Government going after Private Pilots

[GoldenRivet]

So Zach

whats it going to be ?

put TSA guards and a security check point at every FBO at every Podunk airport in the United States?

the ruling is ridiculous.

The owners of these aircraft are usually the pilots, and in cases where they are not the pilots, the pilots they have employed know their customers well.

i could see applying the rules to part 135 air carriers... but not private owners.

The ruling is costly to both the aircraft owner, and the tax payer, it is so vast in scope that it is impractical and it is a gross invasion of privacy by big government.

i for one dont support it.

this "plan" is only one step away from requiring every weekend warrior in a cessna 150 to fall in line with the same BS.

I have worked professionally in the aviation industry for over 10 years... i know first hand what it is like to deal with an "organization" like the TSA.

this plan is BAD for general aviation - plain and simple.

inconvenience is one thing Zach... a gross invasion of privacy and an overstepping of bounds is a whole other matter.

The TSA needs to stick to regulating PUBLIC transportation security and keep their noses out of my Gadamned private hangar.

[Enigma]

No it's E N I G M A not E N E M Y

One and the same?

The fact remains that if i do own a king air - its MINE to own and operate.

the TSA has no business telling me who and what i can bring aboard

period.

That is completely wrong , no matter if you own the plane or not there are piles of laws that tell you when you can fly , if you can fly , how you can fly ,where you cannot fly and who and what you cannot bring onboard .
After all a plane is no different to a car in that manner .

[Enigma]

there are piles of laws that tell you when you can fly , if you can fly , how you can fly ,where you cannot fly and who and what you cannot bring onboard .

Just to satisfy my curiosity, which laws do you speak of?

[Zachstar]

The ones that say you cant fly into Military airspace for one.

Just to satisfy my curiosity, which laws do you speak of?

The big pile of laws which regulate avaition , aircraft safety , pilots , flights and licencing.

[Enigma]

Ok. I was kinda looking for particulars.

As stated before, I'm a pilot so I'm familiar with aviation law. Your statement just seems perhaps a tad broad.

That is completely wrong , no matter if you own the plane or not there are piles of laws that tell you when you can fly , if you can fly , how you can fly ,where you cannot fly and who and what you cannot bring onboard .

You see, a week ago I hopped into an airplane at the time of my choosing, with people of my choosing and flew to an aiport of my choosing. I didn't ask permission from anyone at any time. Granted when I completed my flight training for my PPL and passed a medical, I got permission. If you refer to medical parameters on licensing or restricted airspace, that's another mater all together...

[Aramike]

Originally Posted by Enigma

Ok. I was kinda looking for particulars.

As stated before, I'm a pilot so I'm familiar with aviation law. Your statement just seems perhaps a tad broad.

You see, a week ago I hopped into an airplane at the time of my choosing, with people of my choosing and flew to an aiport of my choosing. I didn't ask permission from anyone at any time. Granted when I completed my flight training for my PPL and passed a medical, I got permission. If you refer to medical parameters on licensing or restricted airspace, that's another mater all together...

Maybe he's referring to flight rules?

[Platapus]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

this "plan" is only one step away from requiring every weekend warrior in a cessna 150 to fall in line with the same BS.

If your Cessna 150 is exceeding 12,500 pounds on take off, I think you have other problems than the TSA.

I didn't ask permission from anyone at any time.

so you had no dealings with anyone concerning your departure , route or arrival ?

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

That is completely wrong , no matter if you own the plane or not there are piles of laws that tell you when you can fly , if you can fly , how you can fly ,where you cannot fly and who and what you cannot bring onboard .
After all a plane is no different to a car in that manner .

this nonsense holds no water

the federal aviation regulations dont tell me when i can or cant fly. sure they have areas where i cant fly - and for good reason - but these regulations have NOTHING to do with the TSA inspecting your aircraft and your passengers.

There is a doctor on my airport who operates a king air. He uses it exclusively to fly his wife and kids to ski trips or other vacations.

should he be forced to dump all the shampoo, coca-cola, bottled water and finger nail clippers out of bags and purses while the TSA stands there and pats them down?? hell no!

sorry tribesman... your dealing with professionals here that KNOW their aviation rights.

Enigma is completely correct. airspace restrictions is a COMPLETELY DIFFERENT MATTER that the TSA standing on the ramp next to your private aircraft dumping out your belongings and telling you "sorry sir, your wife is on the no fly list so she cant go with you on this trip"

they dont and should not have the right!!!

[GoldenRivet]

Originally Posted by Tribesman

so you had no dealings with anyone concerning your departure , route or arrival ?

No.

VFR aircraft in the united states are not required to submit flight plans or propose an estimated time of departure or arrival on domestic flights.

This is America - not Soviet Russia and i for one would prefer to keep it that way.

thousands of planes take off and land under VFR (visual flight rules) every day without bogging down the ATC system with needless requests and communications.

Yes... even King Airs and Lear Jets sometimes operate VFR

[SteamWake]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

No.

VFR aircraft in the united states are not required to submit flight plans or propose an estimated time of departure or arrival on domestic flights.

This is America - not Soviet Russia and i for one would prefer to keep it that way.

thousands of planes take off and land under VFR (visual flight rules) every day without bogging down the ATC system with needless requests and communications.

Yes... even King Airs and Lear Jets sometimes operate VFR

Hrm... with the operating altitudes of the King Air and Lears you would think it would be a requirement to at very least post a cruising altitude. They are at the very least required to set a transponder and get the occasional call "Traffic at xxx fl xxx report them in sight".

[GoldenRivet]

Nope... as long as you dont go above 18000 feet.

I lifted off in a King air once and flew about 250 miles at 12,000 feet - transponder set for VFR.

the only two people i spoke with was the fueler at the home airport that told me to "have a nice flight"... and the fueler at the destination that said "How much fuel will you need, and by the way your rental car is here and ready to go."

given it is not a typical situation - but it does happen - and it is perfectly legal

[Sea Demon]

Originally Posted by GoldenRivet

Nope... as long as you dont go above 18000 feet.

I lifted off in a King air once and flew about 250 miles at 12,000 feet - transponder set for VFR.

the only two people i spoke with was the fueler at the home airport that told me to "have a nice flight"... and the fueler at the destination that said "How much fuel will you need, and by the way your rental car is here and ready to go."

given it is not a typical situation - but it does happen - and it is perfectly legal

Must be nice to fly in your state. It's difficult where I live to avoid Charlie or Bravo airspace. I have to fly inland, and there happens to be MTR low-level routes for Beale AFB aircraft in those areas. I don't wish to become a permanent fixture on the windshield of one of those black T-38's. So I fly South and request a transition through a Class C facility to get there.

Anyway, when flying VFR, I always make it a habit to file a flight plan and use flight following wherever I'm going. And neither is required. It's a safety thing.