Getting constant BSODs when playing Skryim - Page 2

frau kaleun · 10-03-13, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kaleun

Do you have an Asus sound card?? if you do, make sure the DSP mode in the Audio software isn't set to GX - its Asus' emulation of EAX and causes loads of crashes in games.

Yes, I do, and changing that setting may be one of the things I did, because I did go in and check the settings since they've given me odd problems before. Altho I think I usually have it set on the Music or Gaming button and if I'm happy with the sound I'm getting I don't ever go in and change anything, ever, mostly due to the fact that it usually results in the aforementioned odd problems.

I did that early on in the process of looking for culprits, though, so I dunno. But honestly I could swear there've been times when I had to go in and reset things in there that got fouled up without me ever touching them... that card gave me fits for a while when I first got it. Another reason why I rarely mess with the settings.

frau kaleun · 10-03-13, 07:36 PM

GAAAAAAAH.

After playing about three hours last night with no problems, after about an hour tonight the game started crashing again. Sometimes it just crashes to desktop, sometimes the whole screen just goes black and the whole system reboots.

No BSODs so nothing to check there and the Events log just shows the same errors I was getting before, all of which I've already tried (and apparently failed) to remedy. The AODDriver4.01 etc. stuff is all back in Device Manager and the registry so I'm wondering if it's stuff that gets installed when you install the gfx drivers regardless of what version you have. Since I installed those clean and fresh, you'd think I wouldn't be getting errors about files not being found but... there they are. I don't even know if that's what's causing the problem.

I'm getting back to the notion of just reinstalling Windows and everything else onto a reformatted hard drive to see what happens. I've checked the hardware temps over the course of the evening and there still don't seem to be any red flags there, I've got the case open and all fans are running and I can hear them speeding up properly when the game is loaded. Can't find any loose connections anywhere.

frau kaleun · 10-03-13, 07:55 PM

Okay so I went into the software for the soundcard and I SWEAR it looks like the settings have changed since I looked at it the last time. Tinkered with that and with the Windows config for playback devices to get it back to what I think it was when everything was working okay. We'll see what happens but I'm not getting my hopes up.

Edit: Aaaaaand we have my first BSOD in two days. At least now I've got something to interpret the dump file.

Arclight · 10-03-13, 08:43 PM

Considering the other issues... Might try a reinstall. I'd say it's just mod soup or driver crashing (pushing that engine too far perhaps, with the added mods) but if the issues extend outside the game that doesn't really explain it.

In terms of actual hardware failing, my first guess would be the HD. Graphics card issues tend to result in a corrupted image, failing CPU and RAM tend to affect boot as well (failed boot > beeps error code).

Just taking the thing apart and putting it back together can magically fix things as well. Do some cleaning while you're in there. Just reseating the RAM has "fixed" many a system (though in that case they would generally be angrily beeping a code at you).

frau kaleun · 10-03-13, 09:20 PM

The file that got pegged as the likeliest culprit is afd.sys, which appears to be used by a wide variety of devices. A lot of the support stuff online links related crashes to outdated firmware for networking devices, and there is an update for my wireless router so I'm taking care of that right now. Windows searched and said the driver for the network adapter on the 'puter was already up to date.

I went into services.msc after a successful reboot and tried to see if the associated service for that driver is starting up and running with the OS, but I'm not sure what the name of the service would be or if there would even be one to look for. Something to do with Winsock? I dunno. Also checking out some of the services that show up as totally disabled but as far as I can tell they are all things that I don't use or need and have never enabled for that reason, stuff for SmartCard readers and people running web servers.

But I also think the reinstall is probably a good idea at this point. I have changed so many things, including tinkering with the registry, and used System Restore a couple times, and done so much stuff that I'm starting to lose track of what I did and when and whether or not I undid it (if that was even possible) after it didn't have any effect. And I've also just this evening had the computer crash (altho not to BSOD) while the game was NOT running which seems to indicate that the problem is not with the game/mod files, but something that is exacerbated by me running the game. Or else I've been running the game so much trying to recreate the problem that a crash I would have had anyway happens when it's loaded and is much worse because of that.

If I do a complete reinstall and still have problems then I might have to accept that it's hardware, but you are right that sometimes just getting in there and resetting stuff is a good idea. Altho I agree that if it were the GPU I would probably be seeing lag and/or a degradation of gfx quality somewhere, which isn't happening. Everything runs and looks great right up until the moment the whole system goes down.

frau kaleun · 10-15-13, 03:29 PM

Update: I did end up completely wiping my boot drive (and my "gaming" drive, just in case) and reinstalling everything from the OS on up. Also opened the case and checked connections and gave everything a good dust-off, altho there really wasn't much to clean off. I also removed the heatsink/fan from the CPU and cleaned that and put new thermal paste down to reseat it.

Anyhoo what with one thing and another (not to mention all the hours and hours it took to get everything reinstalled) I didn't get a chance to play the game at all until this past weekend, but I've played several times - in one instance for 4-5 hours straight - without any issues at all.

I'm still thinking it was an issue with the graphics drivers not updating/uninstalling properly, as I had THREE entries in the registry for three different versions of the same graphics driver. I think they even reappeared after I tried to manually delete them so something there just wasn't right. After the clean reinstall, there's only one entry for the current and correct version.

But whatevs, everything's running faster and cleaner now all around and Skyrim isn't crashing my whole system so I'm happy.

Skybird · 10-15-13, 03:40 PM

GFX drivers are a very dubious bunch of clowns. Although it is said that you can trust nowadaysw (in case of nVidia drivers) to just install one version over the next and the installation taking care of everything necessary, I found this to be wrong on several occasions. So, I ALWAYS manually delete the old driver before installing another version. Since system restore also never has earned my trust, but failed almost every time I ever cared to try it, it is no option either.

Another good advice is to stick with the version that works stable for you and your needs, it does not matter if you use a version that is two years old. If it works for your needs and your stuff, then it works for your needs and stuff. I think "updating" gfx drivers never has solved any issue for me that I ever might have had. And often trying out a new driver version just introduced new problems to me, leading me to moving back to the former version again.

Some things just need to be done manually, the hard way. That might be old-fashioned - but in case of gfx drivers it is the only thing that works for me, since very long time.

frau kaleun · 10-15-13, 06:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skybird

GFX drivers are a very dubious bunch of clowns. Although it is said that you can trust nowadaysw (in case of nVidia drivers) to just install one version over the next and the installation taking care of everything necessary, I found this to be wrong on several occasions. So, I ALWAYS manually delete the old driver before installing another version. Since system restore also never has earned my trust, but failed almost every time I ever cared to try it, it is no option either.

Another good advice is to stick with the version that works stable for you and your needs, it does not matter if you use a version that is two years old. If it works for your needs and your stuff, then it works for your needs and stuff. I think "updating" gfx drivers never has solved any issue for me that I ever might have had. And often trying out a new driver version just introduced new problems to me, leading me to moving back to the former version again.

Some things just need to be done manually, the hard way. That might be old-fashioned - but in case of gfx drivers it is the only thing that works for me, since very long time.

Very true and typically I ignore all notices to update gfx drivers as long as everything is working okay. About the only time I update them is if I'm having problems or if I install a completely new card - and I always completely uninstall what I've got before installing the new software, but as you say it seems like the "normal" way of doing that is insufficient sometimes. There were obviously traces of old drivers on my system and I think Windows was being led to look for files that were outdated and/or no longer there, because that was the continual message showing up in the error logs - that some service related to the gfx was looking for a file and not finding it and shutting down as a result.

When I started over from scratch this time I used the drivers on the disc that came with this card and I'm not going to experiment with anything different unless I start having issues again. When I was online looking for solutions I did see something about a "cleaner" program that was supposed to *completely* remove all traces of ATI gfx software from your system prior to updating or reinstalling... I didn't look into it as I'd already pretty much resigned myself to wiping everything and working up from the OS but I will definitely keep that idea in mind for the future rather than relying on the uninstall options that come from ATI or Windows itself.

NeonSamurai · 01-07-14, 09:31 PM

Honestly it is always recommendable to reinstall the os when changing major components on one's computer. Heck I've had windows go completely berserk and refuse to boot without BSODing almost immediately, due to a straight up board swap, even though it was the exact same model and revision number as the previous board (an identical board). Plus as mentioned by others, drivers can be rather temperamental just on their own.

frau kaleun · 01-22-14, 10:44 AM

Well, it has been running fine since the reinstall. I took a new character all the way to level 60-something with no crashes, using all the same mods so it definitely wasn't a mod issue or overloading the graphics card with hi-res textures or anything. I'm assuming it was the problem with the residue of old gfx drivers on my system, that seems to have been the most likely culprit.

Wolferz · 03-28-14, 07:21 AM

Better late than never.
It's always a good idea to renew your OS install when you start noticing gremlins interrupting your fav game. Windows OS's are notorious when they get a little aged.
I always try to follow a bi-yearly OS reinstall schedule to pre-empt the shenanigans before they get started. Because once they do get started, they can begin to hammer your hardware. Like the little Gremlin in the Bugs Bunny cartoons. The one who wanted to hammer the bombs.

When I began reading this thread, I knew Frau K would apply all the proper logic in order to find the solution.

The only mistake I saw was the non-use of an engineering notebook to keep track of what had been tried, changed, changed back, tried again, changed again, changed back again and POOF! Hang it all I'm reinstalling EVERYTHING!

Well done me little Skyrim junkie.

10-03-13, 07:55 PM	#18
frau kaleun Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Skyri--oh who are we kidding, I'm probably at Lowe's. Again. Posts: 12,706 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	Okay so I went into the software for the soundcard and I SWEAR it looks like the settings have changed since I looked at it the last time. Tinkered with that and with the Windows config for playback devices to get it back to what I think it was when everything was working okay. We'll see what happens but I'm not getting my hopes up. Edit: Aaaaaand we have my first BSOD in two days. At least now I've got something to interpret the dump file. Last edited by frau kaleun; 10-03-13 at 08:09 PM.

10-03-13, 08:43 PM	#19
Arclight Navy Seal Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Land of windmills, tulips, wooden shoes and cheese. Lots of cheese. Posts: 8,467 Downloads: 53 Uploads: 10	Considering the other issues... Might try a reinstall. I'd say it's just mod soup or driver crashing (pushing that engine too far perhaps, with the added mods) but if the issues extend outside the game that doesn't really explain it. In terms of actual hardware failing, my first guess would be the HD. Graphics card issues tend to result in a corrupted image, failing CPU and RAM tend to affect boot as well (failed boot > beeps error code). Just taking the thing apart and putting it back together can magically fix things as well. Do some cleaning while you're in there. Just reseating the RAM has "fixed" many a system (though in that case they would generally be angrily beeping a code at you). __________________ Contritium praecedit superbia.

10-15-13, 03:40 PM	#22
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 40,532 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	GFX drivers are a very dubious bunch of clowns. Although it is said that you can trust nowadaysw (in case of nVidia drivers) to just install one version over the next and the installation taking care of everything necessary, I found this to be wrong on several occasions. So, I ALWAYS manually delete the old driver before installing another version. Since system restore also never has earned my trust, but failed almost every time I ever cared to try it, it is no option either. Another good advice is to stick with the version that works stable for you and your needs, it does not matter if you use a version that is two years old. If it works for your needs and your stuff, then it works for your needs and stuff. I think "updating" gfx drivers never has solved any issue for me that I ever might have had. And often trying out a new driver version just introduced new problems to me, leading me to moving back to the former version again. Some things just need to be done manually, the hard way. That might be old-fashioned - but in case of gfx drivers it is the only thing that works for me, since very long time. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-07-14, 09:31 PM	#24
NeonSamurai Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Socialist Republic of Kanadia Posts: 3,044 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	Honestly it is always recommendable to reinstall the os when changing major components on one's computer. Heck I've had windows go completely berserk and refuse to boot without BSODing almost immediately, due to a straight up board swap, even though it was the exact same model and revision number as the previous board (an identical board). Plus as mentioned by others, drivers can be rather temperamental just on their own. __________________ SH3 Newbie Guide Links and other helpfull stuff

03-28-14, 07:21 AM	#26
Wolferz Navy Seal Join Date: May 2007 Location: On a mighty quest for the Stick of Truth Posts: 5,963 Downloads: 52 Uploads: 0	Fashionably late to the party. Better late than never. It's always a good idea to renew your OS install when you start noticing gremlins interrupting your fav game. Windows OS's are notorious when they get a little aged. I always try to follow a bi-yearly OS reinstall schedule to pre-empt the shenanigans before they get started. Because once they do get started, they can begin to hammer your hardware. Like the little Gremlin in the Bugs Bunny cartoons. The one who wanted to hammer the bombs. When I began reading this thread, I knew Frau K would apply all the proper logic in order to find the solution. The only mistake I saw was the non-use of an engineering notebook to keep track of what had been tried, changed, changed back, tried again, changed again, changed back again and POOF! Hang it all I'm reinstalling EVERYTHING! Well done me little Skyrim junkie. __________________ Tomorrow never comes

10-03-13, 07:36 PM	#17
frau kaleun Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Skyri--oh who are we kidding, I'm probably at Lowe's. Again. Posts: 12,706 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	GAAAAAAAH. After playing about three hours last night with no problems, after about an hour tonight the game started crashing again. Sometimes it just crashes to desktop, sometimes the whole screen just goes black and the whole system reboots. No BSODs so nothing to check there and the Events log just shows the same errors I was getting before, all of which I've already tried (and apparently failed) to remedy. The AODDriver4.01 etc. stuff is all back in Device Manager and the registry so I'm wondering if it's stuff that gets installed when you install the gfx drivers regardless of what version you have. Since I installed those clean and fresh, you'd think I wouldn't be getting errors about files not being found but... there they are. I don't even know if that's what's causing the problem. I'm getting back to the notion of just reinstalling Windows and everything else onto a reformatted hard drive to see what happens. I've checked the hardware temps over the course of the evening and there still don't seem to be any red flags there, I've got the case open and all fans are running and I can hear them speeding up properly when the game is loaded. Can't find any loose connections anywhere.

10-03-13, 09:20 PM	#20
frau kaleun Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Skyri--oh who are we kidding, I'm probably at Lowe's. Again. Posts: 12,706 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	The file that got pegged as the likeliest culprit is afd.sys, which appears to be used by a wide variety of devices. A lot of the support stuff online links related crashes to outdated firmware for networking devices, and there is an update for my wireless router so I'm taking care of that right now. Windows searched and said the driver for the network adapter on the 'puter was already up to date. I went into services.msc after a successful reboot and tried to see if the associated service for that driver is starting up and running with the OS, but I'm not sure what the name of the service would be or if there would even be one to look for. Something to do with Winsock? I dunno. Also checking out some of the services that show up as totally disabled but as far as I can tell they are all things that I don't use or need and have never enabled for that reason, stuff for SmartCard readers and people running web servers. But I also think the reinstall is probably a good idea at this point. I have changed so many things, including tinkering with the registry, and used System Restore a couple times, and done so much stuff that I'm starting to lose track of what I did and when and whether or not I undid it (if that was even possible) after it didn't have any effect. And I've also just this evening had the computer crash (altho not to BSOD) while the game was NOT running which seems to indicate that the problem is not with the game/mod files, but something that is exacerbated by me running the game. Or else I've been running the game so much trying to recreate the problem that a crash I would have had anyway happens when it's loaded and is much worse because of that. If I do a complete reinstall and still have problems then I might have to accept that it's hardware, but you are right that sometimes just getting in there and resetting stuff is a good idea. Altho I agree that if it were the GPU I would probably be seeing lag and/or a degradation of gfx quality somewhere, which isn't happening. Everything runs and looks great right up until the moment the whole system goes down.

10-15-13, 03:29 PM	#21
frau kaleun Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Skyri--oh who are we kidding, I'm probably at Lowe's. Again. Posts: 12,706 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	Update: I did end up completely wiping my boot drive (and my "gaming" drive, just in case) and reinstalling everything from the OS on up. Also opened the case and checked connections and gave everything a good dust-off, altho there really wasn't much to clean off. I also removed the heatsink/fan from the CPU and cleaned that and put new thermal paste down to reseat it. Anyhoo what with one thing and another (not to mention all the hours and hours it took to get everything reinstalled) I didn't get a chance to play the game at all until this past weekend, but I've played several times - in one instance for 4-5 hours straight - without any issues at all. I'm still thinking it was an issue with the graphics drivers not updating/uninstalling properly, as I had THREE entries in the registry for three different versions of the same graphics driver. I think they even reappeared after I tried to manually delete them so something there just wasn't right. After the clean reinstall, there's only one entry for the current and correct version. But whatevs, everything's running faster and cleaner now all around and Skyrim isn't crashing my whole system so I'm happy.

01-22-14, 10:44 AM	#25
frau kaleun Rear Admiral Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Skyri--oh who are we kidding, I'm probably at Lowe's. Again. Posts: 12,706 Downloads: 168 Uploads: 0	Well, it has been running fine since the reinstall. I took a new character all the way to level 60-something with no crashes, using all the same mods so it definitely wasn't a mod issue or overloading the graphics card with hi-res textures or anything. I'm assuming it was the problem with the residue of old gfx drivers on my system, that seems to have been the most likely culprit.