UK Politics Thread

[Jimbuna]

Mike Greene, the Brexit Party.

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

After reading those articles I'm simply thankful I only have electric ovens in the house

Despite economical.. challenges (i guess you are right with electric ovens, since you have cut down all the forests and wood in Scotland, and your new SSBN subs can probably make up for electrical loss if connected to the power grid ) i found this paragraph to be the most clear:

" [...] And how can we ever get back from this dark place? From this childish, binary way of engaging with and talking about those we disagree with? How do we live with those who have embraced this breakdown of civil society to such an extent they feel free – emboldened even – to express their racism and anti-Semitism, their misogyny and homophobia, their angry, righteous ignorance publicly and with impunity?
I really grieve for what has been so carelessly and thoughtless thrown away.

For all those carefully constructed bridges between people, communities, countries, ways of life and thought, which have been burned, or are about to be burned, down. So when I look to the future my question is; will it ever again be possible for us not to be angry all the time?"

I think this question is valid for a lot of continental countries. I ask myself whether this is a last protest of the far right seeing their influence dwindle in enlightened times, or is is it really a shift back to darker ages.

[STEED]

Lib Dems would win general election if it was held tomorrow - poll


Following impressive results in the European elections, the resurgent Lib Dems pip the Brexit Party to top spot in a YouGov poll.

https://news.sky.com/story/lib-dems-...-ever-11731962


What a load of rubbish, this is why I don't trust polls when I see this sort of trash. People have always voted in a different way at different elections.


Let us not forget YouGov was one of those polls that told us May was going to win the general election with a landslide victory and what happen? She needed the DUP to get her across the line.

[Jimbuna]

The article below is approx. 30 minutes old but I saw her make the announcement at 22:40 on Question Time last night.

Not like the BBC to be so slow.

Jo Swinson has announced she will run to become the next leader of the Liberal Democrats.

The party's deputy leader told the BBC the country was "crying out" for a movement "to challenge the forces of nationalism and populism".
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48468251

[Catfish]

LibDems would win? Smug rabble-rouser Farage will make it.

[BossMark]

Originally Posted by STEED

https://news.sky.com/story/lib-dems-...-ever-11731962


What a load of rubbish, this is why I don't trust polls when I see this sort of trash. People have always voted in a different way at different elections.

More chance of me becoming PM then the lib dums have winning GE

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Catfish

LibDems would win? Smug rabble-rouser Farage will make it.

Most worrying aspect for me would be a hung Parliament and Farage holding the trump card in a coalition situation.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Catfish

Despite economical.. challenges (i guess you are right with electric ovens, since you have cut down all the forests and wood in Scotland, and your new SSBN subs can probably make up for electrical loss if connected to the power grid ) i found this paragraph to be the most clear:

" [...] And how can we ever get back from this dark place? From this childish, binary way of engaging with and talking about those we disagree with? How do we live with those who have embraced this breakdown of civil society to such an extent they feel free – emboldened even – to express their racism and anti-Semitism, their misogyny and homophobia, their angry, righteous ignorance publicly and with impunity?
I really grieve for what has been so carelessly and thoughtless thrown away.

For all those carefully constructed bridges between people, communities, countries, ways of life and thought, which have been burned, or are about to be burned, down. So when I look to the future my question is; will it ever again be possible for us not to be angry all the time?"

I think this question is valid for a lot of continental countries. I ask myself whether this is a last protest of the far right seeing their influence dwindle in enlightened times, or is is it really a shift back to darker ages.

Pressure from the left provokes counter-pressure from the right. Force inflicted, inevitably returns. Liberals and progressives have pushed the envelope so far in the past 30, 40 years that now even former modest, reasonable people of the political middle grow in tolerance for equal extremists from the other side of the spectrum, just so to have them countering the extremists from the left and their policies, and just so because themselves they have the nose full of the progressives and liberals and their lefty ways.

