Wikipedia excommunicates Church of Scientology

This corporation had power,
if You believe,
Like Preachers,Priests,
all organisations,
Roaring down a Microphone?
On TV,
Listen long enough?
You will be hypnotised by this trash,
Yes trash,Rubbish,Pure utter Rubbish,
Lets not forget from past History,
Religion is the Beginning and End of all Wars,
Protect your children from this,
Pure utter Rubbish printed or not.
Religion no matter what type,
was Man made,
Ripleys
Believe It Or Not

[Aramike]

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

Does banning this result in the first step towards banning Christianity? It might be. Things always start in a subtle way.

Christianity is under attack in every country these days. This is in a time where the violent acts of terrorists for Islam are heralded as good deeds.

Someone wake me up, but when did this nightmare start? Obviously it is the direct result of the weakening of Western civ and the ultimate turn away from god. But the end time has to come someday. Welcome to that end.

Even if I were an atheist, I would be looking upon these times with great alarm. Islam is coming for you. If Christianity were the Ying and Islam the Yang, seems you have created a vacuum for them to take over even you. No longer are things balanced. You will try and ban them to, but you will fail. You are already overrun.

-S

Wait - are you suggesting that Wikipedia banning an organization from hijacking their articles to slant them favorably, somehow constitutes a weakening of Western civilization? Let's say that the Vatican was doing the same thing Scientology was - I'd support a ban on that as well.

Wikipedia has absolutely NO reason to not protect its interests the best it can, specifically the veracity of the articles within.

Wikipedia cannot "ban" Scientology any more than it can ban Christianity. But, it has EVERY RIGHT to ban organized efforts by these institutions to taint its content.

What is really the weakening of Western Civilization is this idea that private organizations are not supposed to defend their interests.

[Aramike]

Originally Posted by owner20071963

This corporation had power,
if You believe,
Like Preachers,Priests,
all organisations,
Roaring down a Microphone?
On TV,
Listen long enough?
You will be hypnotised by this trash,
Yes trash,Rubbish,Pure utter Rubbish,
Lets not forget from past History,
Religion is the Beginning and End of all Wars,
Protect your children from this,
Pure utter Rubbish printed or not.
Religion no matter what type,
was Man made,
Ripleys
Believe It Or Not

That is the some of the most closed-minded, short-sighted, hate-filled rubbish I've ever read on here.

It is absolutely foolish to believe that without religion there would be no war. Many, if not most wars are secular in nature (the gain of land and resources). How one can honestly believe that man's nature is guided only by religion is beyond any reasonable mind.

Religion is a man-made construct, generally for the purpose of the worship of a supreme deity. Just like any other man-made construct, it will contain a degree of fallibility. But only the most simple-minded among us will find a way to blame all of the world's ills on a single concept.

Also, your sense of history is flawed. Take the most terrible of modern-day wars, World War II. How did religion cause this? Actually, wasn't religion one of its chief victims?

Religion is surely responsible for some evils, but it is also responsible for many more good acts. Hatred exists independently of religion, and generally only causes evil.

By the way, I'm not in any way religious, but I don't dislike religion. I do despise hatred, however. Your post was filled with it.

[Skybird]

Originally Posted by bookworm_020

I'm surprised they don't try telemarketing! They would reach plenty of gullible people willing to spend money on useless objects!

But they already do! It is their core business to sell crap literature and courses to people.

Let's assume, theoretically, for one moment, they were indeed a religion, not a company having founded a cult to make profit of it. There is one characteristic that sets them apart from ALL major religions there are:

Religious missionaries, religious teachings try to convince you, WHY it is to your benefit if you submit to them. They tell you what their message and belief is, and their deity and idols, and how the content of their message is helping you, they tell you all this for free so that you shall believe it and join them.

Scientology hides it from you.

they say: Hi, my name is Linda, and you look so stressed on this day, if you have a little time here is a little test that may help you to realize how stressed you actually are. Well, those numbers don't look good, well, here is a little book for 9,80 that you can read to find out how to lower that stress level. We also offer courses where you can learn in practice to deal with your stress, they are not expensive for beginner's levels, really.

And you go home and read it and take that course, and follow some advise, and well, eventually you find out that having those ideas on your mind influences the way you experience your job, family, social life, whatever. and you say: hey, this is nice stuff, I want to know more, why am I so stressed. And you go and ask them.

And they tell you, well, actually you are not stressed, but you are not purified from what is oppressing you. Here is a small collection of books for 280 dollars, you may find some answers in them. We also recommend you advance to level two of our relaxation courses for just 490 dollars per weekend. For better effect you take all parts of them, and if you buy them completely, you pay 6 courses and get the 7th for free.

