UK Politics Thread

[Jimbuna]

This article adequately sums up just where Labour are at the present time in my humble opinion.

Labour: anger, recrimination and bitterness mark fresh battle for party’s soul.
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknew...id=mailsignout

[Jimbuna]

[JU_88]

It doesnt matter, the Left is so broken it needs a serious rethink. (If they have any one left who is still allowed to actually think :P)

Who ever replaces Jezza will be basically more of the same for now, the simple reason is the Left by default ostracises anyone who doesn't conform to its now cult like values, for them its no longer a difference of opinion its 'you are a bad person if you think otherwise'.

Their mantra is now constantly pointing out all the bad it sees in people, society, culture and the nation. Greedy, stupid, racist, <insert>phobic, etc' While claiming to be the moral puritans with a 'better way' to fix it all. What was once used in a more subtle liberal way to appear noble, tollerent and progressive has now become arrogant, codecending and spiteful.
You cannot persuade people to vote for you when you give the impression you dispair in / despise them.

Anyway they are stuck now, they cannot win back the working class / Northen vote and keep the Middle class / student vote. Because the two are at odds. If they adopt the values of one they will be rejected by ther other.
They will have wait for either Milenials to grow up or for late boomers to die out. But even then they have a problem: Generation Z -while the right wing Controls Goverment and Economics (areas so remote from the life of an average teenager)
The left still broadly controls main stream culture and academia. So for Generation Z the Left has become the perceived dominent culture 'the status quo' in school and pop culture -And young people generally like to rebel against the status quo and create their own thing. I dont know how they miscalulated that when 20 odd years ago the right died the very same death.

If Trump wins 2020, i think thats will be final nail in the coffin for 'Social Justice' left of this past decade.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by JU_88

It doesnt matter, the Left is so broken it needs a serious rethink. (If they have any one left who is still allowed to actually think :P)

Who ever replaces Jezza will be basically more of the same for now, the simple reason is the Left by default ostracises anyone who doesn't conform to its now cult like values, for them its no longer a difference of opinion its 'you are a bad person if you think otherwise'.

Their mantra is now constantly pointing out all the bad it sees in people, society, culture and the nation. Greedy, stupid, racist, <insert>phobic, etc' While claiming to be the moral puritans with a 'better way' to fix it all. What was once used in a more subtle liberal way to appear noble, tollerent and progressive has now become arrogant, codecending and spiteful.
You cannot persuade people to vote for you when you give the impression you dispair in / despise them.

Anyway they are stuck now, they cannot win back the working class / Northen vote and keep the Middle class / student vote. Because the two are at odds. If they adopt the values of one they will be rejected by ther other.
They will have wait for either Milenials to grow up or for late boomers to die out. But even then they have a problem: Generation Z -while the right wing Controls Goverment and Economics (areas so remote from the life of an average teenager)
The left still broadly controls main stream culture and academia. So for Generation Z the Left has become the perceived dominent culture 'the status quo' in school and pop culture -And young people generally like to rebel against the status quo and create their own thing. I dont know how they miscalulated that when 20 odd years ago the right died the very same death.

If Trump wins 2020, i think thats will be final nail in the coffin for 'Social Justice' left of this past decade.

Very well laid out Francis and in support of your post.

[STEED]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

I can assure you our NHS is still better than that of our European 'cousins' and also the envy of the world.

Sorry to say I have to differ with you jim, my father had a rotten time in hospital and it has left a mark on him. I have never seen him in such a rotten state that is going to take days for him to get back to any kind of normality.

Envy of the world I just will not except that as the NHS is a bloody mess thanks to years and years of under funding. Speak to a few doctors and they may say what has been said to me, they all believe we are a few years from privatisation of the NHS. That is in the region of 10 to 15 years.

The NHS is trying hard but without the proper funding it's a battle they can not win. I made an appointment to see my GP two weeks ago and I still have another four weeks on top of that to wait. Six bloody weeks is just so bloody wrong on all level's. NHS is starved of money and doctor's nurse's.......

