Looking for Danger in the Pacific... - Page 3

Armistead · 04-08-10, 08:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Immacolata

Spot on. Which is probably why I was really bored with it. I never managed to get near any of the flat top action in the Coral sea due to extreme fighter coverage

Taking part of the battle of the Coral Sea is easy, I've done it with an S boat. Just get to where it is and wait. I was in a S boat and first found the Shoho sunk it and went to Coral Sea...I hit one carrier but with S boat couldn't chase it.

The best place to catch the Coral Sea TF is sit below San Cristobal and the smaller island below it. On May 5 or 6 the Yorktown will come through as it launches plans against the TF at Tulagi.
If you'll place yourself near where you find the Yorktown, the night of May 6, maybe 7, the jap fleet will come through.

http://www.historyanimated.com/CoralSea.html

I just finished this major battle using RSRD. After the last 4 patrols it was almost more than I could deal with, probably had 12 hours in it over two days..

http://forums.ubi.com/eve/forums?a=t...058#4151038058

Immacolata · 04-09-10, 02:13 AM

It is the whole "knowing history in advance" that kinds of bore me. I would much rather have opportunities to spot enemies by radio report, chance or luck. Chasing a task force is exciting. Knowing where it is and lie in wait is not. RSRD felt like a whole lot of emptiness with some few, fixed points of fun around it. I guess I just like my Pacific War to be more gamey?

I am not sure how TMO 1.9 works on its campaign layer, but at least I'm having more what SEEMS like "chance" encounters. This is all very subjective, but as I'm not able to cite every naval engagement from the Pacific War by heart, TMO seems to be more fun looking at it through my periscope.

Its a bit like Europa Universalis III. I am all in for a historical SETTING with plausible cause-and-effect. But I dont want to re-enact history.

Armistead · 04-09-10, 04:37 AM

Almost every major engagement subs were sent to close positions and that's what RSRD does....even stock does it, just poorly. The stock reports while you dock telling you what's going on gives you tons of info. With RSRD convoys aren't going to spawn on you every 30 minutes game time

Stock has most of the same battles, just poorly done. No doubt you play stock, RSRD or any campaign mod, you know where to sit you can find things. I always sit in the San Bern Straits for the battle of Leyte to duke it out with the center force. I get bored chasing the stock simple convoys, packed close together, dodge some dd's for a few ship kills when I can do running battles over 500 miles with large TF's or Convoys.

However, Midway, Battle of Philippines, Santa Cruz, Leyte, ect...we basically knew where they were going.

TMO 1.9 reworked layers more like RSRD, except you'll find more convoys. Stock will always spawn convoys near you within certain limits regardless of how real it is. RSRD can get boring as you can go for weeks without a ship, but usually you run into a convoy...it's a big um, well protected.

Like the last major battle I did. I got a contact report, went flank to get there. I was out of position when sonar got it, but tracked for a day to attack. I then chased it for two days in and out of storms almost to Tokyo..

One thing I've done as I did get bored knowing where battles were is to try to attack a different path not where the actual battle is.

Still for most they can't resist getting involved in a large historical battle, most prefer that than chasing the same type convoys over and over.

Immacolata · 04-09-10, 06:05 AM

Hm, perhaps something was not right with my RSRD install. I ran for two months without any radio reports of convoys. OR anything really except that I had to relocate my base when Japan invaded Java etc. All I got was single merchants. Was put on patrol near Formosa and Celebes sea, like, the opposite direction of the action. Sigh.

Armistead · 04-09-10, 06:33 PM

Hmmm, not sure..I don't know that I've ever ran over two months without a radio flash message.

The map screen is much different if RSRD working, you'll notice a lot more labels.

Admiral8Q · 04-09-10, 06:35 PM

Don't use RSRD.

Armistead · 04-09-10, 07:02 PM

Why not...I wouldn't play without it..The traffic layers in stock are fubar.

Admiral8Q · 04-09-10, 07:17 PM

Get the Narwhal, it's a bloody nice boat early in the war.

Immacolata · 04-10-10, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Armistead

Why not...I wouldn't play without it..The traffic layers in stock are fubar.

But I am not using stock traffic layers. I am using TMO 1.9. Ducimus edited the layers a lot, he said.

Armistead · 04-10-10, 02:17 AM

TMO 1.9 layers are much better, closer to RSRD, but a lot more traffic, just not all the invasion forces or battles. I do like how he put more of a zig pattern and more speed to TF in TMO..

Oh, if only we could combine the work of both.

Admiral8Q · 04-10-10, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Immacolata

It is the whole "knowing history in advance" that kinds of bore me. I would much rather have opportunities to spot enemies by radio report, chance or luck. Chasing a task force is exciting. Knowing where it is and lie in wait is not.

I am all in for a historical SETTING with plausible cause-and-effect. But I dont want to re-enact history.

I have to agree with this. It is a game. Games are meant to be fun. On my current patrol I made a supply drop, reported to the south China sea. Chased down a sonar contact which turned out to be a couple of sub chasers. (The game "paused" for a second so I went to the sonar station and found them. My sonar man must be deaf, heh heh!) Now I'm heading pass Singapore hoping to find something to sink. So far I've only sunk one Sampan, oi.

Anyways, it would be interesting to have a campaign where the Japs actually win the Pacific war and the American fight goes on into the 1950's. That would be an interesting scenario!

Armistead · 04-13-10, 06:32 AM

You wanna find some fun with RSRD in Oct -Dec of 43, hang about 170nms east of Saipan. You'll get several flash messages of TF and convoys. I found 3 large convoys just headed that way. On the way back I ran into a lone Shokaku and was like..alone..Oh well...gave him my 4 remaining bows. Wasn't long here came a lone CA, but going fast, so I let him go, only for another lone CA to pop up that I took out with my afts. I had one aft left and a few more CA"S and BB's came through with no escorts. Finally a flash message popped up that IGN units would be coming from Truk to Home Waters. The location was 500NMS away 3 days from now, I just caught them early on their path.

Coming home entering Bismark I run into a TF, thinking US, but a group of LCA's, Kumi and Agano's. I torp left I sunk a rare Agano since I don't see em much.

Another flash message 5 convoys between Truk and Home Waters..Seems they pass 150nms west of Saipan, so that's the honey spot in late 43.

Keelbuster · 04-13-10, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ducimus

Personally, knowing how the AI works, i view attack and evasion as nothing more then an excercise of threading a needle as you manuever your boat in just the right fashion. Thread it right, you succeed. Thread it wrong, you fail. I think the biggest variance is how wide the eye of that needle is. Small eye, hard to thread. Big eye, easy to thread.

All AI modifications are ultimately play out as nothing more then threading a needle. Again, the only varience between mods, is how large the eye of the needle is that it is asking you to thread. The other variance, is in the players ability to thread needles. But at any rate, it's all a very mechanic process in my view. No mystery or pageantry involved at all, which is probably why i haven't played in over a year.

edit: BTW keelbuster, If i wanted to, i could quite easily ifgiven enough time to properly test it, whip up an AI that would make you think GWX was easy. lol

I'm playing TMO clean now. And I'm _liking_ it. First patrol I encountered (via a radio report map update) a decent sized convoy with three escorts in perfectly clear weather just near the entrance to the Bungo Strait. I went in and fired six torps at 4000 yards (closest I dare get around escorts with such sensitive ears) and I sunk one decent sized cargo and blew the rudder and prop off another. In a second attack after overhauling the convoy I scored a hit on a tanker and shew blew up. I promptly got detected and 3 escorts converged. They took turns pinging me, doing DC runs with crazy abandon, and generally beating the hell out of me. I didn't seem to have a thermal layer to get under, and I took damage (though no flooding). After about 15 or 20 minutes of this something big must have happened because all three destroyers turned and blazed away at flank speed. It was a thoroughly satisfying experience. I then came up after a few hours of running silent. I did a hydrophone check, nothing. Came to radar depth, and did a scan - I get a contact at 2200 yards, bearing 190. It's a jap DD, waiting in my baffles. I go silent again and drop down to 300 ft and he searches around a bit and then bails. Eventually I get to surface and do some repairs. Now _that_ is a solid submarine experience. Reminds me of o'le gwx.

Plus, even with update map contacts off, I seem to get my convoy radio reports plotted, which is great. I'm really getting into this mod - so glad to see radio reported convoys plotted on the map again with some regularity. On the way home I got a task force reported going 20kts my way. Unfortunately the only torps I had were aft, and those tubes were damaged in the attack and could not be opened

One thing I noticed about the AI sensors in TMO is that it seems to make a massive difference whether or not you're on silent running. I was about 6000 yards or so away from an escort (clear water) running at ahead slow with silent running off, and he became suspicious. But I've found you can get within 2000 yards ahead slow with silent running without making them suspicious. I can work with this. I'm just used to GWX 3.0, where I remember being able to approach at ahead 2/3 until say...2000m away or so and then go silent.