And you go home and read and you take some courses and you pay some 3000 dollars, after all it's just money. and you are wondering and ask them: why is it that I am so loaded with things I need to purify from? And they tell you: well, at this level of your spiritual journey we cannot tell you, you must first advance to the next level, here are some books for just 790 dollars, and these courses for advanced practitioners that base on the beginner's lessons you already took, just 3000 dollar. Now that you started, you cannot quit, right! This is important for your spiritual health!

and you do as you have been told, and spend all the money. And your wife is asking where all your money has gone, and you go to the church and ask them what you should tell your family. And they tell you that you should bring her with you. Asking her, she rejects your offer, and again you ask your Scientology mentor for advise and he tells you that you must separate from your wife, but should bring your children instead, and that you have to disconnect from your former friends and circle of working buddies, for they are hindering you on your spiritual journey: here is a nice book and a course to help you over it. 10.000 dollars, please.

And that way, you make your way up the spiritual ladder, and the more money you pay, the more fulfilled and purified your spirituality becomes. One day you ask them where all this crap that was hindering you, has been coming from, and they say: pssst, don't tell everybody, but you are close to the next level where it will be revealed to you, just this more books and courses, 29000 dollars, and you will raise to not only the next level, but the next class of completely different levels, where you will learn about the superior power of mind and.... sht, not yet, comrade, first get these books and take these courses.

And you do as you've been told, and see your children being brainwashed and becoming disconnected from their former life and friends as well, and you see the cult completely assimilating them and turning them into beasty missionaries for Scientology, the coming leader's elite to lead the corporation.

when you have read the books and took the courses, they demand an entrance fee of some thousand dollars, then tell you that now you have become a tethan of first degree, and they lend you in their center a holy book of revelations that tells you that there was a great intergalactic war and a ancient Darth Vader plans to blow your body and mind up by throwing you into a volcano and that he already has imposed onto you the bad souls of his enemies millions of years ago, that's where your stress is coming from, and the more purification you get and free yourself from that science fiction heritage, the more a loose cannon your mind will become. You will be able to fly by willpower, you will learn how to kill people with your thought alone, and generally you will make superman look like an idiot. But, pssst, don't tell everyone! And you have to give back the book and leave the building and think what great things are laying ahead of you

Of course, reaching the next tethan level costs you more money for books, training and courses. the hierarchy is such that in theory there are enough tethan levels to consume all money there is in the world during your journey up the ladder. If you become so rich to pay all the world's money, you become tethan level 15, i think, which is the best there is, and seen that way that you managed to once own all the world's money - yes, you have been the master of the world. It's just that you are expected to hand your masterhsip over to them, in order to get those tethan super-mega-power-gimmicks, killer thoughts, cosmic insight and transgalactevolutional tam-tam-wonder-miracle-super-dooper-wonder-show with fireworks and a seat in the first row. Tom Cruise is said to be level 6 or 7, I think. Maybe that's because he always feels so small.

One day you wake up and look at your life which has become a mess, and that you have lost your family and wife and sold your kids, and that you are poor and have debts and your life pretty much in ruins. You break down in depression, but have no money to seek help outside your former paradise of Scientology. You want to take your kids and leave, but they tell you you can't, and hide your kids from you and shield them against you. You flee, and they threaten to kill you and that you bare not allowed to leave, and that you should give back all the books with all the secrets they revealed to you. They launch a huge campaign against you in the media, trying to shatter what is left of your respectability and reputation. they break into your apartment in search of those books, and steal them. when you tell the public what crap they are teaching people, they say: what? we? No, we don't teach that, we do not tell that to people, where is the evidence? He said he had books, where are they? One night you manage to find your children, and take them away. In the following weeks and months you find yourself being sued and sued over claims of child abuse, illegal entrance of their property, false testimony about them, character assassination. Every word you tell about Scientology they try to sue you for. In the night you see strange people lurking around yours apartment. You fear for the safety of your children, which additionally have massively alienated from you, and you are not sure if maybe you have brought the enemy into your hidden shelter by taking them in. On the other hand you read in a newspaper that in Germany, children of leading key personnel of Scientology in Berlin, did not bear the psycho terror anymore and fled from their parents, asking the state for asylum and to protect them against their parents (true event!).

And so on, Scientology never gives up, they are known for haunting their victims (="traitors") for years and years, and try to delete the material evidence for their activity by trying to get back the materials they once sold.

A religion like any other?

Wake up, people. Selling fantasies and declare what is just believed as a proven knowledge, is the business of every religion, yes, so are ridiculous claims of hellfire and salvation. But the way Scientology behaves and hunts for it's monetary profit interests is what makes it unique, and sets it apart. As I said before, they install a snowballing system in your mind to rip you off your money. And for that it is necessary not to tell you what it is about, but to hide it from you, and sell it in many little portions instead, for increasing prices.

