[REL] RFB/Real Fleet Boat for 1.5

[swdw]

For those wondering, the beta for the next release has been uploaded for the testers.

The community release should come soon. We're working on some last minute fixes and changes before making a community release.

[CDR Resser]

Thanks for the update swdw!! After all the teases that we have seen, I have been very anxious for the new release.

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

[AVGWarhawk]

Hehe...more to come:D

Oh yes there is. :D I predict massive frustration and gnashing of teeth after the next release of RFB in regards to the Mark 14s.


That is an understatement if I every heard one:nope: . Darn gyros. I thought it was me. Played the same scenerio 3 times and my torps were crap:cry: I think you are the reason for asprin:rotfl:

[LukeFF]

That is an understatement if I every heard one:nope: . Darn gyros. I thought it was me. Played the same scenerio 3 times and my torps were crap:cry: I think you are the reason for asprin:rotfl:
:D

RFB is not for the faint of heart, that's for sure! I already have mod ideas cooking for the post-addon release. :yep:

[Wilcke]

That is an understatement if I every heard one:nope: . Darn gyros. I thought it was me. Played the same scenerio 3 times and my torps were crap:cry: I think you are the reason for asprin:rotfl:
:D

RFB is not for the faint of heart, that's for sure! I already have mod ideas cooking for the post-addon release. :yep:

Don't forget to protect your tummy with some Prilosec!

[tonschk]

Hello, I dont know very much about mods , i know ROW is reflection of water , can you tell me please what is RFB , thank you very much

[Sailor Steve]

Real Fleet Boat, a successor to SH3's Real U-Boat.

[castorp345]

Hello, I dont know very much about mods , i know ROW is reflection of water , can you tell me please what is RFB , thank you very much

Real Fleet Boat...

please read the first page of the thread...
:roll:

[hydrajak]

I installed ROW, RFB, RSRD, and NSM last night. The game went from an unrealistic arcade to an un-fun chore. The realism buttons I select seem to have no effect.


So it seems like RFB has removed my options. I'd like to play with Automatic T.D.C , but that button doesn't seem to do anything anymore. It doesn't matter what I want, RFB is going to force me to do manual torpedo targeting. What do I need to do get this back?

I would also like the velocity and heading vectors back on the attack map.

I would also like the torpedo track (green line) back on the attack map.

I would also like the torpedo (little black fish) to be drawn on the attack map. At least with that, when I miss, I've got some feedback so I can figure out what I did wrong. I might learn how to use Manual T.D.C if I've got feed back but right now its shoot and wonder why I hit or didn't hit.

--------
Insert reply about "this is realism mod"
--------

Fine. Please assign dedicated staff to my house to draw those tracks on a peice of paper. (Since I can't draw lines on the attack map %^(*%^)($%)$#)#)@@#$((@ )

Look... I don't WANT to have to sit down with graph paper and a trig table to play a game, I just want to play the game and enjoy it. IF that means I'm not as realistic and cool as you, I'm ok with that. I think RFB has some cool things added. I think its great that my torps might run deep or circle back. I think the reduced gun reload time is awesome. I like the proper sensors. I like that airplanes can see you in shallow water.

I just hate the freaking T.D.C. I can't hit the broadside of a barn with it. Maybe some day I'll figure it out, but I really don't WANT to right now, ok? Is that ok?

(When I would rather surface and shoot it out with an CA than shoot 4 torps and miss, there is something wrong)

[AVGWarhawk]

I installed ROW, RFB, RSRD, and NSM last night. The game went from an unrealistic arcade to an un-fun chore. The realism buttons I select seem to have no effect.


So it seems like RFB has removed my options. I'd like to play with Automatic T.D.C , but that button doesn't seem to do anything anymore. It doesn't matter what I want, RFB is going to force me to do manual torpedo targeting. What do I need to do get this back?

I would also like the velocity and heading vectors back on the attack map.

I would also like the torpedo track (green line) back on the attack map.

I would also like the torpedo (little black fish) to be drawn on the attack map. At least with that, when I miss, I've got some feedback so I can figure out what I did wrong. I might learn how to use Manual T.D.C if I've got feed back but right now its shoot and wonder why I hit or didn't hit.

--------
Insert reply about "this is realism mod"
--------

Fine. Please assign dedicated staff to my house to draw those tracks on a peice of paper. (Since I can't draw lines on the attack map %^(*%^)($%)$#)#)@@#$((@ )

Look... I don't WANT to have to sit down with graph paper and a trig table to play a game, I just want to play the game and enjoy it. IF that means I'm not as realistic and cool as you, I'm ok with that. I think RFB has some cool things added. I think its great that my torps might run deep or circle back. I think the reduced gun reload time is awesome. I like the proper sensors. I like that airplanes can see you in shallow water.

I just hate the freaking T.D.C. I can't hit the broadside of a barn with it. Maybe some day I'll figure it out, but I really don't WANT to right now, ok? Is that ok?

(When I would rather surface and shoot it out with an CA than shoot 4 torps and miss, there is something wrong)

If you want all those things and do not want to sit down with graph paper etc, RFB is not for you. RFB is a package for realism. I recommend you play stock game or try Trigger Maru/TM. Right now RFB is working towards realism and is not made to order. That only happens at Burger King.

[castorp345]

That only happens at Burger King.

:rotfl:

[LukeFF]

AVG summed up everything I wanted to say. Thanks! :smug:

[swdw]

You can get auto targeting back, you need to change your realism settings at the mission load screen or when in the office for a career.

From your post, it looks like Trigger Maru is the mod you should be playing.

We could put the stuff you want back in, but then you'd have 2 different flavors of the same thing between TM and RFB, so why bother with RFB? Yeah, more people would be willing to play RFB if we did that, but we aren't going for the biggest user base. We are answering the smaller demand for a very realistic mod.

In fact, after I picked up RFB and started looking for volunteers, Ducimus gave me a very wise piece of advice. He told me (paraphrased), "Have a goal for the mod and build the mod to meet that goal. Don't try to please every one like I did when I first started, it'll drive you nuts and still someone will still be unhappy with what you do. So make RFB fit the purpose you're driving towards and learn to have a thick skin." This was probably the best piece of davice I could have been given as a beginning modder.

Some decisions make people scratch their head though, like why is the external cam on? My answer is w/o it how can you "send people over the side" to check for damage? How else can you "take a walk" around the por facility to check the layout, etc. So we do make an exception here and there.

As Ducimus says, TM is 75% realism and 25% game play. Give it a try. Go to the TM Overhaul thread.

The great thing about SH4 is you have different levels of realism to pick from. Tis why I hope you never see one mod become the only option for SH4.

[fireship4]

I picked up the beta of RC2 of your filefront and as im not 100% sure you want it available, ill make some bug reports...

Im getting no dive plane movement with the porpoise (i have RSRD P3, NSM, ROW and diverate)

[Wilcke]

I picked up the beta of RC2 of your filefront and as im not 100% sure you want it available, ill make some bug reports...

Im getting no dive plane movement with the porpoise (i have RSRD P3, NSM, ROW and diverate)

If you are going to test I would just use the RFB RC2 and omit all other mods. This is a BETA and the folks that are modding are doing daily changes to that original file that you downloaded. Just an FYI. Enjoy! Its going to be awesome.

I have not looked at the diveplane movement on the Propoise, will take a peek tonight.

[fireship4]

I understand, but to note another thing, it seems you must overlay NSM ontop of RFB because RFB modifies Zones.cfg

#ALSO#

Maybe this causes problems too, seeing as my porpoise can no longer reach the test depth now shown on the dial, something around 400 - I stick to 250 for the moment.

Lastly you may want to take a look at ports and trees and things on the map - they dont move in sync with it sometimes when you have it on some of the closer zoom levels.

[swdw]

This beta is meant to be run with stock or ROW only. There are a lot of things being done to it, which is why it's not a public release.

The stock version has the most files and then those extra files are stripped to make versions that are conpatible with other mods. It's easier to do it that way than to add files and retest the additions.

You may want to join the testing forum for the beta. Instead of doing a private release to testers and handling everything via PM, a forum was set up so beta testers would be able to read each others comments and bug reports.

Anyone is welcome to join the forum. But due to spamming issues, it requires admin approval to activate the account. So it make take a day, depending on my schedule, to go through and activate new members.
the forum is at http://forum.kickinbak.com

[Onkel Neal]

updated

[tedhealy]

How close is the RFB team to a release? Any hints?

[AVGWarhawk]

Close, but the new files with the German boats has added some more work. Swdw and LukeFF are the work horses behind this mod and they are working like mad!!!! I would have to say, I'm enjoying the stock version and this will keep me busy for a while:D

[tedhealy]

Can't wait, I'll just have to go out and bag some more tonnage while waiting I guess :arrgh!:

[swdw]

While things are being tested and fixed, here's a couple of screenshots for you.

THere's a lot of "under the hood" changes you won't see, but here are some visual changes thanks to AVGwarhawk, CapnScurvy, Oakgroves orginal work and Re@llyDe@dMe@ts chrono which was reworked some by me.

LukeFF can post some screenshots of the work he's done

Here's a daytime shot through the periscope (yes it was foggy that day)
http://www.kickinbak.com/posts/newRFB.jpg




Here's a shot at night. The crosshairs are a dark green that is visible night or day.


http://www.kickinbak.com/posts/newRFB2.jpg


Notice something on the compass people have been yelling for?
:D

Better scopes mod will be available as an optional install.

[rodan54]

Most excellent work on that interface guys; definitely 5/5. :up:

[AVGWarhawk]

I love the additions to the interface. It came together nicely:up:

[LukeFF]

Just about all of my work has been "under the hood," as swdw noted, so here's what I've done:

-Very detailed torpedo performance mod. You will come to utterly hate the Mark 14 up to the end of September 1943. They will run deep, run off course, blow up prematurely, fail to detonate under the keel and fail to explode when they hit the target. It's a very accurate reflection of the real hassles faced by the submarine crews.

-Overhauled crew configs for all boats. They are now set up as realistically as they can be, within the limits of the game's coding. Flak guns and deck guns will take a substantial number of crewmen to operate efficiently. Equipment repairs will take longer now. Equipment that in reality couldn't be fixed at sea is now non-repairable (propeller shaft, rudder transmission, dive planes). Crewmen will now suffer longer and more severely when injured.

-Various graphics mods. These include updates to the career office and the National Flags mod.

-Submarine performance parameters for all have been adjusted. You can run at decks awash in the fleet boats to pick up sound contacts. Speeds and ranges for all boats are all now very much in line with reality (including new info that puts the S-boats at their WWII performance capabilities, as opposed to their 1920s-30s details). Equipment availability dates have all been adjusted as well. You will now find the S boats to be the red-headed stepchild of the Silent Service when it comes to new equipment. Armor levels have been dropped as well. It's still a work-in-progress, but it's already an improvement over stock.

-Submarine names now correspond to the date they began their first war patrol (as opposed to the past, where it was based on their date of commission). If you don't see a particular submarine name in RFB, it didn't go on at least one war patrol during the war.

All of these features will eventually make their way into the U-boats, as I've already begun preliminary work on them. I have lots of good things in mind for the future of RFB.

[AVGWarhawk]

-Overhauled crew configs for all boats. They are now set up as realistically as they can be, within the limits of the game's coding. Flak guns and deck guns will take a substantial number of crewmen to operate efficiently. Equipment repairs will take longer now. Equipment that in reality couldn't be fixed at sea is now non-repairable (propeller shaft, rudder transmission, dive planes). Crewmen will now suffer longer and more severely when injured.


This alone will make you think twice before heading into the bees nest like Rambo on steroids. :rotfl: Dancing around depth charges now becomes the real dance of death:o

[Fish40]

I'm starting to lick my chops again! Can't wait:up: Keep up the great work:rock:

[tedhealy]

Looks and sounds great!

I've been playing TMO lately and really like how the attack scope is almost useless at night forcing you to use the observation scope which lets in more light. Can this be worked into RFB?

[swdw]

Looks and sounds great!

I've been playing TMO lately and really like how the attack scope is almost useless at night forcing you to use the observation scope which lets in more light. Can this be worked into RFB?

Working on it as we speak.

[CDR Resser]

Without a doubt that is the best looking HUD that I have seen for this sim. You guys knocked that one out of the park. Can hardly wait.:up::rock::up::rock:

[CDR Resser]

I have trolled this thread for several days without noting any new posts or updates.
Admittedly, I am enjoying the Uboat addon myself. I hope that is where you guys are as well and nothing heavy has fallen on the RFB Team.:D
It will be worth the wait, but the suspense is killing me.:p

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

[Fish40]

I have trolled this thread for several days without noting any new posts or updates.
Admittedly, I am enjoying the Uboat addon myself. I hope that is where you guys are as well and nothing heavy has fallen on the RFB Team.:D
It will be worth the wait, but the suspense is killing me.:p

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser



My feelings exactly!:yep:

[Wilcke]

I have trolled this thread for several days without noting any new posts or updates.
Admittedly, I am enjoying the Uboat addon myself. I hope that is where you guys are as well and nothing heavy has fallen on the RFB Team.:D
It will be worth the wait, but the suspense is killing me.:p

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser



My feelings exactly!:yep:

Thanks swdw, see the RFB Team update below!

[THE_MASK]

sorry wrong thread

[RFB Team]

I have trolled this thread for several days without noting any new posts or updates.
Admittedly, I am enjoying the Uboat addon myself. I hope that is where you guys are as well and nothing heavy has fallen on the RFB Team.:D
It will be worth the wait, but the suspense is killing me.:p

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser


My feelings exactly!:yep:
In what is hopefully, the final stages of testing for the 1.4 release. Had some bugs crop up that needed squashing. :damn:

What we try to do is a 2 stage release. The first goes out to the people who want to test it so we can kill any showstoppers, get feedback on changes and make sure all changes from all contributors are correctly rolled in.

Some of the changes take a lot of testing to ensure the effect the modder is going for is what you actually see. A good example is LukeFF's changes that will allow crewmen to be injured easier than stock. Something like that takes a LOT of testing in different situations to make sure the results pan out. Sometimes, there's additional tweaking required. This type of testing is rather time consuming and takes a while.

We know and understand we aren't going to necessarily get it "perfect" before the public release.:yep: Something like this will get better with more feedback. However, we do need to make sure it's playable / useablefor you guys so we only have to worry about fine tuning.

So you know, the plan is to get the bugs/ changes needed for a public release taken care of with the 1.4 version before making it 1.5 compatible. We only want to be dealing with bugs from one source at a time so we don't end up :gulp:

We'll probably add a couple of things to the 1.5 version that will be retrofitted to the 1.4 release.

So pray for no more bugs, and if your prayers are answered:/\\k:, you should see it out in a few days.

For a sample, here are some of the mini-mods rolled into the release. This list isn't complete yet, and these are in addition to all previous mods rolled into the earlier versions:
Peto's extended evasion
CapnScurvy's SCAF
swdw's Draft and dive rate
De@dMe@t's Night Hamilton22 Chrono
Anvart's SD antenna mod
Cap'n Cox's Airbase location mods
Ducimus' tugboat and Kaikoban fixes
LukeFF's Realistc Crew configs and National Flags
SteveTRM's Sounds

Changes to RFB by the team
AI sensor changes
Sub Hydrophone changes
Sub radar changes
Interior gauges
HUD rework
Range changes to boats
Periscope crosshair colors
Flags
Hull damage
Crew damage
Crew roster changes
Crew ability changes
More realistic torpedoes
Corrected dates for boat types, add-ons, torpedoes
Decoys available when historically available
Removal of texture files and scene files that conflict with either Kriller2's or W_Clear's environmental mods.
Shell damage and reload times
A number of addiotoinal sounds and alterations to sounds

Other modifications and changes.

[LukeFF]

The 1.4-compatible release is coming soon, guys. As the post above shows, we've added a lot of stuff into this version, and we want to make sure it's all working correctly. From looking at the 1.5 file changes, I don't think it will be too long before we have a 1.5 version out, either.

[Mav87th]

Are you guys still using the numbers (or philosofy if there are new periscope images) that i came up with back in old days...

or will i have to make a new mod to work with the new RFB ?

[swdw]

Are you guys still using the numbers (or philosofy if there are new periscope images) that i came up with back in old days...

or will i have to make a new mod to work with the new RFB ?
Not sure what you mean here. The images themselves are the textures from before with color changes to the crosshairs and the attack scope lens has been darkened a little with each test release. Trying to get a noticeable night time difference between it and the observation scope.

[Fish40]

The 1.4-compatible release is coming soon, guys. As the post above shows, we've added a lot of stuff into this version, and we want to make sure it's all working correctly. From looking at the 1.5 file changes, I don't think it will be too long before we have a 1.5 version out, either.


This is great news!:yep: I am eagerly awaiting the 1.5 compatable version. I haven't even installed the addon yet in anticapation of this. Great job:up:

[AVGWarhawk]

Yep, they are rolling in all sorts of changes and testing. I think you all will be pleasantly surprised!

[M. Sarsfield]

Since Ducimus is not going to upgrade TM to work with the German career, I'll probably switch over to RFB. This originally caught my eye back in the fall and I've been itching to add more realism to the game.

[CDR Resser]

Wow. That is an impressive list. Everything I see from the teases to the list of changes indicates that this release will be one impressive piece of work.
Thanks for all your hard work.:up::up::up::up::up:

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

[Galanti]

I'm really, really looking forward to the overhauled damage modelling for your own submarine and the crew fixes. I've playing months with TM and was very satisified, but lately have realized that the boat and crew is more or less invulnerable. My crew members never suffer more than five percent health loss, and damage is always repairable. I don't think this is a TM thing, it's probably stock behavior, but frankly, I've had enough of it. I want more of a pucker factor when the ashcans start raining down!

[Dogzero1]

The 1.4-compatible release is coming soon, guys. As the post above shows, we've added a lot of stuff into this version, and we want to make sure it's all working correctly. From looking at the 1.5 file changes, I don't think it will be too long before we have a 1.5 version out, either.


This is great news!:yep: I am eagerly awaiting the 1.5 compatable version. I haven't even installed the addon yet in anticapation of this. Great job:up:

Me too. RFB is my favourite mod.:up:

[Galanti]

How does one make certain equipment impossible to repair mid-patrol? Can you hack the ActivePlayerUnits.upc in the appropriate savegames folder?

I want to keep going with my current career until the new RFB comes out.

[AVGWarhawk]

Bump

[Galanti]

Boy, I know this is going to sound ungrateful, but have you any idea when the 1.5 version is going to be released? I've got the addon collecting dust on my hard drive, and I'm torn (really, writhing in inner turmoil) between starting a 1.4 career with the latrest RFB and waiting for 1.5, because I assume my 1.4 career will be incompatible with 1.5. I'm dying in install the addon, though I couldn't tell you why, as I haven't any interest in Monsun boats. Maybe just because it's there.

Feel free to heap abuse upon me for my impertinence, but I just have to ask. Needless to say, you all rock for your efforts anyway.:rock:

[swdw]

Feel free to heap abuse upon me for my impertinence, but I just have to ask. Needless to say, you all rock for your efforts anyway.:rock:

Let me see. You are such a good fan of the mod that you hold off installing the add-on waiting for the 1.5 version . . . and you think we'd be upset about you asking when the 1.5 RFB will be released?:hmm:

Heck, if anything we should be grateful to you for being sooo patient.:yep:

As for when it will be out. It's being worked on right now. I'll post a progress update in a couple of days.

[swdw]

Added a megaupload location
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=375A4G03

[tedhealy]

Did the darker attack scope vs lighter obs scope not make it in? Tested coming out of port in the dark I kept switching back and forth between the 2 scopes and couldn't pick up a difference.

[swdw]

Working on getting this right. When you look at the textures there's a very noticeable difference. Wiil keep playing with it while working on the 1.5 version and roll the changes into the 1.4 version also.

[tedhealy]

Ok :up:

Time to head out on patrol then :arrgh!:

[Fish40]

Patience is a virtue:yep:

[Tim D]

I am currently running ROW 1.1a, NSM, RFB 1.4 031408, and RSRD V390 with SHIV 1.4. Everything so far has been working great, but I cant seem to get the Torpedo door button in the menu to work. It still works by pressing Q. Thanks for any help and what a outstanding mod thanks for all your hard work.

[lurker_hlb3]

To ALL


Required patches for RSRDC V390

===========================
V390 Patch 1

Replace the original RSRDC SH.sdl file with the one in Real Fleet Boat v1-4 031408.

Resolved conflicts with S18 and Balao files used RSRDC and new RFB to ensure that the new changes from v1-4 031408 are not lost.

Link

http://files.filefront.com/RSRDC+v39.../fileinfo.html (http://files.filefront.com/RSRDC+v390+Patch1rar/;9820239;/fileinfo.html)

[Tim D]

I have applied the V390 Patch, but that still doesnt correct the problem with the Menu button for the torp doors. I think it is a RFB problem, thanks for any help getting it fixed. I am running ROW 1.1a, NSM, RFB 1.4 031408, and RSRD V390, V390 Patch 1, CBS Radio mod with SHIV 1.4 (all in that order)

[swdw]

The v390 patch is from lurker to correct a potential CTD with RSRD and RFB.

The button will be activated in a 1.4 update that will include changes incorporated in the 1.5 release.

[Tim D]

SWDW, Thank you very much for the reply. I will enjoy RFB for now- What a great mod. Thank you to everyone who made all of this possible, there is alot of talented people out there :up:

[tedhealy]

A few observations after 3 patrols. My previous experience has been with TM. Before that, I used Beery's RFB. This is in no way meant to be any sort of this mod is better or worse post, just some observations of mine. This also isn't any sort of rant, my overall impression of the new RFB is very positive.

+ Scopes larger and dirty, love 'em. Also the very large degree numbers at the top are great.

+ binocs, love how they sim actually looking through them where you sort of see the two distinct lens.

- binocs, can't see the compass degrees in low light levels.

+ Wave height and ship roll is great. It's not over done to the point of making me seasick, but you still feel the bigger waves.

+ I like the reworked text from the crew - the officer not giving you range anymore, the weather report seems worded slightly differently, as does the sonar reports.

+ Interior sounds - background noise helps to make the sub seem more alive.

- Interior sounds - that same background noise going on is distracting during silent running. I guess I can't have it both ways though.

- I'd like to have a button or key command to go to the conning tower.

- I'd like to have the crowded feeling in the conning tower a la TMO

- I'd like to have the Straits named on the map a la TMO - like Lombok Strait and Makassar Strait etc.

- Maybe it's a mod combination thing, but during a rain storm, only the officer's face next to me was drawn. It's like his rain coat was not drawn, so he was just a floating head.

Mods/order used

Install PE 1_1
PE 1_1 a3_new_scene_test
Patch for pe1_2Alpha
NSM4 classic - changed zones.cfg keel cargo to None
Real Fleet Boat v1-4 031408
RSRDC_RFBv14_V390
RSRDC_v390_Patch1
FooFighters High Res skins with black and gray

Many thanks to the RFB team for such a great mod :up:

[M. Sarsfield]

How is RFB for 1.5 coming along?

[LukeFF]

How is RFB for 1.5 coming along?

It's coming along. ;)

Lots of good stuff coming for 1.5.

[swdw]

Tis progressing. RFB has a heavily modified 1024x678_menu.ini file. This is taking a while to sort through and get all the bugs worked out.

In the meantime,
Luke has been adding more sounds- fleet boat and u-boat.

Akbar Gulag is working on a really cool airlayer mod to work with RFB and RSRD.

Some tweaks have been made to the sub draft mods.

The RFB HUD and 1.5 HUD files have been integrated, but had to move some tab icons which will require a little button tweaking.

1.5 Crew config and ability changes for both fleet boats and U-boats are being tweaked by LukeFF

CapnScurvy has dropped in a couple minor fixes.

For the 1.5 release we also want to add a couple things including some of Ducimus' changes he's letting us borrow from TMO.

[swdw]

A few observations after 3 patrols. My previous experience has been with TM. Before that, I used Beery's RFB. This is in no way meant to be any sort of this mod is better or worse post, just some observations of mine. This also isn't any sort of rant, my overall impression of the new RFB is very positive.

Many thanks to the RFB team for such a great mod :up:

Thanks for the feedback.

Will look into the missing textures

On your order of install, shift the PE to after RFB for now. I missed deleting the cloud files from RFB. Wehn Kriller puts out PE2, I'll put out a small patch so you can install RFB after PE and the patch will replace the overwritten files.

The next release will have all conflicting files removed. I just need to have Kriller's final release to ensure I have a list of all graphics files that are in the final release.

[CDR Resser]

If I could be impertinent enough to suggest what you might borrow from TMO. After having played with it for a while, his career mod to go to new construction with sea trial missions was really interesting. Also, knowing that Bungo Pete is out there is really neat.
He's a tough one, that Pete.

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

[LukeFF]

If I could be impertinent enough to suggest what you might borrow from TMO. After having played with it for a while, his career mod to go to new construction with sea trial missions was really interesting. Also, knowing that Bungo Pete is out there is really neat.
He's a tough one, that Pete.

Campaign layers are a totally separate issue from RFB.

[CDR Resser]

If I could be impertinent enough to suggest what you might borrow from TMO. After having played with it for a while, his career mod to go to new construction with sea trial missions was really interesting. Also, knowing that Bungo Pete is out there is really neat.
He's a tough one, that Pete.
Campaign layers are a totally separate issue from RFB.

So if someone might be interested in doing such a thing, would it simply involve adding the appropriate file to the campaign layers. As for Bungo Pete, I wouldn't really even know where to start to add him in as well.

Forgive my ignorance, but if its something that wouldn't be included in the release, it would be some thing that I might be interested in doing myself.

Realism with just the slightest touch of undersea whimsy-- sounds pretty good to me.

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

[swdw]

So if someone might be interested in doing such a thing, would it simply involve adding the appropriate file to the campaign layers. As for Bungo Pete, I wouldn't really even know where to start to add him in as well.

Realism with just the slightest touch of undersea whimsy-- sounds pretty good to me.

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser
RFB includes Peto's Prolonged evasion mod. The reports from people using it mentioned they were running into everything from the DD's that are rank amateurs to some that seem to be as nasty as Bungo Pete.

We want to keep RFB working with RSRD so we can concentrate on other areas and utilize lurker's great work for the campaign end. You may want to ask lurker if Bungo Pete is in or can be added to RSRD.

One thing you'll find is the sounds in RFB getting better and more realistic. The team has 3 ex submariners on it, and a couple more that we can ask questions of.

Sound isn't the only thing that will be affected by such input. As time goes by RFB will reflect this influence as it strives more towards the "real" part of RFB (within the limits of the game engine).

One thing too, we are looking at this as a marathon, not a sprint, so you'll see incremental improvements in RFB instead of waiting moths for a huge amount of work to be done. This allows you to take advantage of improvements and for us to include suggestions as development continues.

[Fish40]

Sounds good SWDW! I can't wait for the 1.5 release:yep: About the new sounds, how dose this fit in with the ROW sounds? Will RFB overwrite a good portion of them?

[M. Sarsfield]

Fish40, as with TMO, I recommend just using what's in the super mod. If you really think someone else has a better sound pack, then install it after RFB. Usually, these guys borrow ideas and files (with permission) from each other. So, it may eventually become a moot point as to which mod you use.

[LukeFF]

About the new sounds, how dose this fit in with the ROW sounds? Will RFB overwrite a good portion of them?

It overwrites all of the sounds in ROW and with the 1.5 release will add a new one for German torpedo hydrophone sounds. RFB uses Version 8 of the ROW sounds (since I compiled it) and builds off of that base.

[Fish40]

About the new sounds, how dose this fit in with the ROW sounds? Will RFB overwrite a good portion of them?
It overwrites all of the sounds in ROW and with the 1.5 release will add a new one for German torpedo hydrophone sounds. RFB uses Version 8 of the ROW sounds (since I compiled it) and builds off of that base.



Thanks Luke, that sounds good enough too me. I'll pretty much still basicly have the ROW sounds, then some.:up:

[CDR Resser]

Thanks for the information. I am really looking forward to the release of the next installment of RFB.

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

[Unhealthy]

Hi,

I would like to give it a try, but it's a bit confusing because there are many versions of the mods... I'd like to try what the post suggests : ROW, NSM, RFB, RSRD...

I'd like to know which versions of each one I should use, and if any mod patches are required... Also I want to be sure that the installation order on the 1st page of this thread is still valid.

Thanks a lot

[kylesplanet]

Is there a way to add the directional tails back to RFB? I tried the method that TM uses to get them back but it didn't work. Thanks for any help.:yep:

[swdw]

Hi,

I would like to give it a try, but it's a bit confusing because there are many versions of the mods... I'd like to try what the post suggests : ROW, NSM, RFB, RSRD...

I'd like to know which versions of each one I should use, and if any mod patches are required... Also I want to be sure that the installation order on the 1st page of this thread is still valid.

Thanks a lot
The order listed at the beginning of this topic is still good. When Pacific environment is released by kriller, we'll put up a quick patch and the install will still be the same.

There is only one RFB file you can donwload. Grab the one at the beginning of the topic.

The only thing that's changed in the install order is adding the RSRD patch.

So it still should be
ROW
NSM 1.4 version modified for ROW
RFB
RSRD
RSRD patch

[swdw]

Is there a way to add the directional tails back to RFB? I tried the method that TM uses to get them back but it didn't work. Thanks for any help.:yep:

They are removed in different ways.

The idea is to use your nav tools. Place an x where the ships are at. Wait a couple of minutes, or zoom in and wait a shorter amount of time, and place another x over the now current position. Then draw a line between the 2 marks.

That's how it was done in real life.;)

[one_t]

:up::up:A Very Big Work

[JackMaga]

Hi!
I recently downloaded this mod, and I'm thoroughly enjoying it!

Just one question though.. I see mentioned in the list of changes a "LukeFF's Realistic Crew configs" and when I start a career my Sargo has 6 officers assigned to it: two Lts, three Lt. jr, 2 Ensigns...
Is this intended?
I admit I'm not very informed about the actual crew of a ww2 submarine, but 6 commisioned officers seem a lot!
Did you also change the number of officers required for each compartment so that, for example, the control room requires 4 commissioned officer to function at 100%?

[swdw]

Hi!
I recently downloaded this mod, and I'm thoroughly enjoying it!

Just one question though.. I see mentioned in the list of changes a "LukeFF's Realistic Crew configs" and when I start a career my Sargo has 6 officers assigned to it: two Lts, three Lt. jr, 2 Ensigns...
Is this intended?
I admit I'm not very informed about the actual crew of a ww2 submarine, but 6 commisioned officers seem a lot!
Did you also change the number of officers required for each compartment so that, for example, the control room requires 4 commissioned officer to function at 100%?

Depending on the boat and the year of the war, there were anywhere from 5 to 9 officers on board. So- Luke did it right.:D

[JackMaga]

Depending on the boat and the year of the war, there were anywhere from 5 to 9 officers on board. So- Luke did it right.:D

Obviously! Shame on me for doubting Luke :oops:
Now back to sinking Tojo! :ahoy:

And of course... THANK-YOU for this awesome mod!!! :up:

[RFB Team]

Please note, with the latest release of Pacific Environment 2 and W_clears environment, the install order has been changed. THis is reflected in the first thread now. Here's the change:

The install order would be

NSM
RFB
RSRD
RSRD patch
PE2 or W_Clear environment mod

Without NSM the order would be

RFB
RFB zones file
RSRD
RSRD patch
PE2 or W_Clear environment mod

ROW sounds- LukeFF was one of the primary contributors to the ROW sounds and updated a number of them for RFB with feedback rom the ex submariners on the RFB team.. So try them out before installing the ROW sounds. You'll lose the newer sounds with RFB by installing the ROW sounds.

[Galanti]

I see you've added '1.5 Coming Soon'. May I humbly and meekly inquire as to how soon is soon?

I finally got my copy of the film 'Run Silent, Run Deep', I'm reading the Cameron Cooke novel 'Sink The Shigure', re-reading Blair's 'Silent Victory' and my 18-month old is away at the in-laws. I'm good and ready!

[swdw]

Sigh . . . .

Yell at me, I'm the big holdup.:oops:

Been going through and merging files and have had real life intertupt a LOT lately.
:lost:

[Galanti]

Sigh . . . .

Yell at me, I'm the big holdup.:oops:

Been going through and merging files and have had real life intertupt a LOT lately.
:lost:


No worries....real life, huh? Maybe I should give that a shot in the meantime. Take your time swdw, I know it'll be worth it.

[LukeFF]

Just one question though.. I see mentioned in the list of changes a "LukeFF's Realistic Crew configs" and when I start a career my Sargo has 6 officers assigned to it: two Lts, three Lt. jr, 2 Ensigns...
Is this intended?

I have used real-world crew lists to compile the crew configs part of the mod, so yes, that officer setup is intended. The fleet boats will all have 7 officers, while the S boats have 3. In addition, the crew limit feature introduced with the add-on has now been added to the American boats, so one can't stack his crew full of officers and CPOs. :up:

[ReallyDedPoet]

Look forward to the 1.5 release :up:


RDP

[AlmightyTallest]

Yea, can't wait to try this with v1.5 I'm sure it'll be worth the wait :D

[kylesplanet]

I have a question for swdw or the RFB team. I recently started a career with RFB for the first time. I started in a Porpise class and had two successful patrols, completing my objectives and bagged around 70,000 tons. When I got back to port, I was offered an upgrade to a Salmon class sub.

The problem is, its August 43, the Porpise class had SJ-i radar but the game will not let me add the radar to the Salmon class. If I choose to keep the Porpise, the game retires me. I've posted this in the other forum but I wanted to ask if it could be the mods I'm running or is it the game doing this.

I'm running:
P.E.
RFB
RSRD
radio mods
Foo's skins

Please don't think I'm complaining I'm just curious.

[AVGWarhawk]

The game will retire you sometimes if you do not accept the new command. As far as the radar, not sure but perhaps you have to start building up your new command. I seem to remember SH3 was much the same way. I think Luke can answer this part better.

[LukeFF]

The problem is, its August 43, the Porpise class had SJ-i radar but the game will not let me add the radar to the Salmon class. If I choose to keep the Porpise, the game retires me. I've posted this in the other forum but I wanted to ask if it could be the mods I'm running or is it the game doing this.

I "think" I found out the fix to that, based on a fix I needed for the SJ radar to work properly on the S boats. Will see if it works.

[kylesplanet]

The problem is, its August 43, the Porpise class had SJ-i radar but the game will not let me add the radar to the Salmon class. If I choose to keep the Porpise, the game retires me. I've posted this in the other forum but I wanted to ask if it could be the mods I'm running or is it the game doing this.

I "think" I found out the fix to that, based on a fix I needed for the SJ radar to work properly on the S boats. Will see if it works.

That would be great Luke!:yep:

[kylesplanet]

Luke if it makes any difference, this morning when I woke up, I fired up SH4 with intentions of making the patrol without radar and all of a sudden, it let me install the sj & sj-i :hmm: It makes me wonder if this is just game related instead of mods.

[LukeFF]

Luke if it makes any difference, this morning when I woke up, I fired up SH4 with intentions of making the patrol without radar and all of a sudden, it let me install the sj & sj-i :hmm: It makes me wonder if this is just game related instead of mods.

Hmmph, odd. Anyways, I think my fix will have a benefit to those who've said they can't install radar on their boats.

[LukeFF]

BTW, we're making good progress on the 1.5 release of RFB. The crew configurations and everything else that goes along with U-boat performance have been tweaked to historical standards. I created a really nice, rational system for both the American and German crewmen whereby their skill set, leadership, and intelligence ratings gradually go up as they progress in rank, and each one of them now has a set of skills most relevant to the compartment he is assigned to. That means, for instance, men in the torpedo rooms will have good Mechanical and Guns skills, while radar and sonar men have good Electrical and Watchman skills.

[kylesplanet]

I'm really looking forward to the release. I just started with RFB a couple of weeks ago and I am really impressed so far. The realistic quality is unreal.:yep: PE2 and RFB have a few clashes right now but I'm sure it will be worked out and provide alot of enjoyment.

I really appreciate all of the hard work that has gone into RFB, the entire team has done an outstanding job. :up:

[swdw]

The realistic quality is unreal.:yep: PE2 and RFB have a few clashes right now but I'm sure it will be worked out and provide alot of enjoyment.
Here's how to solve that problem.

If you are using RFB and you go to install PE2, you'll need to do this until the next release of PE.

Deactivate PE2, browse to the Silent Hunter Wolves of the Pacific\MODS\Pacific Environments 2\Data\ and delete the Menu folder.

Reactivate PE2. Kriller said he accidentally included that folder in the PE2 mod. I checked and deleting the folder will not affect PE2. However, leaving that folder in place blows out the HUD and all of the topredo panel work done for RFB.

[kylesplanet]

The realistic quality is unreal.:yep: PE2 and RFB have a few clashes right now but I'm sure it will be worked out and provide alot of enjoyment.

Here's how to solve that problem.

Deactivate PE2, browse to the Silent Hunter Wolves of the Pacific\MODS\Pacific Environments 2\Install_PE2\Data\ and delete the Menu folder.

Reactivate PE2. Kriller said he accidentally included that folder in the PE2 mod. I checked and deleting the mod will not affect PE2. However, leaving that folder in place blows out the HUD and all of the topredo panel work done for RFB.

Will do SWDW, thanks for the reply!

[LukeFF]

X Warning To All Captains X Message Follows X

X Small-caliber Cannon Fire Now Determined To Have A Detrimental Effect Against The Outer Hull Of Our Submarines X Bridge Watch Also Determined To Be At Risk X Use All Caution When Approaching A Target On The Surface X

...;)

[CDR Resser]

X Warning To All Captains X Message Follows X

X Small-caliber Cannon Fire Now Determined To Have A Detrimental Effect Against The Outer Hull Of Our Submarines X Bridge Watch Also Determined To Be At Risk X Use All Caution When Approaching A Target On The Surface X

...;)

For the life of me I cannot figure out why you would want to stay on the surface and slug it out with airplanes.
If they don't perforate you all by themself, they have this invention called a radio, and could call their friends, bigger friends with bigger and more guns.
Isn't the object to only be detected by you torpedoes exploding against the sides of enemy ships.
You should be able to dive faster than a Zeke!!!!!!

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser,

[Schultzy]

Fantastic news re the small caliber weapons on the planes! Now every pass they make's going to hurt...
I'm think i'm going to intstitute dive drills on my sub like Clark Gable. :)

1.5 sounds like it's going to a real must have download!!

Cannot wait. Thanks guys. :)

[AVGWarhawk]

X Warning To All Captains X Message Follows X

X Small-caliber Cannon Fire Now Determined To Have A Detrimental Effect Against The Outer Hull Of Our Submarines X Bridge Watch Also Determined To Be At Risk X Use All Caution When Approaching A Target On The Surface X

...;)

Gosh, I think this is the first time I feel it is ok to get shot up! Excellent! All of a sudden, staying submerged by day is a must.

[tedhealy]

Sounds great!

Message back to commander though, I just had a pair of Japanese planes get the jump on me near Rabaul. They came in to strafe me and collided and crashed so tell them to exercise some caution too.

[LukeFF]

Yep, this is going to introduce a whole new element to combat. Not only will cannon fire from aircraft hurt you now, but sitting off to the side of a disabled merchant with a still-active 25 mm cannon while you try to plink him with deck gun rounds will be a bad thing to do. Thousand-yard deck gun shots will probably become the norm now.

[Galanti]

X Warning To All Captains X Message Follows X

X Small-caliber Cannon Fire Now Determined To Have A Detrimental Effect Against The Outer Hull Of Our Submarines X Bridge Watch Also Determined To Be At Risk X Use All Caution When Approaching A Target On The Surface X

...;)

Fantastic improvement, guys. As it was before, A/C were more of a nuisance than anything else, this is another tweak to the pucker factor I'm looking forward to.

Did you have to make changes to the sub files or the shells.zon to get this to work? If so, will it impact interaction with damage model mods like NSM?

[LukeFF]

Did you have to make changes to the sub files or the shells.zon to get this to work? If so, will it impact interaction with damage model mods like NSM?

I needed to drop the armor value on the subs and modify the 20 mm shell power in shells.zon to get this working right. As it stands right now, all of the subs have 300 hit points. A couple of good barrages from the enemy, and your hull integrity will be down to 60-75% of what it originally was. I had originally wanted a flat 100 hit points for the hulls (like all of the weapons and compartments), but that resulted in the sub getting destroyed WAY too fast. Enemy 20 mm shells now take away half a hit point with every shell that hits your sub. It doesn't sound like much, but sit around in range of the enemy for too long, and your hull will start to look like swiss cheese. ;)

[AlmightyTallest]

Will this also affect the machine and lighter cannon deck guns on escorts?

I always hated the fact I could just keep watching attacking escorts though my periscope while they circled me and fired light machine guns and 20mm and 40mm at me while just under the surface without doing any damage. Now we'd really have to dive for the deep! Or have the risk of the conning tower getting preforated, and lose the radar, and periscopes.

Also, weren't some subs just a little more resiliant to battle damage because of the higher strength steel construction like the Balao and Tench? Not that they should be able to duke it out on the surface either, but maybe just ever so slightly able to handle a few more of the lighter 20mm rounds hitting them. Don't know what the facts are on their stengthened hulls though.

Is there any chance of getting hydrophone upgrades? Were there different models used on the various fleet boats?

Man I can't wait to try this mod out!

[Wilcke]

Will this also affect the machine and lighter cannon deck guns on escorts?

I always hated the fact I could just keep watching attacking escorts though my periscope while they circled me and fired light machine guns and 20mm and 40mm at me while just under the surface without doing any damage. Now we'd really have to dive for the deep! Or have the risk of the conning tower getting preforated, and lose the radar, and periscopes.

Also, weren't some subs just a little more resiliant to battle damage because of the higher strength steel construction like the Balao and Tench? Not that they should be able to duke it out on the surface either, but maybe just ever so slightly able to handle a few more of the lighter 20mm rounds hitting them. Don't know what the facts are on their stengthened hulls though.

Is there any chance of getting hydrophone upgrades? Were there different models used on the various fleet boats?

Man I can't wait to try this mod out!

The pressure hulls were improved with construction consisting of high tensile steel to increase the max dive depth. No consideration was given to absorbing high velocity projectiles in the reading that I have done on the subject. The outer structures and equipment were just as vulnerable.

Nope I am not going to hang around and absorb 20mm fire.....then again its only a game so if its fun go ahead and enjoy!

Happy Hunting!

[AlmightyTallest]

lol, I'm not hanging around soaking up 20 mike mike any more either after this coming patch!

Thanks for the info on the steel hulls Wilcke, just affects diving depth then, gotcha :D

[LukeFF]

Is there any chance of getting hydrophone upgrades? Were there different models used on the various fleet boats?
Fleet boats will start the war with only the ultrasonic WCA sonar, which has a maximum listening range of 9,750 yards. Sometime in the latter half of 1943 JP sonar will become available, which ups the listening range considerably (13,750 yards). S boats have only WCA sonar. Those values, BTW, were taken from real-world performance statistics. Not until very, very late in the war did American sonar start to rival that of the Germans.

[Fish40]

This is sounding better, and better. Can't wait! Still patiently patroling in 1.4.:roll:

[LukeFF]

Yep, it's one of the cool things the devs added to 1.5: the ability to upgrade the sonar equipment. Early on in the war, you will have to rely heavily on your bridge watch to spot targets, because sonar doesn't track that far, and the early SJ radar has a max range of just over 7 miles. Come ~September 1943, though, and things start to really improve. JP-1 sonar and SJ-1 comes online, the problems with the Mark 14 get fixed, and the wakeless Mark 18 is introduced as well (albeit in very small numbers at first).

S boat fans...well, let me just say, get used to being the red-headed stepchildren of the fleet. No JP sonar, no SJ radar for the S-18s until November 1942 (and no SD radar ever), and SJ and SD radar for the S-42s starting only in March 1943.

Another nice little feature we did was make the Mark 10 cost 100 renown points each for the fleet boats. We wanted to mimic the reality of fleet boats taking Mark 10s on patrol but at the same time depict how this wasn't a common occurance. However, the biggest issue with this was trying to find a solution to a player just skirting around the Mark 14's problems by just loading up on Mark 10s each and every patrol. This solution still allows the player to load up the Mark 10 on the fleet boats but at a high cost. Of course, for the S boats they will remain free.

[AlmightyTallest]

This is excellent!! I can't wait for this new RFB!

I posted an article under the New Torpedoes thread about upgrading to Torpex warheads on the Mk 14 here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=132982&page=2 will there be any consideration for purchasing upgraded MK 14's with Torpex warheads as opposed to the standard TNT type? Although the MK 14 may be rather unreliable at first, having the option to get one with a harder hitting warhead may compensate a bit. :D

[kylesplanet]

It looks like the RFB team has been putting in overtime!:) I'm really looking forward to the release, it sounds like a lot of improvements have been made. :yep:

[AVGWarhawk]

S boat fans...well, let me just say, get used to being the red-headed stepchildren of the fleet. No JP sonar, no SJ radar for the S-18s until November 1942 (and no SD radar ever), and SJ and SD radar for the S-42s starting only in March 1943.

Poor buggers...they did do some things! I will be starting in the S when the time comes:D

[tedhealy]

Sounds great, I suppose I'll have to knuckle under and shell out the 10 bucks for 1.5 soon :hmm:

Done and done, bring on RFB for 1.5 :()1:

[Weather-guesser]

This is sounding really good. Are we talking days or weeks for the release if you dont mind me asking? :ping: The coming soon is a big tease.

[CDR Resser]

I am looking forward to this release almost as much as the original release of the sim.
Sounds like it will make a lot of interesting improvements.

Respectfully Submitted;
CDR Resser

[LukeFF]

I posted an article under the New Torpedoes thread about upgrading to Torpex warheads on the Mk 14 here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=132982&page=2 will there be any consideration for purchasing upgraded MK 14's with Torpex warheads as opposed to the standard TNT type? Although the MK 14 may be rather unreliable at first, having the option to get one with a harder hitting warhead may compensate a bit. :D

Thanks for the link. I'll have to see if it's possible to have a Mark 14 with slightly less power early on in the war. The Mark 10 is already set up to be less powerful than the Mark 14.

[AlmightyTallest]

No problem LukeFF, glad I could contribute to this mod in some very small way :D

[LukeFF]

Not a problem. I never even knew there was a version of the Mark 14 without Torpex, lol. Nonetheless, there will be a power adjustment to the torpedoes in this next release. Knowing that Torpex is 50% more powerful than TNT has allowed me to adjust the Mark 10 and the other torpedoes (other than the Mark 14/23) to more realistic levels. It will be one more factor to weigh in when deciding if to load up on Mark 10s instead of Mark 14s: does one take the more powerful but more flawed torpedo or the one that is less powerful, slower and shorter-ranged but more reliable?

[AlmightyTallest]

That sounds Great LukeFF, I'm assuming that other later torpedoes used during the war like the Mk 18 or Mk23 used only Torpex warheads though?

Also, found some info on Periscopes, quoted from this source from the USS Bergall SS-320

http://www.bergall.org/320/patrol/torpedo.html

PERISCOPES: Number 1 is the approach scope. It breaks the surface at 62' 5". It also contains ST radar. I am a little fuzzy on how this works, but it could get a range to the target. Number 2 is the attack scope and breaks the surface at 67' 5". Both have horizontal lines in them where if you have an estimate of the target masthead height, you can count the number of horizontal lines it crosses and get a rough idea of the target range. #2 also has what is called a stadimeter, much like what is used on surface ships, where you match up two images and get a range estimate. TDC: (Torpedo Data Computer) usually located in after end of conning tower on port side. It has automatic input of the submarine course and speed. All other inputs are introduced manually (if I remember correctly !) It also has a section for the target.


Interesting that the two periscopes have slightly different heights if its true, it would allow us to have both scopes up, particularly the attack scope up without having the observation periscope get in the way since it's claimed to stand 5' higher.

Also, from this same submarine is detail on the 5" guns here:

http://www.bergall.org/320/patrol/deckguns.html claiming only 75 rounds among other interesting facts from the men who served on her during the war.

Any chance we could get those Mk 28 homing torpedoes on the fleet boats in 1945?

[M. Sarsfield]

Any chance we could get those Mk 28 homing torpedoes on the fleet boats in 1945?

Keltos created a Mk. 28 Mod and they are available in mid/late 1944.

I wish we had the ST radar on the observation scope. Would be nice to get radar range with only the scope popping out of the water.

[AVGWarhawk]

Any chance we could get those Mk 28 homing torpedoes on the fleet boats in 1945?
Keltos created a Mk. 28 Mod and they are available in mid/late 1944.

I wish we had the ST radar on the observation scope. Would be nice to get radar range with only the scope popping out of the water.

Just surface a bit.

[bluedingo]

http://www.bergall.org/320/patrol/deckguns.html claiming only 75 rounds among other interesting facts from the men who served on her during the war.

Can you actually get similarly sized guns in the game? And wow how a 65-pound shell must hurt if it drops on you.:dead:

[M. Sarsfield]

5" guns are available later in the war/game. The old V-class boats, like Narwhal, had two 6" deck guns.

[LukeFF]

Interesting that the two periscopes have slightly different heights if its true, it would allow us to have both scopes up, particularly the attack scope up without having the observation periscope get in the way since it's claimed to stand 5' higher.

One can certainly mod the extension height of the periscopes. I'll look into doing this.

[AlmightyTallest]

That's great to hear, I'm visiting the USS Requin (SS 481) tomorrow, will check with them on periscope height as well.

[M. Sarsfield]

The tour guides on the Requin aren't necessarily as smart as some of them think they are (from first hand experience). Of course, that was 10 years ago.

[AlmightyTallest]

lol, I know Sarsfield. I called the science center and asked if we'd get unrestricted access and they told me they no longer have tour guides there. They said I could go into the conning tower and look through the periscopes myself if I wanted to. :D

I last went there as a kid in 1990 with the tour guides, and restricions on where we could go so it'll be interesting to see what has changed, and now that I'm older I have a better appreciation for what I'm looking at.

[Mav87th]

Interesting that the two periscopes have slightly different heights if its true, it would allow us to have both scopes up, particularly the attack scope up without having the observation periscope get in the way since it's claimed to stand 5' higher.

With my current setup - ROW+RSRD+RFB they do have different hights. The observation scobe allways gets washed over by small waves and the attack does not. And if i run them both all up the attack scope is not obstructed by the obs. as is the case the opposite way....

BUT!!! in order to see this you would need my cameras.dat mod.......:|\\

Point is that they DO rise to different altitudes, but the clip distance prevents your observationsscope from having an obstructed view by a fully raised attack scope...

[swdw]

Update:

First beta for the testers is uploading. We're following the usual course of ironing out any major bugs and show stoppers before releasing it to everyone. Plus this gives lurker a chance to see what tweaks he may need to make to RSRD ahead of time.

[WhiskeyBravo]

Excellent news, looking forward with anticipation.

WB.

[AVGWarhawk]

Update:

First beta for the testers is uploading. We're following the usual course of ironing out any major bugs and show stoppers before releasing it to everyone. Plus this gives lurker a chance to see what tweaks he may need to make to RSRD ahead of time.

darn it, I missed the memo :damn:

[M. Sarsfield]

Yeah, I'm really looking forward to this. I prefer the modest visual enhancements in TM and RFB over the major environmental mods, since it's less of a burden on the machine.

[swdw]

Update:

First beta for the testers is uploading. We're following the usual course of ironing out any major bugs and show stoppers before releasing it to everyone. Plus this gives lurker a chance to see what tweaks he may need to make to RSRD ahead of time.
darn it, I missed the memo :damn:

That's because I was uploading it at 2 am!:D

[AlmightyTallest]

Edit: Found older post addressing my question, sorry about that.

P.S. whoever did the Periscopes for RFB 1.4 was spot on, the attack periscope I looked through on the USS Requin looked exactly like the one in RFB 1.4, even had the little black spots and flecks that became more numerous near the outside edges of the viewable area, just like in the sim. :up:

[M. Sarsfield]

Did you enjoy your Requin visit? That's nice that they are letting people up into the CT. Batfish lets people climb the ladder most of the way, but a domed cage prevents entry.

[AlmightyTallest]

Yes, it was a very enjoyable afternoon. She also had a Mk 23 torpedo in the forward torpedo room dated 1944. I and my friends spent almost two hours in the ship, studying radar sets and every guage we could find. After playing SH 4 with the mods like TMO and RFB I was able to easily identify many items at a glance and it was a very fun experience. I also liked seeing the depth guage that goes to 600ft :D She has a lot of the origional lighting in place, which was augmented by some modern lighting, so I could imagine it's a little more dim under combat conditions.

The periscopes on this ship also were set at different maximum heights. The attack scope was higher though I don't know how much higher, I'm guessing it's 5 feet like in the text I posted about previously.

But all in all, it was a very fun experience, I'm almost 7 feet tall and I was surprised that I could walk though most compartments while standing up straight. Still had to really watch my head though, and only banged it once while going into the aft torpedo room. The guys there tell me one of the men on ship while she was in service was 6'4, I can't imagine being two months on patrol and having to watch my head for that long lol. I would have to surface just to get out on deck once in awile to relax :rotfl:

I'm going to look around and see if I can visit more WW 2 submarines this summer. The Requin was great, but ideally I would have loved to see a fleet boat with all her origional deck guns, and that awsome Balao/Tench class conning tower. :D For those not familiar USS Requin was a radar picket and was converted a few times in her career, so not everything is exactly like it would have been in 1945. I also noted that the Science center staff room (I was tall enough to look over the wall) had some patches from the Batfish and other submarines decorating the office.

I think it's really great some of you guys in these forums volunteer to help with upkeep on these ships, it's important to preserve such things to help people remember the history and see the conditions men worked in. SH4 with the realism mods is also a great aid to help make the history come alive. Combine reading a good book about WW2 submarine exploits, playing this sim, and a visit to a real WW2 submarine and now I'm really psyched about playing RFB 1.5 :D

[M. Sarsfield]

If you want a WWII fleet boat, then visit the USS Cod. They brag that it's the closest thing to a restored WWII configuration out of all of the museum boats. They even have the Mk. IV TDC working.

[AlmightyTallest]

Thank you for that info Sarsfield, Cleveland Ohio is only a 3 hr drive for me, I'll definately have to check out the USS Cod!!

[AlmightyTallest]

Hey guys, the suspense is killing me, I can't wait anymore, I gotta know....

How's the beta going for RFB 1.5? Have there been any problems? Any chance the rest of us might be able to download RFB 1.5 this weekend? Please?.. Pretty Please?.... Pretty Please with sugar on top? :lol:

:D

[M. Sarsfield]

What AT said. I feel naked without a super mod running. I have RSRDC and PE2 to keep me company, but it's like driving a car with flat tires.

[AVGWarhawk]

The beta is being tested and some minor issues are being corrected. Found a few minor errors and ironing out the wrinkles. RFB is looking to roll out as complete as possible. As each correction/new item is being rolled in, the closer to release it gets. Plus, RSRD is working side by side in beta form with RFB so any issues that crop up can be addressed. RFB is looking to provide a good solid package of realism and game play. To do that, beta testing is needed. I suspect about a week at the estimated time, again, only estimated. I assure you, the package will be all you expect for realism and more.

[M. Sarsfield]

Thanks for the update, Chris... errr..oops. I revealed your secret identity.

Btw, have the Batfish guys gotten back to you about transporting the torpedoes from WA to OK? I can give Rick a nudge, if need be.

[AVGWarhawk]

Thanks for the update, Chris... errr..oops. I revealed your secret identity.

Btw, have the Batfish guys gotten back to you about transporting the torpedoes from WA to OK? I can give Rick a nudge, if need be.

Not as of yet. I believe some transporation cradles needed to be made.

[AlmightyTallest]

Thanks for the update Warhawk,

Dang, another weeks wait.... I'm sure it will be worth it though. :D

I guess I'll have to make do with going outside, seeing the giant sky orb and doing stuff this weekend... :lol:

[modisch]

The USS Torsk (SS-423), a Tench class sub, is a museum piece in Baltimore. I live in VA, but I take a lot of trips up to Baltimore for medical care at Johns Hopkins. Yesterday after an appt, my wife and I went down to the Inner Harbor for lunch. I really wanted to tour the Torsk, but I wasn't in shape for it. I hope that in the near future I can take the tour (and a ton of photos).

The Torsk has the distinction of sinking the last Japanese warships during WWII (two coastal defense frigates on the day before the cease fire was declared). It was later upgraded under the Fleet Snorkel program and again upgraded as a guidance boat for the Regulus missile system. For historical purposes, I'd rather tour a sub in WWII configuration... but I'm still excited about touring the Torsk.

The only other sub I've toured was the USS Growler (SSG-577), the Regulus launch boat now permanently on display in NYC as a part of the Intrepid museum.

Anyhow... fairly off topic but here are some links for the Torsk if anyone is planning their vacations in the area. :D Lotsa pictures in the links too.

Baltimore Maritine Museum (http://www.baltomaritimemuseum.org/museums_usstorsk.php)
Official Torsk site (http://usstorsk.org/)

Darn shame SH4 didn't come with the Tench class as an option...

-m

[M. Sarsfield]

Darn shame SH4 didn't come with the Tench class as an option...

Some of the big mods incorporate a Tench boat mod. Main difference being dive depth and extra torpedo storage, I believe.

[AVGWarhawk]

The USS Torsk (SS-423), a Tench class sub, is a museum piece in Baltimore. I live in VA, but I take a lot of trips up to Baltimore for medical care at Johns Hopkins. Yesterday after an appt, my wife and I went down to the Inner Harbor for lunch. I really wanted to tour the Torsk, but I wasn't in shape for it. I hope that in the near future I can take the tour (and a ton of photos).

The Torsk has the distinction of sinking the last Japanese warships during WWII (two coastal defense frigates on the day before the cease fire was declared). It was later upgraded under the Fleet Snorkel program and again upgraded as a guidance boat for the Regulus missile system. For historical purposes, I'd rather tour a sub in WWII configuration... but I'm still excited about touring the Torsk.

The only other sub I've toured was the USS Growler (SSG-577), the Regulus launch boat now permanently on display in NYC as a part of the Intrepid museum.

Anyhow... fairly off topic but here are some links for the Torsk if anyone is planning their vacations in the area. :D Lotsa pictures in the links too.

Baltimore Maritine Museum (http://www.baltomaritimemuseum.org/museums_usstorsk.php)
Official Torsk site (http://usstorsk.org/)

Darn shame SH4 didn't come with the Tench class as an option...

-m

I do not know much about the Torsk:D Just kidding. Come on up on a Saturday and i will walk you through the boat. If you can come before 10 am, you can have the boat to yourself. Visitors start boarding after 10 am. I can give you the grand tour. No problem at all. Let me know the day you choose and I will meet you there. I'm there just about every Saturday restoring one thing or another. I see you are having some medical things done, it you arrive before 10, you do not have to fight the tourist. Let me know.

[modisch]

I do not know much about the Torsk:D Just kidding. Come on up on a Saturday and i will walk you through the boat. If you can come before 10 am, you can have the boat to yourself. Visitors start boarding after 10 am. I can give you the grand tour. No problem at all. Let me know the day you choose and I will meet you there. I'm there just about every Saturday restoring one thing or another. I see you are having some medical things done, it you arrive before 10, you do not have to fight the tourist. Let me know.
Hahah. Open mouth, insert foot. :rotfl:

I would love to come up and do that. I don't know when that would be (I'm not usually in Baltimore on Saturday), but I will definitely talk to my wife about it. I know she also wants to go to the aquarium again. She won't go near the sub, claustrophobic. Me, I do great in tight places (helps when you spend so much time in an MRI machine).

I'll definitely PM you if I can put together firm plans. Thanks for the offer, I really appreciate that. Yet again, what a great community here.

Thanks,

-m

[AVGWarhawk]

I do not know much about the Torsk:D Just kidding. Come on up on a Saturday and i will walk you through the boat. If you can come before 10 am, you can have the boat to yourself. Visitors start boarding after 10 am. I can give you the grand tour. No problem at all. Let me know the day you choose and I will meet you there. I'm there just about every Saturday restoring one thing or another. I see you are having some medical things done, it you arrive before 10, you do not have to fight the tourist. Let me know.
Hahah. Open mouth, insert foot. :rotfl:

I would love to come up and do that. I don't know when that would be (I'm not usually in Baltimore on Saturday), but I will definitely talk to my wife about it. I know she also wants to go to the aquarium again. She won't go near the sub, claustrophobic. Me, I do great in tight places (helps when you spend so much time in an MRI machine).

I'll definitely PM you if I can put together firm plans. Thanks for the offer, I really appreciate that. Yet again, what a great community here.

Thanks,

-m

If you arrive say at 0900 on a Saturday, you can tour the boat and then hit the aquarium at 10 am when it opens. There are benchs your wife can sit while you go through the boat.

[M. Sarsfield]

There are benchs your wife can sit while you go through the boat.

Don't forget the mini-mall nearby with restaurants and shops. Women love to spend money. She'll forget all about your boat tour... (and your appointment, too). ;)

[modisch]

She'll probably spend the time in the Barnes and Noble. We were just in the Inner Harbor yesterday for lunch and it took me an hour to get her out of the book store.

If anyone has any recommendations for good places to eat, I'll definitely take those. A lot of the tourist trap restaurants are terrifyingly overpriced.

-m

[AVGWarhawk]

We go to Hooters for lunch...no kiddng! :D Nothing like some old Salts at Hooters for lunch. Hard Rocks food is awful. Cheesecake Factory is awesome.

[M. Sarsfield]

Agreed on all points. Hard Rock is expensive, low grade pub grub. Same with ESPN Zone.

[DeepIron]

Cheesecake Factory is awesome. Totally dude! :up:

[AVGWarhawk]

If you want to splurge a bit...Ruth Christs Steak House. :up:

Back to our regularly scheduled program of RFB.

[tedhealy]

Back to our regularly scheduled program of RFB.

So besides the changes to sonar availability, anything else changed or new and cool cooking in the RFB pot you care to reveal?

[AVGWarhawk]

Yes, you now have a ice cream maker. Enjoy the taste of ground metals and lube oil. It is very good! The rest I leave to Swdw and LukeFF. I'm just the beta tester and information gathering part of the mod.

[tedhealy]

Roger, already enjoying ice cream in the current version though :damn:

[tedhealy]

To the RFB crew, Clayton dug this up in the JANAC thread just now, I hope you guys incorporate into RFB

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=113585

I'm not sure how well it works, but if it works as described it should update the leaderboard with wartime claims of tonnage sunk, not after the war revisions. Plus it looks like instead of the totals getting added to the day a ship was sunk, it gets added sometime after to allow for the sub to return to port and report sinkings.

[Sardaukar67]

I really like RFB, played about 2 missions in stock campaign to familiarize myself with controls..which differ from my beloved SH III quite a bit. I never bother with missions ot tutorials...straight into fray...sink or swim ! :rotfl:

Anyhow, really liked RFB & RSRDC for 1.4, since I like realism, not necessarily harder gameplay. Since I just installed U-Boat Missions add-on, I'm really anxious to wait new version of RFB. Just downloaded RSRDC for 1.5 and ASW Air layer mods to entertain me while I wait for RFB for 1.5. Keep up the good work !

[AVGWarhawk]

Roger, already enjoying ice cream in the current version though :damn:

Mine makes cotton candy :o. Where is LukeFF?

[AVGWarhawk]

To the RFB crew, Clayton dug this up in the JANAC thread just now, I hope you guys incorporate into RFB

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=113585

I'm not sure how well it works, but if it works as described it should update the leaderboard with wartime claims of tonnage sunk, not after the war revisions. Plus it looks like instead of the totals getting added to the day a ship was sunk, it gets added sometime after to allow for the sub to return to port and report sinkings.
I will bring this to that attention of the RFB team. Looks interesting. Bear in mind, this is the next installment to get RFB up to par with 1.5. Modding will continue. The RFB team is really enjoying the study of the fleets and crew.

[M. Sarsfield]

The RFB team is really enjoying the study of the fleets and crew.

In what respect? Subrons? Crew compliment?

[AVGWarhawk]

The RFB team is really enjoying the study of the fleets and crew.
In what respect? Subrons? Crew compliment?
All of the above. For example, the original game only gives so many slots for crew for certain things. So this was corrected in so far as each compartment is manned with the correct number of crewmen. Same with the guns and cannon. Also, the game sets you up with just about every space filled with officers. This has been corrected as well. In other words, you and your crew will be earning their dolphins as you patrol. The expert crew you were once used to having from the start are now fresh from Groton CT submarine school. The study of when radar and what type was available. Same with torpedoes. Which ones gave the skipper hell and which ones worked. Things of this nature.

[M. Sarsfield]

Me likely! Bring it on! The only newbish qualities that I've seen with a new crew (stock) is that they often fail to call out radar and visual contacts. Once I had a DD pummel me in the Solomons because they failed to mention that a 35 knot destroyer was bearing down on us with guns blazing.

Currently I'm patrolling south of Japan in late '44 and my n00bs miss contacts all of the time. I'm practically glued to the radar set. So much for being captain.

[tedhealy]

The RFB team is really enjoying the study of the fleets and crew.
In what respect? Subrons? Crew compliment?
All of the above. For example, the original game only gives so many slots for crew for certain things. So this was corrected in so far as each compartment is manned with the correct number of crewmen. Same with the guns and cannon. Also, the game sets you up with just about every space filled with officers. This has been corrected as well. In other words, you and your crew will be earning their dolphins as you patrol. The expert crew you were once used to having from the start are now fresh from Groton CT submarine school. The study of when radar and what type was available. Same with torpedoes. Which ones gave the skipper hell and which ones worked. Things of this nature.

Sounds good. Though if you were starting a career later in the war you'd be getting some experienced transfers from other boats, would you not?

[AVGWarhawk]

At Ted,

Yes you would in RL. But, and LukeFF can correct me if I'm wrong, the game will
not allow that. After 1.5, the boat was stuffed with 8-9 officers and it would not allow anymore...even at the cost of renown. So, it looks like you are starting out with a new crew every time. This is not to say some correction was made here for that.

What LukeFF has done is man the rooms with what the real boat would have. Even at the start of your tour. It is not 8-9 officers and the rest are unrated new crewmen. You have your rated machinist, gunners mate, etc with experience. As it should be and was. You then develop the unrated guys. For example, the cannon was manned by 6 men(the original game gave you 3). LukeFF corrected this. You start with a gunners mate to lead the crew of 6. You have 6 slots now for men to man. Now, you can not load them up with more gunners mates, the game will not allow that. You fill them with new unrated crew and develop them. You will definitely notice proficiency gains by promoting and developing you cannon crew (and the rest of the crew). Reload times become faster as they grow in experience. Torpedoes load faster. Basically, you are starting a carreer in say 43 but your crew has rated superiors overlooking the unrated new crew. Again, the process starts again. As in RL, you received or kept experience crew no matter when you started your patrol but you also received new sub school graduates as well.

I hope I helped you understand how LukeFF went about it. The sub will be manned as if you were moving on to your next patrol with experienced men and new men as well no matter the year. I think you will be satisfied with what LukeFF has done. He has put a lot of time into crew configs for the best realism he can get from the game. Let me tell you, some situations you wish you had the super team of officers loading your torps!!!

[tedhealy]

Sounds good, thanks for the explanation. Looking forward to the release.

[M. Sarsfield]

So, will we see 6 men on deck at the deck gun station?

[swdw]

At Ted,

I hope I helped you understand how LukeFF went about it. The sub will be manned as if you were moving on to your next patrol with experienced men and new men as well no matter the year. I think you will be satisfied with what LukeFF has done. He has put a lot of time into crew configs for the best realism he can get from the game. Let me tell you, some situations you wish you had the super team of officers loading your torps!!!

He also did the same thing for the u-boats and the special abilities have been modified to make the benefits more realistic based on feedback form the ex-submariners on the team.

At M Sarsfield. After making some of the changes with the radar, it revealed a couple of problems in the game engine that took extra feedback to discover. Trying to find a workable solution for this.

As for 6 men being on deck- adding them and have them move correctly is the issue. THere are no animations programmed for the extra men. Some things that would be nice to do are limited by the game engine.

[swdw]

To the RFB crew, Clayton dug this up in the JANAC thread just now, I hope you guys incorporate into RFB

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=113585

I'm not sure how well it works, but if it works as described it should update the leaderboard with wartime claims of tonnage sunk, not after the war revisions. Plus it looks like instead of the totals getting added to the day a ship was sunk, it gets added sometime after to allow for the sub to return to port and report sinkings.

Just sent AntEater a permission to use request

[M. Sarsfield]

At M Sarsfield. After making some of the changes with the radar, it revealed a couple of problems in the game engine that took extra feedback to discover. Trying to find a workable solution for this.


What sort of problems have you discovered?

[AVGWarhawk]

At M Sarsfield. After making some of the changes with the radar, it revealed a couple of problems in the game engine that took extra feedback to discover. Trying to find a workable solution for this.


What sort of problems have you discovered?

It keeps shorting out from all the moisture just like the good'ol days.

[M. Sarsfield]

LOL!

[stary_wars47]

Maybe I'm just dumb, but I can't find the link on Filefront, all I can find is the latest beta for 1.5 which I don't have yet. Is it on there and I'm not finding it?

[AVGWarhawk]

Maybe I'm just dumb, but I can't find the link on Filefront, all I can find is the latest beta for 1.5 which I don't have yet. Is it on there and I'm not finding it?

Are you looking for RFB 1.4 or 1.5? 1.5 is not ready to go as yet, but, it has rounded the corner and headed for home on release. The mega upload link on the first post should have 1.4 version for you.

[swdw]

M Sarsfield. Contacts were showing up on the map w/o being reported. I think sometimes visual contact ocurred first too.


stary_wars47
May be one of those filefront hiccups. Re uploading now. Give megaupload a try.

[LukeFF]

As AVG explained, I have invested a ton of time into getting the crew configs set up properly for each boat. The crew setups you see for each boat in the game are very, very much in line in reality. As was stated by AVG, here are some other things you will be seeing:
Realistic crew configurations based on both the rate and job of the real-world sailors. Three crew rosters were used for this: for the S boats, USS S-44; for the older fleet boats (Porpoise, Salmon, Sargo), USS Swordfish; and for the Gato, Gar, Balao, and Tambor, USS Corvina.
Realistic crew limits for officers and petty officers. Stuffing the boat full of noncoms and officers is no longer an option.
The specialties for the officers have been adjusted to reflect their real-world jobs on the boats. What this means is your officers will have one of two specialties: Watch or Command. Of course, you can still put them in places where they wouldn't historically stand a watch (engine rooms or radar, for instance), but you will not be getting the most of out their skills.
The bridge watch officer is now the officer in charge of the boat. It is from his leadership skills that other crewmen in the boat will recieve a skill bonus.
Your damage control team now consists of crewmen that would not stand a watch in the compartments modeled in the game. These men are your cooks, stewards, and yeomen and can be spotted by them not having a speciality icon on their crew portrait. In this way, your damage control team has become a backup for your "real" damage control team, which is the crew in each compartment. This reflects a reality still present on submarines today: every person on a submarine has to know damage control. As such, you will get the most efficiency out of repairing damaged items by calling your crew to General Quarters and putting the "Damage Control Team" to work in the area they are needed the most.
Submarines now have 1 or 2 Pharmacist's Mates on board, which was made possible by the addition of crew skills with 1.5. It has been modded that only they can have the Medic skill, i.e., you aren't suddenly going to see a torpedoman suddenly gain the Medic skill in the middle of a patrol.
Crewmen on deck are now much, much, more vulnerable to damage from enemy fire. Crewman can and will be hit, and their efficiency will drop like a stone.Some other things I've been working on:
With Ducimus's help, I've adjusted the files so that the probability of receving a conning tower upgrade is much greater, yet still in line with reality.
Equipment upgrades now better reflect the reality for each type of submarine. S-18 boats will get SJ radar in late 1942 but not SD radar; S-42s will get both SJ and SD radar but will have to wait until June 1943 to get it. This is part of a new feature with the S boats whereby the equipment availability is based on when the boats finished their modernization program, which was a lengthy process.
Shell damage power has been adjusted for the 20 mm and 40 mm guns. They are still plenty powerful, but they (especially the 40 mm guns) are no longer the touch of death they were in the past.
Ammo type and quantity has been adjusted for every gun, based on real-world records.

[M. Sarsfield]

I don't know if you guys have seen this site before, but it talks about the firing rate and number of crewmen for the 5"/25 deck gun...

http://www.valoratsea.com/538.htm

[Sailor Steve]

Okay...

The guys who went to the best sources http://www.navweaps.com/Weapons/WNUS_5-25_mk10.htm show two miles less range and about a mile less elevation. The ROF is the same, but remember that is under ideal test condition. Actual rates of fire vary with platform and target speeds, weather conditions and wave height.

[swdw]

The key words in this are "capable of". That means under absolutely ideal conditions, with a dead rock stable platform. Numbers like this are misleading.

For example, the 5" inch guns on U.S. destroyers in WWII were capable of 25 rounds per minute:o

What that figure doesn't tell you is that was with a fire hose spraying the barrel to keep the temperature down at 18 shells/min or faster. These fire rates also do NOT include time for aiming and sighting.

Real life numbers were between 8 and 15. 8 when firing at a moving target, and 15 for shore bombardment. Keeping that in mind, the "real life" firing rate against an ocean going target was < 1/3 of what the gun was "capable of".

Beery's extensive research showed the fastest real life firing rate he could ever find was 3 rounds per minute. This was not the normal fring rate achieved by most sub deck gun crews.

Compare that number to the drop in firing rate for the destroyers in real life situations. If you use the same ratio for the sub deck gun as the destroyer guns, you get a firing rate of 3- 4 shells per minute. Yet the sub's real life firing rate would drop off more than the destroyer's did because the destroyer guns were aimed by a fire control system and the sub's deck guns were manually aimed.

Since the sub's roll could not be compensated for, they'd have to wait until the roll caused the crosshairs to cross the horizon and shoot. This required patience and timing. Since the deck guns in SH4 are rock solid, the reload rates for RFB are pretty realistic for allowing time for reload and aiming. In rougher seas, they are probably even too fast.

The deck gun can easily be destabilized in SH4, but not in a manner that gives you the ability to aim realistically. At least, no ones figured out how to do that yet. Tater tried, kv29 tried, and so did I. At best you wind up with a crap shoot on when to fire (this is the method "discovered" recently for SH3 that people got excited about, which btw, I tried and considered an unnacceptable alternative last November.)

Here's an analogy. For anyone that's ever fired a single shot bolt action rifle. How fast can you shoot at a stationary target with your rifle locked into position on a shooting bench so it can't move, and a bipod on the barrel? Basically your ROF would depend on how fast you could eject the shell and place a new one in the chamber. Now, how fast could you accurately shoot that same rifle hard mounted to a moving truck, on an uneven road, while shooting at a slowly moving target? This is similar what you are comparing with a deck gun between "capable of" and actual ROF.

So until the point where a realistic destabilization can be achieved, we'll go with the longer reload times.

[AVGWarhawk]

To further the discussion and this has been discussed for years(concerning the game), the cannon is a secondary weapon to the torpedo. Castrating the cannon with reload times keeps the cannon as a secondary defensive weapon, not the main battery. If the player is allowed to reload a shell every 10 seconds, the cannon will soon enough become the primary weapon for that player. At that point you have a Destroyer simulation game. That was not to be in the Pacific and not to be in the game. I very rarely use my cannon. It is just boring and ineffective against larger ships. For sinking sampan and defense, I'm all for it. Other than that, I have no use for the cannon.

[Fish40]

To further the discussion and this has been discussed for years(concerning the game), the cannon is a secondary weapon to the torpedo. Castrating the cannon with reload times keeps the cannon as a secondary defensive weapon, not the main battery. If the player is allowed to reload a shell every 10 seconds, the cannon will soon enough become the primary weapon for that player. At that point you have a Destroyer simulation game. That was not to be in the Pacific and not to be in the game. I very rarely use my cannon. It is just boring and ineffective against larger ships. For sinking sampan and defense, I'm all for it. Other than that, I have no use for the cannon.





Well said AVG!:up: You have hit the nail on the head:yep:

[M. Sarsfield]

Agreed on all points. I should have added more to my last post, because what I was focusing on was that they had 7 people listed for the gun operation and encouraged its use as an AA weapon. I can't see it being effective against aircraft at all. It moves and fires too slowly and I think it only elevates about 50 deg.

[AVGWarhawk]

I believe elevation is now taken into account with RFB.

[fireship4]

Just a couple of things about the latest version of RFB.

1. I just finished a patrol in my sugar boat and it is now loaded with Mk 14s - wikipedia tells me that they were incompatible with the S-boats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_14_torpedo)

2. During the dive my boat will hang around periscope depth for a few minutes before speeding up the dive to rated depth.

[M. Sarsfield]

2. During the dive my boat will hang around periscope depth for a few minutes before speeding up the dive to rated depth.

When EE 4.0 incorporated the surface draft mod, I noticed the same behaviour in the S-boat. It took forever to dive. I had to use the D key to get anywhere. "P" and clicking the dial were almost unresponsive.

[AVGWarhawk]

Just a couple of things about the latest version of RFB.

1. I just finished a patrol in my sugar boat and it is now loaded with Mk 14s - wikipedia tells me that they were incompatible with the S-boats (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mark_14_torpedo)

2. During the dive my boat will hang around periscope depth for a few minutes before speeding up the dive to rated depth.

Both corrected with the new release:up:

[AVGWarhawk]

2. During the dive my boat will hang around periscope depth for a few minutes before speeding up the dive to rated depth.
When EE 4.0 incorporated the surface draft mod, I noticed the same behaviour in the S-boat. It took forever to dive. I had to use the D key to get anywhere. "P" and clicking the dial were almost unresponsive.
Corrected with new release. :up: First thing I checked when I got behind the wheel of the S. She will go to periscope depth when asked.

In hindsight and something I have starting doing, I hit the D key for all the subs. Normally, the skipper would order the dive xx depth. Once under he would order the periscope depth or what depth he wanted. So, as I'm submerging via the D key, once under I make my order for periscope depth.

[M. Sarsfield]

I also started doing the same thing. Especially in the u-boats with all of those pesky planes in the air.

[fireship4]

Note I am using the "D" key to dive (i think it was posted on the forums that you should) and not the "P" key.

Thanks Warhawk, will there be 1.4 and 1.5 versions or just 1.5?

[d5j55]

awsome

[AVGWarhawk]

Note I am using the "D" key to dive (i think it was posted on the forums that you should) and not the "P" key.

Thanks Warhawk, will there be 1.4 and 1.5 versions or just 1.5?


This version will be for the 1.5 add on. It has been determined that having to work on both is getting to be much work and more time then the team can afford to offer. Often they have to stop and eat. Although I'm not to sure about LukeFF. I don't think he sleeps:hmm: I have never seen anyone whip out a mod or patch as fast as he does.

[kylesplanet]

As AVG explained, I have invested a ton of time into getting the crew configs set up properly for each boat. The crew setups you see for each boat in the game are very, very much in line in reality. As was stated by AVG, here are some other things you will be seeing:
Realistic crew configurations based on both the rate and job of the real-world sailors. Three crew rosters were used for this: for the S boats, USS S-44; for the older fleet boats (Porpoise, Salmon, Sargo), USS Swordfish; and for the Gato, Gar, Balao, and Tambor, USS Corvina.
Realistic crew limits for officers and petty officers. Stuffing the boat full of noncoms and officers is no longer an option.
The specialties for the officers have been adjusted to reflect their real-world jobs on the boats. What this means is your officers will have one of two specialties: Watch or Command. Of course, you can still put them in places where they wouldn't historically stand a watch (engine rooms or radar, for instance), but you will not be getting the most of out their skills.
The bridge watch officer is now the officer in charge of the boat. It is from his leadership skills that other crewmen in the boat will recieve a skill bonus.
Your damage control team now consists of crewmen that would not stand a watch in the compartments modeled in the game. These men are your cooks, stewards, and yeomen and can be spotted by them not having a speciality icon on their crew portrait. In this way, your damage control team has become a backup for your "real" damage control team, which is the crew in each compartment. This reflects a reality still present on submarines today: every person on a submarine has to know damage control. As such, you will get the most efficiency out of repairing damaged items by calling your crew to General Quarters and putting the "Damage Control Team" to work in the area they are needed the most.
Submarines now have 1 or 2 Pharmacist's Mates on board, which was made possible by the addition of crew skills with 1.5. It has been modded that only they can have the Medic skill, i.e., you aren't suddenly going to see a torpedoman suddenly gain the Medic skill in the middle of a patrol.
Crewmen on deck are now much, much, more vulnerable to damage from enemy fire. Crewman can and will be hit, and their efficiency will drop like a stone.Some other things I've been working on:
With Ducimus's help, I've adjusted the files so that the probability of receving a conning tower upgrade is much greater, yet still in line with reality.
Equipment upgrades now better reflect the reality for each type of submarine. S-18 boats will get SJ radar in late 1942 but not SD radar; S-42s will get both SJ and SD radar but will have to wait until June 1943 to get it. This is part of a new feature with the S boats whereby the equipment availability is based on when the boats finished their modernization program, which was a lengthy process.
Shell damage power has been adjusted for the 20 mm and 40 mm guns. They are still plenty powerful, but they (especially the 40 mm guns) are no longer the touch of death they were in the past.
Ammo type and quantity has been adjusted for every gun, based on real-world records.

I think out of all the things I'm looking forward to this is the most anticipated. The configurations intrigue me the most. It adds so much to the immersion and knowing who is where really keeps me interested and focused on what I'm doing.

I love to personalize the crew with names of friends and family. RFB is gonna just keep getting better!:sunny:

[AVGWarhawk]

@kylesplanet,

LukeFF has done some really cool things. I think you will enjoy it. I'm very happy with his crew configs and everyone getting promoted to Rear Admiral while on patrol is a thing of the past. Like I posted a few back, earning your dolphins is now a reality. Working your crew to make them better is now a reality. It is things like this that make it a bit more challenging. I have been out on several patrols with my crew and unlike stock were 15 guys are promoted to Commander does not happen. You might get one shining star and the other gain some experience gradually making the sub very efficient.

I have a pretty good Pharmacist Mate! Thank God because the bullets now hurt!!!!

[LukeFF]

Often they have to stop and eat. Although I'm not to sure about LukeFF. I don't think he sleeps:hmm: I have never seen anyone whip out a mod or patch as fast as he does.

Sleep is overrated. :zzz: :D

[WhiskeyBravo]

...and eatin's cheatin' so stop wasting time on posting here and get back to work!

Damn it you guys take the biscuit. You work all hours knocking out mods and then expect us to let you have breaks for eating or sleeping? Get real.


:D

WB.

[AVGWarhawk]

Often they have to stop and eat. Although I'm not to sure about LukeFF. I don't think he sleeps:hmm: I have never seen anyone whip out a mod or patch as fast as he does.
Sleep is overrated. :zzz: :D

Not in my house:D It is rated #1! Wake me up when the release comes :rotfl:

[tedhealy]

How's the beta going? Any estimates on ETA for 1.5?

[swdw]

Going good. But we caught a couple of wrinkles that we need to check out.

[M. Sarsfield]

Okay. We'll nag you next Wednesday for another update. :up:

[swdw]

Here's an example of what takes a while. Luke and I had conflicting thoughts on how the angles for calculating dud chances were used by the game engine. We needed to be sure how it's used in game, so this needed to be tested in order to come up with an accurate torpedo file.

Since I had a 16 hour day yesterday, I get today off. So I did the torpedo testing and . . . drum roll please . . . . . . . .

HOLY COW!!!!! did the devs ever come up with a slick torpedo system.

Testing procedure-
Custom mission with no wind, dead calm sea.

3 large tankers docked in a line so they couldn't move

Torpedoes set to allow for a 1 degree turn (after missing several head on shots with 0 degree turn:doh:)

Event camera turned on to watch impact.

Modified Mk10 torpedo file (quickest to change) and S-boat

During the test the dud chance of 100 was moved from one set of angles to another and the result tracked. Final test was with 100 percent chance at 0 to 30 and 60 to 90 to check a couple of things.

Shots were taken with boat at a complete stop. Targeting not used for side shots. Maneuvered the boat to the desired angle for impact and fired straight shots .

Ok first findings.
1. The angle listed for a chance of a dud is how many degrees from the perpendicular the torpedo strikes a surface.

2. second finding- Here is the slick part of it. This angle is a complex angle including any angle on the x, y, or z axis which takes into account the 3D geometry of the hull and any associated list in the target!

I got what appeared to be conflicting results at first. Had a dud chance of 100 at 0 to 30 degrees and 0 at 30 to 90. The torpedoes were duds fired at the side of the hull with a depth of 6 ft. I moved to the stern for an "up the skirt" shot, and had 100% detonation and went HUH???

So a light bulb went on and I thought -wait a minute- the hull slopes at the stern.

Reloaded the test, and started walking the torpedoes down the side of the hull using the same dud angle and percentages. As soon as I got to the significantly curved part of the hull, the torpedoes started going off. Walked them up the hull (after reloading- s-boats don't carry a lot of fish) and until the tanker started to list significantly, had detonations at the curve and duds when hitting the hull where the surface was vertical. If the ship develops a significant list to give a big enough change in angle, you get detonations again.

3. Couldn't verify, but there may be a conflict if the 0 to x and x to 90 angles have the exact same dud chance. Results were inconsistent. But when i varied the chance by 0.1 percent (ex. 99.9 and 100), no longer saw any weird results.

4. Earlier test showed engine seems to have a hiccup and read a percent chance of 1, written as a whole number, to be 100 percent- but not all the time. Would recommend using 0.99 or 1.01 instead of 1 on any percentage values used in any file

So there you go. Now we know how the devs use angle entries for dud chances, and the possible gotchas. Based on this, I think any pitching and rolling the target does will also affect the impact angle.

What we're trying to do when we need to know how the game uses settings, is to determine it by experimentation rather than "guessing" at it. It's the only way to be certain we're giving RFB a chance to live up to the "real" in it.;)

(BTW, over 6 hours of testing in these tests- see why things can be delayed when we hit a "wrinkle")

[M. Sarsfield]

That is pretty cool. Glad to see some complex math and geometry is at work in the game, rather than the computer rolling the random generator dice.

[swdw]

Testers- patch for 1.5 beta posted! Filefront and ftp site

For everyone else. Ome of the reasons we are taking our time, is this is the foundation and framework for additional changes in the future. Like any house, you need a solid foundation and framing before building the rest of the house

[M. Sarsfield]

Alright, testers. Time for all of you to call in sick and play the hell out of this thing. Remember to hold your nose when you call in to work to sound congested. Sticking your finger down your throat will help, too. Or take a cue from Ferris Bueller and have it all recorded ahead of time. :up:

[fireship4]

Yes the 3D geometry being taken into account is cool - may have had something to do with what happened to me last night...

I was testing different depths of torpedo against a destroyer and was watching the torpedos hit the side with the camera. One was coming in really low and hit the "bilge keel" (I think thats what the ribs on the outside of the hull are, facing down and sideways) high up on the torpedo head. Instead of blowing it banged off and went to the bottom!

[tater]

Will reducing the effectiveness of AA guns have a negative effect on surface combat?

I do not mean the sub's effectiveness vs other units, but the converse. I tried for quite a while to make the deck watch vulnerable, but never managed it without making the sub tissue paper. In reality, however, having your decks swept with even rifle caliber MG fire should be brutal.

tater

[M. Sarsfield]

Richochets would be nice. If a torpedo can glance off a hull, why not bullets? Anything that doesn't punch through the superstructures would bounce off or even inside the bridge area. This would cut a bridge crew down very quickly.

[Mav87th]

Dear RFB team..

Would you be so very kind to consider to include the new SUPER GREAT sliderule mod in RFB 1.5 ?

It's one of the best mods that has come up in some time (not deminishing others) and add's greatly to the realism.

[tater]

The problem with the bridge crew would not be fixed by that. They are considered INSIDE their hull section. That section (regardless of angle it's attacked from) must be penetrated to hurt them.

The problem is that it is a section of the boat like any other, and all the guys INSIDE the boat in that area get hit, too. So, if you make them vulnerable to small arms and even 20mm, the boat will be sunk by the first DC that goes off nearby. Also, the guys below get killed, too.

tater

[M. Sarsfield]

Interesting how they devs built the bridge to resemble a compartment like that.

[caspofungin]

is rfb 1.5 going to include the multiple ship fix someone (can't recall) was working on? fixing acceleration and turn rates etc.

[AVGWarhawk]

That was what Swdw was working on for RFB. This has not been addressed as yet but on the burner if I'm not mistaken. This is the new addition of RFB that is compatable with 1.5. There will be more to come. Rest assured there is a laundry list of things to add in the next installment.

[LukeFF]

Will reducing the effectiveness of AA guns have a negative effect on surface combat?

I do not mean the sub's effectiveness vs other units, but the converse. I tried for quite a while to make the deck watch vulnerable, but never managed it without making the sub tissue paper. In reality, however, having your decks swept with even rifle caliber MG fire should be brutal.

So far the tests haven't exposed any glaring issues. Every sub has been given 300 hit points, and the power of the 20 mm shells has been correspondingly adjusted. While one burst of 20 mm fire will not sink the sub, multiple salvoes will eat away your hull integrity very quickly.

[AVGWarhawk]

Will reducing the effectiveness of AA guns have a negative effect on surface combat?

I do not mean the sub's effectiveness vs other units, but the converse. I tried for quite a while to make the deck watch vulnerable, but never managed it without making the sub tissue paper. In reality, however, having your decks swept with even rifle caliber MG fire should be brutal.
So far the tests haven't exposed any glaring issues. Every sub has been given 300 hit points, and the power of the 20 mm shells has been correspondingly adjusted. While one burst of 20 mm fire will not sink the sub, multiple salvoes will eat away your hull integrity very quickly.


Luke is right here....I have used the mod. You will experience hull damage if they get a good bead on you and let the 20 mm rip! It brings a whole new perspective of cruising around on the surface like battleship. Don't do it:know:

[swdw]

Tater, you can give it a try, go to the RFB filefront site and download the beta and patch from the beta folder
http://hosted.filefront.com/RealFleetBoat

Then download the DD gun test under the WIP files folder. You can get shelled one go around, then reload the mission, dive and take a DC'ing for comparison too.

(as I promised you a while back, we don't keep development "secrets", we just wait until everything is put together and the bugs worked out before making an "official" public release. The separate forum we have is to keep from cluttering up this thread. Anyone can drop in and read what's going on or being "kicked around").

Or, I can send you the login info for the team's ftp site used to exchange files we're working on. That has to be private to keep from over running my monthly bandwidth, but beta's and beta patches are mirrored on the filefront site.

BTW, with Luke's adjustments, if you get rammed by a DD, you take major damage!

[RFB Team]

New patch 041908 for the beta posted on the ftp site and at filefront

Be sure to check out the description at the dev forum

[RFB Team]

Dear RFB team..

Would you be so very kind to consider to include the new SUPER GREAT sliderule mod in RFB 1.5 ?

It's one of the best mods that has come up in some time (not deminishing others) and add's greatly to the realism.

Watch for this to be an option after the 1.5 release.:)

[John W. Hamm]

@kylesplanet,

LukeFF has done some really cool things. I think you will enjoy it. I'm very happy with his crew configs and everyone getting promoted to Rear Admiral while on patrol is a thing of the past. Like I posted a few back, earning your dolphins is now a reality. Working your crew to make them better is now a reality. It is things like this that make it a bit more challenging. I have been out on several patrols with my crew and unlike stock were 15 guys are promoted to Commander does not happen. You might get one shining star and the other gain some experience gradually making the sub very efficient.

I have a pretty good Pharmacist Mate! Thank God because the bullets now hurt!!!!

I have done a bit of work with the crew ranks here and there, and i have have played a patrol or two, but never lived long enough to see a guy promoted to Commander let alone R. Adm, Now i have edited the game to make such things happen, and with the stock version if you make them anything higher than a Lt they get an Icon of a sailor and no shoulder board on the Crew management screen, so my question is... when they make these high ranks that you have seen, how do their icons appear and what shoulder boards are used in the crew management slot? (as I believe in the stock version they only go up to Lt.) This answer will greatly further my work on uniforms and characters thank you in advance.

[fireship4]

You guys should have a look at what Ducimus is doing with adding more crew to the sub. It's on the board as "Just when you thought the CT was crowded..." or something similar. Would be a great addition when its finished (he's nearly done with the Gato iirc).

[M. Sarsfield]

Since you are the skipper, you are the LCDR. You'll only have LT's and lower as part of your crew.

[AVGWarhawk]

You guys should have a look at what Ducimus is doing with adding more crew to the sub. It's on the board as "Just when you thought the CT was crowded..." or something similar. Would be a great addition when its finished (he's nearly done with the Gato iirc).

Not to worry friend:D. RFB looks at all requests and suggestions. Some members have dug up some good things to integrate into RFB.

[AVR4000]

I have a strange problem with RFB. The save files is abnormal. I start a patrol december 1, 1941 and when I save the game after sailing from Pearl Harbor, I get a file 81 MB big. I tried before to save in an enemy port and got a file 416 MB big.

I run the RFB on SH IV 1.4 and I have NSM and PE2 installed. If I switches to TMO the save files is normal (about 1-2 MB). I really like RFB so a solution would be nice.

[John W. Hamm]

I have been playing around with the Beta for a few hours now, and i noticed that when I am on the surface and I go to Battle stations all of my officers go on the deck, I'm not an expert at sub warfare by any means but if you are gettting attacked while on the surface, there is a good chance you would kiss you whole command staff good bye, I also noticed that that if I dive while at battle stations one of my junior officers is in the command room with me, (this I like) however when I surface (like i said all officers are on deck) and I have no one standing behind the desk in the center (my chief goes somewhere not sure where though) (though the chief is there under normal conditions

So I have 2 questions

one: where are these points edited at,
two: is it possible to maybe have all but the Sr deck officer down below, and when dived have the sr officer on the command room instead of no one.

Thank you in advance,
John H.

[John W. Hamm]

@kylesplanet,

LukeFF has done some really cool things. I think you will enjoy it. I'm very happy with his crew configs and everyone getting promoted to Rear Admiral while on patrol is a thing of the past. Like I posted a few back, earning your dolphins is now a reality. Working your crew to make them better is now a reality. It is things like this that make it a bit more challenging. I have been out on several patrols with my crew and unlike stock were 15 guys are promoted to Commander does not happen. You might get one shining star and the other gain some experience gradually making the sub very efficient.

I have a pretty good Pharmacist Mate! Thank God because the bullets now hurt!!!!

I have done a bit of work with the crew ranks here and there, and i have have played a patrol or two, but never lived long enough to see a guy promoted to Commander let alone R. Adm, Now i have edited the game to make such things happen, and with the stock version if you make them anything higher than a Lt they get an Icon of a sailor and no shoulder board on the Crew management screen, so my question is... when they make these high ranks that you have seen, how do their icons appear and what shoulder boards are used in the crew management slot? (as I believe in the stock version they only go up to Lt.) This answer will greatly further my work on uniforms and characters thank you in advance.

this question is for AVG

[M. Sarsfield]

John,

Sometimes the dive officer was a CPO. I recommend having most of the officers in the CT at battlestations with one jr. officer or CPO watching the dive station while submerged. On the surface, you'd probably have one or two officers on the bridge, one in the CT, and one or two in the con. At surfaced battlestations, the CT would still be pretty cramped like submerged battlestations, minus the CO and one of his juniors being on the bridge.

Chapter 20 of the Fleet Boat manual should cover the various scenarios, if anyone is interested...

http://www.maritime.org/fleetsub/chap20.htm

[AVGWarhawk]

@kylesplanet,

LukeFF has done some really cool things. I think you will enjoy it. I'm very happy with his crew configs and everyone getting promoted to Rear Admiral while on patrol is a thing of the past. Like I posted a few back, earning your dolphins is now a reality. Working your crew to make them better is now a reality. It is things like this that make it a bit more challenging. I have been out on several patrols with my crew and unlike stock were 15 guys are promoted to Commander does not happen. You might get one shining star and the other gain some experience gradually making the sub very efficient.

I have a pretty good Pharmacist Mate! Thank God because the bullets now hurt!!!!
I have done a bit of work with the crew ranks here and there, and i have have played a patrol or two, but never lived long enough to see a guy promoted to Commander let alone R. Adm, Now i have edited the game to make such things happen, and with the stock version if you make them anything higher than a Lt they get an Icon of a sailor and no shoulder board on the Crew management screen, so my question is... when they make these high ranks that you have seen, how do their icons appear and what shoulder boards are used in the crew management slot? (as I believe in the stock version they only go up to Lt.) This answer will greatly further my work on uniforms and characters thank you in advance.
this question is for AVG

This question is best left to LukeFF. Further, Luke has studied this quite a bit so to create the proper ranks. I think LukeFF will advise what shoulder board to be on the crew.

