SHIV Water!

[Klt_KUrtz]

Has anybody taken a look at SHIV's water?
Maybe we can mod it to use in SHIII?
We are submariners and I like to have good water to look at and it is an important part of the game.
Maybe we can call it... "Bug free water"...or "Works in game water"... or "You do not need a 116M patch to make it work water mod?
Thanks if you can help,:up:
KUrtz.

[Hartmann]

It could be very difficult take all the pacific water to the atlantic sea,
I think is better put the u-boat in the pacific water. :rotfl:

[kys2000]

Has anybody taken a look at SHIV's water?
Maybe we can mod it to use in SHIII?
We are submariners and I like to have good water to look at and it is an important part of the game.
Maybe we can call it... "Bug free water"...or "Works in game water"... or "You do not need a 116M patch to make it work water mod?
Thanks if you can help,:up:
KUrtz.


can you realize it ?? if you make it run in sh3 ,I will run it in my mod " attack japan mod "

the link :
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=109695

[Venatore]

It would be awsome eye candy to see your U-Boat stalking just below the surface, to have the water murky transparent to a depth of about 5-10m would look good.

[Hitman]

The SH4 water is not just the result of a bunch of new textures and values in the code, it is a whole new water engine, clearly seen in the new 3D ship wakes and the transparencies built it. I'm no expert at programming, but I'm afraid it can't be sadly not ported to SH3 :down:

[denis_469]

The SH4 water is not just the result of a bunch of new textures and values in the code, it is a whole new water engine, clearly seen in the new 3D ship wakes and the transparencies built it. I'm no expert at programming, but I'm afraid it can't be sadly not ported to SH3 :down:

Sorry, but I can not see new ship wakes in game. In museum I see it, but in game... After install "Japanese mod" game water effects in SH III was as in SH IV:oops: Visual game water now as in SH IV. Sorry with my english.

[Tikigod]

It would be illegal to distribute content from sh4 to users of sh3 as a mod.

[P_Funk]

It would be illegal to distribute content from sh4 to users of sh3 as a mod.
Oh you're no fun anymore.

[Klt_KUrtz]

It would be illegal to distribute content from sh4 to users of sh3 as a mod.
We can alter and mod the water files!
I think maybe SHIV might...might have content that was "inspired" by SHIII modders?
KUrtz.

[P_Funk]

It would be illegal to distribute content from sh4 to users of sh3 as a mod. We can alter and mod the water files!
I think maybe SHIV might...might have content that was "inspired" by SHIII modders?
KUrtz. Yea see what 18 corporate lawyers say to that.

Fact is that most of this end-user agreement crap is banking on the fact that nobody is gonna fight it or won't be able to afford to. And since we can't cover any freeware mods we have with the GPL since they use SH3 code then they can do whatever they will with it. And sadly we can't.

Ces't la vie and it sucks.

[Letum]

According to your user agreement is is illegal to reverse engineer or edit ANY game files.
Even the GWX mod is totally illegal.

However, on the whole the games industry ignores all modding as it is good for business. :D

So....Yes, it would be illegal to distribute content from sh4 to users of sh3 as a mod.
However....it is illegal to edit and distribute content from sh3 to users of sh3 as a mod and we all do that anyway!

I don't think we have anything to worry about. :up:

[P_Funk]

I'm pretty sure that you could prove in court that they can't tell you that you can't edit files. That whole premise is totally bogus. Its like not photocopying books at a library or recording shows off TV. Its one of their lawyer games. They push it to the extreme of what they can do and hope nobody says "wait a sec, you can't do that".

[Klt_KUrtz]

Well of course I withdraw whole heartedly any statement that might be counter to Corporate Law!
I feel sure that any progress in the modding of games is beneficial to all of us, retailers and buyers and that such mods/repairs call them what you will, are an intrecal part of most computer games played today!
Oh well a water mod was just a thought... maybe UBISoft can come up with something for SHIII?:up:
KUrtz.

[Hitman]

I'm pretty sure that you could prove in court that ....

Oh man....don't get me going on that :doh:

Fact is, there are:

1.- tons of official posts by the devs in the forum promising an open-character sim,
2.- Open formats in many files that allow easy editing of them
3.- An end-user agreement that is not negotiated by you, but imposed by the seller, and which enforces as contractual obligations that are already regulated by laws.

I would say that placing this all together before a court, good evidence is proven to draw a legal conclusion that:

1.- The end user license is not completely legal in that it tries to limit certain user's legal rights in an unnegotiated manner

2.- The very same author of that license agreement -the selling company- does not itself enforce strict acomplishment of that license by the user, in that when marketing and fan support benefits him, ignoring that license is allowed.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that you can do whatever you want, but I'm certainly saying that the whole modding of SH3 in GWX is not by any means illegal. Porting stufffrom Sh3 to SH4 or viceversa for users who do not have bought the other game is a more delicate matter, but as long as the company is notified/officially aware of that intention and does not oppose it, it can be also considered as implicitely accepted.

That's my interpretation of it all. Yet it would have been nice if the modders engaged in porting things from Sh3 to Sh4 and back would have notified UBI of their work to seek explicit or implicit agreement.:yep:

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Well, personally I've become so stinking rich developing GWX... that it would be about like sucking blood from a turnip for those corporate lawyers.

