Do you keep your RADAR on?

Vaux · 08-24-10, 08:50 AM

I finally got RADAR. The funny thing is that the default action seems to be to have it off. I'll go to the RADAR station and the scope is dark. I turn it on, set it to sweep, but when the watch changes it's off again. Is it not a good idea to keep the RADAR on all the time? Did the Japs have detection equipment?

fred8615 · 08-24-10, 09:24 AM

It's not "off" it's just not doing an automatic sweep. Whenever you go to the radar room, it turns off the auto sweep for some reason. You have to manually turn it back on, and then it'll stay on until you go to the radar room again.

BTW, if you're using an older version of SH4, the surface search radar would not turn back on automatically if you submerged and then resurfaced. You would have to turn it on each time manually. But in either patch 1.4 or 1.5 they fixed it so it would come back on by itself when surfacing, even if you turn it off yourself before submerging.

As for Japanese detection equipment, they do get it sometime in 1944.

Whippy · 08-24-10, 10:08 AM

HAHAHA I could have sworn the enemy had RADAR detection sometimes when they "magically" seem to detect me! I think I just have a knack for attracting the most experienced destroyer crews from the IJN

lol I'm glad to know that it is not my RADAR that is giving my position away so often but other factors.

There sure seems to be a lot of Floridians is these forums! ...that's just fine by me because I am by birth Floridian.

Armistead · 08-24-10, 10:28 AM

Mods probably differ, but you can tell when they get radar detection. If you're 12 nms away and they come fast at you is one clue. With mods you can get radar detection with the APR1 unit, so you know what ships have surface radar, almost always capital ships and they will vector escorts right on top of you.

I almost always turn my radar off and check for a few seconds as needed after mid 43, although it may be 44 until they get it. I think it's possible the Yamato and a few capital ships have it earlier.

Rockin Robbins · 08-24-10, 01:39 PM

Your radar tells you their position, heading and speed. Their radar detector tells them you're out there somewhere. They have no direction finding activity. There is no magic scope showing them the same blip on a screen you see. All they can say is "Yep, there's a radar out there somewhere." Advantage you!

Leave the blasted thing on 24 hours a day. When they detect you it only scares them because they know what follows the radar signals.

Armistead · 08-24-10, 01:58 PM

Then how come they come right to you? I assume surface radar, but playing with it, I can cut my radar off for a minute, back on and the escort will have headed back, but will turn back around. With surface radar they will run right up your arse in a storm.

I've played with it and it just seems if you cut your radar off, many times the escort will turn back.

Any idea on radar detection range and radar range? I would think detection would be further.

Be nice if we had a good explanation regarding TMO/RFB is the radar detection is actually directional in the game itself, sure seems so.

Stealhead · 08-24-10, 03:40 PM

If it is pinpoint directional I vote that it be changed because it is not accurate the way it is.Like has been said they only knew "Oh somewhere out there is radar where ever shall we being to look?" not "Ah ha the radar is coming from there!"

I am no expert but I'd say that radar range would have to be much farther than anything detecting it would be the device would have to be inside the waves to know that waves where even preset after all.

Rockin Robbins · 08-24-10, 04:29 PM

It's clear from Joe Enright's book Shinano that he knew they could detect his signal and knew very well that they could have no idea where it was coming from in 1944. The way the battle played out proved that fact.

In the event, the Japanese admiral detected the signal, took it to be a brazen signal that there was a wolfpack out there and acted accordingly, turning neatly in front of Archerfish, which was up to that point maneuvered completely out of any possible attack, and ensuring the demise of his carrier. Had he had any directional capability at all he could have vectored in his three destroyers and chewed up Archerfish like a pack of dogs on a milk bone.

Armistead · 08-24-10, 06:19 PM

We know they had no true directional detection in reality....we're talking game wise, sure seems they do to me.

It's strange they head right to your position on a dime from over 12 nm's away, changing course as quickly as you do. How to know if it's surface radar or if they're detecting your radar is beyond me, just that I can turn my radar off and usually they will turn back.

With TMO in a storm I've had many a escort run right up my arse, so with TMO their surface radar is rather perfect.

WernherVonTrapp · 08-24-10, 07:07 PM

Even though some USN Captains (quite renowned ones too) may have mistakenly believed that the Japanese had radar detection capabilities, whether by sheer coincidence or rampant scuttlebutt, the facts point to the contrary. I have done some extensive research on this subject and, despite some (probably) overexaggerated claims made by one Japanese officer during postwar interrogations, the facts disprove these claims/beliefs. The most comprehensive book I've seen so far on the subject of WWII Radar, "A Radar History of World War II: Technical and Military Imperatives -Louis Brown", indicates clearly that the Japanese just did not have that capability.
That aside

, I keep my radar on at all times, without exception.

