TUTORIAL VIDEO: Advanced Firing Solution using Sonar only - Page 3

Prof · 04-22-07, 02:17 PM

Great video...that might convince me to start using fully manual targetting

Just one question...when you are nearing the end of the solution plotting, you send the range/bearing information to the TDC 5 or 6 times. Why? Does the TDC automatically average the range estimates or were you looking for a good result and repeating the process until you found it?

Q3ark · 04-22-07, 05:25 PM

Hi there, just wanted to say thanks for the tutorial. Stuff like this should have been in the manual and i would never have figured it out for myself. Just one question, what was the formula for figuring out the speed, i can't seem to replicate what you did there

.

WernerSobe · 04-23-07, 05:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prof

Great video...that might convince me to start using fully manual targetting

Just one question...when you are nearing the end of the solution plotting, you send the range/bearing information to the TDC 5 or 6 times. Why? Does the TDC automatically average the range estimates or were you looking for a good result and repeating the process until you found it?

No unfortuanly it does not.

Ive just done it to hit an average. As i said there is a small sonar error. So when you ping a target and you get numbers varying between 2500 and 2000 you should ping it until you are at about 2250 then you have the everage and rather close to correct solution and you can stop.

Basicly - the shorter the time between your last data update and your attack, the less critical will solution errors take effect. Example. You have a solution that is wrong in speed by 1 knot. Now lets say you dont update bearing for about 3 minutes. Your solution will be displaced from real target alot more then if you have updated bearing just before you release the fishes. So the most important thing about it is the correct bearing when you fire. When you update the bearing just before you shoot, they will more likely hit even if the solution is flawed by little.

WernerSobe · 04-23-07, 05:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Q3ark

Hi there, just wanted to say thanks for the tutorial. Stuff like this should have been in the manual and i would never have figured it out for myself. Just one question, what was the formula for figuring out the speed, i can't seem to replicate what you did there

.

In imperial system:

1 knots = 1 nautical Miles per hour.

or

The distance a ship needs to travel through two locations in miles, devided by the time it needs to travel through those locations in minutes and multiplied by 60 equals its speed in knots.

Speed (kt) = Distance (nM) / Time (min) * 60

Q3ark · 04-23-07, 06:10 AM

Thanks for your help

. Now i can use manual TDC, was getting a bit boring not being able to hit anything. I wonder if it is possible to use this method when your sub is moving, will give it a try tonight.

WernerSobe · 04-23-07, 06:11 AM

Note this is not a standard firing procedure. Usualy you can get bearing and range visualy with the scope, it will render a much more accurate solution and is also a faster method. Of course you can also combine the two methods by in example making visual solution and pinging the target to check the data or get the range when youre not sure of your identification, or youre geting wierd numbers from stadimeter. But be carefull, pinging a target may render attention of escorts. They will barely know where the pinging comes from but they will definetely be alerted and start searching for you.

WernerSobe · 04-23-07, 06:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Q3ark

Thanks for your help

. Now i can use manual TDC, was getting a bit boring not being able to hit anything. I wonder if it is possible to use this method when your sub is moving, will give it a try tonight.

And for the speed. You dont need to plot every target to get its speed.

see my another guide here : http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=112448
You shouldnt move however when you are geting speed visualy. Once you have it you can move

kevtherev · 04-23-07, 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WernerSobe

The white line and cross are drawn by Position Keeper. You must give range, speed and AOB to your TDC and have Position aktivated to have it appear. It doesnt mean the target is acutaly there, its just the calculated interception point and its course.

Thanks for the prompt reply Werner but I am still not seeing the white cross etc. even though sending range etc to TDC. I am afraid that I do not understand 'Position aktivated ', how do I do this ?
Do I also have to constatly update AoB similar to range and bearing.
I have read somewhere that there is a bug with the attack map in that it does not show info. at various locations, I have however located my test missions at East China Sea, Celebes and Pearl and at non of these could I bring up the white X etc. Simply annoying. Everything else is super with your tutorial with the exception of my AoB question.
Sorry if these seem to be futile questions but I am a bit of a dummy at firing solutions etc. in general.

WernerSobe · 04-23-07, 06:58 AM

never heard of that bug.

1. do you have any mods installed. Some mods seem to make changes to attack map. Ive seen a mod that removed the green line from attack map and it was not documented.

2. are you sure you have the position keeper activated? (its the red button, im pushing it at minute 10:04 in tutorial) This is whats the entire tutorial is about. Im using position keeper (instead of scope) for updating firing solution. Once the position keeper has 4 informations (range, AoB, speed and bearing) it will automaticly compute all 4 informations based on their connection to each other.

bruschi sauro · 04-23-07, 07:55 AM

thank for the great work!

kevtherev · 04-23-07, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by WernerSobe

##########
2. are you sure you have the position keeper activated? (its the red button, im pushing it at minute 10:04 in tutorial) This is whats the entire tutorial is about. Im using position keeper (instead of scope) for updating firing solution. Once the position keeper has 4 informations (range, AoB, speed and bearing) it will automaticly compute all 4 informations based on their connection to each other.

