Any interest in a 1983 Grenada Mission?

Stewy1 · 06-22-20, 04:38 AM

G'day guys,

Just wanted to sound you out about something.

I've been reading and researching a lot into the U.S. invasion of Grenada, in October, 1983.

I was thinking of planning a mission, where you leave San Juan, Puerto Rico, to operate alone in the Caribbean, in the week before the invasion (and leave Grenadian waters when the Independence and Guam Task Groups arrive)

Questions for you all (because this'll take me a few days of solid mission writing - I have holidays coming up):

1. Would there be an interest in a longer mission like this, or not?
2. Would you prefer to play Perry (Clifton Sprague is not in DW, Underwood would be a fair substitute), or the Urgent Fury subs - Sturgeon (Silversides) or LA Flt 1 (Portsmouth) - obviously there would be advantages and disadvantages to each platform - and it would dictate the style of mission too...

What do you think, guys? Worth making a mission like this? or Nah?

Cheers guys,
Stew

FPSchazly · 06-22-20, 07:06 AM

Hello, Stewy!

Well, for those of us who aren't that familiar with Grenada '83, what would the missions entail?

p7p8 · 06-22-20, 03:01 PM

1. Mission should be shorter because your last very long mission was never completed because you focused on familygrams instead mission goals.
2. For me Perry would be more interesting. We have many single player missions for submarines and only few for surfs. Also long missions are more interesting from surf perspective. For example helo management could be crucial for success of operation.

Polak2 · 06-24-20, 10:19 AM

I think I also would be interested in surface version of the mission but above all I would like to hear some tips on how to go about designing missions in DW. Lately, I read and re-read DW Scenario Building Manual and found the entire subject of Mission building in DW still fascinating as far as the scope and potential possibility hidden there.

Terms like Scripts and Doctrine Language and many others are pretty fascinating and I can see that original SONALYST designers really "went to town " by giving us quite a tool and RA folks really pushed this area of developing of those doctrines for ever new types of weapons and platforms and putting it to really good use. I do realize that Doctrine files are not precisely what Mission language is about but I think they are similar.

I was also watching FTPShazly rather short DW Mission Designer intro video and found it also interesting and helpful (perhaps we could have more than 1 video). Then subsequently I am planning to watch and rewatch p7p8 missions to learn from there as well.

So to sum up what I am blabbing here about is to suggest that this plan to make Operation Urgent Fury83 could be done in form of the blog or vlog of how one goes about with designing missions in DW. Could be perhaps really interesting if this could end up collaboration of the experts here and open discussion about solutions "how to" create believable missions and campaigns.

Stewy1 · 06-24-20, 03:56 PM

Ok, thanks for the feedback, gents.

Looks like it's Perry for the win.

Therefore the type of missions would be ASW, ASuW, air-defence (defense), gunfire support, counter-piracy, liaison with friendly forces, etc.

I might try and 'chop these up' into a few shorter missions.

I had started to make the Grenada mission with the Perry - beginning with a naval gunfire ex off the Vieques Is. Range. But then I hit a snag when I found out that only air platforms can be resupplied in the mission editor.

(starting a week in the Caribbean with no rounds for the gun put a big spanner in the works!)

I might as well finish the gunfire ex and see what you think.

Cheers,
Stew

p7p8 · 06-25-20, 11:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polak2

I am planning to watch and rewatch p7p8 missions to learn from there as well.

Thx but my missions are hard to learning for someone who isn't familiar with editor.
You should use filters because some objects and tactics makes general view not clear for learning.

I made 3 videos for mission makers. One video is simple mission made from scratch to end + test.

But for good mission most important is some kind of sketch with main idea. Without this you will stuck on details. I always make it in my head, (sometimes details on paper).
I recommend to make scenario in "Top-down" method. Otherwise detaills will eat your motivation and you will stuck with nothing.

Very important is map region cause DW havent good drawed shore line and depth/hight map.

Historical mission for first scenario is very bad idea. Its because DW have many limits (for example not all warships/submarines in database). Experienced mission designer is able to use some substitutes for ships but also for trigger solutions (not all is available)

Here is video from making full simple mission.

If you stuck with triggers i can always help. Mission editor is very "stubborn" sometimes but i knows few tricks

Janus · 07-01-20, 03:33 AM

I'm not at all familiar with the navy part of Urgent Fury (did Urgent Fury even include the navy parts of the operation or was that only the land forces effort?), so I would be interested in a longer scenario which is inspired by the events in 1983.

Playability should precede historical accuracy in terms of involved platforms and missions/tasks assigned to the player.
I would not try too hard to recreate specific historical events as it might bog you down and be frustrating. I don't have much DW mission design experience but have learned this from designing historically inspired missions for other games (I made a battle of Mount Longdon mission for the Falklands mod for Operation Flashpoint once).

A single, longer mission might work better when the player drives a sub as it operates more independently whereas a surface platform needs to coordinate more with other platforms controlled by the AI. This is harder to orchestrate and get right in the mission editor I guess?