[LukeFF]

I have done a bit of work with the crew ranks here and there, and i have have played a patrol or two, but never lived long enough to see a guy promoted to Commander let alone R. Adm, Now i have edited the game to make such things happen, and with the stock version if you make them anything higher than a Lt they get an Icon of a sailor and no shoulder board on the Crew management screen, so my question is... when they make these high ranks that you have seen, how do their icons appear and what shoulder boards are used in the crew management slot? (as I believe in the stock version they only go up to Lt.) This answer will greatly further my work on uniforms and characters thank you in advance.
John,

I have RFB set up so the highest rank a crewman can achieve is Lieutenant. Given the problem you encountered (which I also ran into) and the fact that the overwhelming majority of real-world crew rosters "stopped" at Lieutenant (below the CO), I left the promotion system like it currently is. The only modifications I've done to the rank structure for RFB is to eliminate the Senior Chief and Master Chief ranks and to prevent CPOs from being promoted to Ensign.

[LukeFF]

I have been playing around with the Beta for a few hours now, and i noticed that when I am on the surface and I go to Battle stations all of my officers go on the deck, I'm not an expert at sub warfare by any means but if you are gettting attacked while on the surface, there is a good chance you would kiss you whole command staff good bye, I also noticed that that if I dive while at battle stations one of my junior officers is in the command room with me, (this I like) however when I surface (like i said all officers are on deck) and I have no one standing behind the desk in the center (my chief goes somewhere not sure where though) (though the chief is there under normal conditions

So I have 2 questions

one: where are these points edited at,
two: is it possible to maybe have all but the Sr deck officer down below, and when dived have the sr officer on the command room instead of no one.
For the fleet boats, the battle station assignments for officers are as follows (for the 3D slots):
Bridge: two officers
TDC: one officer
Control Room: one officer at the diving station, one at the navigator's desk.A CPO is always as the trim manifold.

In answer to your questions, you can edit the location of any crewman in the UPC files located in /Data/Submarine (for the below-decks positions) and /Data/UPCData (and UPCDataGE)/UPCUnits Data for the bridge positions. They are very powerful files, and a lot can be done with them. The UPC files for RFB are heavily modified from stock, because they also cover more than just the crew setups. They also cover things like Upgrade Pack schedules, crew and equipment exposure, fatigue rates, etc.

[John W. Hamm]

I have been playing around with the Beta for a few hours now, and i noticed that when I am on the surface and I go to Battle stations all of my officers go on the deck, I'm not an expert at sub warfare by any means but if you are gettting attacked while on the surface, there is a good chance you would kiss you whole command staff good bye, I also noticed that that if I dive while at battle stations one of my junior officers is in the command room with me, (this I like) however when I surface (like i said all officers are on deck) and I have no one standing behind the desk in the center (my chief goes somewhere not sure where though) (though the chief is there under normal conditions

So I have 2 questions

one: where are these points edited at,
two: is it possible to maybe have all but the Sr deck officer down below, and when dived have the sr officer on the command room instead of no one.
For the fleet boats, the battle station assignments for officers are as follows (for the 3D slots):

Bridge: two officers
TDC: one officer
Control Room: one officer at the diving station, one at the navigator's desk.A CPO is always as the trim manifold.

In answer to your questions, you can edit the location of any crewman in the UPC files located in /Data/Submarine (for the below-decks positions) and /Data/UPCData (and UPCDataGE)/UPCUnits Data for the bridge positions. They are very powerful files, and a lot can be done with them. The UPC files for RFB are heavily modified from stock, because they also cover more than just the crew setups. They also cover things like Upgrade Pack schedules, crew and equipment exposure, fatigue rates, etc.

LukeFF your Mods and your effort is as always Stellar!!, thank you for your prompt and precise response, :up:

I look forward to the finished RFB MOD!!

[John W. Hamm]

I have done a bit of work with the crew ranks here and there, and i have have played a patrol or two, but never lived long enough to see a guy promoted to Commander let alone R. Adm, Now i have edited the game to make such things happen, and with the stock version if you make them anything higher than a Lt they get an Icon of a sailor and no shoulder board on the Crew management screen, so my question is... when they make these high ranks that you have seen, how do their icons appear and what shoulder boards are used in the crew management slot? (as I believe in the stock version they only go up to Lt.) This answer will greatly further my work on uniforms and characters thank you in advance.
John,

I have RFB set up so the highest rank a crewman can achieve is Lieutenant. Given the problem you encountered (which I also ran into) and the fact that the overwhelming majority of real-world crew rosters "stopped" at Lieutenant (below the CO), I left the promotion system like it currently is. The only modifications I've done to the rank structure for RFB is to eliminate the Senior Chief and Master Chief ranks and to prevent CPOs from being promoted to Ensign.

I Had seen a post of yours outlineing the warrant officer addition and thought that it was a very good idea, and incorporated the idea into my newest version of my Uniform Mod, Originially I had dealt with the CPO issue by eliminating the 2 ranks and adding Ltcdr and Cdr, but that caused other issues, (mainly when replacing crew) SO after seeing your WO idea that helped a great deal, so thanks !! for the idea:)

And BTW I can't thank you guys enough for all the hard work you are doing on this Mod it Rocks:rock:

John H.

[swdw]

And BTW I can't thank you guys enough for all the hard work you are doing on this Mod it Rocks:rock:

John H.

If you wanna jump in on the dev forum, it's at http://forum.kickinbak.com

Registering requires admin authorization to keep spammers from posting.

Suggestions, tips, questions, criticisms always welcome.

Also, on the rank issue, there were actually some boats that left port with a LT as the skipper. Often they were promoted to LtCdr sometime during the first patrol.

Don't think that ever happened again after WWII. Nowadays most skippers are either a Cdr or Capt.

[RFB Team]

Coming with the next release of RFB will be a re-work of all the ship flags. These flags sport a more realistic-looking fabric texture and fix errors in the old National Flags mod with the flags of Brazil, New Zealand, and India:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/LukeFF/SH4/SH4Img2008-04-27_153937_250.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/LukeFF/SH4/SH4Img2008-04-27_154011_203.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/LukeFF/SH4/SH4Img2008-04-27_154037_156.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/LukeFF/SH4/SH4Img2008-04-27_154104_250.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v258/LukeFF/SH4/SH4Img2008-04-27_160115_734.jpg

In a future release we will be adding flags from nations not in stock SH4 to support the campaign mods of lurker_hlb3.

[M. Sarsfield]

Nice. How is the beta testing going?

[ustahl]

Will the new ship flags, pretty as they look, remain as abnormally huge as before or will they be reduced somewhat to a more realistic looking smaller size (for my taste at least)?:o
That would also increase the challenge of identification a little.;)

[LukeFF]

Will the new ship flags, pretty as they look, remain as abnormally huge as before or will they be reduced somewhat to a more realistic looking smaller size (for my taste at least)?:o
That would also increase the challenge of identification a little.;)

I'm still trying to figure out how to reduce the size of the flags, so for now they will remain in their abnormally huge state. ;) (which I agree they are too large in many cases).

[ustahl]

Just read in the Ubi German modding forum abt the upcoming SH4 mod pack by the AOTD team, called "Fall of the rising sun". In that thread AOTD_MadMaxU48 (who occasionally also participates here at Subsim) states that one of many features are reduced size ship flags in place of what he calls huge bed sheets. That means that MadMax or somebody in their team has solved that flag size problem. How about you talking to each other?:yep:
On the other hand, maybe they want to keep that knowledge for themselves.:shifty:

[LukeFF]

Just read in the Ubi German modding forum abt the upcoming SH4 mod pack by the AOTD team, called "Fall of the rising sun". In that thread AOTD_MadMaxU48 (who occasionally also participates here at Subsim) states that one of many features are reduced size ship flags in place of what he calls huge bed sheets. That means that MadMax or somebody in their team has solved that flag size problem. How about you talking to each other?:yep:

I'm not overly inclined to ask him for help after the way he openly insulted and accused the devs of plagarism right here on this very forum.

[dc1962]

Any idea when you anticipate RFB for 1.5 will be out? Also, will it be compatible with Operation Monsun?

Thanks for all your work!

[RFB Team]

Any idea when you anticipate RFB for 1.5 will be out? Also, will it be compatible with Operation Monsun?

Thanks for all your work!

We're still testing everything out to make sure everything's working together properly. Best estimate I can give right now is we're about 1-2 weeks away from an official release.

And yes, Operation Monsun will be compatible with the mod.

[Hitman]

I'm still trying to figure out how to reduce the size of the flags, so for now they will remain in their abnormally huge state. ;) (which I agree they are too large in many cases).

Luke,

would it be possible to make the flag smaller inside its graphic and then turn the surronding empty area transparent? May be with an Alpha Channel? :hmm:

[Nisgeis]

In my experience, the game doesn't read alpha for textures and interprets transparency as black.

[LukeFF]

Nisgeis is right. I tried creating swallowtail flags for nations like Sweden by creating a an alpha channel in the appropriate area, but the game didn't like it.

[Char]

Great Mod I love it two Thumbs WAY UP!:up: :up:

[DrJonez]

I just recently installed Real Fleet Boat for the first time, and I'm liking it a lot. I have a few questions though, and I'm really hoping someone can help me.

1. Is there a file I can edit somewhere or something to turn the map updates back on? I find it really difficult to visualize what's going on without the icons, and while I appreciate the other realism in the mod I'd really like this back if possible.

2. I started a historical campaign, and I'm in an S-18 I think in the Asiatic fleet. Everything seems to work ok except for the depth control. Ordering the crew to go to periscope depth, or setting a depth by clicking on the gauge doesn't seem to do anything. The only way to get the ship to submerge is to press D for dive, and then A to level out when I get to where I want. If I'm submerged and I order a new depth or hit P, the ship will suddenly surface very quickly. What am I doing wrong? Is this a known bug?

3. When I'm using time compression, I notice that sometimes the game won't drop to 1x when I spot a ship. So there are ships that I fly past at 4096x compression, and have no idea what it was or who it belonged to because the game didn't drop back to 1x. What's the deal?

I'm running SH4 1.4, and the newest RFB for 1.4. I'm not sure what's going on, but these things are really ruining my enjoyment of the mod :(

Please help! :dead:

[Wilcke]

I just recently installed Real Fleet Boat for the first time, and I'm liking it a lot. I have a few questions though, and I'm really hoping someone can help me.

1. Is there a file I can edit somewhere or something to turn the map updates back on? I find it really difficult to visualize what's going on without the icons, and while I appreciate the other realism in the mod I'd really like this back if possible.

2. I started a historical campaign, and I'm in an S-18 I think in the Asiatic fleet. Everything seems to work ok except for the depth control. Ordering the crew to go to periscope depth, or setting a depth by clicking on the gauge doesn't seem to do anything. The only way to get the ship to submerge is to press D for dive, and then A to level out when I get to where I want. If I'm submerged and I order a new depth or hit P, the ship will suddenly surface very quickly. What am I doing wrong? Is this a known bug?

3. When I'm using time compression, I notice that sometimes the game won't drop to 1x when I spot a ship. So there are ships that I fly past at 4096x compression, and have no idea what it was or who it belonged to because the game didn't drop back to 1x. What's the deal?

I'm running SH4 1.4, and the newest RFB for 1.4. I'm not sure what's going on, but these things are really ruining my enjoyment of the mod :(

Please help! :dead:

I just Beta test, so I can answer only few questions.

The TC thing. When on high TC, how do you know you flew by a ship if it does not drop down? I am confused. Generally, when I go out on patrol I will use high TC to get close to the patrol area. I then use no more than 512 where I am expecting to run into shipping. A lot can happen at high TC.

If you are running the newest RFB that could be the BETA Release Candidate for SH4 1.5 which will probably not work with a 1.4 install. You need to run RFB 1.4 with SH4 1.4.

Dive sequence, you are correct, "D" key to start the dive, when below the periscope depth you can press the "P" key. Or continue the dive to rated test depth. If you are noticing "funny" behaviour then it could be that you have the BETA of RFB running with SH4 1.4.

Anyhow hope this helps, if not then post more questions, the folks on the RFB Team will be most happy to assist you.

You can post in their forum also, see below my sig for the link.

Happy hunting!

[DrJonez]

I can tell that there are ships because I'll hear "Ship spotted!" and see the icon appear and quickly disappear on the map. It only seems to happen with non hostile ships though, so maybe it's not a big deal.

And I did some further testing. The S-18 is the only sub that has the goofy behavior. Dive and maintain depth are the only diving commands that work. Ordering periscope depth from any depth immediately causes the ship to surface, almost at emergency speeds. It makes the sub pretty much unplayable, since maintain depth seems to only work half the time :(

The name of my RFB folder is RFB_v1-4_031408, so which version is that? Is that the one I want to use with 1.4?

[AVGWarhawk]

I can tell that there are ships because I'll hear "Ship spotted!" and see the icon appear and quickly disappear on the map. It only seems to happen with non hostile ships though, so maybe it's not a big deal.


If you uncheck ship updates on the map, you will not see the squares but you will have line show up around your sub that will tell you were the vessel is. Zoom in on your sub while in the map window.


And I did some further testing. The S-18 is the only sub that has the goofy behavior. Dive and maintain depth are the only diving commands that work. Ordering periscope depth from any depth immediately causes the ship to surface, almost at emergency speeds. It makes the sub pretty much unplayable, since maintain depth seems to only work half the time :(

The name of my RFB folder is RFB_v1-4_031408, so which version is that? Is that the one I want to use with 1.4?


That was the old beta mod for the S class. I highly recommend you get the add on for patch 1.5 because RFB is working the mod to be compatible with the add on. Thus far the beta for RFB 1.5 has fixed the S boat issue.