US Politics Thread 2021-24

[August]

Originally Posted by Dargo

All those countries Trump said he will not help if Putin attacks them pay their share above the 2% GDP.

That's not how I read that chart. Looks to me like only half, including the US, pay MORE than their fair share and the ones in black (including some very rich nations) are deadbeats.

[Jimbuna]

Currently only eleven of the thirty NATO members meet the recommended criteria.

[les green01]

11 out of 30 not even half if anything happens the ones who don't comes a running they don't want to produce or be able to fight shouldn't come running with their hands out or female doging on this thread if the USA decides to do America first

[Buddahaid]

Originally Posted by les green01

11 out of 30 not even half if anything happens the ones who don't comes a running they don't want to produce or be able to fight shouldn't come running with their hands out or female doging on this thread if the USA decides to do America first

And again the supremacy clause of the Constitution makes honoring treaties part of the supreme law of the land. The US the would have to formally withdraw from NATO which would require congress to act on it, not the executive branch. Read the damned document.

[mapuc]

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

And again the supremacy clause of the Constitution makes honoring treaties part of the supreme law of the land. The US the would have to formally withdraw from NATO which would require congress to act on it, not the executive branch. Read the damned document.

As I understand it - It wasn't about leaving NATO, it was to withhold any military assist to those members who hadn't payed full 2 % of the countries BNP.

And if I read the Article 5 correct-USA isn't forced to help a member in need.

Markus

[Jimbuna]

I think the main bone of contention here is the fact that the potential next POTUS announced to the world “You didn't pay? You're delinquent? No, I would not protect you – in fact, I would encourage them to do whatever they want… You gotta pay.”

[Skybird]

Pacta sunt servanda.

Europeans have forgotten that.

Trump could boycott the defense of European nations without needing to leave NATO. He could just use the loophole build into NATO article 5 whose wording is such that it leaves every country the freedom to decide by itself whether it defines a given situation as a case valid to trigger the obligation to assist, or not. It also leaves open the possibility that any government dedices for itself in what form and by what means it contributes to the cause of defending somebody.

Article 5 is not that fail-safe road to "one for all, all for one" as which especially Europeans usually understand it.

I cant stand Trump, but sometimes, not matter what his real motives may be, he gets something right. And here he is. At least as far as his view on the European obligations goes.


On the other hand he is so derranged that it seems he cannot differentiate anymore between somebody who was Ronald Reagan or Margret Thatcher and somebody who was Adolf Hitler or Pol Pot, and mistakes the respectability of the one with that of the other, hence his admiration for Putin, Kim and Xi. Just that his own interest trumps everything and everybody else.



Regarding his geostrategic understanding of the US' global military and logistical interests, some US general recently described him as an "uneducated illiterate". That phrasing is a Bingo.

The cards get reshuffled. The US, China and Russia, icreasingly India divide and distribute the world newly. The old order after WW2 is no more. Europe is almost certainly gonna be left behind, has not what it takes to play with the big boys. However, if the US let it fall, it might be that Europe decides to then align itself to Russia, adding its potentials and skills it has to the Russian pool. And is that really in America's interest...?

Sometimes it is better to stay friends with someone, just to prevent them from befriending your enemy. After the example set by Saudi Arabia, Washington better should have learned this.

[Otto Harkaman]

USA is Trillions of dollars in debt, our military is dispersed all over the globe and the Europeans are complaining about paying just the minimum for their own defense

[Dargo]

Republican warning of 'national security threat' is about Russia wanting nuke in space

The White House's national security adviser said Wednesday that he had already scheduled a classified meeting with congressional leadership before a top House Republican requested that President Joe Biden "declassify all information" that relates to "serious national security threat." Two sources familiar with deliberations on Capitol Hill said the intelligence has to do with the Russians wanting to put a nuclear weapon into space. This is not to drop a nuclear weapon onto Earth but rather to possibly use against satellites.

"It is very concerning and very sensitive," said one source, who called it "a big deal." While not addressing the subject matter directly, multiple members of Congress have described the issue as serious -- but nothing that should cause public alarm... https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/whit...y?id=107232293

[mapuc]

Our newspaper here are using scare tactics-They say if Trump wins it's the end of NATO.

No it's not the end, it's the beginning of a new era a new type of NATO where each member pay their share(2 % of BNP)

Why they are using these scare tactics I don't know-It's not an American newspaper, so there's nothing we the European can do IF he decide to withdraw US from NATO.

He will not...

Markus

[Onkel Neal]

Mitterrand is back, too!



and somehow the President of Mexico opened the Israeli gate...


He's just wandering around here...

[ET2SN]

I'm still voting for him.

I worked too hard back in the day to just give everything to the Kremlin.

[ET2SN]

Meanwhile,..

[August]

Originally Posted by mapuc

It's not an American newspaper, so there's nothing we the European can do IF he decide to withdraw US from NATO.

He will not...

Markus

Trump can't withdraw us from NATO even if he desperately wanted to. Budda is correct. It would take a literal act of Congress.

[les green01]

Originally Posted by Buddahaid

And again the supremacy clause of the Constitution makes honoring treaties part of the supreme law of the land. The US the would have to formally withdraw from NATO which would require congress to act on it, not the executive branch. Read the damned document.

Honoring treaties that a joke how many treaties they made with the native Americans they honor again you talk about reading the damn document but you want to use 14-3 that can't be used the countries the not holding up their part of the NATO treaty to begin with don't deserve our help or money seem like you democrates are so worried about europe or nato and not what crossing the border that you guys open up