Who has cancelled their order! - Page 5

DaMaGe007 · 03-21-07, 12:11 PM

You have to remember that moderators were once users like us and they dont sign on to subsim policy of suporting games in particular.
They are given privlages to control users due to thier record over time on the forum.

They dont magicly lose thier opinions when they become a mod, and they tend to be suportive of sub titled despite bugs ect because otherwise they wont be a mod here at all due to the forum disapearing cos of lack of games.

I dont expect Mods to be impartial unless they are moderating a dispute.

Hitman · 03-21-07, 12:27 PM

Quote:

What I disagree is that a moderator of this forum don't stay neutral, even if you claim now to express your personnal opinion. The fact is: you come in this thread to say what your are saying, under you official moderator label and not under an other anonymous label.

And now, one of your collegue come to help you singing the same song and an other one, in an other thread the same.

Like I said already in the other thread, I start to think more and more that Ubisoft is sponsoring Subsim.

ACS

A moderator is not a judge making a trial, it is a user with certain prerrogatives to help keep the discussions civil. We moderators do not settle the questions, do not make final trials or decissions that are imposed to everyone. We simply try to prevent insulting, harrassing, posting prohibited contents and other acts againts the web's official policy. When we express opinions we are not doing it under the "moderator" label. The moderator label is used to delete forbidden contents, lock threads that get out of control and such, and as far as I know, none of this actions has been performed against you.

I respect your point of view, and understand it, just as I defend mine, and all comments done have been in an attempt to steer the discussions towards a more positive feedback and attitude (Which is the official web's policy). You are free not to concur to that intention, and no "moderation" is to be performed against you simply because of that. It is therefore unfair insinuating that there has been an implicit threat in any of the moderator's posts replying to yours.

John Channing · 03-21-07, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACSoft

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDK1044

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACSoft

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDK1044

I will continue to support the Silent Hunter series by purchasing each new addition to the series. Do I think these games should be in a healthier state at the time of release...absolutely, but Silent Hunter 3 patched to 1.4 and moderately modded was quite superb in my view.

The only person you're punishing by not buying the game is yourself. Ubisoft are not going to worry at all if a handfull of people in the subsim forums (and that's all it would be) choose not to purchase the game on a point of principle. That's your choice and I respect it, but it's also your loss. You don't improve a game by not buying it, nor does a handful of people not buying Silent Hunter 4 in any way influence Ubisoft's decision regarding Silent Hunter 5. The game either meets its projected sales target or it doesn't.

Oh boy, I cannot believe a subsim moderator can write this

ACS

Being a Moderator here has nothing to do with expressing a pesonal opinion. If you disagree, I respect that.

I understand the argument regarding FSAA, and I undertsand that people are not impressed with the upscaling resolution issue and feel that there are too many bugs in the release version of the game. I'd rather keep supporting the franchise and try and improve things that way rather than simply not buying the game.

I don't care on which side you are, personnaly, in this debate. What I disagree is that a moderator of this forum don't stay neutral, even if you claim now to express your personnal opinion. The fact is: you come in this thread to say what your are saying, under you official moderator label and not under an other anonymous label.

And now, one of your collegue come to help you singing the same song and an other one, in an other thread the same.

Like I said already in the other thread, I start to think more and more that Ubisoft is sponsoring Subsim.

ACS

And for the record Subsim.com is owned and operated solely by Neal Stevens.

Neal spends countless hours and money out of his own pocket to provide a place where you think you can come and insult him.

Please stop.

JCC

The General · 03-21-07, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDK1044

I think what you're missing is that the reason there isn't any competition is because there isn't that much money to be made producing sub sims. These games attract a predominantly older demographic, and they are PC based games in a world where the large market share is in console based games. The budget and production schedule allocated to a game like Silent Hunter 4 reflects that fact.

Accepting the fact that because of production schedule and cost restraints you're not going to get a bug free game which satisfies you, would you rather have a game that's buggy at release, but which can be patched and modded to make it a great game like SH3, or would you rather have no game at all?

Because if SH4 doesn't meet its sale projection and out sell Silent Hunter 3, that's exactly what's going to happen. And if anyone here thinks that another company will then step in and start making bug free WWII sub sims, having watched Ubisoft fail, then you're living in cloud cukoo land.

Companies produce games to make money. When a game stops making money, they stop making it. What good is all the talent present on this Forum if there's no game for us to play and mod?

So my personal view, which has nothing to do with being a Moderator, is please support the Silent Hunter franchise.

OH! TDK's 2 for 2! High five!

codmander · 03-21-07, 12:42 PM

lol with sh4 getting bashed like this i may get it sooner for 10$

geetrue · 03-21-07, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ryuzu

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biggs[CV]

The thing that gets me about people cancelling their orders is this: The game will be patched, probably 3-4 times at least. UBI knows there are bugs and they are planning to fix them. Get the game, play it a bit, get a feel for it. Get some experiance. Wait for the patches. It'll get better.

The problem is that you are making some big assumptions. Firstly you assume Ubi will provide a patch - so far there has been no statement to that effect. Secondly you assume that "someone else" will provide mods, again there is no confirmation of that.

Ubi may well know there are bugs, whether it's worth patching them is a different matter entirely.

Until something official is written (or better released) then there are no guarantees (having said that, even the README refers to a patch release!:rotfl: ).

r.

Eat your words man

... patch on the way: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=108143

Spaxspore · 03-21-07, 12:49 PM

yea dont confuse ubisoft with eagames...

Gammel · 03-21-07, 12:50 PM

please come down again, folks.

i was close to cancel my order 2 days ago but i didnt.
Now i´m happy to see there´s a release day patch that looks very promising, esp due it adds lots of already promised features.
Guess UBI´s biggest mistake so far with SH4 was the strange northern europe release nearly one week before official release day.

Would be no problem and clever marketing when the pre released version had met some quality standards.
Obviously it hadn´t, so again i cant get why they did that self destructing stuff.

Looking forward to play SH4 this weekend :p

TDK1044 · 03-21-07, 12:55 PM

A substantial patch is about to be released which was being worked on while the game was 'Gold'. The Devs have given 110 percent to this project all the way down the line and within very tight constraints.

-Pv- · 03-21-07, 01:04 PM

I too have cancelled my order since Amazon today decided to push back delivery to the 1st of April (no doubt they will push it again due to lack of attention to demand/delivery.)

Looking for a local retailer now.
-Pv-

Flakchak · 03-21-07, 01:06 PM

I cancelled my order with Amazon...

But reordered with Ubi. I'm not waiting until the end of the month for my freaking game.

I figure by the time I get it, the first patch will be out.

DMarkwick · 03-21-07, 01:37 PM

I can't believe the amount of crying, whining and petulant flouncing going on here. If you're not buying the game no-one cares, and if you're not buying the game you got no further busuness in the SH4 forums. Curl up with SH3 and weep.

50 guys (I have to assume a minimum level of manliness despite the posts here) making angry spanky posts will not in any way affect anything, only gross sales will do that. Most of the guys complaining are the sort to angrily NOT buy any given sim because it doesn't match their exacting requirements in some way or other, and assume that anyone gives a crap.

I too have no business posting in this particular thread (still waiting on a local release) but really, please, show some frickin' dignity with the wailing and gnashing of teeth. It's a game, you don't like it don't buy it and move on to something you DO like.

Also, most of this crap is second hand crap, hearing about no AA, no high res, no this that & the other. How does it actually PLAY? Not many people seem concerned with that, are quite happy to quit based on hearsay and (lack of) imagination which is not very surprising really.

DaMaGe007 · 03-21-07, 01:41 PM

and whining/crying about whining/crying is OK right ?

I guess diferent things upset different people

ACSoft · 03-21-07, 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitman

A moderator is not a judge making a trial, it is a user with certain prerrogatives to help keep the discussions civil. We moderators do not settle the questions, do not make final trials or decissions that are imposed to everyone. We simply try to prevent insulting, harrassing, posting prohibited contents and other acts againts the web's official policy. When we express opinions we are not doing it under the "moderator" label.

OK, then as I said before, I think it would be better to really use an other label (I mean other login & pseudo).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitman

The moderator label is used to delete forbidden contents, lock threads that get out of control and such, and as far as I know, none of this actions has been performed against you.