Some claim that to be only "protest", and protest voting. I say such voices aim and precisely miss their target - and therefore will fail in finding a remedy for their decline. The good news is they are gone then. The bad news is we then have the right to deal with. I do not say the one evil is lesser or worse than the other, to me both stink with the same smell. I reject to fight against the one of the them just to see the other benefitting from that. And when they go after each other, I stay away and at best make sure that they do not get interrupted. I may not like Nazis. But I do not like EUcrats and lefties as well, I am as sick of these as I am sick of the first.

[MGR1]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

The article below is approx. 30 minutes old but I saw her make the announcement at 22:40 on Question Time last night.

Not like the BBC to be so slow.

Three words:

West. Lothian. Question.

List of powers controlled by the Scottish Parliament at Holyrood:

• agriculture, forestry and fisheries
• education and training
• environment
• health and social services
• housing
• law and order
• local government
• sport and the arts
• tourism and economic development
• many aspects of transport

What are the powers of the Scottish Parliament?

She's a Scottish MP elected by a Scottish constituency. The very existence of devolution undercuts her potential leadership position when it comes to enacting any policy in England that's devolved in Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland.

I'm a Scotsman who resides in Scotland. Even I can see that there's a problem of legitimacy here.

Until and unless there's some form of devolution for the whole of England, it's sad to say but no Scottish, Welsh or (unlikely) Northern Irish MP could ever again become Prime Minister or lead a major UK party unless they represented an English constituency.

Mike.

[STEED]

Tory leadership candidates so far (Updated)

Boris Johnson 70%
Esther McVey 20%
Jeremy Hunt 50%
Rory Stewart 40%
Matt Hancock 40%
Dominic Raab 50%
Andrea Leadsom 45%
Michael Gove 60%
Sajid Javid 70%
Kit Malthouse 30%
James Cleverly 50%
Mark Harper 10%
(% is my predictions so far)

[STEED]

Peter Willsman: Labour suspends NEC member over anti-Semitism remarks

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-48472977

What a disgrace, this vermin should have been thrown out already.

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Pressure from the left provokes counter-pressure from the right.

Like at the end of the Weimar Republic. If you think that the right will ever play by the rules and give back power to democratic elections you must be delusional.

Saying the right wing CDU has introduced "leftist" views or "communism" is nonsense, and you (should) know it. What i hear by you is the typical "Wutbuerger" and deny-it-all "logic".

The old german classic right-wing conservative CDU has shifted to other points of view under Mrs Merkel you are certainly right. But it has been a right wing party in Germany that has governed since decades with a short break with the SPD's Schroeder.

On the other hand Merkel does a lot in the interest of Germany, economically. She usually bases her decisions on science and german interest, sometimes hard to combine. Whether she is right about immigration is everyone's personal point of view, but i like this much more than "taking back control", vote for the far right, encourage rabble-rousers and building walls which does not solve any problem.
You prefer the likes of CDU's Merz and Koch?

If you want less refugees go to the roots, do not export weapons to immigrant countries, help those countries to improve civilian society, infrastructure and a perspective and better conditions for the young. What the US and partly the UK does breeds terrorists. "Despite much evidence to the contrary, the American foreign policy community--
and to a lesser extent, the American public—avoids (like the plague) accepting any
notion that U.S. actions overseas could result in blowback."
I do not like the Cato institue very much, but they have their merits: https://wcfia.harvard.edu/files/wcfi.../615_eland.pdf

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Catfish

Like at the end of the Weimar Republic. If you think that the right will ever play by the rules and give back power to democratic elections you must be delusional.

I have not said nor implied that. I said that lefties and progressives have pushed their policies so far that plenty of ordinary people in the poltical middle ground are done with them and even started to tolerate rightwingers to get rid of the lefties' polices. This happens in practically every major region in Europe now.

Saying the right wing CDU has introduced "leftist" views or "communism" is nonsense, and you (should) know it. What i hear by you is the typical "Wutbuerger" and deny-it-all "logic".

