Europe's migrant problem

[Fahnenbohn]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

I would tend to agree. The EU has finally shown it's true face. Most countries have no interest in helping out or showing solidarity with the nations that take in refugees. Solidarity is obviously supposed to be just a one way road payed for by Germany and a few others.
Even the most pink glassed EU fanatic should now realize that it has always just been an illusion. The hearts and minds of most have never been in it.

I think you didn't understand my mind. I'm not speaking about the political monster called the "EU". I'm talking about the european soul. EU has never been the true Europe, but an organisation destined to impose ultra-liberalism and US imperial policy to Europe. And this is more true than ever with the free trade agreement signed in secret with USA, against european people.

[Skybird]

There are walls to keep people in. Berlin wall.

There are walls to keep people separate that cannot live together reasonably well. Israel.

There are walls to keep others away. Troy.

Three totally different things.

The first is called prison.

The second is called pragmatic reason.

The third is called self-defence.

[Skybird]

Solidarity is always and inevitably and indispensably a voluntary quality decided on by own desire. I show it not because it is expected from me, but because I feel the personal want to show my solidarity with someone. Or not. It cannot be demanded or blackmailed or enforced - then it is no solidarity anymore, but submission to a superior force. And conformism.

What the EU demands is that other nations share the German folly and stupidity and act as irresponsible and insane as Germany does.

Enforced or blackmailed solidarity (or tolerance, for that matter), is no solidarity (or tolerance), but is force and bullying. And it never is anything else.

Merkel tried to shock-and-awe Europe into moral indignation by creating facts on the ground without asking, but by breaking national laws, international treaties, and German constitutional rules. And now realises that other nations around are big time pissed by Germany and refuse the servility she learned by the germans' example to take for granted. And I cannot criticise these other nations for being pissed. They have all reason to be.

My sympathy for Germany and the Germans, has run thin over the years and by now, in this crisis, is most extremely limited. They got what they asked for, once again. And the moral supremacism by which German romantic hysterics time and again want to lecture the world and time and again get knocked out by reality, pisses me as well. It seems we are a people of retards that just never learn the lesson reality teaches us.

Never forget, when the rational and reason-basing enlightenment "haunted" the Anglosaxon world, the Germans rejected it, so to speak. It was too clear, too harsh, too coldly intellectual, too less emotional for them. They wanted to wallow in emotions instead, feel the things, and endlessly dream about nature, life and meaning. Thats why Goethe's Werther caused so many suicides over here, but nowhere else. The era of the German "Romantik" was the result of the German way. Nice poems, sweet music, all nice and well, but incomplete if left to itself. If only we would have shared the Anglosaxon development of the rational enlightenment. I see this failure as one fundament that later served as a fertile field that racists and ultra-nationalists like infamous Sombart and others later could sow out there blood-dripping seeds on already before WWI, and that later the Nazis claimed and took as their heritage. Nothing the Nazis showed up with, was new or had grownj on their own thinking'S soil. they just took a fully readied set of concepts that already existed since decades, and only added the anti-Jew-card to the set of cards.

When needing to chose between emotion and reason, I pick reason every time. With emotions, you can make even the most peaceful man behaving like a monster. With reason, you cannot. All what politicians do today, for the most aims at the lower emotions, and the irrational sentiments, to bring the crowd on their side - but appealing to reason almost all politicians avoid at all cost - they know they cannot hold their grounds in the face of it. Reasonable thinking should become a forgotten and ignored instance, and if that does not work, it gets demonised as heresy and anti-xyz and abc-phobic. A thoughtcrime that becomes criminalised and turned into a hatecrime. In other words: it is about uniformity, about totalitarian mind control, and conformism, and obedience to a new feudal elite. The German madness of the third Reich, the German transfiguration of totalitarianism and state, the over-estimation of German lead model and German moral and German "reason", is all result from this profound irrationality rooting deep in German emotionalism and sentimentality.

We Germans are refugees from reality, that simple it is.We mistake the world that we dream to live in for the world that we live in for real.

[VipertheSniper]

Originally Posted by Skybird

With emotions, you can make even the most peaceful man behaving like a monster. With reason, you cannot.

That's total and utter bs. Have you ever heard of the thought experiment "paperclip maximizer"? Replace the general artifical intelligence with a human acting without emotion but only with reason...
I would say that human would constitute a monster.

[August]

Originally Posted by Fahnenbohn

I think you didn't understand my mind. I'm not speaking about the political monster called the "EU". I'm talking about the european soul. EU has never been the true Europe, but an organisation destined to impose ultra-liberalism and US imperial policy to Europe. And this is more true than ever with the free trade agreement signed in secret with USA, against european people.

Don't blame your perceived societal failings on us.

"European soul", what's that? I know of German Soul, French Soul, Italian, British, Dutch, etc etc but each culture is very different.

[eddie]

with August on that!

[August]

Originally Posted by Oberon

Oh, and August, I went back through his post history, you'll want this pic ready:

https://karavansara.files.wordpress....hese-guys1.jpg

Enjoy.

Thanks! That looks better than the one I have...

[Betonov]

Originally Posted by August

"European soul", what's that? I know of German Soul, French Soul, Italian, British, Dutch, etc etc but each culture is very different.

It's called tourism.
We like visiting each other. We used to do it with long marches and tank rides, now we take the plane or car.

Speaking of tourism, now would be the perfect time to visit Belgrade.
I can buy a one way ticket and join the line for a free adventure filled trek back.

[Buddahaid]

Originally Posted by Betonov

...We like visiting each other. We used to do it with long marches and tank rides, now we take the plane or car.....

Nicely put.

