Zombies! What are you going to do when... - Page 5

razark · 05-02-10, 01:29 AM

As much as I like the idea of taking and holding a castle against the rampaging hordes of zombies, I do see a problem with the idea. Castles were built as fortresses. They really weren't meant to be major population centers by themselves. Any castle would require a town to support and maintain the needs of the castle, as well as farmlands to supply food for the town and castle. During times of trouble, the people of the town and surrounding area could withdraw to the castle, but to keep it operational on a day to day basis, it needs more land.

For an initial, widespread outbreak of zombies, a castle would serve as an ideal base. However, food supplies are going to run low after some time. In the case of an ongoing zombie situation, you would need to start holding and protecting enough land around the castle to provide food for the population. The agricultural conditions will not be the modern tractor and fertilizer methods we are now using. We will need to revert to horse pulled ploughs, and massive amounts of labor to provide for the population. We would need a decent sized base of skilled labor to support the military and agricultural needs as well. Blacksmiths, potters, wheelwrights, coopers, carpenters, glassmakers, bakers, masons, weavers, etc. Basically going from a modern lifestyle straight back to at least semi-medieval living. And how many people do you know who have those kind of skills these days?

In the case of a quick zombie situation, with a massive die-off of the zombies not long after it begins, you are faced with many of the same problems. Civilization will be in chaos. Normal networks for food distribution will be gone. If you can't grow it, you won't be eating it. You will need to hold enough land to provide food for whatever size group you have, as well as the skilled labor to support them. Once again, you're back to a semi-medieval lifestyle.

In either case, as well as fending off zombies, you will need to deal with the marauding bands of humans, with their swords and shotguns, riding their horses or SUVs or whatever, looking only to steal whatever food supplies you've managed to provide for yourselves. If you're in a coastal area, you'll also need to worry about those folks landing their boats or sailing over from their oil rigs to pillage your holdings.

Either way, I predict a return to a feudal system, with roving bands of pillagers.

Feuer Frei! · 05-02-10, 01:43 AM

deleted due to infringement

Raptor1 · 05-02-10, 02:51 AM

11. Wake up and smell the ashes

Turbografx · 05-02-10, 02:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by razark

As much as I like the idea of taking and holding a castle against the rampaging hordes of zombies, I do see a problem with the idea. Castles were built as fortresses. They really weren't meant to be major population centers by themselves. Any castle would require a town to support and maintain the needs of the castle, as well as farmlands to supply food for the town and castle. During times of trouble, the people of the town and surrounding area could withdraw to the castle, but to keep it operational on a day to day basis, it needs more land.

For an initial, widespread outbreak of zombies, a castle would serve as an ideal base. However, food supplies are going to run low after some time. In the case of an ongoing zombie situation, you would need to start holding and protecting enough land around the castle to provide food for the population.

This applies to any shelter. At least in a castle you know they can't break their way in.

The group I envision would be no more than 100 people max, and probably half that number would be ideal (40 or so). The castle has farmland surrounding it, gardens and even a fruit tree orchard. Also, a marina. So its pretty much perfect.

1. Everyone comes inside at night.
2. People work during the day with sentries on the perimeter and in towers.
3. If zombies are spotted:

a. Lots. Retreat to castle.

b. Few. Non-combatants to castle. Combatants deal with zombies.

Continue once the problem is overcome.

Focus on simple crops and food that can be kept well:

dried/smoked fish/eel (the river is on the doorstep, sea is just a little down the river.)

cabbage & potatoes (in the farmland)

plums (already planted in orchard, can be dried)

cooking and medicinal herbs (already planted in herb-garden)

Takeda Shingen · 05-02-10, 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

Me, I prefer an armored roadwarrior type vehicle like Task Force envisions. Even stationary you're only vulnerable if you have to leave it. You can carry more weaponry, more loot, more people, more everything, and if zombies get in your way you just run them down and squish them.

I agree that any type of vehicle would provide superior protection, speed and even killing power to the horse. After all, zombies are rotten and squishy; you can just run them over and they'll splatter. Still, the real problem is fuel. There won't be that many people remaining, so supply will not be a problem, but what can be done when there is no power to operate the gasoline pumps? You can have 10,000 gallons of fuel right underneath you, but in any post-apocalypic scenario the power grid required to operate the pumps will only run for a few days after the event. After that, no more electricity, no more refrigeration and no more gasoline.

The argument could be made that one could stockpile fuel right as the event hits, but I am not so certain. I would imagine that the first 72 hours of any zombie apocalypse would be a veritable orgy of chomping and blood. Any and all of us survivors would, naturally, have to flee from the population centers during that time, and we likely not be able to return before the power was out.

