Europe's migrant problem - Page 45

01-11-16, 01:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schroeder

Not going to happen as we don't deport to most places of origin of those guys. If the perpetrator has to fear for his life or health in his country of origin he can't be deported and they know it.

And on top of that, they first have to get a trial and a sentence. And that alone takes forever.
even then, he can stay and enjoy the comfort of German prisons - paid by us.
Enjoy your stay, Ahmed, and the Women when you're out again after a few months, because you're "just a victim too" bla bla...

ikalugin · 01-11-16, 01:39 PM

The impression I get is that German law enforcement has two main problems now:
- inability to prosecute suspected criminals due to the inability to narrow down the responsibility to a specific individual during crimes commited by a group.
- inability to deport criminals who did not commit heavy crimes.

This could lead to the perception by the newly arrived people that they are not only entitled to the exceptional social services, but also that they would not suffer consequences for their actions.

While you can't fix the 2nd problem due to the international conventions you can try to fix the first one (via a network of informants for example) and you could also take other measures such as forced fingerprinting of all new arrivers.

mapuc · 01-11-16, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ikalugin

The impression I get is that German law enforcement has two main problems now:
- inability to prosecute suspected criminals due to the inability to narrow down the responsibility to a specific individual during crimes commited by a group.
- inability to deport criminals who did not commit heavy crimes.

This could lead to the perception by the newly arrived people that they are not only entitled to the exceptional social services, but also that they would not suffer consequences for their actions.

While you can't fix the 2nd problem due to the international conventions you can try to fix the first one (via a network of informants for example) and you could also take other measures such as forced fingerprinting of all new arrivers.

The are many stories "floating around" regarding what happened in Cologne and other German cities.

One of them is about how the Police in Cologne was humiliated.

I wasn't there so I can't say what is true and what is not

Markus

Skybird · 01-11-16, 04:42 PM

Its a blame game between the most superior politician responsible for the police - which would be the interiror minister of North Rhine-Westphalia, Mr. Jäger (SPD), and the police officers in Cologne who were at the scene, serve on the scene since long, and did the paper work on that night (and still do so: 540 complaints now filed, now over 40% of these over sexual harassment and attempted or done rape). The shame of victims of sexual violence is the greatest, these are the victims that take the longest time to bring up the courage to go to the police, so the longer complaints keep coming in, the higher the share of complaints over sexual harassment amongst these "latecomers". Jäger is no objkective neutral in this, he has his big share of responsibility of having reduced plice forces and cut budgets for the police, so his own fate is at stake (not that it counts muich). If needing to chose between Jäger and the police officers, I tend to believe those who were on the scene, and who do the paperwork and know the police rercords first hand and the numbers because they wrote the complaints. And that is neither Mr. Jäger, nor official - and politically regulated - spokesmen of the police.

It is the officers themselves I believe most.

Over 200 cases of sexual violence, by the current standing of records. So much for those unscrupulous propagandists who already insist again that the majority of crimes were about stealing purses and cellphones. Yes, 60% of the filed complaints are on that. And over 200 complaints are filed for sexual violence and attempted or completed rape. 200 humiliated and to varying degrees traumatized girls and women for whom life is not like it was before, and whjo have fear now added to their everday life as an omnipresent companion.

Kongo Otto · 01-11-16, 10:12 PM

/zynism mode on
Nah c'mon, nobody could have known that when we (the German Government) bring in some one Million welfare tourists with the mentality and traditions still in the 13th century, that they will bring there mentaliiy and traditions with them.
/zynism mode off

Don't forget they all have at least a College or University degree and are all higly searched Doctors, Engineeers and so on and so forth.
And of course this has nothing to do with the religion of the permanently offended, erm, sorry, i mean Islam, as always, some could say.
/ second time zynism mode off

Skybird · 01-12-16, 11:26 AM

Number of complaints filed with the police over assaults at Cologne Central Station now over 650.

Schroeder · 01-12-16, 12:23 PM

It seems that the police forces at least in North Rhine-Westphalia have been gagged for years when it came to publish the origin of criminals. I'm certain that the same is true for pretty much all states in Germany.
Sorry, German only:
http://www1.wdr.de/themen/politik/di...rlass-100.html

Wildcat · 01-14-16, 11:16 AM

What a lot of you people don't seem to get is this:

Germany cannot deport asylum seekers. It is against international law.

Once someone applies for asylum in any country signatory to the UN convention regarding treatment of refugees / asylum seekers, that country cannot deport them. CAN NOT. To do so is a violation of the UN convention and in any civilized country would result in huge political ramifications and financial penalties. Refugees can only leave the country if they A) decide they want to leave on their own accord and B) have a country in mind that will take them in and where the refugee can PROVE to the satisfaction of the immigration authorities' that they will not be in danger if they attempt to enter said country.

The refugees all know this. They understand it very well which is why they are not afraid to commit crimes in your countries. They're untouchable. They can be charged, but being in jail is likely an improvement in quality of life for many of them. They don't need to work, they get free food, medical and dental care, television all day, and then they get released, likely after the fighting in their country is finished. Ultra-left wingers and refugee apologists get to these people as soon as they're in the country and feed them with all the information they need to stay there as long as possible and how to receive as much of the government's money as is possible.

If you want to deport asylum seekers you need to have your country change its participation in the UN convention dealing with refugees. Unlikely to happen barring massive political changes.

In the case of Japan which has not changed at all since WW2, they just put asylum seekers in immigration camps permanently, and occasionally murder them in their cells. They killed 3 asylum seekers out of a population of 500 in 2014 inside the government camps, check online about that.

Again, you don't need to believe me, but I've gone through this process firsthand which is a lot more than anyone else can say in this thread. I challenge anyone who thinks they "know more" about this issue than I do. I've seen the process from the inside out, from start to finish. I know exactly what those refugees are doing, and 90-99% of them are bad people and they are just in your country to take your money, and they do not like you, and they despise your country and your way of life. Many of them would not hesitate to kill you if they thought they could get away with it. They are sick people.

Yes, there are a few who are good people, and who truly fit the definition of refugees - people running from violence, oppression, persecution etc. (The UN has strict guidelines regarding what is acceptable as a reason for asylum, look it up). All these fake refugees make it impossible for real victims to get in though.

Rockstar · 01-14-16, 01:10 PM

International law recognizes that countries have the right to exclude asylum seekers who may be a danger to society. These include those who have committed serious crimes, pose threats to national security, or who have committed war crimes or "crimes against humanity".

Terrorism concerns can lead to automatic disqualification from asylum. Even before the events of 9/11, people with terrorist connections were ineligible for asylum and subject to deportation. However, laws passed by Congress after 9/11 in 2001 and again 2005 have broadened restrictions even further. Under current U.S. law, any person who provides "material support" to terrorists will be refused asylum. Since there is no exemption for cases of coercion, even acts such as providing drinking water at gunpoint to terrorists are to be considered material support.

Schroeder · 01-14-16, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockstar

International law recognizes that countries have the right to exclude asylum seekers who may be a danger to society. These include those who have committed serious crimes, pose threats to national security, or who have committed war crimes or "crimes against humanity".

Terrorism concerns can lead to automatic disqualification from asylum. Even before the events of 9/11, people with terrorist connections were ineligible for asylum and subject to deportation. However, laws passed by Congress after 9/11 in 2001 and again 2005 have broadened restrictions even further. Under current U.S. law, any person who provides "material support" to terrorists will be refused asylum. Since there is no exemption for cases of coercion, even acts such as providing drinking water at gunpoint to terrorists are to be considered material support.

^This.

The Convention relating to the Status of Refugees allows to deport convicted criminals and that is what Germany is planning to do now (though I doubt I'll ever see it actually happen...).

Rockstar · 01-14-16, 01:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schroeder

^This.

The Convention relating to the Status of Refugees allows to deport convicted criminals and that is what Germany is planning to do now (though I doubt I'll ever see it actually happen...).

