Surprise: the Big Bang isn’t the beginning of the universe anymore

[Arlo]

Originally Posted by mapuc

I do not claim that I'm absolutely correct in my home made theories when it comes to our universe.

Heck from what I know there could be nothing but emptiness and from nowhere the universe startet to expand.

Well, I guess questioning your own home made theories is a good start.

[mapuc]

What does Quantum Mechanics have to say about nothingness ?

According to quantum mechanics, a vacuum isn't empty at all. It's actually filled with quantum energy and particles that blink in and out of existence for a fleeting moment - strange signals that are known as quantum fluctuations. ... There are no particles there, and nothing to interfere with pure physics.

Markus

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by mapuc

Just having difficulty to believe nothingness can exist.

Good, that is a sign for your sanity.

But you may misunderstand it alltogether. Linearity may be the enemy of imagination.

Pick any of these for start.

https://www.youtube.com/results?sear...auss+lawrence+

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Arlo

Well, I guess questioning your own home made theories is a good start.

You right so I have questioning my own theory about this nothingness.

Can it exist according to quantum mechanics-See above Skybirds comment

Can it exist according to law of physics
Well according to it, it can

Therefore absolute nothingness is impossible. One moer point "nothingness" means "there not being anything (not something)", and "be (being)" means "existence", which according to your definition is an attribute - and an attribute can only be an attribute of something (anything).

So what's correct. Law of Quantum mechanics or Law of Physics ?

Is there some mathematical formula who can support this state of nothingness
I haven't found any. Only some google book.

Markus

[Reece]

God created the universe!

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Reece

God created the universe!

So who created God?

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

So who created God?

[mapuc]

It's nothing but fata morgana all this is being feedet into our brain via pipes, while we lay in this liquid in our coffin.

Yep we are in the Matrix

(this can't be proved-yet)

Markus

[Rockstar]

According to religion God created the universe. According to science it was what they call Quantum Fluctuations.

Neither can be fully explained. Yet both can be defined much the same way. Both predate time and the universe, both are non physical yet act upon the physical both created something from nothing.

Who created God?
Who created quantum fluctuations?

[mapuc]

Let's take about God and its creation

Is God an entity or is the word God a substitut for some very advanced aliens who planted a seed (some type of atoms) and thereafter supervised while it grew.

Then the question is where did these advanced aliens come from.

Quantum fluctuations
Was this planted by God or these advanced aliens.

I think that from the very first start of our universe, there was nothing but this Quantum fluctuations-atoms appear and disappear...until some of them survived.

Another thought
Could there have been a kind of Big Bang from the very first start-A Big Bang who started this Quantum fluctuation ?

Markus

[3catcircus]

An interesting hypothesis is that the big bang is a white hole - that is - everything sucked into a black hole ends up a singularity. That singularity then turns into a new universe via a big bang. Every black hole in this universe turns into a new universe that bubbles off from this one. Our universe bubbled off from a different one via our big bang. Quantum foam in the multiverse.

The real mystery is what is the multiverse...

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by 3catcircus

An interesting hypothesis is that the big bang is a white hole - that is - everything sucked into a black hole ends up a singularity. That singularity then turns into a new universe via a big bang. Every black hole in this universe turns into a new universe that bubbles off from this one. Our universe bubbled off from a different one via our big bang. Quantum foam in the multiverse.

The real mystery is what is the multiverse...

Can't remember his name-Know he's from Asia-Theoretical physicist Use to see him in How the universe work, The universe and Through the Wormhole with Morgan Freeman.

He came up with this hypothesis black on one side-White on the opposite side.

Here's the mathematical formula for multiverses

https://www.scirp.org/journal/paperi...?paperid=67752

Analysis of WMAP and Planck spacecraft data has proved that we live in an invisible Multiverse, referred to as hidden, that has a quaternion structure

Markus

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by mapuc

It's nothing but fata morgana all this is being feedet into our brain via pipes, while we lay in this liquid in our coffin.

Yep we are in the Matrix

(this can't be proved-yet)

Markus

Truer is that we cannot objectively perceive the penultimate, final "reality". With what we perceive of the universe with our senses, we only demonstrate that our senses work according top their inbuilt modus operandi. And thats why for different species with different biological senses, one and the same universe appears to be very different things. We deal with echos of these perceptions that get fed into our brain via physical and chemical electric impulses. While the nature of matter also is somethign very different than what our senses seem to tell us about them.

We can get along. We can orientate ourselves sufficiently to exist for a while. And all the time we probably know NOTHING about how things "really" are. I mean: really "really".


