How long does it REALLY take to reload torpedo tubes?

[PL_Harpoon]

Originally Posted by shipkiller1

You could put the variable in one of the config files so the hard core guys can change it.

Actually, that's already done.

It's in config.txt under difficulty settings:

PlayerWeaponReloadTime=0.8,1,1.5,2

The value of 1 means 30s in 1x time scale.
I already tested the game with a value of 15 (7.5 minutes, so that 2 torps cam be loaded in 15) and was actually surprised how little effect this had on gameplay (or maybe I adjusted quickly to the new situation).

[Ramius]

Originally Posted by shipkiller1

Lido's fish and chips in Helensburgh...

You'll be asking for a battered Mars bar or deep fried pizza too I suppose

[Steiger]

Originally Posted by PL_Harpoon

Actually, that's already done.

It's in config.txt under difficulty settings:


The value of 1 means 30s in 1x time scale.
I already tested the game with a value of 15 (7.5 minutes, so that 2 torps cam be loaded in 15) and was actually surprised how little effect this had on gameplay (or maybe I adjusted quickly to the new situation).

The genesis of this question is rooted in the Soviet campaign that I'm working on. I've build 10-ship convoys that the player has to attack - with the old 30-second reload, the player can infinitely spam the seas with torps, and a miss is not a big deal. With a 7 minute reload, and 6 tubes on some Soviet vessels, this will add a deeper tactical layer to the game I think. Missing a ship, or wasting too many torps on the same target will become a problem. It's already a problem in my play testing and that's with a 30 second reload.

[Julhelm]

Originally Posted by shipkiller1

Look, I am just telling you reality. Polmar was a researcher and journalist and never had to do this.

Personally, I do not think the weapon reload times need to be changed. I don't find that a short (with respect to reality) reload time a big deal.
They keep the balance and flow of what you are trying to do high.

If you increase the reload times too much, then the non-hardcore sub-sim gamer will not find the game fun and not recommend it to their friends.. and that is the end game here.

You could put the variable in one of the config files so the hard core guys can change it.

I am a realism nut, but I find the game highly entertaining, and I have recommended it to the guys in the office. We are all retired submarine Fire Control Chiefs (E7's and E8's). We are the tech reps and engineers that have to fly to where ever to fix the boat when it is broke, which means we spend a lot of time overseas. Scotland is my favorite place to go....

I am a realism nut as well to a degree, but yes, the game has to be enjoyable. This is entertainment software after all. We originally had a 1:30 reload time but I always felt this was a bit on the tedious side, so we brought it down to be faster. We never factored in you can reload two tubes at a time though, which means it took the Germans and Soviets about 3:30 to reload one of their bow tubes.

The reload times are in the vessel data files under the weapon systems block. Players can simply edit this value to what they think works best.
For some reason rate of fire is never given for submarines while it is for surface ships.

[shipkiller1]

Rate of fire is determined by how fast the ejection pump can cycle. Usually in about 30 seconds or so. Each tube has its own slide valve. You can only have one slide valve open per bank. These are mechanically and electrically interlocked. We have not used compressed air to directly eject a weapon for 60 years or so...

We use compressed air to move the ejection pump piston which moves the water cylinder forcing seawater up through the Impulse tank. The impulse tank is a vertical tank which has both tubes running through it.. The slide valve for the tube being shot opens and allows the water from the impulse tank into the tube, thus forcing the torpedo out with HUGE force.... three to four G'sss This is one of the reasons you can launch at any speed.
Here is a crude quick drawing:


You can be draining/loading a tube at the same time you are shooting the other tube in the bank. The cycle time is from the time of fire to when the ejection pump ram goes back to battery, ready for the next shot..
zz

[ollie1983]

After conversing with a former serving crewman, he reckoned provided the required weapon was on the rack right behind the tube in question, he reckons 2-3 minutes tops.

It is rather more complex when the weapon has to be moved around as it stowed away in the wrong place, when it all becomes a bit like a sliding puzzle as you need to move other weapons around to make a slot for the one you want. This could take 15 minutes or more.