Also, I seem to remember that in SH3/GWX the DDs were deaf if they were moving fast or very fast. I feel like this might not be the case in SH4/TMO. Anybody know?

Cheers to TMO.

Kb

P.S. What kind of ship is Bungo Pete? Sub-chaser perhaps?

Platapus · 04-13-10, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keelbuster

P.S. What kind of ship is Bungo Pete? Sub-chaser perhaps?

In the movie it was called an "Akikaze". There was an such a ship called the Akikaze. It was commissioned in 1921 a Minekaze class destroyer. While still a pretty good esort, it would not have been the sub killer as depicted in the movie. Especially since she did not have any depth charges. She was designed more as a torpedo launcher.

The Akikaze died an honourable death in November 1944 when she deliberatly intercepted torpedoes headed toward the carrier Junyō. All hands were lost.

What I find interesting in the movie is that Clark Gable "practiced" his approach using a Momo destroyer.

There was such a destroyer called the Momo. It was one of the Matsu Class destroyers. However, the Momo was commissioned in 1944 and the movie was supposed to take place in 1943. (missed it by that much)

If, the movie had taken place in late 1944, Clark Gable would have found the Momo a much harder adversary than the Akikaze. He would have used the Akikaze to practice his dumb approach.

So to answer your question, these were fictional destroyers in the movie.

In the Beach book, Bungo Pete was the nickname of the Japanese destroyer Captain, not the ship.

If you have not yet read the book, be prepared. It is quite different from the movie. And it raises an interesting and dark moral question.

Ducimus · 04-13-10, 06:13 PM

The akikaze is indeed a fictional character, I put him in as a nod to the movie "Run silent run deep".

The akikaze in TMO is a minekaze class destroyer, though in the Rec manual, it will say "Akikaze class". He's fitted with the BEST hydrophone and active sonar for the japs in game, has 2 drop racks, and 4 Kguns arranged in such a way to deliver wide pattern, which you can vaugley see starting at 1Min and ending at 1:38 in someone posted.

Bungo pete, will sometimes make an appearance in the bungo suido (near area 7 on your nav map). And, late war, will sometimes be found escorting a convoy (very rare, but possible as of tmo 1.9)

The other one you have to look out for, is PB102. A clemson class destroyer captured by the japanese, and participant in the attack that sank "Destroyer killer" Sam Dealy. He may sometimes be found in place of the akikaze.

04-09-10, 02:13 AM	#32
Immacolata Grey Wolf Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 798 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	It is the whole "knowing history in advance" that kinds of bore me. I would much rather have opportunities to spot enemies by radio report, chance or luck. Chasing a task force is exciting. Knowing where it is and lie in wait is not. RSRD felt like a whole lot of emptiness with some few, fixed points of fun around it. I guess I just like my Pacific War to be more gamey? I am not sure how TMO 1.9 works on its campaign layer, but at least I'm having more what SEEMS like "chance" encounters. This is all very subjective, but as I'm not able to cite every naval engagement from the Pacific War by heart, TMO seems to be more fun looking at it through my periscope. Its a bit like Europa Universalis III. I am all in for a historical SETTING with plausible cause-and-effect. But I dont want to re-enact history. __________________ "The power of the executive to cast a man into prison without formulating any charge known to the law, and particularly to deny him the judgment of his peers, is in the highest degree odious, and the foundation of all totalitarian government whether Nazi or Communist." - W. Churchill

04-09-10, 06:05 AM	#34
Immacolata Grey Wolf Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 798 Downloads: 3 Uploads: 0	Hm, perhaps something was not right with my RSRD install. I ran for two months without any radio reports of convoys. OR anything really except that I had to relocate my base when Japan invaded Java etc. All I got was single merchants. Was put on patrol near Formosa and Celebes sea, like, the opposite direction of the action. Sigh. __________________ "The power of the executive to cast a man into prison without formulating any charge known to the law, and particularly to deny him the judgment of his peers, is in the highest degree odious, and the foundation of all totalitarian government whether Nazi or Communist." - W. Churchill