August · 05-02-10, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Takeda Shingen

You can have 10,000 gallons of fuel right underneath you, but in any post-apocalypic scenario the power grid required to operate the pumps will only run for a few days after the event. After that, no more electricity, no more refrigeration and no more gasoline.

I've been thinking about that problem and here's what I've come up with so far:

A trapdoor in the bottom of the road warrior. Position the vehicle over the filler hatches to the underground gas tanks at a gas station. Open the hatch cover and run a siphon hose down into the tank. Using a manual pump siphon the gas up into an on board reservoir in the vehicle.

The only thing I haven't figured is how to get the proper octane mix.

Oberon · 05-02-10, 11:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by August

I've been thinking about that problem and here's what I've come up with so far:

A trapdoor in the bottom of the road warrior. Position the vehicle over the filler hatches to the underground gas tanks at a gas station. Open the hatch cover and run a siphon hose down into the tank. Using a manual pump siphon the gas up into an on board reservoir in the vehicle.

The only thing I haven't figured is how to get the proper octane mix.

Damn, you can tell you're an ex-Para, I want you on my team

That's a great idea. Snag is what happens when the gas stations run dry, presuming other people have a similar idea and writing off a number of gas stations due to fires, which of course will burn out of control once started (another hazard), but it's certainly a good short to medium term solution.

Schroeder · 05-02-10, 12:12 PM

Actually you can salvage all the fuel out of every car you find. That should keep your vehicle running for some time.
The only tricky part is that you are outside of your vehicle while doing that. So a guard or two would be in order.

Takeda Shingen · 05-02-10, 12:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oberon

Damn, you can tell you're an ex-Para, I want you on my team

That's a great idea. Snag is what happens when the gas stations run dry, presuming other people have a similar idea and writing off a number of gas stations due to fires, which of course will burn out of control once started (another hazard), but it's certainly a good short to medium term solution.

I agree. August's idea is very good. Okay, scratch the horse for me.

I don't think that fuel supply will be a problem. There are multitudes of gas stations, and most of the world's population will be either dead or infected. Also, the number of people with August's MacGyver-esque instincts will be miniscule, so there are just not going to be that many road warriors out there. That type of gasoline supply would last though any of our natural lives.

Fr8monkey · 05-02-10, 01:45 PM

Problem is the additives in gasoline break down in a year or so. After that it turns into a gummy mess.

Task Force · 05-02-10, 01:48 PM

Hmm couldnt we use diesel ran truck, acouple of mods and you could use vegtable oil...

August · 05-02-10, 01:51 PM

OMG don't get rid of the horse!

While, depending on several factors, there may be an ample gas supply it will eventually run out or become contaminated. The way I figure it, surviving the zombie virus will be easy enough, basically fort up until they eat up their available food supply and die off, maybe wait a few months after that to let the corpses decompose then all you have to worry about are the savages.

It's because of that and the loss of modern conveniences that will make surviving in the long term the real challenge. In that horses and other low tech things will be vital.

Oberon · 05-02-10, 02:33 PM

Yeah, definitely keep the horse, it's a long term investment.

In the short term you have to prepare for the long term.
I think there would be more 'road warrior'-esque gangs than you'd think, and eventually they would move over to horses too, and eventually back down to swords and bows until communities have re-established themselves enough to start getting things working again.
Winter is also going to be a big factor. I'd say the first few winters post-event will be a fair bit colder than usual because of all the smoke and dust in the atmosphere from the fires burning out of control. Particularly in things like oil refineries and the like.

Which brings me to another question...

What would happen to the nuclear power stations?

Raptor1 · 05-02-10, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oberon

Yeah, definitely keep the horse, it's a long term investment.

In the short term you have to prepare for the long term.
I think there would be more 'road warrior'-esque gangs than you'd think, and eventually they would move over to horses too, and eventually back down to swords and bows until communities have re-established themselves enough to start getting things working again.
Winter is also going to be a big factor. I'd say the first few winters post-event will be a fair bit colder than usual because of all the smoke and dust in the atmosphere from the fires burning out of control. Particularly in things like oil refineries and the like.

Which brings me to another question...

What would happen to the nuclear power stations?

Scram down and hope nobody tries to mess with the stuff inside?

Oberon · 05-02-10, 02:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Raptor1

Scram down and hope nobody tries to mess with the stuff inside?

One can only hope that would be the case. Scram down and lock up tight.

Over time though...you're going to have problems though, surely? Structural collapse due to age?

05-02-10, 01:29 AM	#61
razark Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Houston, TX Posts: 2,731 Downloads: 393 Uploads: 12	As much as I like the idea of taking and holding a castle against the rampaging hordes of zombies, I do see a problem with the idea. Castles were built as fortresses. They really weren't meant to be major population centers by themselves. Any castle would require a town to support and maintain the needs of the castle, as well as farmlands to supply food for the town and castle. During times of trouble, the people of the town and surrounding area could withdraw to the castle, but to keep it operational on a day to day basis, it needs more land. For an initial, widespread outbreak of zombies, a castle would serve as an ideal base. However, food supplies are going to run low after some time. In the case of an ongoing zombie situation, you would need to start holding and protecting enough land around the castle to provide food for the population. The agricultural conditions will not be the modern tractor and fertilizer methods we are now using. We will need to revert to horse pulled ploughs, and massive amounts of labor to provide for the population. We would need a decent sized base of skilled labor to support the military and agricultural needs as well. Blacksmiths, potters, wheelwrights, coopers, carpenters, glassmakers, bakers, masons, weavers, etc. Basically going from a modern lifestyle straight back to at least semi-medieval living. And how many people do you know who have those kind of skills these days? In the case of a quick zombie situation, with a massive die-off of the zombies not long after it begins, you are faced with many of the same problems. Civilization will be in chaos. Normal networks for food distribution will be gone. If you can't grow it, you won't be eating it. You will need to hold enough land to provide food for whatever size group you have, as well as the skilled labor to support them. Once again, you're back to a semi-medieval lifestyle. In either case, as well as fending off zombies, you will need to deal with the marauding bands of humans, with their swords and shotguns, riding their horses or SUVs or whatever, looking only to steal whatever food supplies you've managed to provide for yourselves. If you're in a coastal area, you'll also need to worry about those folks landing their boats or sailing over from their oil rigs to pillage your holdings. Either way, I predict a return to a feudal system, with roving bands of pillagers. __________________ "Never ask a World War II history buff for a 'final solution' to your problem!"

05-02-10, 01:43 AM	#62
Feuer Frei! Navy Seal Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Valhalla Posts: 5,295 Downloads: 141 Uploads: 17	deleted due to infringement __________________ "History is the lies that the victors agree on"- Napoleon LINK TO MY SH 3 MODS Last edited by Feuer Frei!; 10-13-11 at 05:01 AM.

05-02-10, 02:51 AM	#63
Raptor1 Navy Seal Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Stavka Posts: 8,211 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	11. Wake up and smell the ashes __________________ Current Eastern Front status: Probable Victory

05-02-10, 12:12 PM	#68
Schroeder Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Banana Republic of Germany Posts: 6,170 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	Actually you can salvage all the fuel out of every car you find. That should keep your vehicle running for some time. The only tricky part is that you are outside of your vehicle while doing that. So a guard or two would be in order. __________________ Putting Germ back into Germany.

05-02-10, 01:45 PM	#70
Fr8monkey Captain Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 518 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	Problem is the additives in gasoline break down in a year or so. After that it turns into a gummy mess. __________________ NASA's budget in 2011... $19 billion. Result: Hi-resolution images from 127 million miles away. AT&T's budget in 2011... $20 billion. Result: Still can't get any signal from my bathroom.

05-02-10, 01:48 PM	#71
Task Force Rear Admiral Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: SPACE!!!! Posts: 10,142 Downloads: 85 Uploads: 0	Hmm couldnt we use diesel ran truck, acouple of mods and you could use vegtable oil... __________________ Task Force industries "Taking control of the world, one mind at a time"

05-02-10, 01:51 PM	#72
August Wayfaring Stranger Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 23,197 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	OMG don't get rid of the horse! While, depending on several factors, there may be an ample gas supply it will eventually run out or become contaminated. The way I figure it, surviving the zombie virus will be easy enough, basically fort up until they eat up their available food supply and die off, maybe wait a few months after that to let the corpses decompose then all you have to worry about are the savages. It's because of that and the loss of modern conveniences that will make surviving in the long term the real challenge. In that horses and other low tech things will be vital. __________________ Flanked by life and the funeral pyre. Putting on a show for you to see.

05-02-10, 02:33 PM	#73
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Yeah, definitely keep the horse, it's a long term investment. In the short term you have to prepare for the long term. I think there would be more 'road warrior'-esque gangs than you'd think, and eventually they would move over to horses too, and eventually back down to swords and bows until communities have re-established themselves enough to start getting things working again. Winter is also going to be a big factor. I'd say the first few winters post-event will be a fair bit colder than usual because of all the smoke and dust in the atmosphere from the fires burning out of control. Particularly in things like oil refineries and the like. Which brings me to another question... What would happen to the nuclear power stations?