The Lazarus Project; or, getting old ain't for sissies! - Page 5

MarkShot · 05-27-07, 09:51 PM

Neal,

Was that with DOSBOX?

CTRL-F5 is the DOSBOX key to screen capture. You can define the capture path in the CONF file.

If it was true DOS, then just search the Internet for "DOS screen capture TSR" ... you should be able to find a few free ones. Also, I think I have one or two which I could send you.

Glad for your progress.

Onkel Neal · 05-27-07, 11:36 PM

Ahoy Mark,

No, no Dosbox in this case. I got it running on the retro machine. I think I had some problems with a cdrom driver, so I updated that. And I changed the fastattack.ini file and moved some of the files off the CD to the HD, and disabled the screensavers and power management stuff. I start the machine in DOS and it seems to work pretty well.

Thanks a million for the encouragement, Mark. I searched for some TSR apps and found one that works perfectly, Snarf. And looky here!

Fast Attack review: Updated with screens

thanks!
Neal

MarkShot · 05-28-07, 10:21 AM

Neal,

Nice screens especially BB.

I most admit I never played that. My first and second sub sims were AOD and SC. Both of which I purchased when they were first released, 1994 and 2001, but wasn't able to get into them.

However, starting in 2005, I seriously discovered subs and began enjoying AOD, SHCE, SC/SCXIIc/SCU, SH2/PA (gave up with it), and now finally SH3/GWX/NYGM/WAC. So, most of the retro games you are tinkering with I never even experienced. On the other hand, I am satisfied that I've hit the most important ones in my short subsimming career.

MarkShot · 05-28-07, 10:25 AM

Neal,

I just skimmed your review. If you can get it running under Virtual PC, you will be able save the session and reload it at any point in the game. Virtual PC works just like "hibernate" does in XP. It can save and reload the entire machine state.

Worth a try if that bothers you.

Onkel Neal · 05-28-07, 11:49 AM

WOW!

I did not know that such a thing existed, that could be the Holy Grail for buggy sims. I will have to check that Virtual PC out now for sure, I can see if being very useful for Fast Attack and games that stop without warning (there are not many these days, but back in the 80s and 90s... it was common).

You should definitely try Fast Attack. It has a great blend of realism and access, great environment and atmosphere. Fast Attack has auto IDing, and assisted TMA, but on the REAL level, you have to do just about everything yourself. The waterfall display does not have narrowband or DEMON, but aside from that, it is on par with Sub Command and Jane's 688(I). I actually liked FA slightly better than 688(I); it just has such a great feel and gameplay.

It's funny, when I got FA, I had just started Subsim, back in '96. My first copy of FA crashed like crazy on a Pentium 100 with 16MB ram. I could hardly get through a mission. There was a Sierra BBS but not much support. I got to know one of the Sierra 1-800 tech support guys (yeah, back then I actually called people on the phone). Then about a year later, while looking through games in a Hastings store, I saw a repackaged Fast Attack for $10 or so. When I installed it, I noticed it said "Fast Attack Gold" and had a different version number. And it was pretty stable!

So, I called the Sierra tech to get the lowdown. He said they had made a patch for Fast Attack, and it was added to the bargain version of the game being sold, but no permission had come to release the patch to the public, for those guys who bought the original version. Well, we both agreed that was unethical, so he slipped me the patch and I hosted it online.

I would be interested in hearing your impression of Fast Attack after a few missions, Mark. I did finish the mission #3 in the Sea of Japan this morning and my sub was resupplied and I was awarded the Bronze Star! So, back to sea.

Neal

MarkShot · 05-28-07, 12:42 PM

Neal,

One thing I should tell about trying these older DOS games with DOSBOX or VPC is that if you got them working on the Time Machine PC, then you don't need to worry about installations under DOSBOX or VPC. Just move the entire game directory from the Time Machine PC to your XP/Vista directory (to be mounted for DOSBOX) or to your virtual hard drive for VPC. DOS had no registry, INI files, or system/system32 to worry about. So, pretty much everything needed for the game went into the installation tree. That tree can simply be ported over to whatever emulator you are trying.

