Sacked...

06-12-07, 02:36 PM

I read these stories about suspended/relieved/sacked/you name it commanders that collide with the surface traffic or run aground. Why is the Navy court this hard on them?
There is no, like, second chance?

CCIP · 06-12-07, 02:50 PM

Well, can you really screw up anymore than running a ship you've been entrusted with aground?

It runs with the assumption that the captain is 100% responsible for his ship. It's a position of absolute command, and with that comes the responsibility.

06-12-07, 02:53 PM

I still think that they are way too hard on these men....

Camaero · 06-12-07, 02:55 PM

Weed out the weak, only the strong will remain.

06-12-07, 02:59 PM

I mean, it could happen to anyone. As for the punisment, maybe one rank below than the present one, but to end a whole career.
That sucks...

Sailor Steve · 06-12-07, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GakunGak

I mean, it could happen to anyone.

No, it doesn't happen to competent captains, only incompetent ones. If your ship runs over someone else's, it's your fault. If your ship gets run over, it's your fault, even if you were asleep in your bunk at the time.

After HMS Melbourne ran over and sank USS Frank Evans in 1969, both captains ended up losing their commands. Later in 1970 my ship was doing maneuvers with the Melbourne. I was a radioman on the midwatch, and was surprised to find our captain up on the bridge a 02:30. He wasn't taking any chances.

It's an old tradition. Even part of the Horation Hornblower novels are concerned with how precarious a command is. There was also an episode of JAG in which a ship ran aground, and the captain had to explain to marine lawyer Colonel McKenzie why his next command would be a desk.

I'm not saying it's necessarily right; it's just the way the navy looks at it.

CCIP · 06-12-07, 03:00 PM

I think it is unfair. By civilian standards. But by civilian standards the captain's powers over his ship would also be considered rather despotic - you don't question the captain. It's a very hierarchical structure, and one where errors are not forgiven.

Another oversight on his ship could result in much worse than the captain's sacking, and there's no second chances there either.

06-12-07, 03:04 PM

If no one questions the skip, then why are commands confirmed several times?
To minimize the possibility of error, and XO & Chief should also see if there's any danger and inform the cap.
:hmm:

Heibges · 06-12-07, 03:15 PM

Officers do not generally get second chances in any branch of the military for any reason.

06-12-07, 03:18 PM

Like the boarding inqury would do any better...

06-12-07, 02:36 PM	#1
GakunGak Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Sacked... I read these stories about suspended/relieved/sacked/you name it commanders that collide with the surface traffic or run aground. Why is the Navy court this hard on them? There is no, like, second chance?

06-12-07, 02:50 PM	#2
CCIP Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Waterloo, Canada Posts: 8,700 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 2	Well, can you really screw up anymore than running a ship you've been entrusted with aground? It runs with the assumption that the captain is 100% responsible for his ship. It's a position of absolute command, and with that comes the responsibility. __________________ There are only forty people in the world and five of them are hamburgers. -Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart)

06-12-07, 02:55 PM	#4
Camaero The Old Man Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: USA, Massachusetts Posts: 1,477 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	Weed out the weak, only the strong will remain. __________________

06-12-07, 03:00 PM	#7
CCIP Navy Seal Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Waterloo, Canada Posts: 8,700 Downloads: 29 Uploads: 2	I think it is unfair. By civilian standards. But by civilian standards the captain's powers over his ship would also be considered rather despotic - you don't question the captain. It's a very hierarchical structure, and one where errors are not forgiven. Another oversight on his ship could result in much worse than the captain's sacking, and there's no second chances there either. __________________ There are only forty people in the world and five of them are hamburgers. -Don Van Vliet (aka Captain Beefheart)

06-12-07, 03:15 PM	#9
Heibges Sea Lord Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: San Francisco, California Posts: 1,633 Downloads: 1 Uploads: 0	Officers do not generally get second chances in any branch of the military for any reason. __________________ U.Kdt.Hdb B. I. 28) This possibility of using the hydrophone to help in detecting surface ships should, however, be restricted to those cases where the submarine is unavoidably compelled to stay below the surface. http://www.hackworth.com/

06-12-07, 02:53 PM	#3
GakunGak Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I still think that they are way too hard on these men....

06-12-07, 02:59 PM	#5
GakunGak Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	I mean, it could happen to anyone. As for the punisment, maybe one rank below than the present one, but to end a whole career. That sucks...

06-12-07, 03:04 PM	#8
GakunGak Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	If no one questions the skip, then why are commands confirmed several times? To minimize the possibility of error, and XO & Chief should also see if there's any danger and inform the cap. :hmm:

06-12-07, 03:18 PM	#10
GakunGak Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Like the boarding inqury would do any better...