference, just a bit less targets - mostly can be remedied through the sliders anyway.

Thanks again. Oh, and I was SOOOOO lucky to have caught the post about not using the Erase All button. God, that's my favorite button. I would have wept had I not read that. Heehee.

That one is a classic! Too bad there is no Undo Button in SHIII :rotfl:

[Seminole]

Downloaded and installed with no problems. Workd fine.

Thanks for the program. Adds another layer of enjoyment.

[Sailor Steve]

I've also installed it, and can't tell any difference from the original. On the other hand, since I have yet to act on any of the intelligence, how would I know whether it's accurate or not? :rotfl:

[don1reed]

Global Explorer :

GE

You bring good things to light :up:

[GlobalExplorer]

Hi, I haven't posted here for a long time and thought I'd say hello and ask who's still using Sh3Gen, or if there's anthing that needs my attention.

The reason I have not released anything in a long time is of course weather, the world cup and my work. I am not playing Silent Hunter at the moment. But when it's cooler I hope to get back to improving this tool, which I'm still absolutely dedicated to.

There are some smaller fixes I have already done like typo corrections and better implementation of campaign layer selection, but as I said, release is on hold until it gets significantly cooler.

I am also considering a version for dotNET 2.0, maybe somebody is waiting for it.

Global Explorer