[REQ] Severe Storm cause Damage to Sub

[TheBeast]

Is is possible to make Severe Storm Weather Damage U-Boat equipment?:06:

Equipment such as Dive Planes, Rudder, Antenna's, Hydrophone etc.

IMO, If this is possible it would add another layer of realism for game emmersion.:up:

Also, when submerged, exceeding 5-7 knots may damage Periscopes and or Snorkel.:o

Has anyone done or attempted to do any work in this respect?:06:

Regards!
TheBeast

[Rongel]

That is an excellent idea! :yeah:

I wonder if something like that is made to previous titles? Studying old mods would be the place to start.

[Sartoris]

This is a great idea! I hope someone can shed more light on it...

[tonschk]

I am not sure to which extent the U-Boot were fragile or not to Severe Storm Weather :hmmm:

[charognard]

I am not sure to which extent the U-Boot were fragile or not to Severe Storm Weather :hmmm:

Me too, need historic documentation before thinking to do anything ^^

[dcb]

Me too, need historic documentation before thinking to do anything ^^

After briefly googling the idea (which BTW is great), here is a brief reference:

- 5 U-boats including 1 by RAF Bay of Biscay patrol; 3 by US Navy in Azores and Madeira areas; 1 scuttled after storm damaged in mid-Atlantic.

Source:
http://www.naval-history.net/WW2CampaignsUboats4.htm

EDIT:
And here is another reference:

The crew of U.188 (...) struggled to return to Europe with their valuable cargo, so desperately needed - unable to communicate, in a submarine that was short of essential supplies, mechanically failing and severely damaged in a storm rounding the Cape of Good Hope.

Source:
http://scotland.users.ftech.net/u188p1.htm

[Commander Mysenses]

Perhaps time based damage to diesel engines running at flank speeds for extended periods?
"She canna take much more captain"

[Sailor Steve]

After briefly googling the idea (which BTW is great), here is a brief reference:

- 5 U-boats including 1 by RAF Bay of Biscay patrol; 3 by US Navy in Azores and Madeira areas; 1 scuttled after storm damaged in mid-Atlantic.
Exactly where is that listing? I searched the whole page and didn't see it.
1 out of 51. That's 2%

I looked all through here http://uboat.net/fates/losses/ and couldn't find any u-boats officially lost due to storm damage. I may have missed it if there was one, and of course that doesn't count boats that took damage and survived. And there are a lot of "Missing".

As to the OP, a WW2 submarine is basically a surface ship that can dive for limited periods. On the other hand, if the storm is dangerous they could dive for quite a while, riding out the worst of it in safety.

[dcb]

Exactly where is that listing? I searched the whole page and didn't see it.

Search the page using the word "scuttled" and you'll find the paragraph in the chapter dedicated to DECEMBER 1943.

And the fact that subs were not damaged by storm on a regular basis is not an argument against the idea. References to at least a couple of such incidents can be found by simply browsing the internet for 10 minutes.

Someone asked for historical references, and that's precisely what I found.

[TheBeast]

Logic would dictate that submarines were not damaged by storm conditions mainly because they would not surface during stormy weather unless required.

I know from personal experience in 1984, I was on USS Coral Sea off east coast of US. In a Storm. A big Wave that came in at 45 degree angle ripped off half the Port Side Cat Walk from Bow to Mid Ship and all antenna on that side as well.
The Cat Walk is at Flight Deck level approximately 30-45 feet (10-15m) above water level.

[TheDarkWraith]

Logic would dictate that submarines were not damaged by storm conditions mainly because they would not surface during stormy weather unless required.

I know from personal experience in 1984, I was on USS Coral Sea off east coast of US. In a Storm. A big Wave that came in at 45 degree angle ripped off half the Port Side Cat Walk from Bow to Mid Ship and all antenna on that side as well.
The Cat Walk is at Flight Deck level approximately 30-45 feet (10-15m) above water level.

I can attest to storm damage also. Was on the USS South Carolina (CGN-37 - the so-pig as we called it) crossing the Atlantic for the med. Two hurricanes were spinning out there and our captain decided to take a path between them. We were in 40-45 foot seas, literally submaring our ship depending on how we crested the wave (gave new meaning to walking on walls). I didn't believe it either till I went to the bridge and watched walls of water going over the bridge. Ripped off radars, antennas, parts of the superstructure, etc. We got an extended stay in Gibraltar to try and repair some of the damage. To this day I still don't know what was so important that we had to risk the safety of the crew and the ship to get over to the med :shifty:

We weren't allowed outside on the maindecks (for obvious reasons) but man was I curious to see just how much the keel was flexing when we crested some of those waves. Right in the middle of the ship you could put your feet on two sides of sliding plate to get an idea of how much the keel was flexing. It's amazing how much those ships 'flex'

[Hartmann]

I am not sure to which extent the U-Boot were fragile or not to Severe Storm Weather :hmmm:

I think the same.