The first step is for officials to recognize they live in a fantasy world and ground themselves in reality so they can see the problem. Only then can deportation proceedings begin.

Dowly · 01-14-16, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockstar

The first step is for officials to recognize they live in a fantasy world and ground themselves in reality so they can see the problem. Only then can deportation proceedings begin.

Exactly.

I think this video (the woman) illustrates quite correctly how most European governments act atm:

Jimbuna · 01-15-16, 06:58 AM

Well done that French court....common sense prevailed.

Quote:

BOULOGNE-SUR-MER, France (AP) — A British man who risked being convicted as a smuggler prevailed in court Thursday, convincing judges that he acted with his heart when he tried to deliver a four-year-old Afghan girl from a squalid migrant camp in France to family members in Britain.

The three-judge panel threw out the smuggling charge — which carried a penalty of up to five years in prison — convicting him instead of the far less grievous crime of endangerment and suspended the 1000-euro ($1,090) fine.

The court room erupted in cheers at the verdict.

http://news.yahoo.com/hero-smuggler-...084538316.html

STEED · 01-17-16, 08:48 AM

Quote:

German Finance Minister Wolfgang Schaeuble on Saturday mooted the possibility of an additional EU-wide petrol tax to cover the increasing cost of migration to Europe.

https://about.hr/news/europe/german-...-migrants-6625

Schroeder · 01-17-16, 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by STEED

https://about.hr/news/europe/german-...-migrants-6625

Has already been shot down. but I think it's time that the other EU countries pay their share (and that Merkel finally comes to her senses and does a 180° turn around which is about as likely as world peace by tomorrow

).
The opinion in the population has changed and for the first time a majority of Germans is unsatisfied with Merkel's migration politics...I still don't think she cares....welcome to "democracy".

01-11-16, 01:39 PM	#662
ikalugin Ocean Warrior Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Moscow, Russia Posts: 3,212 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 0	The impression I get is that German law enforcement has two main problems now: - inability to prosecute suspected criminals due to the inability to narrow down the responsibility to a specific individual during crimes commited by a group. - inability to deport criminals who did not commit heavy crimes. This could lead to the perception by the newly arrived people that they are not only entitled to the exceptional social services, but also that they would not suffer consequences for their actions. While you can't fix the 2nd problem due to the international conventions you can try to fix the first one (via a network of informants for example) and you could also take other measures such as forced fingerprinting of all new arrivers. __________________ Grumpy as always.

01-11-16, 04:42 PM	#664
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,717 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Its a blame game between the most superior politician responsible for the police - which would be the interiror minister of North Rhine-Westphalia, Mr. Jäger (SPD), and the police officers in Cologne who were at the scene, serve on the scene since long, and did the paper work on that night (and still do so: 540 complaints now filed, now over 40% of these over sexual harassment and attempted or done rape). The shame of victims of sexual violence is the greatest, these are the victims that take the longest time to bring up the courage to go to the police, so the longer complaints keep coming in, the higher the share of complaints over sexual harassment amongst these "latecomers". Jäger is no objkective neutral in this, he has his big share of responsibility of having reduced plice forces and cut budgets for the police, so his own fate is at stake (not that it counts muich). If needing to chose between Jäger and the police officers, I tend to believe those who were on the scene, and who do the paperwork and know the police rercords first hand and the numbers because they wrote the complaints. And that is neither Mr. Jäger, nor official - and politically regulated - spokesmen of the police. It is the officers themselves I believe most. Over 200 cases of sexual violence, by the current standing of records. So much for those unscrupulous propagandists who already insist again that the majority of crimes were about stealing purses and cellphones. Yes, 60% of the filed complaints are on that. And over 200 complaints are filed for sexual violence and attempted or completed rape. 200 humiliated and to varying degrees traumatized girls and women for whom life is not like it was before, and whjo have fear now added to their everday life as an omnipresent companion. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-12-16, 11:26 AM	#666
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 42,717 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	Number of complaints filed with the police over assaults at Cologne Central Station now over 650. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-12-16, 12:23 PM	#667
Schroeder Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Banana Republic of Germany Posts: 6,170 Downloads: 62 Uploads: 0	It seems that the police forces at least in North Rhine-Westphalia have been gagged for years when it came to publish the origin of criminals. I'm certain that the same is true for pretty much all states in Germany. Sorry, German only: http://www1.wdr.de/themen/politik/di...rlass-100.html __________________ Putting Germ back into Germany.

01-14-16, 11:16 AM	#668
Wildcat Engineer Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 215 Downloads: 69 Uploads: 0	What a lot of you people don't seem to get is this: Germany cannot deport asylum seekers. It is against international law. Once someone applies for asylum in any country signatory to the UN convention regarding treatment of refugees / asylum seekers, that country cannot deport them. CAN NOT. To do so is a violation of the UN convention and in any civilized country would result in huge political ramifications and financial penalties. Refugees can only leave the country if they A) decide they want to leave on their own accord and B) have a country in mind that will take them in and where the refugee can PROVE to the satisfaction of the immigration authorities' that they will not be in danger if they attempt to enter said country. The refugees all know this. They understand it very well which is why they are not afraid to commit crimes in your countries. They're untouchable. They can be charged, but being in jail is likely an improvement in quality of life for many of them. They don't need to work, they get free food, medical and dental care, television all day, and then they get released, likely after the fighting in their country is finished. Ultra-left wingers and refugee apologists get to these people as soon as they're in the country and feed them with all the information they need to stay there as long as possible and how to receive as much of the government's money as is possible. If you want to deport asylum seekers you need to have your country change its participation in the UN convention dealing with refugees. Unlikely to happen barring massive political changes. In the case of Japan which has not changed at all since WW2, they just put asylum seekers in immigration camps permanently, and occasionally murder them in their cells. They killed 3 asylum seekers out of a population of 500 in 2014 inside the government camps, check online about that. Again, you don't need to believe me, but I've gone through this process firsthand which is a lot more than anyone else can say in this thread. I challenge anyone who thinks they "know more" about this issue than I do. I've seen the process from the inside out, from start to finish. I know exactly what those refugees are doing, and 90-99% of them are bad people and they are just in your country to take your money, and they do not like you, and they despise your country and your way of life. Many of them would not hesitate to kill you if they thought they could get away with it. They are sick people. Yes, there are a few who are good people, and who truly fit the definition of refugees - people running from violence, oppression, persecution etc. (The UN has strict guidelines regarding what is acceptable as a reason for asylum, look it up). All these fake refugees make it impossible for real victims to get in though. Last edited by Wildcat; 01-14-16 at 11:23 AM.

01-11-16, 10:12 PM	#665
Kongo Otto Commodore Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Augsburg / Germany Posts: 631 Downloads: 203 Uploads: 0	/zynism mode on Nah c'mon, nobody could have known that when we (the German Government) bring in some one Million welfare tourists with the mentality and traditions still in the 13th century, that they will bring there mentaliiy and traditions with them. /zynism mode off Don't forget they all have at least a College or University degree and are all higly searched Doctors, Engineeers and so on and so forth. And of course this has nothing to do with the religion of the permanently offended, erm, sorry, i mean Islam, as always, some could say. / second time zynism mode off

01-14-16, 01:10 PM	#669
Rockstar In the Brig Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Zendia Bar & Grill Posts: 12,614 Downloads: 10 Uploads: 0	International law recognizes that countries have the right to exclude asylum seekers who may be a danger to society. These include those who have committed serious crimes, pose threats to national security, or who have committed war crimes or "crimes against humanity". Terrorism concerns can lead to automatic disqualification from asylum. Even before the events of 9/11, people with terrorist connections were ineligible for asylum and subject to deportation. However, laws passed by Congress after 9/11 in 2001 and again 2005 have broadened restrictions even further. Under current U.S. law, any person who provides "material support" to terrorists will be refused asylum. Since there is no exemption for cases of coercion, even acts such as providing drinking water at gunpoint to terrorists are to be considered material support.