SUBSIM: The Web's #1 resource for all submarine & naval simulations since 1997 |
12-13-17, 04:39 PM | #3931 |
Old enough to know better
|
Unless it's CNN.
__________________
“Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke |
12-13-17, 04:57 PM | #3932 |
Navy Seal
|
There's really a big difference between an error in news reportage (its not yet proven the CNN story was deliberate, in spite of how much the Trump camp may bellow about it) and an actual act of intentional fraud that may even be of a level of criminality...
...unless, of course, criminality is not a problem for the Trump defenders; after all they must still be smarting after they failed to deliberately get a pedophile elected to the Senate... <O>
__________________
__________________________________________________ __ |
12-13-17, 05:35 PM | #3933 |
Old enough to know better
|
That is true. But CNN has lost just about all it's hard earned credibility. If you are a fair minded person you cannot look at them in any other way than as a news network with a political agenda. News people are suppose to gather facts, confirm those facts and create a narrative for us to see and read. It is very obvious to me that CNN has already written the narrative and are gathering facts to support that narrative. This is exactly what happened this week with the WikiLeaks/Donald Trump Jr. story. The facts fit their preconceived story perfectly and they ran with it. You can call it an error if you want but I see it as something else. It's an ongoing, purposeful attempt to shape the narrative that they have already decided is true. It's bad journalism. In fact it's not even journalism.
__________________
“Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke |
12-13-17, 06:04 PM | #3934 |
Wayfaring Stranger
|
If this were a single instance Vienna might have a point but CNN has a long and extensive history of biased reporting. They even have their own Wiki page for it:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CNN_controversies
__________________
Flanked by life and the funeral pyre. Putting on a show for you to see. |
12-13-17, 06:13 PM | #3935 |
Rear Admiral
|
Geezuz U-Crank its unfortunate that in this day and age you still have to explain that to people. Personally if and when I watch TV I can see a particular bent to most news stories regardless if its CNN, Fox, CBS who ever. I tend to think in order to gain and keep an audience you must above all tell them what they want to hear, otherwise they'll go elsewhere.
__________________
Extradite Deez Nutz in your mouth Commissioner Mark Rowley you fascist pig. Make 1984 fiction again. Last edited by Rockstar; 12-13-17 at 07:21 PM. |
12-13-17, 06:31 PM | #3936 | |
Navy Seal
|
Quote:
...and just which news outlet or organization do you see as meeting your requirements of not having a slant or bent, of not having a bias, and of being entirely accurate all the time and in every case, because I would like to find what you have found to be a wholly reliable source, although I feel it would be easier to find, say, a unicorn or Bigfoot... An intelligent, discerning person would approach any new reportage with a grain of salt; it is never a good practice to accept any reportage of subjective material as hard, solid fact; there will always be a 'taint' and it is up to any reasonably intelligent person to seek out as many different reports and/or sources as needed to either confirm or refute any reportage; to quote a prominent GOP leader: "Trust, but verify". The persons at both ends of the political spectrum seem bent on persuading us only their particular brand of reportage is the gospel truth. Any time someone tries to desperately and loudly sell you their 'snake oil' as being the best and only, its usually because it isn't. The much maligned 'mainstream media' is very much more often right than wrong, and far more right than the Alt-Right media that carps about fake news. The current Schumer events are a prime example: the mainstream sought to verify while the Atl-Right media just ran with the raw story, gloating over how the had a 'Gotcha!' on Schumer and the DEMs, with blaring headlines, only to find the case was far, far different than what the Alt-R was reporting; note also how the Alt-R media, in the wake of the revelation the Schumer report was fraud, has yet to really make retractions, amendations, clarifications, or apologies, things mainstream media do as a matter of course and policy... Then there is "fake news". The Trump camp and the Alt-R media are always going on about the subject, yet, if you really look at it, the mainstream has been far more accurate than the detractors would have you believe. Let's just loom at the Flynn case as an example; Report: Flynn had contact with foreign entities Alt-R/Trump: "Fake News! Fake News!" ...until it was proved true... Report: Flynn had meetings with Russians Alt-R/Trump: "Fake News! Fake News!" ...until it was proved true... Report: Flynn had multiple meetings with Russians Alt-R/Trump: "Fake News! Fake News!" ...until it was proved true... Report: Flynn had meetings with Russians prior to Trump taking office and discussed lifting sanctions Alt-R/Trump: "Fake News! Fake News!" ...until it was proved true... Report: Flynn asked Russia's ambassador to the US "to refrain from escalating the situation in response to sanctions that the United States had imposed against Russia that same day." Alt-R/Trump: "Fake News! Fake News!" ...until it was proved true... Over and over again, the many "fake news" reports regarding the Trump administration have been proven substantially true and the subjects of those reports are now facing criminal charges (a couple have already plead guilty) with more charges to come. In Flynn's case the only real "fake news" was the assertions of the Trump camp that Flynn did not "willfully and knowingly make materially false, fictitious and fraudulent statements” to the FBI (a direct quote form the charges against Flynn to which, he has, in fact, plead guilty). There is far more fakery coming from the Alt-R and the Trump camp than has been coming from the mainstream, with the Trump camp "fake news" being expected, coming as it does from sources supporting a person who, himself, has ax extremely distant relationship with truth and honesty than one would expect to find in even the most crass politician. Basically, when Trump says, "Believe me!", you very much shouldn't... For now, I will continue to seek facts from all sources of all bents and not be enslaved to the extreme bent of either side of any issue... You know; "Trust, but verify."... <O>
__________________
__________________________________________________ __ |
|
12-13-17, 06:49 PM | #3937 | ||
Navy Seal
|
Quote:
Quote:
It is possible to go back and look at any news media's history and find missteps; the true test is if the number of missteps versus accurate reportage rise to the level of truly bad reportage. Reputable media goes the whole length to acknowledge and report their own errors, which CNN has done in the past and continues to do, as do all the other reputable news media, a degree of integrity and custom notably lacking in the Alt-R media or, even outlets like Fox News; in fact, the last time Fox issued a public retraction was under the duress of legal liability stemming from one of the "Fair and Balanced" reports. Odd, isn't it, that Fox News no longer use that slogan? Odd and appropriate... <O>
__________________
__________________________________________________ __ |
||
12-13-17, 07:20 PM | #3938 | ||
Old enough to know better
|
Quote:
Quote:
And who specifically are these Alt-R media sources you keep mentioning.
__________________
“Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke |
||
12-13-17, 08:17 PM | #3939 | |||||
Navy Seal
|
Quote:
Quote:
Additionally, I didn't say you are responsible for something before it airs; that is ludicrous on its face and a fallacious argument, quite possibly an act of avoidance. It is a responsibility for any person who values truth and fact to be prepared, if they really place such a high value, to seek out not just what is presented to them at face value, but, also to go beyond to establish the truth and verify the facts from all sources. This may be a foreign concept to those who follow a person who bases his judgements of the veracity of his 'friends' on the basis of "I believe him; he told me it wasn't true" with no facts to support it and even if it flies in the face of known facts. If you truly take things at face value, I've got this bridge in NY you might be interested in or, perhaps, you'd like to meet a very generous Nigerian prince... Quote:
To quote John McEnroe: "You cannot be serious." If you insist I state the obvious, oh, how about Fox News, Brietbart, Infowars, Charles Johnson, Mike Cernovich, etc., all of whom, BTW, have made some whoppers of errors in their time; in fact, a sample of the nature of what appears to be proper Alt-R due dilligence can be found in the Schumer piece to which I posted a link in my post about eight or so posts back: Quote:
Quote:
I came across this Doonesbury toon and, who knows, it may explain away the whole Russia scandal: I not sure: I can't remember if you're Canadian... <O>
__________________
__________________________________________________ __ |
|||||
12-13-17, 09:10 PM | #3940 | ||||
Old enough to know better
|
Quote:
Quote:
And this is their hilarious correction. Quote:
Quote:
If you are going to call Fox News Alt Right then do you call CNN and MSNBC Alt left?
