Okay is SH1 still alive? Do you play?

[oche]

What i really miss about SH1 is the TDC. Best of all series. If i would go back to SH1 this would be the No. 1 reason.

[aanker]

Yup - combine the SHCE game with the SH4 world & graphics, and somebody could make a good sub sim!

Happy Hunting!

Art

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by oche

What i really miss about SH1 is the TDC. Best of all series. If i would go back to SH1 this would be the No. 1 reason.

Yes, the TDC was good. I tried to start up a session with on my old computer, but the CD drive is not working.

The thing that bothered me about SHCE was the teleporting between areas and the way the patrol zones were goofed up. That, and the overabundence of shipping. I've read that the game was not "moddible". Does anyone know if that's true?

[aanker]

Originally Posted by TorpX

Yes, the TDC was good. I tried to start up a session with on my old computer, but the CD drive is not working.

The thing that bothered me about SHCE was the teleporting between areas and the way the patrol zones were goofed up. That, and the overabundence of shipping. I've read that the game was not "moddible". Does anyone know if that's true?

That is mostly true. I'm sure you are aware of Hawk's Utilities that made the boats more realistic, changed the tonnage on all Maru's, edit your rank, Patrol Zone selector, New boat and hull number...

Then Kim made his Torpedo Change Tool that did all of the above plus change the torpedo type and loadout.

We desperately wanted the Gilbert's and other areas and I got a taste of a reverse engineered PZ discombobulator and actually saw the Sun & Moon in the PZ for every day along with a lot of code and colored blocks of code representing things. Kim was looking into making a 16th PZ then SH4 came out.

I think he could have done it. The Lat & Long are off several degrees in SH1 so he made a Lat/Long offset in a plotter tool.

Aside from Hawk's Utilities and Kim's TCT SH1 is hard coded and not moddable.

I would ignore a percentage of contacts because of the over abundance of shipping. At least the shipping routes were reasonably accurate.

Happy Hunting!

Art

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by aanker

That is mostly true. I'm sure you are aware of Hawk's Utilities that made the boats more realistic, changed the tonnage on all Maru's, edit your rank, Patrol Zone selector, New boat and hull number...

Yes, I used Hawk's Utilities, at least most of them.

Originally Posted by aanker

We desperately wanted the Gilbert's and other areas and I got a taste of a reverse engineered PZ discombobulator and actually saw the Sun & Moon in the PZ for every day along with a lot of code and colored blocks of code representing things. Kim was looking into making a 16th PZ then SH4 came out.

I think he could have done it. The Lat & Long are off several degrees in SH1 so he made a Lat/Long offset in a plotter tool.

I didn't try any plotter tool.
What I was refering to is the Lat/Lon being far off in the PZ's. By that I mean a degree being only 25 or 30 nm instead of the correct 60 or whatever. I made a table with the in-game values so I could calculate interceptions when needed. For some reason every PZ was different (but all were wrong); I could never figure out why. IIRC, the island of Borneo was only about half it's real-life size in the game! I always wanted to change that. Stuff like that just bugs me.

Originally Posted by aanker

Aside from Hawk's Utilities and Kim's TCT SH1 is hard coded and not moddable.

Too bad.

[aanker]

Originally Posted by TorpX

I didn't try any plotter tool.

What I was refering to is the Lat/Lon being far off in the PZ's. By that I mean a degree being only 25 or 30 nm instead of the correct 60 or whatever. I made a table with the in-game values so I could calculate interceptions when needed. For some reason every PZ was different (but all were wrong); I could never figure out why. IIRC, the island of Borneo was only about half it's real-life size in the game! I always wanted to change that. Stuff like that just bugs me.

Poor Kim must have tore his hair out making the ENOPTC plotting tool because like you say, they are all off and none are the same-off. I know what you meant by they are off though.

From his Readme:

In SH 1 latitude minute is equal to 1 longitude minute and this varies in distance from map to map.

The navigational program actually has corrections factors for longitude as well as latitude – I never dreamt that anyone with any navigational knowledge would so bluntly disregard what any sailor knows – that there is a difference of longitude and latitude minutes in distance, one varies with position and the other is constant. I took me a long time to recognize this, I was full of disbelief.