MarkShot · 05-28-07, 12:47 PM

Regarding VPC and saving games. You will close it selecting "save state" instead "turn it off". That will save the session exactly as it was. Then, you can just make a copy of your *.VHD (virtual hard drive) and *.VMC (virtual machine definition) files. Copy them back to restore a "save" game. The DOS test machine I made for trying the "1830" game the other day, takes about 20Mb (mainly the VHD) which is nothing these days in terms of disk space.

MarkShot · 05-29-07, 01:16 AM

Neal,

I uninstalled VPC 2007 and have reinstalled VPC 2004. It seems that you cannot run both versions on one PC. I am trying VPC 2004, since DOS support was actually dropped from VPC 2007.

I want to see how that works with old DOS games. I'll let you know what I find.

MarkShot · 05-29-07, 02:11 AM

Neal,

I have given up on DOS and VPC for the following reasons:

(1) VPC 2007 does not support DOS. Although I did install DOS under VPC 2007, but I could not get file sharing with the host operating system working.

(2) VPC 2004 does support DOS. It is supposed to be possible to share files with the hosting system. However, I could not get the "additions" to work/load; mean file sharing.

Now, I have seen the "additions" work under Win98 SE and sharing files with the host O/S is just like mapping network drives. It is supposed to be able to work with DOS under VPC 2004 the same way. But I just cannot seem to figure it out. For me, this is a show stopper, since it makes it difficult to manipulate or do anything with your game from the larger Windows environment. Perhaps, someone else knows the answer to this. BB Nuke?

This is one of the nice things about DOSBOX in that it completely uses the NTFS file system for all of its files. This makes configuring, backing up, and manipulating the game files much easier. For example, AOD autosaves every 20 minutes. With DOSBOX, I was able to develop a separate utility running in the background the checkpoints AODs autosaves with filename/timestamp. Thus, I have an AOD environment which I can very easily back track in if as you said if I have a "buggy game issue".

Besides providing a pseudo save game functionality, the other good thing about VPCs simulated file system contained within a virtual hard drive is that you could install the OS and a game. Then, you can distribute the complete package to someone else simply giving them two files presuming that they already have VPC installed.

Oh, well ... Time to get some sleep - 3am here.

Onkel Neal · 05-29-07, 06:04 AM

You are more advanced than me. I've been reading up on VPC, I didn't realize 07 would not support DOS. But Fast Attack has been behaving, so no pressing need to use a save vhd; finished games 4,5, and 6 in the Sea of Japan battleset. Wow, I did't realize these battlesets had so many missions. Now I am itching to start the campaign. How many missions does it have? I don't remember finishing it back when the game was new.

Onkel Neal · 05-30-07, 11:29 PM

Well, played through the 8th Sea of Japan mission tonight? How many missions do these battle sets contain?!

This one was tough, a Han class sub used a merchant to mask his presence, and he let me have it before I knew he was there.

I guess I should stop playing Fast Attack and continue working on the Subsim Retro Machine, but for the last few evenings I've have "Conn: Sonar, new contact, bearing 342, Sierra 4" running through my brain.

After I complete this battle set, I will continue this project and my little blog here

Onkel Neal · 05-30-07, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

If you need the discs for Red Storm Rising, I think I have the Amiga version somewhere - but no more Amiga. That one i played a lot.

Thanks, Sky. I have RSR on 5inch floppies, I'm watching ebay for a compatible drive.

What year was the Amiga version, btw?

jmr · 06-08-07, 08:12 PM

Hey, Markshot, if you're still around I could use some DosBox help with AOD (DOS version).

I downloaded DosBox along with the Dfend frontend client and I set it up for AOD but when I launch the game I get the "loading simulation . . . " message but it never loads it. Do I have something configured wrong here?

MarkShot · 06-19-07, 01:43 PM

Two images of AOD running side by side on the same PC. First, AOD DOS using DOSBOX. Second, CAOD Win98SE using Virtual PC 2007. Both running on top Win XP Pro SP2.

MarkShot · 06-19-07, 01:46 PM

Myself, I much prefer the DOS version as it provides a better experience with DOSBOX, but I recently installed CAOD to watch the interviews that come along with it. (Someone made me aware of that on the SH3 forum.)

05-27-07, 09:51 PM	#61
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Neal, Was that with DOSBOX? CTRL-F5 is the DOSBOX key to screen capture. You can define the capture path in the CONF file. If it was true DOS, then just search the Internet for "DOS screen capture TSR" ... you should be able to find a few free ones. Also, I think I have one or two which I could send you. Glad for your progress. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

05-28-07, 10:21 AM	#63
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Neal, Nice screens especially BB. I most admit I never played that. My first and second sub sims were AOD and SC. Both of which I purchased when they were first released, 1994 and 2001, but wasn't able to get into them. However, starting in 2005, I seriously discovered subs and began enjoying AOD, SHCE, SC/SCXIIc/SCU, SH2/PA (gave up with it), and now finally SH3/GWX/NYGM/WAC. So, most of the retro games you are tinkering with I never even experienced. On the other hand, I am satisfied that I've hit the most important ones in my short subsimming career. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

05-28-07, 10:25 AM	#64
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Neal, I just skimmed your review. If you can get it running under Virtual PC, you will be able save the session and reload it at any point in the game. Virtual PC works just like "hibernate" does in XP. It can save and reload the entire machine state. Worth a try if that bothers you. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

05-28-07, 11:49 AM	#65
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,284 Downloads: 534 Uploads: 224	WOW! I did not know that such a thing existed, that could be the Holy Grail for buggy sims. I will have to check that Virtual PC out now for sure, I can see if being very useful for Fast Attack and games that stop without warning (there are not many these days, but back in the 80s and 90s... it was common). You should definitely try Fast Attack. It has a great blend of realism and access, great environment and atmosphere. Fast Attack has auto IDing, and assisted TMA, but on the REAL level, you have to do just about everything yourself. The waterfall display does not have narrowband or DEMON, but aside from that, it is on par with Sub Command and Jane's 688(I). I actually liked FA slightly better than 688(I); it just has such a great feel and gameplay. It's funny, when I got FA, I had just started Subsim, back in '96. My first copy of FA crashed like crazy on a Pentium 100 with 16MB ram. I could hardly get through a mission. There was a Sierra BBS but not much support. I got to know one of the Sierra 1-800 tech support guys (yeah, back then I actually called people on the phone). Then about a year later, while looking through games in a Hastings store, I saw a repackaged Fast Attack for $10 or so. When I installed it, I noticed it said "Fast Attack Gold" and had a different version number. And it was pretty stable! So, I called the Sierra tech to get the lowdown. He said they had made a patch for Fast Attack, and it was added to the bargain version of the game being sold, but no permission had come to release the patch to the public, for those guys who bought the original version. Well, we both agreed that was unethical, so he slipped me the patch and I hosted it online. I would be interested in hearing your impression of Fast Attack after a few missions, Mark. I did finish the mission #3 in the Sea of Japan this morning and my sub was resupplied and I was awarded the Bronze Star! So, back to sea. Neal __________________ SUBSIM - 26 Years on the Web

05-28-07, 12:42 PM	#66
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Neal, One thing I should tell about trying these older DOS games with DOSBOX or VPC is that if you got them working on the Time Machine PC, then you don't need to worry about installations under DOSBOX or VPC. Just move the entire game directory from the Time Machine PC to your XP/Vista directory (to be mounted for DOSBOX) or to your virtual hard drive for VPC. DOS had no registry, INI files, or system/system32 to worry about. So, pretty much everything needed for the game went into the installation tree. That tree can simply be ported over to whatever emulator you are trying. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

05-27-07, 11:36 PM	#62
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,284 Downloads: 534 Uploads: 224	Ahoy Mark, No, no Dosbox in this case. I got it running on the retro machine. I think I had some problems with a cdrom driver, so I updated that. And I changed the fastattack.ini file and moved some of the files off the CD to the HD, and disabled the screensavers and power management stuff. I start the machine in DOS and it seems to work pretty well. Thanks a million for the encouragement, Mark. I searched for some TSR apps and found one that works perfectly, Snarf. And looky here! Fast Attack review: Updated with screens thanks! Neal

05-28-07, 12:47 PM	#67
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Regarding VPC and saving games. You will close it selecting "save state" instead "turn it off". That will save the session exactly as it was. Then, you can just make a copy of your .VHD (virtual hard drive) and .VMC (virtual machine definition) files. Copy them back to restore a "save" game. The DOS test machine I made for trying the "1830" game the other day, takes about 20Mb (mainly the VHD) which is nothing these days in terms of disk space. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

05-29-07, 01:16 AM	#68
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Neal, I uninstalled VPC 2007 and have reinstalled VPC 2004. It seems that you cannot run both versions on one PC. I am trying VPC 2004, since DOS support was actually dropped from VPC 2007. I want to see how that works with old DOS games. I'll let you know what I find. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

05-29-07, 02:11 AM	#69
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Neal, I have given up on DOS and VPC for the following reasons: (1) VPC 2007 does not support DOS. Although I did install DOS under VPC 2007, but I could not get file sharing with the host operating system working. (2) VPC 2004 does support DOS. It is supposed to be possible to share files with the hosting system. However, I could not get the "additions" to work/load; mean file sharing. Now, I have seen the "additions" work under Win98 SE and sharing files with the host O/S is just like mapping network drives. It is supposed to be able to work with DOS under VPC 2004 the same way. But I just cannot seem to figure it out. For me, this is a show stopper, since it makes it difficult to manipulate or do anything with your game from the larger Windows environment. Perhaps, someone else knows the answer to this. BB Nuke? This is one of the nice things about DOSBOX in that it completely uses the NTFS file system for all of its files. This makes configuring, backing up, and manipulating the game files much easier. For example, AOD autosaves every 20 minutes. With DOSBOX, I was able to develop a separate utility running in the background the checkpoints AODs autosaves with filename/timestamp. Thus, I have an AOD environment which I can very easily back track in if as you said if I have a "buggy game issue". Besides providing a pseudo save game functionality, the other good thing about VPCs simulated file system contained within a virtual hard drive is that you could install the OS and a game. Then, you can distribute the complete package to someone else simply giving them two files presuming that they already have VPC installed. Oh, well ... Time to get some sleep - 3am here. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

05-29-07, 06:04 AM	#70
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,284 Downloads: 534 Uploads: 224	You are more advanced than me. I've been reading up on VPC, I didn't realize 07 would not support DOS. But Fast Attack has been behaving, so no pressing need to use a save vhd; finished games 4,5, and 6 in the Sea of Japan battleset. Wow, I did't realize these battlesets had so many missions. Now I am itching to start the campaign. How many missions does it have? I don't remember finishing it back when the game was new.

05-30-07, 11:29 PM	#71
Onkel Neal Born to Run Silent Join Date: Jan 1997 Location: Cougar Trap, Texas Posts: 21,284 Downloads: 534 Uploads: 224	Well, played through the 8th Sea of Japan mission tonight? How many missions do these battle sets contain?! This one was tough, a Han class sub used a merchant to mask his presence, and he let me have it before I knew he was there. I guess I should stop playing Fast Attack and continue working on the Subsim Retro Machine, but for the last few evenings I've have "Conn: Sonar, new contact, bearing 342, Sierra 4" running through my brain. After I complete this battle set, I will continue this project and my little blog here

06-08-07, 08:12 PM	#73
jmr Commander Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 462 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	Hey, Markshot, if you're still around I could use some DosBox help with AOD (DOS version). I downloaded DosBox along with the Dfend frontend client and I set it up for AOD but when I launch the game I get the "loading simulation . . . " message but it never loads it. Do I have something configured wrong here?

06-19-07, 01:43 PM	#74
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Two images of AOD running side by side on the same PC. First, AOD DOS using DOSBOX. Second, CAOD Win98SE using Virtual PC 2007. Both running on top Win XP Pro SP2. __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!

06-19-07, 01:46 PM	#75
MarkShot Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 1,134 Downloads: 93 Uploads: 0	Myself, I much prefer the DOS version as it provides a better experience with DOSBOX, but I recently installed CAOD to watch the interviews that come along with it. (Someone made me aware of that on the SH3 forum.) __________________ War games, not wars! --- Only a small few profit from war (that should not stand)!