Barkhorn1x · 08-25-10, 11:15 AM

Armistead's point, once again, is that (history aside) the IJN sure seem to have DF capabilities in the game. I use TMO and I concur w/ his assessment.

Diopos · 08-25-10, 11:26 AM

I can't recall where I read it but it seemed that radars used by the two navies signaled at similar wavelengths so there was a possibility of "receiving" enemy signals on the same receiver with your own. "Radar detection" by accident ... Can anyone more knowledgeable verify this (or is my mind playing tricks

)?

,

razark · 08-25-10, 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diopos

I can't recall where I read it but it seemed that radars used by the two navies signaled at similar wavelengths so there was a possibility of "receiving" enemy signals on the same receiver with your own. "Radar detection" by accident ... Can anyone more knowledgeable verify this (or is my mind playing tricks

)?

I remember reading about the Batfish and the sinking of three Japanese subs. The Batfish was getting a strange effect on their radar, which someone recognized as interference from another radar transmitting on nearly the same frequency. The fact that a small vessel was carrying an advanced, expensive piece of equipment is what triggered the realization they were facing a submarine. They used the radar carefully afterward to avoid giving themselves away.

The next night, the same radar effect, and another sunk sub. And again two nights later.

Diopos · 08-25-10, 11:35 AM

Thanks razarak,

.

Nisgeis · 08-25-10, 11:36 AM

USS Baya encountered a radar eqipped escort, that could pick up the Baya's radar and used it to navigate away from the Baya. The Baya was also receiving interference from the escort. If you turn your receiver, you can tell where the signal is coming from.

The US subs also could use the SJ radar as a line of sight comms system, with a telegraphy key attached it could be used to send morse in a highly directional way. The incoming signal would be picked up as interference on the scope.

08-24-10, 08:50 AM	#1
Vaux Torpedoman Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Florida Posts: 116 Downloads: 26 Uploads: 0	Do you keep your RADAR on? I finally got RADAR. The funny thing is that the default action seems to be to have it off. I'll go to the RADAR station and the scope is dark. I turn it on, set it to sweep, but when the watch changes it's off again. Is it not a good idea to keep the RADAR on all the time? Did the Japs have detection equipment?

08-24-10, 09:24 AM	#2
fred8615 Saint of the seas Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Sorrento, Louisiana Posts: 1,305 Downloads: 265 Uploads: 127	It's not "off" it's just not doing an automatic sweep. Whenever you go to the radar room, it turns off the auto sweep for some reason. You have to manually turn it back on, and then it'll stay on until you go to the radar room again. BTW, if you're using an older version of SH4, the surface search radar would not turn back on automatically if you submerged and then resurfaced. You would have to turn it on each time manually. But in either patch 1.4 or 1.5 they fixed it so it would come back on by itself when surfacing, even if you turn it off yourself before submerging. As for Japanese detection equipment, they do get it sometime in 1944. __________________ Frederick J. Barnett Radio Stations & Music Captain's Desk Photos FJB Camera Pre Pearl Harbor Career Start Office links, Info Boxes, & 50 cal Crew Rank Fix Sub Class Info Real Subs SH4 Randomizer Sub Images Office Images Sub Pinups & Pics 24 Hour Clocks Office Posters Nav Map Make-Over Add-ons FJB Navigation Maps Office Window Chronographs Someone's got to take the responsibility if the job's going to get done! Do you think that's easy?! - Gregory Peck, The Guns of Navarone.

08-24-10, 10:08 AM	#3
Whippy Watch Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: USA Posts: 28 Downloads: 26 Uploads: 0	HAHAHA I could have sworn the enemy had RADAR detection sometimes when they "magically" seem to detect me! I think I just have a knack for attracting the most experienced destroyer crews from the IJN lol I'm glad to know that it is not my RADAR that is giving my position away so often but other factors. There sure seems to be a lot of Floridians is these forums! ...that's just fine by me because I am by birth Floridian. __________________ Stephen Boland

08-24-10, 01:39 PM	#5
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,899 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	Your radar tells you their position, heading and speed. Their radar detector tells them you're out there somewhere. They have no direction finding activity. There is no magic scope showing them the same blip on a screen you see. All they can say is "Yep, there's a radar out there somewhere." Advantage you! Leave the blasted thing on 24 hours a day. When they detect you it only scares them because they know what follows the radar signals. __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

08-24-10, 04:29 PM	#8
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,899 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	It's clear from Joe Enright's book Shinano that he knew they could detect his signal and knew very well that they could have no idea where it was coming from in 1944. The way the battle played out proved that fact. In the event, the Japanese admiral detected the signal, took it to be a brazen signal that there was a wolfpack out there and acted accordingly, turning neatly in front of Archerfish, which was up to that point maneuvered completely out of any possible attack, and ensuring the demise of his carrier. Had he had any directional capability at all he could have vectored in his three destroyers and chewed up Archerfish like a pack of dogs on a milk bone. __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