Transcendence can only be had at the price of overlooking, forgetting oneself and one's own inbuilt sensual and intellectual limitations. Thats what meditation originally really is about. Its about the death of the - never having existed - ego, and the big danger therein lies in the easiness by which this can be understood terribly wrong, guiding you deeper and deeper into what you originally wanted to escape from.

The mere circumstance of "wanting" already is the root of all evil in this. And if you want to not want, you nevertheless already have stepped into the trap again.

Suche den Schimmer,
suche den Glanz,
Du findest es nimmer,
findest du es nicht ganz.
(Hans Bemmann: Stein und Flöte)

"If anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross and follow me."
(Mark 8, 34)

"The spirit is of shining clarity, so throw away the darkness of all your terms. Free yourself from everything!"
(Huang Po)


"There exists only one spirit and not a single particle of something different to which one could cling to. Because this spirit is Buddha-nature. If you students that are on the search, cannot awake to this substance of of spirit, then you will overlay the spirit with conceptual, abstract thinkling. Search for Buddha outside, and you will stay bound to external form, religious exercises and more things that are only harmful and are not the way of highets insight [...] Even the smallest thought to cling to this or that, already creates imaginary symbols that lead you back into diverse rebirths."
(Huang Po).

"What we see, never is nature itself, but is nature that is exposed to our way of asking questions about it."
(Werner Heisenberg)

"Therefore, I am the cause of myself according to my essential being which is eternal, but not according to my developing /unfolding apperance/form, which is temporal. And therefore, I am unborn, and according to that, I never can die. By the way of not being born I have existed sinc eall times, and I do exiost now, and will exist forever. What I am by the way of my developiung/unfolding appearance/form, will die and will be ruined, because it is mortal, therefore it will be shattere dby time."
(Meister Eckehart)

The Jews and the Taoists put it best:

"The name of God cannot be pronounced." (Judaism)

"The One Essence that could be known,
is not the essence of the Unknowable,
the idea that could be imagined,
is not the image of the Eternal.
Nameless is the All-One, is inner Essence.
Known by names is the all-many, is outer form.
Resting without desires means to learn the invisible inside.
Acting with desires means to stay with the limited outside.
All-the-One and all-the-many are of the same origin,
different only in appearance and name.
What they have in common, is th wwonder of Being.
The secret of this wonder
is the gate to all understanding."
(Lao Tse).

The summary of it all? By the experience of "Enlightenment", there is nothing that you would additionally gain. If only we would now it! We already are there and never have been somewhere else. The best spiritual practicing is to stopp making a fuss about thes eoh so important questions. Eat when you are hungry, sleep when you are tired, drink when you are thirsty, piss when your bladder is full. How much more obvious can reality be for you?

"Pain is no penalty. Death is no failure. Life is no reward."
(Treya Wilber)

According to religion

"Religion"? Which one? They can be very different. Some are theist and focus on deities and demons, others do not know such conceptions. Some are monotheist, some are multitheist, some are atheist. Some claim a beginning and an end, others dont even know what useful meaning these term could have. And ironically the most poetic genesis story of how the world was created, is even more fictional than all the others, its the song of the Ainur by Tolkien. The metaphor is beautiful, and the idea of matter/existence from music (wave), is not even that far-fetched, scientifically seen. All matter swings in waves, all the world swings in waves.

[Skybird]

Space exploration to me always means two things: the outer and the inner space. And something tells me that if one thinks it to the end, both are just one and the same.

Our world, we living people of today have forgotten this. And thats why our technology and science are off balance and threaten to destroy us. Only materialism. No spirituality. No wonder we are in troubles.

What is spirituality?

To me it is just this, only this and nothig else: the asking of the questions that every mind of sufficient complexity to form any concept of self-awareness and an understanding for its own mortality in one way or the other must ask and cannot avoid to ask and cannot run away from:

Who am I?
Where do i come from?
Ho much time do I have?

We are thanatophobic, and think all materialism and science as ways to trick death and run away from it. We may run. But we can't hide.

What is death? The dropping of the veil of Maya: What gets revealed behind it is only what always has been, since always. We never were away from it, and we thus never can return to it.



It is.

[Rockstar]

Originally Posted by Skybird

"Religion"? Which one? They can be very different. Some are theiostic and focus on deities and demons, others do not know such conceptions. Some claim a beginning and an end, others dont even know what useful meaning these term could have. And ironically the most poetic genweis story of how the world was created, is even more ficitknal than all the bothers, its the song of the Ainur by Tolkien. The metaphor is beautiful, and the idea of matter/existence from music (wave), is not even that far-fetched, scientifically seen. All matter swings in waves, all the world swings in waves.

Take your pick. I don’t think any one religion has the market cornered on truth. Though it seems to me most ancient religions have a source for the creation of the universe. What makes them different and diverge from one another is in the retelling of that story.