Silent Hunter Online

[Wolfstriked]

Originally Posted by 7thSeal

SH5 wasn't exactly a sim but a migration to console, it didn't fail and you're expecting the next game to lean toward PC? Heck even the 'online' phase is enough to see that it won't be a sim. But if sim gamers run out and buy it then what the heck no failures or jobs lost and business goes on as usual.

Its free to play though.I doubt any of the realistic simulation players from here will pay any money once they see its not geared towards realism.Its ok with me and I wish them luck.If its good then there is lots of money to be made for them.

Originally Posted by KeldorKatarn

At least give this a chance ok?

No.

UBI has earned the "Utter Crap Until Proven Otherwise" reputation. They have proven time and again that they care only for making profits and sales and will screw over their customers if it will make them a quick buck.

Its genius of them to use Silent Hunter really, its already a dead series to them so if they can use it as a testbed for this stuff, if it fails then nothing is really lost, if they succeed then they can get lot's of moneys and can go about turning their more profitable series into freemium crapfests, like Assassin's Creed.

[glarus]

Originally Posted by Ralf73

I support You! Bravo!!!!

They already deleted mine

[BigBANGtheory]

Originally Posted by KeldorKatarn

I told you, we are not Ubisoft and we have no communication with the former developer studio. And as a developer you don't ask a publisher for anything. They give you a project, you do the project. You have no influence whatsoever beyond that.



No there is nothing at all that we could do. It is their property. They can do with it whatever they like.



So you want us to get Ubisoft to get us access to a source code written by a totally different studio without any knowledge about their code base and then patch the thing for free.... honestly what world are you living in?



Yeah, right. We all might have personal opinions, but they are just that, personal. If we voice them individually as something official, we get fired, and rightly so. You don't go ahead and publicly denounce a business partner. And you also don't do that as a company if you plan to make business with ANYBODY ever again.



Easy solution: if you don't like Ubisoft, don't buy their games. They have no obligation to you to do anything. If you buy their stuff you seem to be happy enough with it to spend money. if you don't buy their stuff there is nothing to complain about.

Seriously people, get real here.
You can be unhappy with Ubisoft all you want. Solution: Don't buy their products. But it is ridiculous to ask a developer studio that had nothing to do with anything concerning Silent Hunter in the past to go and publicly attack Ubisoft or magically fix problems caused by a developer studio that they don't even know.

The new studio got the contract to develop a new Silent Hunter game on a free to play basis. That's what these guys did, and they tried their best to make it in a way that the community will like it. the contract was to make a free to play game, not a desktop game. And there is nothing the studio can do about that. You get told what to do and you try your best to make that concept as fun as possible.

Seriously I don't see your problem here honestly. The game is free to play. The designers made sure that all the pay-to-play moments are convenience only, you don't need to pay anything to play the game successfully, you just spend more time on certain tasks.

So what is the big cry here all about. Yes, Ubisoft didn't do what you liked them to do most.. fine. But that is no reason to call this game crap before you've even seen it. Our studio is not responsible for Ubisoft business decision nor is our game bad just because you think Ubisoft sucks.

You get a game basically for free, some people will have to pay for stuff for it to be bring in money yes, but nobody is forcing anybody to do that. Also again, this is a different studio. The time and money put into this project is in no way whatsoever preventing the other studio from pushing our patches. So why the hatred towards this project before you even tried it?
Theres a lot of people working on this that had nothing to do with anything that you are complaining about here, and no matter how well founded your accusations might be towards Ubisoft, your downtalking this game is just unfair to the new team that had nothing to do with anything that happened in the past.

You have valid concerns, bring them up with Ubisoft. But don't punish a game and a studio for something that their publisher did in the past.
If you don't like this game once it is out you have three options:
- Don't play it... we're fine with that.
- Play it but don't pay for it. We're more than fine with that too.
- Play it and help the live team make it better. Really cool.

If you like it:
- Play it, love it, but don't pay for it. We're fine with that.
- Play it, and pay small amounts here and there. Thank you.
- Play it, love the crap out of it and sink your life insurance money into it. Thanks a lot, we hope you know what you're doing

No seriously... people should get back down to Earth on this one I think.

You are publishing a game through Ubisoft which basically shat all over its customer base and you expect the sub sim fans to just wipe the slate clean because its a different bunch of guys developing the game?

No seriously get real yourself.

You signed a doomed contract my friend. Its like going to Japan and Ukraine with a new nuclear concept saying 'its a totally different team this time, whats your problem?'

Even the idea is offensive to some here, read it yourself.

I bear the new team no I'll will, but as Orpheus said 'best of luck - they're gonna need it'. The trust with the Silent Hunter series has been broken and that my friend is a fact.

[glarus]

Originally Posted by Sartoris

I suggest we unload all our rage on their Facebook page. Let them know what we think about this...

EDIT: I left my comments, wonder how long it'll take them to delete them.

They already deleted mine

[KeldorKatarn]

Guys, you should really learn the difference between publishers and developers. Ubisoft is just paying for this, they are not developing it.

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by 0rpheus

Convince us that your game isn't just another Ubi money-grab. Convince us that realism will have its right and proper place alongside historical accuracy. Convince us that, despite the choice of format, this will be a game that knows and respects the history of the Silent Hunter series.

Couldn't have said it better.

[KeldorKatarn]

Originally Posted by BigBANGtheory

You are publishing a game through Ubisoft which basically shat all over its customer base and you expect the sub sim fans to just wipe the slate clean because its a different bunch of guys developing the game?

No seriously get real yourself.

Oh common. WE don't publish silent Hunter through Ubisoft, they let us develop it. We don't own it, they do.

Jesus, people. I understand certain sentiments here but if you make accusations like this, first get your facts right on how the industry works. Ubisoft own the franchise and they contract developer studios. This is one of the biggest projects that Ubisoft gave away the last year. Do you honestly expect a studio to turn down such a huge offer?


As for the comments "Prove to us that this game is worth it". Well, that's what the beta is for. I haven't played it but I can say it is far from being casual. it is much too complex for that. I don't know how realistic the combat is yet, as mentioned I haven't played it myself, just watched our QA doing it, but I can only encourage you to try it and then voice your opinions. Ubisoft does not target the casual audience with this, because they know very well that no Farmville audience in this world will ever tough something this complex, no matter how much you dumb it down.

There may be stuff in there to make it more simple to let people get into the game more quickly, but that is necessary in this kind of product, otherwise you don't get a big enough player base (and no, big enough in this case doesn't mean mainstream, this was never intended to be mainstream, it is intended for the SH crowd). if you don't agree with the complexity or other parts, voice your opinions. You may think of free to play whatever you like, but let me tell you this. You have more power here than you think. SH5 you bought and after that you had no more say in it.

This game you don't buy. Ubisoft needs continuous money flow, even if in small amounts per player or big amounts of very few players, doesn't matter. And they also need a lot of people haveing fun with it without ever spending a dime. because the people willing to pay for it won't pay a dime either if there's nobody around to play WITH. And since this is not targeted at mainstream, ubisoft NEEDS this to appeal to you guys, otherwise they'll have sunk money 5000m deep in the atlantic ocean.

So give it a chance, check it out, then tell the team what's good and what's crap. Ubisoft needs this to be a success so they will have to listen this time.

You may think Free-To-Play is just a big money grab... and it is... potentially, and that's completely alright, but compared to legacy methods of selling products, F2P is a huge risk. because if the game doesn't take off, you'll have flushed a huge investment down the toilet. And in case of a company like Ubisoft that hurts, because everybody knows them and sees that happening. That's bad.

So I know this isn't what you wanted, but on the other hand, you never had so much power over a SH game before. Think about it.

Edit: Also one more thing. I'm not the boss of my company. I'm one single developer not even working on the SH team. So I don't speak officially for anyone. I'm just a guy who happens to work for the same company and thought I'd offer some insights from the other side of the fence since I'm just a big a SH fan as you all here. I have tons of WW2 books in my shelf and a lot of them about the Battle of the Atlantic, I ate up SH3 like crazy, trying most of the great mods being pumped out here and did a few myself. Before joining the company and until recenly I also was the co-producer of a free "for fans by fans" game calles Wing Commander Saga, recently released on www.wcsaga.com, that I worked on for 5 years for free, just so that the fans could have a fun space sim game again because EA didn't want to make them anymore. So you see I'm just a big a fan and crazy gamer as you are.
Don't beat me over the head for Ubisoft or even for what my boss decides to accept in terms of a contract or not (but honestly, would YOU have said no if Ubisoft had offered you to make the next SH and you are a fan of the series? REALLY?) I just came here because I know the guys working on this and that they are really trying hard to make it the best game possible. They are really nervious that you might not like it because it is really such a new approach, but they are pumping a lot of work into it, and honestly, the only thing these guys are hoping for right now is for you to give it a chance and then tell them what is good and what isn't, so they can continue working on making this a really good SH game.
That's all I was trying to do. Sorry if I offended anybody in the process. I didn't want to pour gasoline into the fire...

[Sailor Steve]

A convenient excuse. In SH5 the developers did what the publisher told them to. It's not Ubi Romania's fault SH5 is a dog. Are you saying it's different this time?

I don't care if this is good or not - it's not my kind of game. That said, UBI has developed a reputation for shooting themselves in the foot and blaming everyone else for the catastrophe, everyone but themselves.

Originally Posted by KeldorKatarn

Guys, you should really learn the difference between publishers and developers. Ubisoft is just paying for this, they are not developing it.

Alright, the developers should quit and reform as an independent developer, indie games are doing quite well these days. If they don't want to be considered part of Ubisoft then break all ties with them.

[Sonarman]

Originally Posted by Sailor Steve

A convenient excuse. In SH5 the developers did what the publisher told them to. It's not Ubi Romania's fault SH5 is a dog. Are you saying it's different this time?

Even Dan himself took issue with that assessment.

Originally Posted by Elanaiba

Ubisoft is a company, of which Ubisoft Romania is a part. Please stop separating the two. Not everything that is good is our merit, not everything that is bad is "the suits" fault. I, of all people, have my parts in the failures of SH5. The people "high up" could have simply decided not to do another SH, just as you guys can choose not to buy.

Please stop trying to create a war / antagonism between modders and devs, we need each other.

[bigboywooly]

Have played many alleged F2P games on FB
I say alleged cos they all start free but if you want to progress then you gotta pay.
Of course it can be done free but soooo much harder.
Developers exploit the weakness of us punters that want the easy route by forcing purchases down your throat.
Flash games on sites such as FB are basically a time filler. If I want to play SH will fire up SH3 and play how was meant to be played.
Have signed up for the beta but no matter how good it is I wont be parting with any cash.
And if noone else does then Ubi loses out.
Meh

[Dowly]

Originally Posted by KeldorKatarn

There may be stuff in there to make it more simple to let people get into the game more quickly[...]

And that is, imho, something that will result in a lot of flak from the SH fans.
We are simmers, we like complex things. What we don't like is someone holding
our hand and not letting us learn something complex on our own.

But, I will be trying out the game if I get a beta key. If I have fun playing it,
I'll keep playing it.

[KeldorKatarn]

Originally Posted by Dowly

But, I will be trying out the game if I get a beta key. If I have fun playing it, I'll keep playing it.

That's all the guys working on it can ask

[0rpheus]

Originally Posted by KeldorKatarn

So I know this isn't what you wanted, but on the other hand, you never had so much power over a SH game before. Think about it.

I'm playing through WCSaga at the moment, grats on a fine job.

But you're not listening. You're surprised at the reaction and suggest that any of us would've jumped at the chance to develop a new SH game and in that respect you're right. We should also be grateful that a new submarine game is being made at all, no matter the format - because it doesn't happen often.

But to say we have more control than ever is a terribly erroneous statement. We're being given access to a beta, in which we will no doubt make suggestions, some of which will probably end up in the game. But since the game will be tied to a browser, that makes it impossible to mod - and for most of us, it's the mods that make the games playable, because in all cases, even SH3, they were released buggy and flawed.

Now we no longer have that option for SHO, and we are reliant on your people to keep the game up to scratch. Given Ubi and their other teams couldn't manage to fix SH5, the precedent is already set, and the onus is on your team to prove they can do otherwise. Don't expect anyone to hold their breath - things could be different with your guys, they may well be - but until we actually see it, you'll forgive us for being sceptical. If anything, we've never had less control over an SH game before.

And I bet the dev team is nervous, probably because they're starting to realise that if they please the casuals, they'll alienate the simmers, and vice versa, and end up with a flop that pleases neither camp. Really the fault lies with UBI (as usual); whoever thought sim-heads would take well to a browser based game is a retard of the highest (lowest?) calibre, but your boss & the team must have anticipated this reaction.

They could pull a rabbit out of the hat; certainly WCSaga is excellent, and that alone gives me a bit more hope - but its up to your boys to overcome the damage Ubi has done.

I hope they manage it. I also hope they come here and make use of the vast resources of submarine info at the site, as that alone would go a long way to making people feel better about the game.