08-24-10, 10:28 AM	#4
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,864 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Mods probably differ, but you can tell when they get radar detection. If you're 12 nms away and they come fast at you is one clue. With mods you can get radar detection with the APR1 unit, so you know what ships have surface radar, almost always capital ships and they will vector escorts right on top of you. I almost always turn my radar off and check for a few seconds as needed after mid 43, although it may be 44 until they get it. I think it's possible the Yamato and a few capital ships have it earlier.

08-24-10, 01:58 PM	#6
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,864 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Then how come they come right to you? I assume surface radar, but playing with it, I can cut my radar off for a minute, back on and the escort will have headed back, but will turn back around. With surface radar they will run right up your arse in a storm. I've played with it and it just seems if you cut your radar off, many times the escort will turn back. Any idea on radar detection range and radar range? I would think detection would be further. Be nice if we had a good explanation regarding TMO/RFB is the radar detection is actually directional in the game itself, sure seems so.

08-24-10, 03:40 PM	#7
Stealhead Navy Seal Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Kentucky Posts: 5,421 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	If it is pinpoint directional I vote that it be changed because it is not accurate the way it is.Like has been said they only knew "Oh somewhere out there is radar where ever shall we being to look?" not "Ah ha the radar is coming from there!" I am no expert but I'd say that radar range would have to be much farther than anything detecting it would be the device would have to be inside the waves to know that waves where even preset after all.

08-24-10, 06:19 PM	#9
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,864 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	We know they had no true directional detection in reality....we're talking game wise, sure seems they do to me. It's strange they head right to your position on a dime from over 12 nm's away, changing course as quickly as you do. How to know if it's surface radar or if they're detecting your radar is beyond me, just that I can turn my radar off and usually they will turn back. With TMO in a storm I've had many a escort run right up my arse, so with TMO their surface radar is rather perfect.

08-24-10, 07:07 PM	#10
WernherVonTrapp Admiral Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Now, alot farther from NYC. Posts: 2,228 Downloads: 105 Uploads: 0	Even though some USN Captains (quite renowned ones too) may have mistakenly believed that the Japanese had radar detection capabilities, whether by sheer coincidence or rampant scuttlebutt, the facts point to the contrary. I have done some extensive research on this subject and, despite some (probably) overexaggerated claims made by one Japanese officer during postwar interrogations, the facts disprove these claims/beliefs. The most comprehensive book I've seen so far on the subject of WWII Radar, "*A Radar History of World War II: Technical and Military Imperatives -Louis Brown", indicates clearly that the Japanese just did not have that capability. That aside, I keep my radar on at all times, without exception. __________________ "The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step." -Miyamoto Musashi ------------------------------------------------------- "What is truth?"* -Pontius Pilate

08-25-10, 11:15 AM	#11
Barkhorn1x Captain Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: Davie, FL Grid DM 23 Posts: 539 Downloads: 59 Uploads: 0	Armistead's point, once again, is that (history aside) the IJN sure seem to have DF capabilities in the game. I use TMO and I concur w/ his assessment.

08-25-10, 11:26 AM	#12
Diopos Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Athens, the original one. Posts: 1,226 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	I can't recall where I read it but it seemed that radars used by the two navies signaled at similar wavelengths so there was a possibility of "receiving" enemy signals on the same receiver with your own. "Radar detection" by accident ... Can anyone more knowledgeable verify this (or is my mind playing tricks )? , __________________ - Oh God! They're all over the place! CRASH DIVE!!! - Ehm... we can't honey. We're in the car right now. - What?... er right... Doesn't matter! We'll give it a try anyway!

08-25-10, 11:35 AM	#14
Diopos Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Athens, the original one. Posts: 1,226 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	Thanks razarak, . __________________ - Oh God! They're all over the place! CRASH DIVE!!! - Ehm... we can't honey. We're in the car right now. - What?... er right... Doesn't matter! We'll give it a try anyway!

08-25-10, 11:36 AM	#15
Nisgeis Ocean Warrior Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 2,909 Downloads: 77 Uploads: 11	USS Baya encountered a radar eqipped escort, that could pick up the Baya's radar and used it to navigate away from the Baya. The Baya was also receiving interference from the escort. If you turn your receiver, you can tell where the signal is coming from. The US subs also could use the SJ radar as a line of sight comms system, with a telegraphy key attached it could be used to send morse in a highly directional way. The incoming signal would be picked up as interference on the scope. __________________ -------------------------------- This space left intentionally blank.