It has never been our intent to break any law... and at the very least hopefully they'd show a little mercy on us... because I think we've probably helped sell one or two copies of SH3 for them.

Besides, adding money to the mix where GW is concerned... the project would have blown up in our face LONNNG ago.

We just wanted to make the game a touch better. I'm sure that had the time, money, and manpower been available to the SH3 devs... they would have given us all that we wanted to begin with.

Honestly, I can understand now in a rather intimate way, how difficult building a simulator (or even overhauling it) can be and why they would want to protect it above and beyond "money." Work with a thing long enough and you feel beholden to it!

Had I known how tough the road would be by taking responsibility for such a thing... I may have never set foot on the path and it would be a moot point.

I just hope that they look favorably on what we have done with their "baby." I know the Devs are aware of GW/GWX... but I haven't got the slightest clue as to what they think of the effort.

[Mush Martin]

Well, personally I've become so stinking rich developing GWX... that it would be about like sucking blood from a turnip for those corporate lawyers.

It has never been our intent to break any law... and at the very least hopefully they'd show a little mercy on us... because I think we've probably helped sell one or two copies of SH3 for them.

Besides, adding money to the mix where GW is concerned... the project would have blown up in our face LONNNG ago.

We just wanted to make the game a touch better. I'm sure that had the time, money, and manpower been available to the SH3 devs... they would have given us all that we wanted to begin with.

Honestly, I can understand now in a rather intimate way, how difficult building a simulator (or even overhauling it) can be and why they would want to protect it above and beyond "money." Work with a thing long enough and you feel beholden to it!

Had I known how tough the road would be by taking responsibility for such a thing... I may have never set foot on the path and it would be a moot point.

I just hope that they look favorably on what we have done with their "baby." I know the Devs are aware of GW/GWX... but I haven't got the slightest clue as to what they think of the effort.


Well Kpt I believe that the devs would clearly respect the purity
of the work by you and GWX team. As does the community
at large.

[P_Funk]

Certainly I don't think that any of this discussion is meant to reflect badly on anyone other than the publishers that enforce the agreement. The devs themselves are really sweet hearts.

Fear not Kpt. History will certainly reflect well on you and your crew.:up:

[AJ!]

Or why not remake the U boats for SH4?? for a start you could make far better models then SH3 and you would cut out half the hassle....

It would make far more sense to start modding the atlantic theatre into SH4 rather then to try and bring all the features into SH3 :hmm:

[bigboywooly]

Or why not remake the U boats for SH4?? for a start you could make far better models then SH3 and you would cut out half the hassle....

It would make far more sense to start modding the atlantic theatre into SH4 rather then to try and bring all the features into SH3 :hmm:

Maybe when Ubi has finished patching the thing

Not everyone has a rig good enough to play SH4
I dont
Certainly not in my scope to upgrade at the mo and as I am not interested in the PTO thats fine

Eventually the uboats will be there
Some have already started but it wont be a quick and easy job I guess

[bigboywooly]

I'm pretty sure that you could prove in court that ....

Oh man....don't get me going on that :doh:

Fact is, there are:

1.- tons of official posts by the devs in the forum promising an open-character sim,
2.- Open formats in many files that allow easy editing of them
3.- An end-user agreement that is not negotiated by you, but imposed by the seller, and which enforces as contractual obligations that are already regulated by laws.

I would say that placing this all together before a court, good evidence is proven to draw a legal conclusion that:

1.- The end user license is not completely legal in that it tries to limit certain user's legal rights in an unnegotiated manner

2.- The very same author of that license agreement -the selling company- does not itself enforce strict acomplishment of that license by the user, in that when marketing and fan support benefits him, ignoring that license is allowed.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that you can do whatever you want, but I'm certainly saying that the whole modding of SH3 in GWX is not by any means illegal. Porting stufffrom Sh3 to SH4 or viceversa for users who do not have bought the other game is a more delicate matter, but as long as the company is notified/officially aware of that intention and does not oppose it, it can be also considered as implicitely accepted.

That's my interpretation of it all. Yet it would have been nice if the modders engaged in porting things from Sh3 to Sh4 and back would have notified UBI of their work to seek explicit or implicit agreement.:yep:

Good idea
IF Ubi answer
Which in my dealings with them isnt likely

There are a couple of SH4 devs active in the SH4 forum so you would have thought its all common knowledge to both them and Ubi
Yet no statement thus far either way

I dont think the porting of SH3 material into SH4 would be a worry for them as sales have been made are it wont matter either way
The reverse is different though but sales of SH4 seem strong despite the problems with it

Morally speaking I know if I were going to be using SH4 material I would buy the game even if I cant play it

[sergbuto]

Or why not remake the U boats for SH4?? for a start you could make far better models then SH3 and you would cut out half the hassle....

It would make far more sense to start modding the atlantic theatre into SH4 rather then to try and bring all the features into SH3 :hmm:

My guess is that it is impossible to have German TDC in SH4 and having the right TDC is a significant part of the sub simulator.

[P_Funk]

Or why not remake the U boats for SH4?? for a start you could make far better models then SH3 and you would cut out half the hassle....

It would make far more sense to start modding the atlantic theatre into SH4 rather then to try and bring all the features into SH3 :hmm:
My guess is that it is impossible to have German TDC in SH4 and having the right TDC is a significant part of the sub simulator.
Unless theres an SDK.:roll:

This convo is somehow getting familiar.:hmm: