Here we go again-Ukraine once again

[clayton]

Here's hoping they get a tank with a whole crew for each Javelin launched.

[Skybird]

According to Ukrainian police, this is the airspace over Kiev.



Not fighters or bombers - helicopters...

[mapuc]

In every war there's always volunteers who come from abroad. Wonder how many thousands foreigners has join the Ukrainian army ?

Markus

[clayton]

If they take one step out of Ukraine, there will be dead Russians—tyrannical, naked aggression.

[Skybird]

Ever more shame on Germany:


Focus writes:
Instead of weapons, Ukraine asked the German government for radios or protective equipment in early February. A report now reveals that the German government apparently left the request for arms assistance unanswered.

Ukraine's February 3 request to the German government for arms assistance has not yet been officially reviewed by the relevant ministries. This was reported by "Business Insider" with reference to persons entrusted with the matter.

By letter to the Foreign Office (AA) and the Minister of Defense, the Ukrainian embassy had asked for help on February 3: In view of the growing threat of war, the embassy said it wanted various military equipment such as electronic tracking systems, mine-clearing equipment, protective suits, digital radios, radar stations and night-vision equipment. The German government led by Olaf Scholz (SPD) has so far categorically ruled out supplying weapons. But it says it can imagine supplying one or two of the other armaments.

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)


Meanwhile Putin's best man in Europe, former chancellor Schröder, relativises Russia' role and refuses to call the attack an aggression, attack, invasion.


And the German economy minister Habeck once again has ruled out that Germany will deliver any weapons to the Ukraine.



---


I live as a stranger in this foreign land. Do not read anything into me having a German ID card. It means nothing, is only a bureaucratic formality. It means nothing beyond that.

[Rockstar]

Forgot where I saw it, but because Russian made armaments are on both sides of the engagement. In order to tell them apart and help prevent friendly fire. The Russians painted a Z painted on their tanks. I imagine other vehicles would have them too.

Remember in early ‘20 we sent troops into Poland and established military bases. We knew this was coming.

[Susexx]

Originally Posted by Rockstar

Forgot where I saw it, but because Russian made armaments are on both sides of the engagement. In order to tell them apart and help prevent friendly fire. The Russians painted a Z painted on their tanks. I imagine other vehicles would have them too.

Yes, that's right, and white armbands on the uniform

[Andreas86]

The helicopter footage is hours old. Jets are operating in east Ukraine, and Russia has used cruise and ballistic missiles.

Sky news just showed this from the Belarus-Ukraine border:





Many Russian tanks in the Oleshki region:


https://www.facebook.com/100003071082217/videos/969764973725374/

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Susexx

But we regularly hear from the governments of Poland, the Baltic States, the UK and many others that Russians are subhumans (Untermensch).

Eh, using that terminology were the Nazis 80 years ago.

In fact Western politicians often reiterate that they have no quarrel with the ordinary Russian people, Biden once again did so just days ago, and several European politicians over the past couple of weeks.

Nor do even people like me feel "hate" for your people. I don't, actually I knew Russians, years ago, at former work. No problem. But I hold your people responsible to the election choices you make. And that is only consistent, because I do the same with my own people and attack them often over the election results they produce. I even condemn them for going to elections at all, instead of boycotting the political caste completely and cancelling their loyalty and obedience.

Its about your political tyrants. It always was. That are the Russian individuals we have deep problems with.

I also tell you this, in all clarity. The Russians in your country (I assume Russia is your country) have no claim for the Ukranians. They are not your property, your posession or your slaves. You do not own them. You have no right to force them to live with you if they do not want that. Every people has the natural right to decide itself by whom it wants to get governed and by whom not. While there are varying-sized minorities of ethnic Russians in various provinces of the ukraine, these form the absolute majority only in one of these: the Crimea. The last census before the war in the Donbass region showed that alrready in Luhansk and Donbass the Russian share of the total population already was below one third, and that is the very eats of the Ukraine. The more Westward you go, the samller the ethnic Russian groups in provinces become. So, what claim do you have to make there that you have not boosted by driving non-agreeing Ukrainians away and importing Russia-friendly people from abroad, like has been done in Donbass and Luhansk?

I have no problem with the Ukrainian people going all for Russia if that is what they freely decide, unpressed, unintimidated, unmanipulated, by their own voluntary will and desire. But apparently they dont want it that way, and after the horror of the SAtlain tyranny I cannot mistake them for that, they paid with millions of lives (and that were not the Nazis, that was Stalin). But your Führer in the Kremlin takes it upon him to now decide it in their place and on their behalf, using force and violence to subjugate them to his very own will. That is what makes him a pariah and war criminal. That he revives the Stlain cult tells all there is to kn ow. If the Germans would reinstall a figure like Hitler again who relativises the detah toll of the WW2 and the Holocaust and celebrate him and call him a figure of freedom and independence - what would you then think, eh?

That Putin threatens several other European states as well, mayke slciam for them, demands to command the Us out of Europe, and even threatens to use nuclear weapons if others would try to interfere with him, does not make it any better.

Russia is the attacker here, the aggressor, the invader. Putin is the evil bad guy. A very capable, competent, skillful evil-doer and bad guy, yes - but the bad guy he is. And there is no way to weasel around this simple fact.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Andreas86

The helicopter footage is hours old. Jets are operating in east Ukraine, and Russia has used cruise and ballistic missiles.

Sky news just showed this from the Belarus-Ukraine border:





Many Russian tanks in the Oleshki region:


https://www.facebook.com/100003071082217/videos/969764973725374/

Those gunships look like troop carriers or heavy gunships that also carry small troop numbers, thats why I was stunned. I would expect these to come AFTER jets and bombers are done with the city. And they probably came after them, which means that things went very fast. Before the Olympics I said I expect the Russian blitz for Kiev from both sides of the Nothern part of the Dnjepr and the shock forces reaching Kiev in twice the time a civil car would need to cover the distance, so I estimated said 6-8 hours. It may not even have taken the Russians that long, which means their advance is VERY fast.

Thats why the helicopter image stunned me.

[mapuc]

^ I was thinking the same.

Using Helicopters so early I thought they was only used when you have almost 100% control over the airspace ?

Then I remembered it's Russian military doctrine, not USA.

Markus

[Rockstar]

Like him or not. I think Putin deserves this years Big Brass Balls Award

[kranz]

in b4 ikalugin saying 'these are NOT russian troops'

[Andreas86]

Originally Posted by mapuc

^ I was thinking the same.

Using Helicopters so early I thought they was only used when you have almost 100% control over the airspace ?

Then I remembered it's Russian military doctrine, not USA.

Markus

It could be that much of Ukraines air defenses were taken out by cruise missiles early on. Just like in Desert Storm, where a big number of tomahawks were launched from warships in the Gulf and struck even before the F-117s hit their targets, as far as I know even before task force Normandy hit the radars.

So perhaps Russia didn't even need to use a large scale bomber attack to achieve their objectives today.

Latest news are that the airbase outside Kiev is taken and Russian transports and fighters have left Russia for Kiev.

[Susexx]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Eh, using that terminology were the Nazis 80 years ago.

In fact Western politicians often reiterate that they have no quarrel with the ordinary Russian people, Biden once again did so just days ago, and several European politicians over the past couple of weeks.

Nor do even people like me feel "hate" for your people. I don't, actually I knew Russians, years ago, at former work. No problem. But I hold your people responsible to the election choices you make. And that is only consistent, because I do the same with my own people and attack them often over the election results they produce. I even condemn them for going to elections at all, instead of boycotting the political caste completely and cancelling their loyalty and obedience.

Its about your political tyrants. It always was. That are the Russian individuals we have deep problems with.

I also tell you this, in all clarity. The Russians in your country (I assume Russia is your country) have no claim for the Ukranians. They are not your property, your posession or your slaves. You do not own them. You have no right to force them to live with you if they do not want that. Every people has the natural right to decide itself by whom it wants to get governed and by whom not. While there are varying-sized minorities of ethnic Russians in various provinces of the ukraine, these form the absolute majority only in one of these: the Crimea. The last census before the war in the Donbass region showed that alrready in Luhansk and Donbass the Russian share of the total population already was below one third, and that is the very eats of the Ukraine. The more Westward you go, the samller the ethnic Russian groups in provinces become. So, what claim do you have to make there that you have not boosted by driving non-agreeing Ukrainians away and importing Russia-friendly people from abroad, like has been done in Donbass and Luhansk?

I would like to believe you, but the reality is that ordinary citizens are already suffering and will continue to suffer. And old Joe's words are just words. For him, everything that needs to be decided and done. And so it is everywhere. Nothing depends on the elections at all. It's like blaming the Germans for choosing Hitler. Aren 't you dissatisfied with the government yourself ? Why did you choose him ? The modern world is when people who have to take dementia pills make decisions. I have nothing personal to you.