The term "Japs"

[Iron Budokan]

Maybe I'm opening a can of worms that should better remain closed, but here goes anyway. I've noticed several people on this board are starting to refer to the Japanese opponents in SH5 as "Japs". I know racism was particularly virulent on both sides (American and Japanese) during the war. My main question is how do we handle that in SH5 and on these boards?

Speaking for myself I won't refer to my polygon opponents as Japs. Nor do I care if someone else does, maybe they're just doing the immersion thing. And I swear I'm not trying to imply in any way someone who says that is racist. But it got me to thinking. If we were playing a sim where we were on a destroyer hunting German subs would we refer to them as Krauts?

Do you see what I'm trying to say? I'm just wondering where the line is, or if there should even be a line. What do you guys think?

[Barkhorn1x]

Originally Posted by Iron Budokan

Maybe I'm opening a can of worms that should better remain closed, but here goes anyway. I've noticed several people on this board are starting to refer to the Japanese opponents in SH5 as "Japs".

SH5 is out?!?!

OMG - I must have just missed about 1.5 years of my life!!!!





Barkhorn.

[Finback]

I'm with you Iron. It's good to keep in mind as the war has been over for a long time. Personally, I don't want to offend anyone who visits this site. Looking at all the Germans who attend this site maybe we should keep in mind that with SH4 rolling out we may see quite a few Japanese who are also interested in this era...

Salute!!!

[fire-fox]

same here two.

[timmyg00]

"Japs" is just the shortened form of "Japanese". It's like a nickname.

Likewise, "Nips" is the short form of "Nipponese" (Nippon = Japan) ... ditto.

Were I a German citizen, I might find "Krauts" annoying, since it stereotypes Germans as sauerkraut eaters, which is silly. However, I don't think I'd find it to be particularly bigoted. But... I'm not a German citizen, so I really don't have a frame of reference for an informed opinion.

There are far worse epithets that could be, and have been, used to describe any given racial or ethnic group. I think shortened forms of acceptable terms are, by extension, also acceptable (As a citizen of the U.S., I reference the term "Yanks", as our British friends call us... hardly an offensive term...)

TG

[hyperion2206]

In WW1 the 'Tommies' (that's how we call them) used to call us 'Huns' which is (IMHO) even funnier than 'Krauts'. I guess every nation has such epithets like 'Frogs' for our French friends, or 'Yanks'. To me these names are rather harmless, but I could understand if somebody would feel offended.

[flintlock]

Originally Posted by timmyg00

"Japs" is just the shortened form of "Japanese". It's like a nickname.

The term may be shortened version of Japanese and a nickname, however, to Japanese people: it's a disparaging and offensive slang term.

[nattydread]

Originally Posted by timmyg00

"Japs" is just the shortened form of "Japanese". It's like a nickname.

Likewise, "Nips" is the short form of "Nipponese" (Nippon = Japan) ... ditto.

Were I a German citizen, I might find "Krauts" annoying, since it stereotypes Germans as sauerkraut eaters, which is silly. However, I don't think I'd find it to be particularly bigoted. But... I'm not a German citizen, so I really don't have a frame of reference for an informed opinion.

There are far worse epithets that could be, and have been, used to describe any given racial or ethnic group. I think shortened forms of acceptable terms are, by extension, also acceptable (As a citizen of the U.S., I reference the term "Yanks", as our British friends call us... hardly an offensive term...)

TG

Ok, lets be real, Americans didnt call them Japs and Nips because they liked them, knew them, identified with them, grew up with them on the block, had slumber parties with them on weekends or respected them. They called them these names at a time when we were at war with, while upset, while feeling violated, while wanting to kill them and on some level desiring to exterminate them as people. It was a name that grew in hostile times, with hostile thoughts, fears and a general air of racial tension and public acceptance for racist attitudes.
The Japanese wouldnt have accepted these "nickname" from us anymore than you'd accept the nickname given to you by some one you deem hostile or that you have conflict with. You'd never freely accept the nickname gievn you by a bully or someone you hated. When your at each other's throats and trying to kill the other, no name you come up with for the other will have any friendly, nice or good intentions behind it. Its a slur, plain and simple. The only difference is the name hasnt been challenged or question on any large social level. But then again, being called a ****** didnt either until about a couple of generations ago, it didnt mean African-Americans didnt like being called that until the '60s(yes, Im Black).
I assure you when my Viet-Nam vet father uses the term "Gook", that it has no good intentions behind it, its laced with pain, hurt and anger. Jap and Nip carried the same.
Im not going to tell you not to use it, that argument will take too much energy and generally its wasted breath on those who have yet to understand and crasp on a larger social level why it shouldnt be used. But lets not fool ourselves, if your going to enjoy its use, be real. Accept it for what it is, and accept your contribution and participation in it.

No hard feelings on my part(and hopefully none on yours), I've said my piece, its added into the conversation, you weigh its merit just like everyone elses comments. I will say that it may be a bit easier for me to identify, and perhaps easy for me to make more of it also, because Im a minority...been there, done that.


p.s. please dont lock the thread or be scared to further discuss the matter on my part. Its a reasonable discussion topic.

[hyperion2206]

Originally Posted by Iron Budokan

Maybe I'm opening a can of worms that should better remain closed, but here goes anyway. I've noticed several people on this board are starting to refer to the Japanese opponents in SH5 as "Japs". I know racism was particularly virulent on both sides (American and Japanese) during the war. My main question is how do we handle that in SH5 and on these boards?

Speaking for myself I won't refer to my polygon opponents as Japs. Nor do I care if someone else does, maybe they're just doing the immersion thing. And I swear I'm not trying to imply in any way someone who says that is racist. But it got me to thinking. If we were playing a sim where we were on a destroyer hunting German subs would we refer to them as Krauts?

Do you see what I'm trying to say? I'm just wondering where the line is, or if there should even be a line. What do you guys think?

I don't see what's wrong with 'Japs'. I don't mind being called a 'Kraut', in fact I find quite funny. Once I've read that only soldiers serving on the east coast called the Japanes 'Japs', soldiers serving in Pacific called them 'Nips'