Trigger help?

[tater]

This stuff is confusing.

I was looking at patrol objectives inside the campaign. Some we get are patrols, that's easy. There are a class of "sink" missions where you "deploy" to the patrol area, then get a mission update radioed saying ' ENGAGE ENEMY SHIPPING" or something like that. That part I get.

What I'd like is for that message to say that intel has determined that a target will be at place X at time Y where Y is some time after you get the message.

Ie: "A japanese troop transport is steaming at top speed and is scheduled to put in to Davao harbor in 28 hours." I'd then like the liner to actually do that in ~28 hours.

Is that possible?

[FAdmiral]

I have been toying with that idea in some of my custom missions to get
TF arriving at a certian place at a certain time. As far as I can tell, it is
a matter of how far away they start and how fast they are going. Of course,
this will be a big trial & error sort of solution but I have got it working fairly
close to what I want. I had a DD show up about 8-9 minutes later of when I was
attacking a lone merchant....

JIM

[tater]

How does the game link a particular ship or group to the trigger?

tater

[FAdmiral]

Triggers & events are a hard one to figure out. Been trying to use them
since SH3 but they don't always do what they are supposed to do.
The devs never put out a detailed read-me on the editor so I have just
been trying different things....

JIM

[FAdmiral]

I now know when the Yamato TF will show up at a location on its route in
my "Sink the Yamato" patrol. If I knew just how to use the triggers, I could
put a radio message warning the player sub about the scheduled stop.

JIM

[Ducimus]

The best way ive found messages to appear, is by either
A.) the player entering a zone, which you lay down on them map for them to "step in" specifically to trigger a message, or

b.) objective completion of some sort.

[FAdmiral]

The "b" might be the one to use as there are 2 main objectives in the patrol.
The first is to "Sink the Yamato" so it is not the one. The second is
to "sink merchant tonnage" which I achieved long before the Yamato TF was
due at where I was waiting. The best way to test would be to set the tonnage
low so that I achieved that objective early to see if the trigger message worked.
Just how would I go about setting up that trigger?

JIM

[tater]

The more fleshed out this thread gets, the better, lol.

As an aside, does anyone understand the dynamic campaign.cfg file?

I notice several patrol objectives have 2 versions, one with a d at the end (d=dynamic?). I'm trying to make sense of it.

I have yet to figure out how or if you can make a unit appear with a trigger. Without being able to do that, I will be forced to rely on missions with start dates such that you'd only ever see them VERY rarely, so I'd need TONS of such missions.

Ie: ULTRA points you at a TF. If I can create the TF on the fly by a trigger, I can have it happen on any old patrol in the area somewhat randomly. Without that, I have to script the TF, and set the patrol such that you'd have to be in the patrol area at the right time.

I really want the patrols to be more interactive in that way. Instead of chasing "contact reports" out of your patrol area (entirely on your initiative), you could be ordered around to chase them.

[tater]

There is another way to get a seemingly random trigger.

Set a SMALL zone within the patrol area. THAT triggers it. If the player never patrols there, tough. (that obviously makes more sense for a campaign).

Alternately, you could be explicit in the patrol orders to patrol for X days at the point marked, then proceed to some other point and the hidden zone is there or en-route (in which case it could be bigger).

tater

[tater]

Is it possible to set a trigger based upon you sending a status report?

So you could require the player to go to a spot, then broadcast?

tater

[FAdmiral]

It would be nice to get some Dev help on the triggers makup. A readme on how
all aspects of the editor worked was never made by them. Since there are no
posts in this thread other than the few of us asking questions, I wonder if anyone
outside of the Dev team knows any answers...

JIM

[tater]

Right now (based on the Mare Island stuff) I say Ducimus is the leading expert.

heheh.

I have looked t at them in detail, I just need to figure out how to connect them. I need a flowchart, lol.

tater

[Ducimus]

Right now (based on the Mare Island stuff) I say Ducimus is the leading expert.



Oh god, please don't ask me to explain what i did, im not even sure *I* know how i did it. I just muttled thorugh it, it got easier after the 2nd and 3rd mission, but admittidly theres triggers that i dont understand. Time based triggers for instance, or that option to "refresh instance".

[FAdmiral]

OK, with no readme on the editor, its up to the trial & error test missions.
I just made one called the "Yamato trigger". Just 3 platforms are included.
Player sub, a single merchant and the yamato. I did 2 objectives, one being
the sunk tonnage (meaning the merchant) and the second being to sink the
yamato (really not needed for test). I set up the trigger for the tonnage
objective with the event being a message sent to the sub upon completion
of the first objective (sink tonnage). The message said "Yamato due in your
area in 24 hrs." It Worked GREAT !! After the destruction of the merchant
and the objective met, I received a radiogram with my message. So I know
that it works with a completed objective. Other types of triggers & events
need to be tested too but I think once we have it all figured out, we are going
to kick ourselves on how easy it was all the while....

JIM.

[tater]

Does the trigger CAUSE Yamato to appear in 24 hours, or will she show up anyway (meaning the trigger only triggers a message)?



tater

[FAdmiral]

I think it only sends the message. Making the yamato actually show up at that
time would be up to the player setting it up in the editor. Of this I am about 95%
sure but 5% says i could be wrong. Testing and more testing is needed to answer
these kind of questions....

JIM

[tater]

So if they don't make the sinking, they never get the message, but they might see it anyway (yamato).

I'm wanting to force the creation of units, or the loading of a mission on the fly because in the campaign that would be so very much less work.

tater

[FAdmiral]

OK, tried the mission again but deleted my Yamato so I could check if a
spawn would occur. Waited the 24 hrs but NO DICE ! It's only a message
event trigger, nothing else. But then I got to thinking, in order to spawn
something, you need a time period and a location. I don't think the message
event would do that but there may be something else listed in the triggers or
event section that might. Bottom Line: They ALL need to be tested....

JIM

[FAdmiral]

Next step: The radiogram works with an objective met, a certain ship/class
sunk and a date/time reached. I also think that a patrol area would work too.
As of yet, I have not got any instance or objective events to work correctly.
Still proceeding on a trial & error basis....

JIM

[tater]

Cool. I was meaning to try more of this, then I started trying to make coastal guns into ships, etc. LOL.

Many hands makes light work, however. While I have yet to solve my particular problem, I have discovered a few other useful things.

tater

[wovik]

I don't profess to understand this but if you look at the SimData.dll file with a hex editor and search for the word "trigger" you will find alot on it. Perhaps someone with programming knowledge could make a flowchart out of this information?

[FAdmiral]

Objectives & Triggers are fairly easy to do but I am still having loads of
trouble with attaching the Events to them to work properly. Do you see
any files that will expain the Events more completely?

JIM

[wovik]

Objectives & Triggers are fairly easy to do but I am still having loads of
trouble with attaching the Events to them to work properly. Do you see
any files that will expain the Events more completely?

JIM

Same file, just search for the word "event". I can almost see a flowchart but don't understand it.

[FAdmiral]

I don't have a hex editor but maybe someone who does and knows what
he/she is looking for can view it....

JIM