[PL_Harpoon]

Originally Posted by shipkiller1

Rate of fire is determined by how fast the ejection pump can cycle. Usually in about 30 seconds or so. Each tube has its own slide valve. You can only have one slide valve open per bank. These are mechanically and electrically interlocked. We have not used compressed air to directly eject a weapon for 60 years or so...

We use compressed air to move the ejection pump piston which moves the water cylinder forcing seawater up through the Impulse tank. The impulse tank is a vertical tank which has both tubes running through it.. The slide valve for the tube being shot opens and allows the water from the impulse tank into the tube, thus forcing the torpedo out with HUGE force.... three to four G'sss This is one of the reasons you can launch at any speed.
Here is a crude quick drawing:


You can be draining/loading a tube at the same time you are shooting the other tube in the bank. The cycle time is from the time of fire to when the ejection pump ram goes back to battery, ready for the next shot..
zz

Funny that I was just about to ask about this. So Fast Attack was correct in a sense that you can have only one torpedo door open per side.

Originally Posted by ollie1983

After conversing with a former serving crewman, he reckoned provided the required weapon was on the rack right behind the tube in question, he reckons 2-3 minutes tops.

It is rather more complex when the weapon has to be moved around as it stowed away in the wrong place, when it all becomes a bit like a sliding puzzle as you need to move other weapons around to make a slot for the one you want. This could take 15 minutes or more.

It would be really cool to see that implemented in the game too. Just small additions like that could add a lot of depth to the game.

And before someone says it would be too unintuitive for a game, no it wouldn't. You could just make the "stores" panel look something like that:



A simple glance at this panel would give you an idea how can you reload a desired weapon.
Then, in between missions you could rearrange the stores by simply dragging a weapon into selected slots. The same would apply to refitting at port.

Great post Harpoon, I agree.
This is one of the many small details that turns a game into a deeper sim without making things complicated, I feel.

[shipkiller1]

Both outer doors can be open at the same time. Just one slide valve.

[ChaosDuck7]

Originally Posted by PL_Harpoon

/snip

Thats an AWESOME concept picture. I always thought the weapon management screen in the game needed an overhaul.

[PL_Harpoon]

Originally Posted by shipkiller1

Both outer doors can be open at the same time. Just one slide valve.

Ok, but you still need to open the slide valve to launch the torpedo, right?
So you can't launch the second tube if the first one is open?
Or is it that after launching a tube you can close the slide valves but keep the tube open to not loose the wire, then refill the tank and shoot the second tube?

[ikalugin]

Originally Posted by Wiz33

It's not that long, close the tube door, pump out water (probably slowly to reduce noise), check and clean the tube for any debris that was trapped, remove the old wire spool and any other electronics connections. load new weapon (which won't be that fast given the 3500lbs weight). re-attached new wire spool/electronics. close torp door and given that any weapon handling is probably double or triple checked. That's totally reason. They may speed it up in an emergency but given that anything that has to do with watertight integrity is of the highest priority on a sub. 15 minutes under combat condition still sound reasonable.

On soviet subs there is no need to remove the wire spool.

[shipkiller1]

Originally Posted by PL_Harpoon

Ok, but you still need to open the slide valve to launch the torpedo, right?
So you can't launch the second tube if the first one is open?
Or is it that after launching a tube you can close the slide valves but keep the tube open to not loose the wire, then refill the tank and shoot the second tube?

Correct.

[shipkiller1]

The silver canister on the back of the torpedo in the pictures is called the Torpedo Mounted Dispenser (TMD). It contains approx 10kyds of guidance wire, with 250 yards is enclosed in a armored sheath call the Flex Hose. The TMD primary purpose is to pay out wire to compensate for own ship maneuvers.. The torpedo still has its own spool.

This is why I say the wires fail too often in the game...

[jmr]

It's sucks that the wire fails too often because from what I remember from Dangerous Waters is that you always want to fire in a lag LOS but in CW that means wire break.