The (complicated) tool used a large jpg of the PZ and you could navigate using it by calculating course, distance, speed and time. I think one could draw both red and blue lines on this map. Sightings on the in-game big map were only permitted if the weather was not overcast. Pretty hard not being able to zoom out to the big map.

It was a lot of fun back then.......

[TorpX]

In SH 1 latitude minute is equal to 1 longitude minute and this varies in distance from map to map.

The navigational program actually has corrections factors for longitude as well as latitude – I never dreamt that anyone with any navigational knowledge would so bluntly disregard what any sailor knows – that there is a difference of longitude and latitude minutes in distance, one varies with position and the other is constant. I took me a long time to recognize this, I was full of disbelief.

That was pretty much my reaction.

I kept checking my figures looking for a (reasonable?) expanation.

Well I'm glad I wasn't the only one who was bothered by this.

[oche]

My biggest dissapointment with SHIV is that it does not have an independent view to the TDC like SH1 had where you could back to see the gauges of the TDC. I know that the Pacific Aces mod has the SH2 engine limitations with the TDC engine and did not have a "manual" Position keeper function for the TDC but still you can "track" ships in AUTO mode and go back to the independent TDC station to see the TDC gauges rolling so i guess for the mod purposes that passes for an automatic TDC with a PK, just like in subs with more than 4 bow tubes the tube 5 and 6 are allocated to tube No. 4 because of the SH2 engine limitations.

[dannygjk]

Originally Posted by TorpX

Yes, I used Hawk's Utilities, at least most of them.

I didn't try any plotter tool.
What I was refering to is the Lat/Lon being far off in the PZ's. By that I mean a degree being only 25 or 30 nm instead of the correct 60 or whatever. I made a table with the in-game values so I could calculate interceptions when needed. For some reason every PZ was different (but all were wrong); I could never figure out why. IIRC, the island of Borneo was only about half it's real-life size in the game! I always wanted to change that. Stuff like that just bugs me.

Too bad.

Actually it is ONLY latitude degrees which are equal to 60 Nm. The size of a degree of longitude varies according the latitude at which it is located.

[dannygjk]

I would gladly mod silent hunter 1. All I need is the tools which are used to write/edit the assembly language/machine code. I have a legal copy of SHCE.

I learned assembly language programming back in the early 80's and my bro and I used to mod games all the time. I had bought an app to write and mod assembly/machine code and after 2-3 months of study we started to work on games.

It's a time in my life that I greatly miss altho I did spend too much time in front of a computer. Over the years we wrote some small games for our and our friends amusement. It takes a helluva lot of time tho to write software and sometimes a lot of time even to make small mods. I haven't done much coding for several years but always craved to get back into it. One problem tho is it's so addictive, lol.

The initial stage of studying the piece of software is very time-consuming-can take weeks just to get familiar with it.

Then of course there is the legal issue as to whether it is legal to distribute modded copies, (even for free).

[TorpX]

Actually it is ONLY latitude degrees which are equal to 60 Nm. The size of a degree of longitude varies according the latitude at which it is located.

Yes, I realize that. What I meant is that neither the longitude or latitude are correct. If you still play the game check out the island of Borneo, it's much smaller. All the zones are too small. I guess someone just made a mistake with the numbers.

The initial stage of studying the piece of software is very time-consuming-can take weeks just to get familiar with it.

Oh, I believe you. I tried to mod it years ago. After much effort, I had to throw in the towel. The only thing I was able to do was insert a girl's picture and a map into the Captain's cabin. Very minor eye-candy. I wanted to fix the patrol zones, change the periscope/ TBT marks, reduce the shipping and ultra traffic and a few things like that. As you said, someone with the proper tools and know-how could do this, but my computer skills fall far short. I suspect the people who wrote the code, could have done it in a couple hours, if they had but understood the value of it.

Then of course there is the legal issue as to whether it is legal to distribute modded copies, (even for free).

This is something I will never understand. I mean how software companies can sell something that is in need of, for lack of a better word, "maintainance", wash their hands of it, but prevent anyone else from fixing it. I have to think the legalities of this will change one day.