An u-boat had a small size compared with large ships and with a streemlined design that makes more difficult take damage by big waves, that can pass over the hull whereas a surface ship the waves hit against the hull .

[ETsd4]

In reality comes first the storm and THEN the damage and not the other way around.
SH5 is limited to Force 7. Storm means Force 10 and higher. So there is no storm in SH5.

Concerning the SH5-weather i have seen a lot of crap: false wind-sounds, one wind-sound for all weather, one wave-sound for all weather, false wave-heights, false weather-reports, weather totaly broken and not changing anymore etc. etc. This should be fixed.

[Damo]

In reality comes first the storm and THEN the damage and not the other way around.
SH5 is limited to Force 7. Storm means Force 10 and higher. So there is no storm in SH5.

Concerning the SH5-weather i have seen a lot of crap: false wind-sounds, one wind-sound for all weather, one wave-sound for all weather, false wave-heights, false weather-reports, weather totaly broken and not changing anymore etc. etc. This should be fixed.

Take it you don't use the Dynamic Environment mod? Kinda fixes most of what you mention. Not sure about wind and wave sounds for different sea/weather states but there are new sounds included.

[arnahud2]

@TheDarkWraith : look at that, especially at 0:13 sec. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEkErF51Uxg&list=PL2F141E5348E81E27&index=11&feature=plpp_video

Very impressive, isn't it ?

[TheDarkWraith]

@TheDarkWraith : look at that, especially at 0:13 sec. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qEkErF51Uxg&list=PL2F141E5348E81E27&index=11&feature=plpp_video

Very impressive, isn't it ?

yes it is. Reminds me of when I'm stuck in traffic on long bridge expanses and you can feel the bridge bouncing up and down as large trucks pass.

[Rongel]

In reality comes first the storm and THEN the damage and not the other way around.
SH5 is limited to Force 7. Storm means Force 10 and higher. So there is no storm in SH5.



That might be true. But still it would be great to have somekind of malfunctions with the sub when sailing the seas. It doesn't have to be neccessarily connected with the storm, but just basic wear and tear. Now the sailing part is too safe because things never break. Also there is no dud-torpedoes, so the world feels a bit too "perfect" for me.

If I have understood correctly, SH 3 had the Commander-mod that caused random malfunctions to sub. Something like that would really make things more exciting. But again that is probably something that needs .exe modding and great skills...

[Madox58]

Also, when submerged, exceeding 5-7 knots may damage Periscopes and or Snorkel.:o

Has anyone done or attempted to do any work in this respect?:06:


That was done for SH3 by h.sie was it not?

[TheBeast]

That was done for SH3 by h.sie was it not?
Yes, I PM'd h.sie about that and Purging Co2 with Snorkel.
He replied that he does not have SH5...:hmmm:

[jason210]

Perhaps time based damage to diesel engines running at flank speeds for extended periods?
"She canna take much more captain"

Excellent idea! I think some general wear would also add something to this dimension of realism.

[TheBeast]

The point of the idea of Storms causing damage is not to say boats were fragile but to emphasize the point that a U-Boat would not be runnng on Surface during a storm unless it absolutely had to in order to recharge battery, replentish O2 or replentish compressed air.
The reason there was very few reports of Storm Damage on U-Boats is because they were able get under the stormy sea conditions.
A big storm at sea in the "Deep Blue" waters would toss a small Uboat like a rubber duck causing it to roll so severely that both ship and crew could be damaged/injured.

Currently in SH5, I am able to run at any speed surfaced during any storm condition and this is not realistic IMO.
At sea, IMO, current wave height's during bad weather are more in line with wave height's for normal weather in real life.
The Picture below is not from severe storm but just foul weather.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/picture.php?albumid=229&pictureid=2239
Excellent idea! I think some general wear would also add something to this dimension of realism.

General Wear is something that may be possible.
I think it would have to be scripted using random number generator, equipment armor levels, current sea weather state, time since last maintenance.
Running Surfaced for several days at 12 knots without stopping engines for maintenance bothers me as well.
Maybe have the Motor Office (Willi Petz) warn you that he needs to do some work on <blah> equipment would add a little to game play.

At the same time there are so many things that factor in to a possible malfunction, it would be very hard to obtain any resemblance of realism in this area.

[0rpheus]

At sea, IMO, current wave height's during bad weather are more in line with wave height's for normal weather in real life.

Agree with this. The Dynamic Environment 'Hurricane' wave addon comes closest to getting the waves right in storms, but it introduces a weird reflection effect in deep wave troughs and makes the boat ride oddly in the water. Storms look amazing though, it's perfect - if you can ignore the glitches.

I tried tweaking it, thinking a small reduction in the values might be enough to hide the glitches without reducing the wave size too much, but I could never get it to work properly. :06: