FSAA/Anti-aliasing/Major resolution problem (merged) - Page 4

Immacolata · 03-20-07, 06:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Safe-Keeper

"Lying" and "feeling certain enough that a given feature will be in to promise its insertion, for then to have it cut short because of unexpected hindrances" are two very different things.

Yes, yes, but that balanced view completely ruins the emo's hissyfits, throwing toy out of pram and what not. I'll do the wait and see approach to this game I think, not going to get worked up over it. If I can keep up my resolve I will wait till after first patch to buy it.

Quote:

Most developers are good people. Many publishers are good people. Too many games are rushed these days, but most developers I don't have a problem with.

I actually think Ubi is working up a slightly troubled track record on buggy releases. Its not just SH4, its just about every game these days. Take EA for instance, their games are much less buggy. Not flawless of course, but they just work better out of the box.

if Ubi really wants to beat EA they better up their quality standards a bit.

DragonRR1 · 03-20-07, 07:04 AM

Just an update on my original post:

I am almost 100% certain now that anything 3D is locked at 1024x768

I've tried the SH3 res fix.. doesn't seem to work.

I've searched through the config files and other files to find a fix and cannot find anything obvious.

It seems that anything 2D is rendered at the set resolution - in my case 1920x1200 - for example on the navigation map screen everything excluding event cameras is at full resolution.

A programmer friend of mine thinks that it would actually be more difficult for the devs to render the 3D in this way (he thinks they are rendering to a back buffer first rather than direct rendering) so he suggests that they could probably fix it if they chose to.

For me the problem is disappointing to say the least. I have gone back to SH3+GWX with the old SH3 res fix to run at 1920x1200 for now.. imho it looks, in the main, better than SH4.

The problem isn't a complete show stopper but it is just ludicrous that at 1920x1200 distant objects and even the sub's railings look pixellated.

Here's a shot I took of Sh3 with GWX at 1920x1200.. no jaggies or pixellation.. AND NO AA!! for those of you that think this is an AA problem

[img=http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/8100/sh3xe0.th.gif]

Interestingly if you enable the software AA at 1920x1200 (shift-pageup/dwn I think) in SH3 it starts to look more like SH4! I've tried various key combinations in SH4 but can't find anything to turn off s/w AA (if it's there at all)

Paco454 · 03-21-07, 12:42 PM

Ok seems you change resolution but this only effects the menu's and icons. The game however remains fixed at 1024x768 with AA not working. I tried using the keygety's res fix for Sh3 using the Compatibilty Administrator but it only bumps me back to desktop.

We need a fix for this as we did in SH3.
Anybody able to fix this?

PACO454

OneTinSoldier · 03-21-07, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paco454

Ok seems you change resolution but this only effects the menu's and icons. The game however remains fixed at 1024x768 with AA not working. I tried using the keygety's res fix for Sh3 using the Compatibilty Administrator but it only bumps me back to desktop.

We need a fix for this as we did in SH3.
Anybody able to fix this?

PACO454

No. Not yet.

And it's why this thread is 22 pages long and still going strong! We want this made right Ubi!

DragonRR1 · 03-21-07, 01:19 PM

Great news about the patch!

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=108143

Except that there is not a single mention of the resolution issue

Guido · 03-21-07, 02:09 PM

I wonder if that patch will fix the carboard crew members, my wife came in whilst I was playing SH4, and I showed her the crew. She laughed aloud at the "stick men" as she called them. I really think Id prefer no crew at all, to the "RIFLE RANGE MEN"!

Grobschnitt · 03-24-07, 02:08 AM

I'm not holding my beath for a fix, there are so many bugs missing features that the devs will not have time/money to fix all of it all..

Ark · 03-24-07, 02:12 PM

After checking out osme other games, if I had to choose between resolution OR FSAA, I would choose FSAA.

There is a higher likelihood the community can mod the resolution. I doubt the community could integrate FSAA since there is a very good chance it is directly related to the engine.

In addiiton, higher resolution without FSAA still looks like a mess, IMO Which is why I used the resolution hack AND fsaa in SH3). In all honesty, you can't really have one without the other in terms of looks. If we only had FSAA the resolution would still be low and peope with LCDs would not get to true in native-res. If we only had high resolution, jaggies would still be present and those who run at lower resolution would still get the short end of the stick. IMO, you really need to have both options available so everybody can benefit in their own way.

DragonRR1 · 03-24-07, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ark

After checking out osme other games, if I had to choose between resolution OR FSAA, I would choose FSAA.

There is a higher likelihood the community can mod the resolution. I doubt the community could integrate FSAA since there is a very good chance it is directly related to the engine.

In addiiton, higher resolution without FSAA still looks like a mess, IMO Which is why I used the resolution hack AND fsaa in SH3). In all honesty, you can't really have one without the other in terms of looks. If we only had FSAA the resolution would still be low and peope with LCDs would not get to true in native-res. If we only had high resolution, jaggies would still be present and those who run at lower resolution would still get the short end of the stick. IMO, you really need to have both options available so everybody can benefit in their own way.

I can't say that modding the resolution isn't possible but it probably won't be easy. As I have mentioned I *think* that some 3D views such as the periscope view are at a higher resolution which would make the forced resolution settings harder to find. I have some programming and modding experience and I have had a really good look through the files for anything forcing the resolution, there is nothing obvious and I've already tried changing the most obvious entries, including a few in the main .exe file, to no affect. The SH3 res fix doesn't have any affect in SH4 but it does work with other games where the WHOLE screen resolution is fixed (according to the author). http://www.kegetys.net/misc/

People like myself with largish screens capable of 1920x1200, 1680x1050 or 1600x1200 even 16x AA on 1024x768 would be awful. As you say ideally we need both high res AND the ability to do H/W AA but for I would MUCH rather have full res than AA if I had to choose between them.

The smaller the dot pitch of your screen the less you need AA. Obviously if you have a dot pitch smaller than the eye can see then you don't need AA at all. I have a 17" laptop with a resolution of 1920x1200 the pixels are so tiny that AA would be almost worthless. For SH4 and gaming I use a 27" Dell with a dot pitch of about 0.3 which means that a pixel is fairly noticeable but I still tend not to bother with AA at full resolution if I have to sacrifice FPS for it.

For people with 1080P 40-60" TV's high res isn't enough.. a 46" is 0.5mm and a 57" is about 0.7mm so jagged edges would be pretty obvious. This is also true for people with lower resolution but relatively large screens.

nhall70 · 03-24-07, 10:17 PM

Generally speaking, I would have to agree with Ark.

When forced to make a choice, I typically run at the highest resolution I can afford (performance wise) AFTER I've cranked FSAA all the way up.

However, in the end they are both very important for good image quality (if you're in to that kind of thing).

Here's to running SH4 at 1920x1200 with x16Q...it will be a sight to behold!

SteamWake · 03-24-07, 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhall70

Generally speaking, I would have to agree with Ark.

When forced to make a choice, I typically run at the highest resolution I can afford (performance wise) AFTER I've cranked FSAA all the way up.

However, in the end they are both very important for good image quality (if you're in to that kind of thing).

Here's to running SH4 at 1920x1200 with x16Q...it will be a sight to behold!

Would

Gizzmoe · 03-25-07, 12:18 PM

Actually it´s time to close this thread, the main reason is that this topic has been discussed to death, the second reason is that threads with a many replies put a large strain on the forum database/server, due to the way the forum software works.

I´ve added a link to this thread to the "Technical Help and Questions" sticky.

03-21-07, 12:42 PM	#3
Paco454 Swabbie Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 7 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Resolutions. Forced 1024x768 Ok seems you change resolution but this only effects the menu's and icons. The game however remains fixed at 1024x768 with AA not working. I tried using the keygety's res fix for Sh3 using the Compatibilty Administrator but it only bumps me back to desktop. We need a fix for this as we did in SH3. Anybody able to fix this? PACO454

03-21-07, 02:09 PM	#6
Guido Loader Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Englande Posts: 84 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I wonder if that patch will fix the carboard crew members, my wife came in whilst I was playing SH4, and I showed her the crew. She laughed aloud at the "stick men" as she called them. I really think Id prefer no crew at all, to the "RIFLE RANGE MEN"! __________________ Cant sink, wont sink........................

03-24-07, 02:12 PM	#8
Ark Samurai Navy Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Fresno, CA. Posts: 581 Downloads: 95 Uploads: 0	After checking out osme other games, if I had to choose between resolution OR FSAA, I would choose FSAA. There is a higher likelihood the community can mod the resolution. I doubt the community could integrate FSAA since there is a very good chance it is directly related to the engine. In addiiton, higher resolution without FSAA still looks like a mess, IMO Which is why I used the resolution hack AND fsaa in SH3). In all honesty, you can't really have one without the other in terms of looks. If we only had FSAA the resolution would still be low and peope with LCDs would not get to true in native-res. If we only had high resolution, jaggies would still be present and those who run at lower resolution would still get the short end of the stick. IMO, you really need to have both options available so everybody can benefit in their own way. __________________ Ark -------------- Vista 64-bit SP1 Asus P6T Deluxe mobo Core i7 920 @ 3.8ghz 6GB G.Skill DDR3 1600 Evga GTX 285 SSC SB X-FI Fatality 640GB WD "Black" Dell 3007WFP-HC 30" LCD / Acer 23" H233H Last edited by Ark; 03-24-07 at 02:26 PM.

03-25-07, 12:18 PM	#12
Gizzmoe Silent Hunter Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Germany Posts: 3,668 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Actually it´s time to close this thread, the main reason is that this topic has been discussed to death, the second reason is that threads with a many replies put a large strain on the forum database/server, due to the way the forum software works. I´ve added a link to this thread to the "Technical Help and Questions" sticky. Last edited by Gizzmoe; 03-25-07 at 12:37 PM.

03-20-07, 07:04 AM	#2
DragonRR1 Officer Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: UK Posts: 246 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Just an update on my original post: I am almost 100% certain now that anything 3D is locked at 1024x768 I've tried the SH3 res fix.. doesn't seem to work. I've searched through the config files and other files to find a fix and cannot find anything obvious. It seems that anything 2D is rendered at the set resolution - in my case 1920x1200 - for example on the navigation map screen everything excluding event cameras is at full resolution. A programmer friend of mine thinks that it would actually be more difficult for the devs to render the 3D in this way (he thinks they are rendering to a back buffer first rather than direct rendering) so he suggests that they could probably fix it if they chose to. For me the problem is disappointing to say the least. I have gone back to SH3+GWX with the old SH3 res fix to run at 1920x1200 for now.. imho it looks, in the main, better than SH4. The problem isn't a complete show stopper but it is just ludicrous that at 1920x1200 distant objects and even the sub's railings look pixellated. Here's a shot I took of Sh3 with GWX at 1920x1200.. no jaggies or pixellation.. AND NO AA!! for those of you that think this is an AA problem [img=http://img59.imageshack.us/img59/8100/sh3xe0.th.gif] Interestingly if you enable the software AA at 1920x1200 (shift-pageup/dwn I think) in SH3 it starts to look more like SH4! I've tried various key combinations in SH4 but can't find anything to turn off s/w AA (if it's there at all)

03-21-07, 01:19 PM	#5
DragonRR1 Officer Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: UK Posts: 246 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Great news about the patch! http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=108143 Except that there is not a single mention of the resolution issue

03-24-07, 02:08 AM	#7
Grobschnitt Swabbie Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Canada Posts: 9 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	I'm not holding my beath for a fix, there are so many bugs missing features that the devs will not have time/money to fix all of it all..

03-24-07, 10:17 PM	#10
nhall70 Sailor man Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 46 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Generally speaking, I would have to agree with Ark. When forced to make a choice, I typically run at the highest resolution I can afford (performance wise) AFTER I've cranked FSAA all the way up. However, in the end they are both very important for good image quality (if you're in to that kind of thing). Here's to running SH4 at 1920x1200 with x16Q...it will be a sight to behold!