I have not said nor implied that. See above. You simply get so easily emotionally engaged that your aroused emotions lead you to not pay attention to what I actually said, and then you become busy with your fantasy about what you think I should have said to justify that emotional spiking of yours. And the CDU certainly is not right nor conservative anymore. Merkel deleted these traits. The CDU are mercireless opportunists and Merkel clqueurs now. And that will beocme obvious when Merkel is no longer chancellor and has left the national stage.

On the other hand Merkel does a lot in the interest of Germany, economically. She usually bases her decisions on science and german interest, sometimes hard to combine.

But you tell me >I< am delusional? She throws vital German key interests out of the window and wastes German wealth on sentimental baiting and symbolism. Germns lost hundreds of billiosn and in the end: over a trillion due to her misled policies. She has systematically increased the threats and risks for Germany, and mounte dmore and more burdens onto German taxpayer shoulders to finance her internaqtional illusions. I have wriotten off Germany in the long run, therefore, it will not be able to survive the bill once it gets put on the table. And this day will come, before the middle of this century, mark my word. At maximum another thirty years. But I dont think it will last this long anymore.

You prefer the likes of CDU's Merz and Koch?

You can know by now, after these years, that I like neither them nor anyone else there is in these gangs.

If you want less refugees go to the roots, do not export weapons to immigrant countries, help those countries to improve civilian society, infrastructure and a perspective and better conditions for the young. What the US and partly the UK does breeds terrorists. "Despite much evidence to the contrary, the American foreign policy community--
and to a lesser extent, the American public—avoids (like the plague) accepting any
notion that U.S. actions overseas could result in blowback."
I do not like the Cato institue very much, but they have their merits: https://wcfia.harvard.edu/files/wcfi.../615_eland.pdf

I agree on banning military goods from international trade, but that makes only any effect if EVERY country exporting wepaons currently plays ball. Else customers will simply buy weapons not from us, but from the others then.



Colonization is over since decades and genberations, and still they have not come to terms ion Africa, but are busy with old tribal animosities in Africa,vote leaders they know are corrupt, and breed like rabbits and dio, beside the Siuteast asians, their huieg share to lead population explosion to new levels. It is cheap to always declare us guilty for THEIR inabilities, but a common, widespread pattrern of the politicla left over here. Its always ourt guilt. We are responsible. We must give. We must pay. We must coinfess. Becasue we are guuilty, guilty, guilty. Of everything. I am sick of hearing this opportunistic propaganda again and again and again.



We are severla billions too many, and that is not due to the birth rates in Europe. If you want to adress erosion of fertile grounds, desertification, epidemic diseases, corruption, and so forth, then adress the people causing these: the people living in these places where it happens. I agree in so far that organisations in the West helping in these evils blossmoing, from the catholic curch over the westenr company deforesting rain forest to build cattle industries fore export to North america, to generla financial development aid patterns as you seem to defend, should be stopped by us.



But the key issues are not our responsibilities - but theirs. Its their part to cleasn up their houses and chase their lousy masters away. Ours only is to withhold the gangsters from ourt sidetrying to widen their problems for their own profit. And this will not be done by govenrments in the Westm sicne these are integral part of the problem, and oftent he cause of these exported evils.



Ypou seme to have soime very naive, but tpyically left wordviews there. Its always the same narration form that political direction. And it never was right, and it will nto become any less wrong just becasue it gets endlessly repeated. Its 90% nonsense. But it declares the West the guilty, the enemy, the villain, and thats why it gets endlessly repeated.



You may mean your things well, I give you that. But you are under the crowd's and its masters' spell.

[em2nought]

Nationalists are Nazis, blah, blah, blah.

[Jimbuna]

Donald Trump says Boris Johnson would be 'excellent' Tory leader.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48478706

Will this endorsement do him any favours though?