__________________
“Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke |
||||
12-13-17, 09:58 PM | #3941 | |
Navy Seal
|
Actually, I do; not on a daily basis, but I do like to keep up on all sides of an issue; I'll particularly go to them if I find them referred to as a source or as a relevant part of another outlet's story; the more intel one has, the better they can process fact from fiction... It's a dirty job, but somebody's gotta do it... Quote:
I did notice some time ago some of the Alt-R media began to use the term 'Alt-Left' towards other media outlets, but it doesn't seem to have gained much or any traction as a matter of general use. Perhaps it has something to do with a lot of the Alt-R actively embracing the moniker, "Alt-Right" and a general indifference by the other media to consider describing themselves as 'Alt'-anything. Feel free to use Alt-L, if you wish... <O>
__________________
__________________________________________________ __ |
|
12-14-17, 04:09 AM | #3942 | |
Dipped Squirrel Operative
|
Quote:
No, i would say CNN and MSNBC are neutral to left-leaning while Fox Breitbart and Bannon are barking dogs of right-wing populism. CNN may have lost a bit of credibility, where the latter never had any.
__________________
>^..^<*)))>{ All generalizations are wrong. |
|
12-14-17, 07:04 AM | #3943 | ||
Old enough to know better
|
Quote:
Quote:
__________________
“Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke |
||
12-14-17, 07:24 AM | #3944 | |||
Old enough to know better
|
Quote:
Here's an article that may shed some light on the disagreement. Quote:
Quote:
__________________
“Two possibilities exist: either we are alone in the Universe or we are not. Both are equally terrifying.” ― Arthur C. Clarke |
|||
12-14-17, 08:35 AM | #3945 |
Dipped Squirrel Operative
|
"Conservatives lost faith in mainstream media" ?
My heart bleeds. From the article: "Ever since the advent of "the media" as an industrial complex -- large corporate conglomerates based in coastal cities where many of the ad agencies are -- it's been a left-leaning, urban-minded, somewhat elitist outfit with a blind spot for conservative America." So the coastal cities are the bad leftist boys. And all of California, of course. And now even Alabama decided to leave the republican path. So the "conservative America" is.. exactly where? In the mid west? Or in Canada, lately? You quote just of all CNN, which you say is leftist and biased, to support your arguments? This is somehow like with the Trump evangelists, they hate and despise science, but (ab)use scientific titles and universities to support their arguments, when they think they fit their agenda. They openly support Trump and what he does e.g. with the EPA. Closing natural parks and reservates, open them for drilling and exploiting resources. But at least CNN writes about it. In the very article you mention. It is aware it does not do the best, and admits failure in not recognizing conservative points of view. Show me this with Breitbart! Fox and Breitbart are owned privately by singulary bosses with rightist mindsets. Those guys have an agenda and built their company around it, picking those news and employees they see fit. I have never seen Fox or Breitbart be the tiniest bit critical of themselves, or being funny without beating around against the "left" wildly. They have bought the truth, and you read this in every self-righteous and hate-dripping article. For them all is political, from dying polar bears, to weapons, to soft ice. It all serves them, and if not it's just warped and twisted until they produced a "fact" against "leftists" out of it. They have an agenda, and they use assorted and selected facts, myths, gut feeling and whatever primitive sentiment to drive their point home. They try to control, relentlessly and aggressively – the latter is the reason why lots of unbiased normal people with usually common sense are now standing up against them. CNN or even the Washington Post are a lot different, though i can understand that they are a bit concerned about Trump and what he does. You would have to be deaf dumb and blind not to be concerned of this ..., and his entourage. What CNN does is ridicule politics and criticizing it, what Bannon does is demonizing and hating half of America's population that does not fit in his world view. Free journalism has mostly tried to limit power, criticize it, regardless which political colour. Free journalism is mostly not "rightist", nor "leftist". It is only "left" in the viewpoint of Bannon and the alt-right (whatever the latter really is).
__________________
>^..^<*)))>{ All generalizations are wrong. Last edited by Catfish; 12-14-17 at 09:10 AM. |
Tags |
biden, clinton, election, harris, obama, politics, trump, twitter |
|
|