UK Politics Thread - Page 394

Oberon · 01-27-17, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

"England leading the world, together with the US".
Who will be greater?

Ach nee...

Catfish · 01-27-17, 03:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Oberon

Ach nee...

Doch..

Oberon · 01-27-17, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

Doch..

Wunderbar...

STEED · 01-27-17, 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Catfish

Doch..

Quote:

Theresa May to tell Republicans US, UK can lead the world

Have to knock out Russia and China first...

WW3?

Well Trump did say its a angry world.

MGR1 · 01-28-17, 12:18 PM

More on Tam Dalyell:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-29367988

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-38773566

Agree or disagree with him, you always knew exactly where you stood with him - something that you can't say about the politicos of today. I don't think we'll see someone like him at Westminster again.

Mike.

Jimbuna · 01-29-17, 09:24 AM

Trumps latest executive order reaches far and wide....some politicians included I suspect.

Quote:

MP Zahawi says Trump order banning him from US is 'demeaning and sad'

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-38787517

Oberon · 01-29-17, 09:42 AM

The Mobot has been hit by it too:

Oberon · 01-29-17, 09:46 AM

Also, in this weeks irony ore train:

Skybird · 01-29-17, 09:47 AM

The US is a sovereign, independent state, and nobody who does not hold US citizenship has any claim to make whether the people of this state and their institutions have to allow him in, or can ban him from entering.

This latest decree by Trump is far reahcing, I agree with Jimbuna on this, and it holds a lot of risk and potential for Trump seeing it exploding in his face due to legal resistence. But it is an issue that the American people alone and exclusively have to come to terms with - to decide whether they accept this course, or not. We foreigners shoud hold our mouth, I think. We have no claim that Americans must obey our wishes, demands and desires.

I think the same way about the possible implications for foreigners wanting to enter the UK after Brexit. If Britain does ban certain, or many, or all foreigners from working or living or visiting Britain in the future, then this is the Brits' natural right to decide so. Freedom and self-responsibility go hand in hand, you cannot have the one without the other. Its either having both, or none of the two.

A state or its citizens that must obey the demand of foreigners to let them enter and roam at will, is neither sovereign, nor independent.

The truth bites both ways. Of course Americans as well as Britons have to accept any consequences coming from their choices. It is not the duty of others to comepnsate them for their choices. So everybody is well-advised to make sure his people/nation can indeed afford what they choose.

Oberon · 01-29-17, 09:54 AM

We can comment on whether we think it's a stupid idea though.

I mean, come on...

Jimbuna · 01-29-17, 10:17 AM

True that Sky but one word immediately springs to mind....isolationism. I

I doubt that will be of any real eventual benefit to anyone.

Oberon · 01-29-17, 11:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

True that Sky but one word immediately springs to mind....isolationism. I

I doubt that will be of any real eventual benefit to anyone.

But it seems to be the growing trend now, Hard Brexit, Muslim Ban, everyone is pulling up the drawbridges and glaring at their neighbours.
It'll end in tears...and bloodshed. It always does.

MGR1 · 01-29-17, 11:46 AM

Sad but true.

Mike.

Skybird · 01-29-17, 12:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimbuna

True that Sky but one word immediately springs to mind....isolationism. I

I doubt that will be of any real eventual benefit to anyone.

The pendulum swings back from the current extreme - globalism - to the other. I must say that all in all globalism has done much more damage than good. In the third world, as well as in the first world. The social rifts it has created, are hard to even count out. And this I say despite having an eye of Germany - with the one economy in the world that depends more on globalism than any other economy out there, more than Japan, China or any other. But we have manouvered ourselves into a corner there, and the numbers are more and more dangerously hanginging and circling about our heads like Damocles' sword. When they start to rain down - and they will sooner or later -, they will simply slay us with their mere individual weight. For Germany, Trump's econiomic ideas are especially dangerous.

And Germany is the fiscal motor of this sick man named EU.

The distortions in social integrity of nations and cultures both in the first and third world, are monumental. And I do not see that the cure is in sight. More globalism to me reads like the recipe for pushing from "most likely a global disaster" to "guaranteed disaster, total and complete".

Add to this that so far nobody has a reaosnable, working formula for how to treat the more and more evidently emerging contradiction of a model that demands people to work for earning their living, and a working world that more and more does not need simple workers, simple jobs, and thus collides with the ned for work to make a living. This and the distribution war between old and young are pure dynamite, and it is set to blow our societies into pieces. That for exmaple in germany over 50% of the electorate are 50 years and older and all nations are practically bancrupt and dpeending on an economic model of endless delayed filing of insolvency, is additional oil spilled into the fire. When these bombs go up, I hope I will already be no longer around.