[Skybird]

The term "Europe" is kind of special. Grammatically it reads a singular, but by reference and meanign it necessarily and inevitably implies a plural.

That is why the EU with its uniform and centrlaised, totalitarian, neo-feudal ambition, and "Europe", are not just two totally different things, but indeed are antagonistic to each other. You cannot be for Europe while wanting a strong EU. If you want a stroing EU, you destroy what Europe is: a plural, a group, not one uniformed, collective actor imposing his will on all subordinate entities.

The "European spirit" is an utopic ideal of a choir where the voices sing some part of the partition - that one about economic cooperation and only that one, please - in synchronism, or coordination. deGaulle called it the "Europe of (economically) cooperating fatherlands". He implied a French leading role in that, I ignore that implication, and only refer to the phrase he has chosen - that is the only form of EU that I would not condemn alltogether from beginning on. What the EU now wants to be is a continental one-government-for-all with even less regional sovereignty than the American federal states have against Washington. The EU copies the model of the Sovjet example from USSR times, plain and simple.

[Bilge_Rat]

a map which really summarizes the problem well:



there may be 350,000 in Europe, but 4,000,000 other refugees are in the ME, so the number of refugees in Europe could easily double or triple in the next years.

The most effective way to resolve the refugee problem is to put an end to the Syrian/ISIS crisis.

http://www.theatlantic.com/internati...e-isis/410746/

[Schroeder]

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

there may be 350,000 in Europe, but 4,000,000 other refugees are in the ME, so the number of refugees in Europe could easily double or triple in the next years.

It is estimated that Germany will have taken one million refugees by the end of the year. We sometimes get more than 10.000 refugees per day. So the numbers in that picture seem to be highly outdated and the time period stops just when the big wave started moving.

[Skybird]

That numbers are meaningless and are not even close to what really goes on. Hopelessly outdated, if ever having been true at all. See that the right graphic even reads "2011-summer 2014" - before Merkel announced her invitation to all world to come to germany.

Multiply the number of Syrian refugees and economic migrants fro other countries by several factors.

Several factors.

Then consider that those who are given permission to stay, by that get the right to bring in their families (wives, husbands, children) as well. Increase the total number of staying newcomers again by several factors, due to that.

Germany alone now is beyond the 1 million mark already - form this year alone. The government supresses the real numbers. Police got ordered to hide from the public and media the number of problems and incidents where police has to intervene in facilities as well. Since nothing gets done to stop this mess and Merkel as usuall just sits and swings the propaganda hammer and so more will come, for the following years several millions are expected: more refugees, more migrants, and families being called in by those who can stay.

Of those who cannot stay, a huge number nevertheless gets tolerated to stay for longer periods of time.

Merkel does what she always does best: nothing, babbling empty phrases, and allow problems to pile up. All the time laws, treaties and constitutional rules mean nothing to her. As always, she thinks she is above all that.

---
Some facts about Merkel that foreigners and even most Germans do not know. She has risen to high ranks in the former GDR within the youth Organisation FdJ, making it to the top ranks of it'S office for agitation and propaganda. She had a special permission to travel abroad (only loyal regime members and sympathisers got that), she was involved in spying on civil regime critics, namely Robert Havemann, and most likely therefore was spying for the StaSi, was an informant of the StaSi. She furiously engages in legal sanctions against media and journalists reporting on that, like Gregor Gysi does, a known name ove rher ein Germany, former head of the far left in the parliament and also a striong sympathiser of the SED and GDR system, also an informant for the StaSi as well (even a court ruled that he was that, he nevertheless charges everybody refering to that court sentence and makes so much noise about it in threats and actions that most people do not dare to challenge him on his spying past).

In other words: Merkel was an established and benefitting member of the regime'S inner personnel circle, enjoying privileges and opportunistically hanging her banner according to the wind'S direction. She was allowed to study at an elitist academy of the regime, and politically became an expert trained in propaganda, and agitation as they calledf it in the GDR.

She is an underhanded opportunistic fat cat and "Parteibonze" whose mind has enough room for only wo things: "herself, and her power.

The claim risen that she acts on grounds of humanitarian considerations, is not just absurd, but an offence for the many victims of the past regime and the immense collateral damage she now causes in Germany in the past ten years. Merkel never has solved anything. She just sits still and flattens everybody until he cannot breathe anymore. She does so with the EU. Wioth the Euro. With our problems with the "Energiewende". Infrastructure. And now the mass migration he has directly triggered. All for securing her in office.

Considering her for the peace nobel prize this year not only once again is a massive abuse of Nobel'S foundation, but is so absurd and so malicious that I almost wanted to spit on the TV screen when they announced that possibility first time.

A joke over here says Merkel is Erich Honnecker's late revenge on the BRD (FRG). But the point is - that is no joke. It simply is the truth. Merkel is the most successful turncoat in Europe after the collapse of the Eastern order. And most Germans have no clue of it at all.

The germans have learned nothing.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by Schroeder

It is estimated that Germany will have taken one million refugees by the end of the year. We sometimes get more than 10.000 refugees per day.

Some days ago there was the existence of an internal paper confirmed saying that the government knows that already now we are far beyond the 1 million mark.

And people scramble for Germany from more and more regions in africa that are not linked to the Syrian conflict at all.

---
If there is one thing positive coming from all this, then that it drives deep rifts into the EU and erodes its internal structures, making it hopefully more prone to collapse one day. I hope the Eastern states stay resolute. Ironically, I hope the election results in Poland also mean more troubles for the EU and Germany.

But maybe the EU's fall is less a collapse as an event, but a hard death by long-term erosion. Not so much a quick bullet through the head, but a slow death by cancer.

Originally Posted by Fahnenbohn

...they are not from my race.

Aaaand that matters because........?