The Christian church at least is clever enough to heavily susidize the prices for bibles in your bookshop. and on some occasions you can even get it for free. Now what if I sell you the first book of Moses for 29 dollars, telling you the real stuff starts not before book 2 (78 dollars), and after you have read it you ask for the sequel of the unfinished story and I sell you book 3 for 198 dollar, and when you want to know it all, now that you already have gone all the way, I tell you that there is a secret 4th book, it is not for everybody, that's why it is 498 dollar? Congratulations, you finished completing your first degree, now, there is plenty more... and after you are in debts and disconnected from your former life I tell you: congratulations, you now own the knowledge of all the old testament! I have a surprise for you, you know what, buddy? Psssst, don't tell everybody, but there is a new testament as well! :rotfl:

And once you have become a Megachristian of 20th degree, there comes the revelations. The Qumram scriptures. The fifth Gospel by john. Dune part 1-6. The screenplay of teletubbies. You want to become the real lord of the rings? Well, there are three books...

Germany, France, Netherlands, Belgium, Italy, Spain, and some other European nations refuse to accept their claim to be a religion. I know that American laws are different here, but Europeans must not obey American laws. And maybe in this case it simply is a stupid law anyway if it makes it possible to ennoble a criminal organization like Scientology the way it does, giving them tax reliefs and constitutional protection.

Check Google to learn the long criminal records of Scientology in various nations. It includes

-major fraud,
-tax evasion,
-wrongful deprivation of personal liberty,
-threat of physical violence and murder,
-child abuse,
-claims over kidnapping,
-illegal medical practicing,
-abuse of one's position in public and social offices,
-lying in job interviews,
-perjury,
-mistreatment,
-mobbing
-and various variations of accusations focusing on psychic cruelty.

Add to this the plethora of court cases Scientology has ripple-fired against "traitors", researchers, opponents and critics.

[clive bradbury]

Originally Posted by SUBMAN1

Does banning this result in the first step towards banning Christianity? It might be. Things always start in a subtle way.

Christianity is under attack in every country these days. This is in a time where the violent acts of terrorists for Islam are heralded as good deeds.

Someone wake me up, but when did this nightmare start? Obviously it is the direct result of the weakening of Western civ and the ultimate turn away from god. But the end time has to come someday. Welcome to that end.

Even if I were an atheist, I would be looking upon these times with great alarm. Islam is coming for you. If Christianity were the Ying and Islam the Yang, seems you have created a vacuum for them to take over even you. No longer are things balanced. You will try and ban them to, but you will fail. You are already overrun.

-S

Why I find this post interesting, subman, is that it displays rather typical fears of a narrow 'western' viewpoint. This is not a criticism of you, but it does show how the USA has consistently underestimated the effects of its foreign policy upon other nations. Such is (was?) your confidence in the 'exportability' of your system and doctrines the USA was genuinely amazed when you found that not everyone felt that way. Ironically the fears you express are PRECISELY how others feel in different parts of the world. To demonstrate this, simply swap the words 'Islam' and 'Christianity' in the above post to see how someone in Afghanistan or Beirut might see the current world order.

[Stealth Hunter]

Originally Posted by Torplexed

I dunno. Is there anyone still worshiping Ra, Zeus or Thor anymore? Just curious.

Believe it or not, there are still people who worship these gods. Actually, Greece has a minority group of about 5,000 people who still worship Zeus and the other gods/goddesses.

I know there are also some who worship Norse deities in Norway and Denmark as well, but I don't know about Ra. I assume there are still some for them, however.

Personally, I'm more inclined to like the polytheistic religions over the monotheistic ones (Mithra is an exception, however; he basically preached what Jesus preached 600 years before Jesus existed according to the Bible).

[nikimcbee]

Hey, look at the bright side, it makes for a great episode of Oprah. Ol' Tom will be doing more than jumping on the couch.

Originally Posted by Stealth Hunter

Believe it or not, there are still people who worship these gods. Actually, Greece has a minority group of about 5,000 people who still worship Zeus and the other gods/goddesses.

I know there are also some who worship Norse deities in Norway and Denmark as well, but I don't know about Ra. I assume there are still some for them, however.

Personally, I'm more inclined to like the polytheistic religions over the monotheistic ones (Mithra is an exception, however; he basically preached what Jesus preached 600 years before Jesus existed according to the Bible).

I do think were making a comeback, theirs even Hellenic Polytheistic groups about in the States here.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hellenic_Neopaganism

[Stealth Hunter]

:rotfl:

Well, any questions?

[Skybird]

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