UK Politics Thread

[STEED]

Jezzer lusts for power and wants to spend money and bankrupt the UK that is his only desire. As for Brexit he is clueless.

[JU_88]

Originally Posted by STEED

Jezzer lusts for power and wants to spend money and bankrupt the UK that is his only desire. As for Brexit he is clueless.

Yes Jezza would in all probability, overspend/borrow and trigger a case of capital flight-itus. To what extent i don't know, but now is not really a good time for a gamble on a fringe guy.
Ideally we should never put fringey Marxist or Libertarian Utopian fantasists in control of anything - they don't know what they are doing. they will fix one thing but break 10 things to get there. And they don't care because they put ideology before reason far more than any moderate.

[Skybird]

EUpistas react with anger, dissappointment and end of patience to yesterday's vote. I think that could mean they are now even less willing for any further concessions, if there ever was that on the really important things.

This now could mean that if the vote today gets nayed down, too, and tomorrow they vote in favour of delays - it is not a given at all that the EU side will agree to that delay.

And if the UK tomorrow votes for delay and the eU says No - doesn't that mean a no deal exit as well then (in case the UK does not completely withdraw its Brexit operatipon and steals the referendum)? I don't know.

[Skybird]

German comment on the future of May. Pretty much my reasoning. I still think so far it all went according to plan. Her plan. Her true, real, secret plan. May was against Brexit before she grapped the office of MP immediately after the referendum.

https://translate.google.de/translat...exit-unterhaus

And thats why I think she will not voluntarily leave until the battle has been fought with either ending having become true. She probabaly sees herself on a mission to prevent Brexit in the meaning of the word.

Its probably all a conspiracy against the referendum, and all acting so far has been a theatre play designed to fool the public.The question is whether or not she will be stopped on the last meters.

[Skybird]

I just learned that the decision whether a request for delay gets accepted by the EU, is made unanimously by the heads of governments of the 27. Just one No spoils the show for London. And the Netherlands just indicated that they are critical of it.


A delay may only be had at the cost of London giving even more concessions.


Hehehe.

[STEED]

Time to stock up on baked beans and soup civil war here we come?

This is going to be the only chance the voters to wake up and say we are no longer going to vote for a out of date system for a bunch of morons feathering their own nests.

[STEED]

Stand by around mid day the Chancellor will be giving his spring statement..

Will it be interesting or another big bore lets go down the pub?

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by JU_88

Well in way, he'd be crazy not to 'fish' at this point in time. He probably wont get another opportunity as good as this to take power. on the otherhand -
Would he and his kabal be any more competent at handling this? Not likely. So even if he got there, it could quickly become his undoing.
Same goes for who ever takes over from May - if she goes.

Precisely

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Who voted for these political "elites", and legitimises them time and again, and with enthusiastic servility subordinates himself under their claim for command and power although history could and should teach everybody for the better...?

Politicians and politics are a symptom only for the state of mind and character the population lives in. Politicians are neither a God-given, nor do they have any natural fundament for their claim to be set above anyone else and living at his/their cost.

We are too many. No one can overwacth it anymore, it is all too big and too much of everything and too complex. Because we are way too many, in every aspect and meaning imaginable. And that is where any attempt to solve things and heal the world must start. Which means short-sighted short cuts and quick solutions will not work. We talk about a decades- and generations project. A jump in intellectual evolution. And as always wioth evoluution, this our species either adapts to the need, or goes extinct. No gain, no loss, just things in motion there.

Its like with interstellar travel. Such travels will need to be thought of not in terms of individual's lifespans, but generations'. Which gives a whole new meaning to the sentence: the cause weighs heavier than the individual life.

The dome of Cologne was build over centuries and generations as well. Compared to the minds of those ancient people nevertheless tarting with it, modern, super-accelerated man has the awareness span of an ant only.

Politicians are not the cause. They are a symptom (that additionally feeds back on itself, however).

Parliment voted (over 80%) to accept Article 50 and take us out of the EU.

They are currently defying not only the will of the majority of the UK population but also what they voted for.

All voting is made public and I believe there will be a day of reckoning in many constituencies at the next general election.

That is how democracy so often pans out.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by Skybird

I just learned that the decision whether a request for delay gets accepted by the EU, is made unanimously by the heads of governments of the 27. Just one No spoils the show for London. And the Netherlands just indicated that they are critical of it.


A delay may only be had at the cost of London giving even more concessions.


Hehehe.

And I have just been made privy to the fact that the four Royal Navy Vanguard Class submarines are now on station in the English Channel

[Catfish]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

[...]
They are currently defying not only the will of the majority of the UK population but also what they voted for. [...]

Oh please. I really wonder what is being broadcasted in the News over there. The Uk held a 'referendum' that indulged ignorance and irresponsibility, while abandoning the considered judgment of representative democracy.

The Leave campaign and brexit was also orchestrated by Arron banks (financing Farage, but not only), by the Rupert Murdoch tabloid media and rich brexiters who expected financial advantages and the softening of workers rights by leaving the EU, for their personal advantage (Rees-Mogg anyone? Lmao!)
Not to forget Cambridge analytica, your electoral laws were obviously powerless against "social" media manipulation - which is of course no unique "feature" of the UK.

The referendum campaign was anything but explicit and should have at least had a 2/3d majority. The outcome was not legally binding. But the MPs looked at the result with horror, and those who were responsible ran away. End of story, and the beginning of the brexiters bashing the EU and George Soros (you know "this jew responsible for islamisation", as Farage says) as usual. Disgusting. I would never have thought that this was possible today, least in the UK.