Its like Lupus, House would say: the body's immune system turns against the body and destroys its vitality slowly, its biological self-destruction. We do the same currently, we slowly destroy ourselves. With the best intention, like the immune system in case of Lupus.

Oberon · 01-29-17, 12:53 PM

Is it globalism or capitalism which has created those rifts though Sky? Or is it globalism exacerbating capitalism, and or vice versa?

I'm certainly not sure that capitalism in its current state can survive the coming challenges, and don't get me wrong, I'm not going to advocate full force communism or something daft, but I think that we're going to need to develop a new system in order to cope with the shrinking of the world and the increase in automation, because short of a major event which destroys modern society neither of those are going away and our current economic and social structure emphasises the rapid development of both.

01-28-17, 12:18 PM	#5900
MGR1 Grey Wolf Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Aberdeen, Scotland, United Kingdom Posts: 964 Downloads: 252 Uploads: 0	More on Tam Dalyell: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-29367988 http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotlan...itics-38773566 Agree or disagree with him, you always knew exactly where you stood with him - something that you can't say about the politicos of today. I don't think we'll see someone like him at Westminster again. Mike. __________________ "I am the battleship Jean Bart. This name originates from a certain 'respected' privateer... Yes? You want to know what privateers are? Hmph, they are pirates that rob openly under the banner of their country." Jean Bart from the mobile game Azur Lane.

01-29-17, 09:47 AM	#5904
Skybird Soaring Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: the mental asylum named Germany Posts: 40,737 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	The US is a sovereign, independent state, and nobody who does not hold US citizenship has any claim to make whether the people of this state and their institutions have to allow him in, or can ban him from entering. This latest decree by Trump is far reahcing, I agree with Jimbuna on this, and it holds a lot of risk and potential for Trump seeing it exploding in his face due to legal resistence. But it is an issue that the American people alone and exclusively have to come to terms with - to decide whether they accept this course, or not. We foreigners shoud hold our mouth, I think. We have no claim that Americans must obey our wishes, demands and desires. I think the same way about the possible implications for foreigners wanting to enter the UK after Brexit. If Britain does ban certain, or many, or all foreigners from working or living or visiting Britain in the future, then this is the Brits' natural right to decide so. Freedom and self-responsibility go hand in hand, you cannot have the one without the other. Its either having both, or none of the two. A state or its citizens that must obey the demand of foreigners to let them enter and roam at will, is neither sovereign, nor independent. The truth bites both ways. Of course Americans as well as Britons have to accept any consequences coming from their choices. It is not the duty of others to comepnsate them for their choices. So everybody is well-advised to make sure his people/nation can indeed afford what they choose. __________________ If you feel nuts, consult an expert.

01-29-17, 10:17 AM	#5906
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 181,865 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	True that Sky but one word immediately springs to mind....isolationism. I I doubt that will be of any real eventual benefit to anyone. __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!! GWX3.0 Download Page - Donation/instant access to GWX (Help SubSim)

01-29-17, 11:46 AM	#5908
MGR1 Grey Wolf Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Aberdeen, Scotland, United Kingdom Posts: 964 Downloads: 252 Uploads: 0	Sad but true. Mike. __________________ "I am the battleship Jean Bart. This name originates from a certain 'respected' privateer... Yes? You want to know what privateers are? Hmph, they are pirates that rob openly under the banner of their country." Jean Bart from the mobile game Azur Lane.

01-29-17, 09:42 AM	#5902
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	The Mobot has been hit by it too:

01-29-17, 09:46 AM	#5903
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Also, in this weeks irony ore train:

01-29-17, 09:54 AM	#5905
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	We can comment on whether we think it's a stupid idea though. I mean, come on...

01-29-17, 12:53 PM	#5910
Oberon Lucky Jack Join Date: Jul 2002 Posts: 25,976 Downloads: 61 Uploads: 20	Is it globalism or capitalism which has created those rifts though Sky? Or is it globalism exacerbating capitalism, and or vice versa? I'm certainly not sure that capitalism in its current state can survive the coming challenges, and don't get me wrong, I'm not going to advocate full force communism or something daft, but I think that we're going to need to develop a new system in order to cope with the shrinking of the world and the increase in automation, because short of a major event which destroys modern society neither of those are going away and our current economic and social structure emphasises the rapid development of both.