It is because of all this power and responsability that I think a moderator must stay neutral.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hitman

I respect your point of view, and understand it, just as I defend mine, and all comments done have been in an attempt to steer the discussions towards a more positive feedback and attitude (Which is the official web's policy). You are free not to concur to that intention, and no "moderation" is to be performed against you simply because of that. It is therefore unfair insinuating that there has been an implicit threat in any of the moderator's posts replying to yours.

Sorry, but with all the respect, I think that moderators and Neal too, are going much more far than just to steer the discussions towards a more positive feedback and attitude, like you say. But this is just my opinion.

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Channing

And for the record Subsim.com is owned and operated solely by Neal Stevens.

Neal spends countless hours and money out of his own pocket to provide a place where you think you can come and insult him.

Please stop.

JCC

Yes, I will stop. I promise.

But I do not consider my remark about sponsorship to be an insult.

I remain convinced that saying to peoples more or less "buy the game, or you will punish yourself because Ubisoft will not continue the franchise", do not help at all the dev team. It is the contrary, because it will allow more and more Ubisoft management to "push the dev team on the wall".

I am sure that most of the developers are the first to be very sad TO HAVE BEEN FORCED to give to production an unfinished and still buggy product.

The day the lead developer may argue: "attention Boss, in its actual state, this game will be fired by Subsim and all other specialized forums and this will have probably some bad impact on the income". Then, maybe the Boss will say "Huuumm, you are right. How many time you need to finish ?".

I appologize to everybody I may have bother with my crusade lost in advance.

OK, now I go aways and return to SH3 forums.

ACS

-Pv- · 03-21-07, 02:40 PM

It's the wailing and crying on the part of people who have not bought the game and have no intention of doing so that's so irritating. 99% of us commited to the game have not even played it yet and already there is a patch to make up for the bean counters at UBI pressing to meet the contractural release date, getting product in the stores so we don't have to all slam web servers with 400 meg downloads. Patches don't bother me. It's part of life. How many posts have I seen "there will be no patch" despite every release of SH has been patched? How many posts "even if they patch it they will not fix what I want so I will not buy it." And... "SHII will be the last game because no one will buyt it."

If you have to look at it this way, we all got a demo for a day or two and now we get patched to new and improved. It's probably just the 1st with one or more to come. In the end our monetary investment is the same, the product is the same, and the whole world isn't going to stop turning because one or two features don't meet a minority opinion. As time goes on, more people will buy the game based on seeing reports from hundreds of players and the investors will get their money back- not because they created a perfect game, but because they made a commitment to their BUYERS. I play several games with no ability to turn on AntiAliasing because they are fun to play. It's not a make/break for me although I appreciate games where I CAN add AA.

None of the detractors will influence my commitment because this is the game I want. I have returned games that didn't work to my satisfaction, but at least I PAID for and EXPERIENCED the game myself first. I take VERY strong note of anything people who have PLAYED the game say. They influence my opinion greatly. I take next to nothing from people who have NOT played the game who are critisizing it's game play value. Especially when the multitude of complaints eventually proove unfounded over the life of the product.
The test of a prophet is if what they prophesi comes true, not how outlandish or likely it may be.

Best Buy in my area thinks they will have 50 copies in stock by the end of the day. They will get my Amazon money. This is how the market place works.
-Pv-

03-21-07, 12:49 PM	#67
Spaxspore Sonar Guy Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 399 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	yea dont confuse ubisoft with eagames... __________________ Behold, the Glory of the Sh4 engine..... Morning strole off Tokyo Bay...

03-21-07, 12:50 PM	#68
Gammel Commodore Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 641 Downloads: 276 Uploads: 0	please come down again, folks. i was close to cancel my order 2 days ago but i didnt. Now i´m happy to see there´s a release day patch that looks very promising, esp due it adds lots of already promised features. Guess UBI´s biggest mistake so far with SH4 was the strange northern europe release nearly one week before official release day. Would be no problem and clever marketing when the pre released version had met some quality standards. Obviously it hadn´t, so again i cant get why they did that self destructing stuff. Looking forward to play SH4 this weekend :p __________________ nie das Boot verlassen

03-21-07, 12:11 PM	#61
DaMaGe007 Watch Officer Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 338 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	You have to remember that moderators were once users like us and they dont sign on to subsim policy of suporting games in particular. They are given privlages to control users due to thier record over time on the forum. They dont magicly lose thier opinions when they become a mod, and they tend to be suportive of sub titled despite bugs ect because otherwise they wont be a mod here at all due to the forum disapearing cos of lack of games. I dont expect Mods to be impartial unless they are moderating a dispute.

03-21-07, 12:42 PM	#65
codmander Seasoned Skipper Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: cape cod mass. Posts: 678 Downloads: 59 Uploads: 0	lol with sh4 getting bashed like this i may get it sooner for 10$

03-21-07, 12:55 PM	#69
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	A substantial patch is about to be released which was being worked on while the game was 'Gold'. The Devs have given 110 percent to this project all the way down the line and within very tight constraints.

03-21-07, 01:04 PM	#70
-Pv- The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,434 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	I too have cancelled my order since Amazon today decided to push back delivery to the 1st of April (no doubt they will push it again due to lack of attention to demand/delivery.) Looking for a local retailer now. -Pv-

03-21-07, 01:06 PM	#71
Flakchak Swabbie Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 11 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	I cancelled my order with Amazon... But reordered with Ubi. I'm not waiting until the end of the month for my freaking game. I figure by the time I get it, the first patch will be out.

03-21-07, 01:37 PM	#72
DMarkwick Shore leave Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 70 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I can't believe the amount of crying, whining and petulant flouncing going on here. If you're not buying the game no-one cares, and if you're not buying the game you got no further busuness in the SH4 forums. Curl up with SH3 and weep. 50 guys (I have to assume a minimum level of manliness despite the posts here) making angry spanky posts will not in any way affect anything, only gross sales will do that. Most of the guys complaining are the sort to angrily NOT buy any given sim because it doesn't match their exacting requirements in some way or other, and assume that anyone gives a crap. I too have no business posting in this particular thread (still waiting on a local release) but really, please, show some frickin' dignity with the wailing and gnashing of teeth. It's a game, you don't like it don't buy it and move on to something you DO like. Also, most of this crap is second hand crap, hearing about no AA, no high res, no this that & the other. How does it actually PLAY? Not many people seem concerned with that, are quite happy to quit based on hearsay and (lack of) imagination which is not very surprising really.

03-21-07, 01:41 PM	#73
DaMaGe007 Watch Officer Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 338 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	and whining/crying about whining/crying is OK right ? I guess diferent things upset different people

03-21-07, 02:40 PM	#75
-Pv- The Old Man Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 1,434 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	It's the wailing and crying on the part of people who have not bought the game and have no intention of doing so that's so irritating. 99% of us commited to the game have not even played it yet and already there is a patch to make up for the bean counters at UBI pressing to meet the contractural release date, getting product in the stores so we don't have to all slam web servers with 400 meg downloads. Patches don't bother me. It's part of life. How many posts have I seen "there will be no patch" despite every release of SH has been patched? How many posts "even if they patch it they will not fix what I want so I will not buy it." And... "SHII will be the last game because no one will buyt it." If you have to look at it this way, we all got a demo for a day or two and now we get patched to new and improved. It's probably just the 1st with one or more to come. In the end our monetary investment is the same, the product is the same, and the whole world isn't going to stop turning because one or two features don't meet a minority opinion. As time goes on, more people will buy the game based on seeing reports from hundreds of players and the investors will get their money back- not because they created a perfect game, but because they made a commitment to their BUYERS. I play several games with no ability to turn on AntiAliasing because they are fun to play. It's not a make/break for me although I appreciate games where I CAN add AA. None of the detractors will influence my commitment because this is the game I want. I have returned games that didn't work to my satisfaction, but at least I PAID for and EXPERIENCED the game myself first. I take VERY strong note of anything people who have PLAYED the game say. They influence my opinion greatly. I take next to nothing from people who have NOT played the game who are critisizing it's game play value. Especially when the multitude of complaints eventually proove unfounded over the life of the product. The test of a prophet is if what they prophesi comes true, not how outlandish or likely it may be. Best Buy in my area thinks they will have 50 copies in stock by the end of the day. They will get my Amazon money. This is how the market place works. -Pv-