04-09-10, 06:35 PM	#36
Admiral8Q Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Prince Edward Island, Canada Posts: 1,077 Downloads: 24 Uploads: 0	Don't use RSRD. __________________

04-09-10, 07:17 PM	#38
Admiral8Q Ace of the Deep Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Prince Edward Island, Canada Posts: 1,077 Downloads: 24 Uploads: 0	Get the Narwhal, it's a bloody nice boat early in the war. __________________

04-13-10, 06:32 AM	#42
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	You wanna find some fun with RSRD in Oct -Dec of 43, hang about 170nms east of Saipan. You'll get several flash messages of TF and convoys. I found 3 large convoys just headed that way. On the way back I ran into a lone Shokaku and was like..alone..Oh well...gave him my 4 remaining bows. Wasn't long here came a lone CA, but going fast, so I let him go, only for another lone CA to pop up that I took out with my afts. I had one aft left and a few more CA"S and BB's came through with no escorts. Finally a flash message popped up that IGN units would be coming from Truk to Home Waters. The location was 500NMS away 3 days from now, I just caught them early on their path. Coming home entering Bismark I run into a TF, thinking US, but a group of LCA's, Kumi and Agano's. I torp left I sunk a rare Agano since I don't see em much. Another flash message 5 convoys between Truk and Home Waters..Seems they pass 150nms west of Saipan, so that's the honey spot in late 43. Last edited by Armistead; 04-13-10 at 07:44 PM.

04-09-10, 04:37 AM	#33
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Almost every major engagement subs were sent to close positions and that's what RSRD does....even stock does it, just poorly. The stock reports while you dock telling you what's going on gives you tons of info. With RSRD convoys aren't going to spawn on you every 30 minutes game time Stock has most of the same battles, just poorly done. No doubt you play stock, RSRD or any campaign mod, you know where to sit you can find things. I always sit in the San Bern Straits for the battle of Leyte to duke it out with the center force. I get bored chasing the stock simple convoys, packed close together, dodge some dd's for a few ship kills when I can do running battles over 500 miles with large TF's or Convoys. However, Midway, Battle of Philippines, Santa Cruz, Leyte, ect...we basically knew where they were going. TMO 1.9 reworked layers more like RSRD, except you'll find more convoys. Stock will always spawn convoys near you within certain limits regardless of how real it is. RSRD can get boring as you can go for weeks without a ship, but usually you run into a convoy...it's a big um, well protected. Like the last major battle I did. I got a contact report, went flank to get there. I was out of position when sonar got it, but tracked for a day to attack. I then chased it for two days in and out of storms almost to Tokyo.. One thing I've done as I did get bored knowing where battles were is to try to attack a different path not where the actual battle is. Still for most they can't resist getting involved in a large historical battle, most prefer that than chasing the same type convoys over and over.

04-09-10, 06:33 PM	#35
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Hmmm, not sure..I don't know that I've ever ran over two months without a radio flash message. The map screen is much different if RSRD working, you'll notice a lot more labels.

04-09-10, 07:02 PM	#37
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	Why not...I wouldn't play without it..The traffic layers in stock are fubar.

04-10-10, 02:17 AM	#40
Armistead Rear Admiral Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: on the Dan Posts: 10,880 Downloads: 364 Uploads: 0	TMO 1.9 layers are much better, closer to RSRD, but a lot more traffic, just not all the invasion forces or battles. I do like how he put more of a zig pattern and more speed to TF in TMO.. Oh, if only we could combine the work of both.

04-13-10, 06:13 PM	#45
Ducimus Rear Admiral Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 12,987 Downloads: 67 Uploads: 2	The akikaze is indeed a fictional character, I put him in as a nod to the movie "Run silent run deep". The akikaze in TMO is a minekaze class destroyer, though in the Rec manual, it will say "Akikaze class". He's fitted with the BEST hydrophone and active sonar for the japs in game, has 2 drop racks, and 4 Kguns arranged in such a way to deliver wide pattern, which you can vaugley see starting at 1Min and ending at 1:38 in someone posted. Bungo pete, will sometimes make an appearance in the bungo suido (near area 7 on your nav map). And, late war, will sometimes be found escorting a convoy (very rare, but possible as of tmo 1.9) The other one you have to look out for, is PB102. A clemson class destroyer captured by the japanese, and participant in the attack that sank "Destroyer killer" Sam Dealy. He may sometimes be found in place of the akikaze.