Do you have any book recommendations on the Grenada invasion (both naval and land campaign)? Or did you use online resources only?

06-22-20, 04:38 AM	#1
Stewy1 Girt by Sea Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Red Route 1 Posts: 363 Downloads: 131 Uploads: 34	Any interest in a 1983 Grenada Mission? G'day guys, Just wanted to sound you out about something. I've been reading and researching a lot into the U.S. invasion of Grenada, in October, 1983. I was thinking of planning a mission, where you leave San Juan, Puerto Rico, to operate alone in the Caribbean, in the week before the invasion (and leave Grenadian waters when the Independence and Guam Task Groups arrive) Questions for you all (because this'll take me a few days of solid mission writing - I have holidays coming up): 1. Would there be an interest in a longer mission like this, or not? 2. Would you prefer to play Perry (Clifton Sprague is not in DW, Underwood would be a fair substitute), or the Urgent Fury subs - Sturgeon (Silversides) or LA Flt 1 (Portsmouth) - obviously there would be advantages and disadvantages to each platform - and it would dictate the style of mission too... What do you think, guys? Worth making a mission like this? or Nah? Cheers guys, Stew

06-22-20, 07:06 AM	#2
FPSchazly Good Hunting! Join Date: Apr 2014 Location: Maryland Posts: 771 Downloads: 15 Uploads: 1	Hello, Stewy! Well, for those of us who aren't that familiar with Grenada '83, what would the missions entail? __________________ Your friendly neighborhood modern submarine YouTuber. My videos: Exclusive Look at Modern Naval Warfare! Dangerous Waters Liu Doctrine (LwAmi Learn to play Dangerous Waters

06-22-20, 03:01 PM	#3
p7p8 Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 742 Downloads: 136 Uploads: 6	1. Mission should be shorter because your last very long mission was never completed because you focused on familygrams instead mission goals. 2. For me Perry would be more interesting. We have many single player missions for submarines and only few for surfs. Also long missions are more interesting from surf perspective. For example helo management could be crucial for success of operation. __________________

06-24-20, 10:19 AM	#4
Polak2 Weps Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 371 Downloads: 60 Uploads: 0	I think I also would be interested in surface version of the mission but above all I would like to hear some tips on how to go about designing missions in DW. Lately, I read and re-read DW Scenario Building Manual and found the entire subject of Mission building in DW still fascinating as far as the scope and potential possibility hidden there. Terms like Scripts and Doctrine Language and many others are pretty fascinating and I can see that original SONALYST designers really "went to town " by giving us quite a tool and RA folks really pushed this area of developing of those doctrines for ever new types of weapons and platforms and putting it to really good use. I do realize that Doctrine files are not precisely what Mission language is about but I think they are similar. I was also watching FTPShazly rather short DW Mission Designer intro video and found it also interesting and helpful (perhaps we could have more than 1 video). Then subsequently I am planning to watch and rewatch p7p8 missions to learn from there as well. So to sum up what I am blabbing here about is to suggest that this plan to make Operation Urgent Fury83 could be done in form of the blog or vlog of how one goes about with designing missions in DW. Could be perhaps really interesting if this could end up collaboration of the experts here and open discussion about solutions "how to" create believable missions and campaigns.

06-24-20, 03:56 PM	#5
Stewy1 Girt by Sea Join Date: Mar 2015 Location: Red Route 1 Posts: 363 Downloads: 131 Uploads: 34	Ok, thanks for the feedback, gents. Looks like it's Perry for the win. Therefore the type of missions would be ASW, ASuW, air-defence (defense), gunfire support, counter-piracy, liaison with friendly forces, etc. I might try and 'chop these up' into a few shorter missions. I had started to make the Grenada mission with the Perry - beginning with a naval gunfire ex off the Vieques Is. Range. But then I hit a snag when I found out that only air platforms can be resupplied in the mission editor. (starting a week in the Caribbean with no rounds for the gun put a big spanner in the works!) I might as well finish the gunfire ex and see what you think. Cheers, Stew

07-01-20, 03:33 AM	#7
Janus XO Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 434 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	I'm not at all familiar with the navy part of Urgent Fury (did Urgent Fury even include the navy parts of the operation or was that only the land forces effort?), so I would be interested in a longer scenario which is inspired by the events in 1983. Playability should precede historical accuracy in terms of involved platforms and missions/tasks assigned to the player. I would not try too hard to recreate specific historical events as it might bog you down and be frustrating. I don't have much DW mission design experience but have learned this from designing historically inspired missions for other games (I made a battle of Mount Longdon mission for the Falklands mod for Operation Flashpoint once). A single, longer mission might work better when the player drives a sub as it operates more independently whereas a surface platform needs to coordinate more with other platforms controlled by the AI. This is harder to orchestrate and get right in the mission editor I guess? Do you have any book recommendations on the Grenada invasion (both naval and land campaign)? Or did you use online resources only?