I do not expect much anymore, but the EU would be dumb to let the UK in again after this stunt. I have no pity for the brexiters for what lies ahead when the UK leaves without a deal, but i feel sorry for the other half (or more) of the UK population.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

Parliment voted (over 80%) to accept Article 50 and take us out of the EU.

They are currently defying not only the will of the majority of the UK population but also what they voted for.

All voting is made public and I believe there will be a day of reckoning in many constituencies at the next general election.

That is how democracy so often pans out.

Problem is, its a strawman or a fake law-and-order scheme only. Because politicians never really get held accountable, they are not being held liable with their own personal property, wealth and personal freedom. That elections "hold them accountable" by not bringing them into an office anymore (but another one instead that their party finds for them...) is accountability in the meaning of a bank robber who breaks into his own home bank where he has a bank account, and he breaks into the safe but then gets caught, and the only legal action taken against him is that the bank cancels his bank account. The loot he stole from the safe, he can keep, and he not pay or compensate for it, nor is there any further penalty. And the guards that he may have injured, also must not be paid compensation for.



Politicians must be held accountable with their own private property and belongings. And people who have no own property in the fire, no own skin in the game, must be excluded from candidating. Same is true for the act of voting, it mst be a reward to ward for contributions one made to the common good. Net receivers only shall have no right to vote. Just rights, no duties - it does not work. It works shockingly lousy, to be precise.



Same is being demanded more and more urgently for company managers of big corporations, btw. Many trigger-happy decisions are being made only by the fact that they can make a personal profit by them and must not fear to ever be held accountable.



One of the biggest and in principle most obviosu design flaws with modern socalled democracy: that the helmsman can claim only rights, but must not accept any responsibility worth the name - the worst he has to fear is that he is not allowed to carry on every 4-5 years. If the leading personnel is allowed to exclude itself from the consequences of its decision-making processes, then never can come anything good from this. We could as well accept any leader who claims that God wants him to rule and that it thus is his birth right to do so.


Parasites whereever you look... The vopting schemes makes sure that the ost unsuiotable charcters, those with the biggest mouths and the smallest scruples, win the race - because such characters make the most convincing blenders. The modern understanding of "democracy" does not present an antidot to this problem, as often claimed - but it enables it and makes it even worse. Thats why the establishment of parasites turns right this system into a holy mass and declares it the centre of freedom and politics.



Its raining all afternoon over here. Grey is the day, and grumpy my mood. Perfect match.

[Catfish]

Why shall only politicians be held accountable for subversion, ignorance and manipulation? Why not businessmen bribing and letting themselves be bribed, why not the population being too lazy to inform themselves, or to think critical of obvious manipulation and propaganda of some treacherous tabloid owners, and the far right? No one has a glimpse of what the EU is about and what signed binding laws mean, but all had that special gut feeling? Brilliance!
Arron Banks. Where did the money come from?
You were tricked and f'd by Putin and some rich trolls who were promised billions, riding on a wave of fear and antisemitism. Get over it and fight back!

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Catfish

Why shall only politicians be held accountable for subversion, ignorance and manipulation? Why not businessmen bribing and letting themselves be bribed, why not the population being too lazy to inform themselves, or to think critical

Indeed, and I often hinted that out. For exmaple just one or two posts above I mentioned "company managers". I mock voters and said often I see them getting what they were dumb enough to legitmise in actions done in their names. I called politicians yesterday not the source of the mess but a symptom of voters damn retarded state og mind. Elections do not equal "best qualification", or "sense of reasponsibility". Most career politicans these days have enbitehr the first, nor the latter, and they come to popwers on the votes of stupid people still participating in elections and going to vote - instead of stormign the party headquarters and setting them ablaze - ALL parties, not just the one or the other - but every Peter and every Paul thinks that he has his glorious five minutesd every four years when he casts a vote and calls that pitiful act by which he usually risks nothing and that usually does not chnage the final result of an election one bithis precious right, his precious freedom: truth is he has a ring in his nose and politicians lead him around in circles by it.


Its a stupid system in which stupid people are allowed, even demanded, to vote other stupid people into powerful positions, and thery do these voting acts on the grounds of their own incompetence on matters and their own lacking insight and their own failing longsightedness. If you add together two stupids, you do not get one raise in cleverness, you only get m ore self-feeding stupidity. Majority does not mean "correct, right, true". It only means somebody managed to organise a bigger mob than yourself. Usually by appealing to mob's lower emotions and personal greeds. And that is usually beign acchieved by yellig louder than the other and telling lies more unscrupulously than the other - and throwing other peoples' money out of the window more irresponsibly in order to bribe the masses - and afterwards letting them pay for it.



Disgusting system it is, a high mass of clueless fools wanting to get betrayed and selfish gangsters eager to betray them. Masters and servants - its the same old game, just the foot- and hand-irons now got a golden coating and a polished leather cushion inside. Ain't freedom great? The point is: the irons are not locked. People could stand up and throw them off any day - if only they would want that. But they don't, and here is where it gets so absolutely hopeless and discouraging.



Once again I recommend Jason Brennan's works. His diagnosis is spot on. And it is devastating.

[Obltn Strand]

Originally Posted by STEED

Place your bets now...

Sorry the odds will not be good.

For the no deal %

Against no deal %

One thing I can agree of this whole pile of crap.

At least we don't lose Millwall guy because UK citizens are allowed to stay regardless the outcome of brexit...