[Catfish]

^^ two posts further north:
I posted that withour further explanation (sry having a difficult time).
I have lived in England for some time, though i admit this was only up to 2004. Seldom needed myself, helped some friends driving them to doctors etc. The doctors were always friendly and helpful despite me being a bloody foreigner, but the doctor's offices, the equipment and the availability of certain medicine was pure 1960ies and left a lot to be desired. It was better in London, but even there..
Compared to doctors and offices in Italy, France or Germany there can be no question where the medical support is more advanced.

That said, the idea of a free National Health Service is great and worth keeping, even if Americans would call this socialism (OMG!!).
If it can be financed stick to it by all means. Compared to other countries worldwide (including the USA) the english system is indeed better, imho.

[Jimbuna]

When a sitting MP loses their seat it happens very publicly, standing on stage with the other candidates as the results are announced - but what happens to the people working behind the scenes?

When an MP is not re-elected, their staff - in Parliament and in their constituency - are also made redundant.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50869679

Just a gentle reminder that the election result often affects more than just the MP.

[STEED]

Look no further than what sits on the opposition front benches for the answer. And from there you will see what needs to be done, better hurry up the hard line loony left is digging in.

[Skybird]

https://translate.google.de/translat..._11482716.html

Brexit Prime Minister Boris Johnson has received a lot of criticism for his idea of ​​simultaneously stipulating in the exit law now introduced in Parliament that the United Kingdom will end negotiations with the EU Commission by December 31, 2020 at the latest. Wrongly, I think. Because Johnson knows only too well that a contractual Brexit is de facto impossible. It was always clear to him that there was either a hard Brexit or no Brexit. This also explains why he has persistently refused to rule out a Brexit without a succession plan in recent months.
This coincides with the view that I have long held: as a EU member state, full sovereignty under international law can in fact only be returned today with a hard exit. Because the EU member states have been so closely intertwined politically and economically since the Lisbon Treaty - a kind of basic law of the EU - that a contractually regulated exit with the consent of all EU countries is theoretically still possible, but not in reality.

About the guest author

Dr. Klemens Joos is a lecturer at the Faculty of Business Administration at the Ludwig Maximilians University in Munich . Joos is also the founder and managing director of the internationally active EU policy and management consultancy EUTOP in Munich.

[Jimbuna]

I'll maintain my steadfast belief in the NHS thanks.

[Jimbuna]

Ex-Labour leader Ed Miliband will sit on a panel of party figures to review its general election failure.

Labour Together, which describes itself as a network of activists from all traditions, is setting up a commission to "map out a route back to power".

It says the panel will view attempts to pin the blame on a single cause, such as Brexit or Jeremy Corbyn's leadership, as simplistic and wrong.

Members, focus groups in heartlands, and defeated candidates will get a say.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-50888060

Why Ed? He was a total failure previously himself.

[MGR1]

To be honest, IF Labour are to make some form of recovery my own recommendation would be for them to concentrate on England and Wales only and stay out of Scotland. The SNP have very much stolen their slot (and the vast majority of their former voters) on the political spectrum up here.

Mike.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by MGR1

To be honest, IF Labour are to make some form of recovery my own recommendation would be for them to concentrate on England and Wales only and stay out of Scotland. The SNP have very much stolen their slot (and the vast majority of their former voters) on the political spectrum up here.

Mike.

I doubt the left of the party will allow any lessons to be learned. As I have said in the past, they are not totally committed to running the country but the party itself is a totally different matter.

[MGR1]

Maybe so, but for a healthy democracy we both know that you have to have a viable opposition and Labour are the only current choice south of the border. Perhaps something else will evolve in the fullness of time but at the moment what we in the UK mainland have is a series of hegemonic one party states - the Conservatives in England, the SNP in Scotland and, to a lesser extent, Labour in Wales.

Any opposition activity is going to be at that level, pitching the component parts of the UK against each other until and unless natural opposition groups form within those same components.

For my own part I would prefer Labour to abandon Scotland completely - one, their now superflous, and secondly, because of the sheer amount of damage their stupidity and corruption has caused up here.


Mike.

[Jimbuna]

My preference would be proportionate representation but we both know neither of the two largest parties would be interested in seeing that come about.