Silly me Werner, I was going off the UBI manual for TDC and PK operation. In my manual there is a picture of the PK but no button as you describe. On the actual game PK the button is quite clear and when pressed (showing red) does indeed bring up the solution on the attack map. Thanks to Werner, no thanks to UBI (again). The solutions that I had been getting (without activated PK) produced reasonable results but with it activated they are probably better. Once again, and for the last time on this subject, many thanks.

MfG from Hamburg.

stuntcow · 04-23-07, 01:10 PM

Thank you for your time and effort in making this video. Is a big help and enjoyed it a great deal.

04-23-07, 02:23 PM

Werner you have a cool accent, I wish I could speak German as well as you speak English! Your tutorial totally opened the game up to a new level for me. I was apprehensive of turning on manual TDC, but now I am going to try it for sure.. visual shots first of course hehe, but watching you own a tanker with nothing but acoustic data was just shocking...

I am downloading the high res version to watch it again, this is so cool! Thanks for taking the time!

Snacko · 04-23-07, 03:04 PM

Great Job!

I love Video Tutorials too! More Please!

WernerSobe · 04-23-07, 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sakko

Werner you have a cool accent, I wish I could speak German as well as you speak English! Your tutorial totally opened the game up to a new level for me. I was apprehensive of turning on manual TDC, but now I am going to try it for sure.. visual shots first of course hehe, but watching you own a tanker with nothing but acoustic data was just shocking...

I am downloading the high res version to watch it again, this is so cool! Thanks for taking the time!

tnx :-) welcome to 100%

04-23-07, 01:10 PM	#42
stuntcow Torpedoman Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Tucson, AZ USA Posts: 113 Downloads: 13 Uploads: 0	Thank you for your time and effort in making this video. Is a big help and enjoyed it a great deal. __________________ U.S.S. Harder "Hit'em Harder" "How long can you tread water?"

04-23-07, 03:04 PM	#44
Snacko Engineer Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 212 Downloads: 58 Uploads: 0	Great Job! I love Video Tutorials too! More Please! __________________

04-22-07, 02:17 PM	#31
Prof Medic Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Cambridge, UK Posts: 167 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Great video...that might convince me to start using fully manual targetting Just one question...when you are nearing the end of the solution plotting, you send the range/bearing information to the TDC 5 or 6 times. Why? Does the TDC automatically average the range estimates or were you looking for a good result and repeating the process until you found it?

04-22-07, 05:25 PM	#32
Q3ark Watch Officer Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: York, England Posts: 346 Downloads: 47 Uploads: 0	Hi there, just wanted to say thanks for the tutorial. Stuff like this should have been in the manual and i would never have figured it out for myself. Just one question, what was the formula for figuring out the speed, i can't seem to replicate what you did there .

04-23-07, 06:10 AM	#35
Q3ark Watch Officer Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: York, England Posts: 346 Downloads: 47 Uploads: 0	Thanks for your help . Now i can use manual TDC, was getting a bit boring not being able to hit anything. I wonder if it is possible to use this method when your sub is moving, will give it a try tonight.

04-23-07, 06:11 AM	#36
WernerSobe Commodore Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 625 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	Note this is not a standard firing procedure. Usualy you can get bearing and range visualy with the scope, it will render a much more accurate solution and is also a faster method. Of course you can also combine the two methods by in example making visual solution and pinging the target to check the data or get the range when youre not sure of your identification, or youre geting wierd numbers from stadimeter. But be carefull, pinging a target may render attention of escorts. They will barely know where the pinging comes from but they will definetely be alerted and start searching for you.

04-23-07, 06:58 AM	#39
WernerSobe Commodore Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 625 Downloads: 5 Uploads: 0	never heard of that bug. 1. do you have any mods installed. Some mods seem to make changes to attack map. Ive seen a mod that removed the green line from attack map and it was not documented. 2. are you sure you have the position keeper activated? (its the red button, im pushing it at minute 10:04 in tutorial) This is whats the entire tutorial is about. Im using position keeper (instead of scope) for updating firing solution. Once the position keeper has 4 informations (range, AoB, speed and bearing) it will automaticly compute all 4 informations based on their connection to each other.

04-23-07, 07:55 AM	#40
bruschi sauro Frogman Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Florence Italy Posts: 307 Downloads: 64 Uploads: 0	thank for the great work!

04-23-07, 02:23 PM	#43
sakko Stowaway Posts: n/a Downloads: Uploads:	Werner you have a cool accent, I wish I could speak German as well as you speak English! Your tutorial totally opened the game up to a new level for me. I was apprehensive of turning on manual TDC, but now I am going to try it for sure.. visual shots first of course hehe, but watching you own a tanker with nothing but acoustic data was just shocking... I am downloading the high res version to watch it again, this is so cool! Thanks for taking the time!